Codies have weak backbones?
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Join Date: May 2012
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Codies have weak backbones?
I don't know, I'm just asking, and basically accusing myself of having a weak backbone.
I like to think of myself as a strong woman with an assertive personality. Maybe I simply found someone with a bigger and stronger assertive personality. bit off more than I could chew?
I keep thinking about how the A really doesn't give a damn what we think of their drinking, else they would do something about it. Most of them continue on doing what they want to do, regardless of what we want. Yet at the same time, we panic, worry, fear, etc. , leave them, get weak, miss them horribly, focus on the pain of losing our love, cry, etc., and return to them as if we were bad, our tails between our legs....which I haven't done this time...YET, maybe never.
How do they have the ability to continue living just like they want to, regardless of what we want, when we are afraid half the time to even bring up the elephant in the room?
It's just a discussion is what I am looking for. How we endure and suffer, while they look at us with that kiss my ass look.
Maybe it's just my story, since the A never even tried to quit drinking. The message seemed to be clear--what are you going to do about it since you love me so much?
I like to think of myself as a strong woman with an assertive personality. Maybe I simply found someone with a bigger and stronger assertive personality. bit off more than I could chew?
I keep thinking about how the A really doesn't give a damn what we think of their drinking, else they would do something about it. Most of them continue on doing what they want to do, regardless of what we want. Yet at the same time, we panic, worry, fear, etc. , leave them, get weak, miss them horribly, focus on the pain of losing our love, cry, etc., and return to them as if we were bad, our tails between our legs....which I haven't done this time...YET, maybe never.
How do they have the ability to continue living just like they want to, regardless of what we want, when we are afraid half the time to even bring up the elephant in the room?
It's just a discussion is what I am looking for. How we endure and suffer, while they look at us with that kiss my ass look.
Maybe it's just my story, since the A never even tried to quit drinking. The message seemed to be clear--what are you going to do about it since you love me so much?
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Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: right here, right now
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It doesn't matter what you start out with.
Alcoholism breaks you down, whether you're a frightened little wallflower or Chuck Norris in drag.
I've always been strong and independent.
It was what attracted AXH to me -- and it was what made me proud enough not to see the warning signs and take them seriously.
I thought I was strong enough to handle it all.
But alcoholism broke me.
And I wasn't even the alcoholic.
Alcoholism breaks you down, whether you're a frightened little wallflower or Chuck Norris in drag.
I've always been strong and independent.
It was what attracted AXH to me -- and it was what made me proud enough not to see the warning signs and take them seriously.
I thought I was strong enough to handle it all.
But alcoholism broke me.
And I wasn't even the alcoholic.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 391
Made of Glass,
It is a pretty clear message. In a perfect world where my codependent issues are dormant and I'm following the steps, I guess my response to that message would be.
Yes, I love you "so" much - but I choose to love myself more. That's what I'm going to do about it. (Then, in my head, giving into weakness, I would say ....put that in your glass and drink it!!!!!)
In reality I wonder if they really do care what we think. But that craving, that need for alcohol is so strong and so loud it drowns everything else out.
I don't know.
I'm feeling at peace today and feeling empathy for my STBXAH. I know there are glimmers of real feeling and caring in there somewhere. Unfortunately, he chose to show me the unfeeling, cruel (and eventually scary) part of himself too much.
sigh.
MamaKit
It is a pretty clear message. In a perfect world where my codependent issues are dormant and I'm following the steps, I guess my response to that message would be.
Yes, I love you "so" much - but I choose to love myself more. That's what I'm going to do about it. (Then, in my head, giving into weakness, I would say ....put that in your glass and drink it!!!!!)
In reality I wonder if they really do care what we think. But that craving, that need for alcohol is so strong and so loud it drowns everything else out.
I don't know.
I'm feeling at peace today and feeling empathy for my STBXAH. I know there are glimmers of real feeling and caring in there somewhere. Unfortunately, he chose to show me the unfeeling, cruel (and eventually scary) part of himself too much.
sigh.
MamaKit
Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 391
I've always been strong and independent.
It was what attracted AXH to me -- and it was what made me proud enough not to see the warning signs and take them seriously.
Ooooohhh. Lightbulb!!!!!
Lillamy, thank you for making me gain some understanding of why I did not take the warning signs I saw seriously.
It's not a lack of backbone in my case, it's maybe that mine was just too rigid (with pride).
MamaKit
It was what attracted AXH to me -- and it was what made me proud enough not to see the warning signs and take them seriously.
Ooooohhh. Lightbulb!!!!!
Lillamy, thank you for making me gain some understanding of why I did not take the warning signs I saw seriously.
It's not a lack of backbone in my case, it's maybe that mine was just too rigid (with pride).
MamaKit
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Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Real World
Posts: 729
They have issues, we have issues.
I'm a big strong guy who has always been in leadership positions... I have a hard time standing up for myself with a sig other because mommy yelled at me a whole bunch when she wasn't well.
...we all have baggage. It's not a character defect any more than contracting the disease of alcoholism is. Backbone is acknowledging our shortcomings and doing something about them ;-)
I'm a big strong guy who has always been in leadership positions... I have a hard time standing up for myself with a sig other because mommy yelled at me a whole bunch when she wasn't well.
...we all have baggage. It's not a character defect any more than contracting the disease of alcoholism is. Backbone is acknowledging our shortcomings and doing something about them ;-)
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Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,443
I don't know about backbone but for me I think it was a combination of stubbornness, ego, and the ease with which I live in the land of magically thinking versus the land of reality.
Magical thinking - I had a picture in my head of what he, me, and our life together was going to look like. I held true to that picture even when reality was vastly different. My thoughts processed as if that picture was real, all while managing the realities of living with an alcoholic. I had convinced myself that he was that picture, and not that alcoholic stealing his 8yo's allowance - so when it came time to leave - I had to switch my thinking, which was hard. I had to leave the real man because it made no sense to leave the fantasy man in my head.
Stubbornness - and then I was going to try differently, try harder, try more, try everything including destroying us both - to MAKE that picture real. To control and manipulate my way through the marriage until *poof* we all transformed into that picture in my head.
Ego - It would happen if only I could get him on board and to see that I alone had the magic wand of rightness.
Seems ridiculous writing it out there like that but that was basically it. It wasn't that I couldn't stand up to him (although it felt that way a lot of the time - I have very very weak boundaries) it was that I was not ready to admit defeat.
Magical thinking - I had a picture in my head of what he, me, and our life together was going to look like. I held true to that picture even when reality was vastly different. My thoughts processed as if that picture was real, all while managing the realities of living with an alcoholic. I had convinced myself that he was that picture, and not that alcoholic stealing his 8yo's allowance - so when it came time to leave - I had to switch my thinking, which was hard. I had to leave the real man because it made no sense to leave the fantasy man in my head.
Stubbornness - and then I was going to try differently, try harder, try more, try everything including destroying us both - to MAKE that picture real. To control and manipulate my way through the marriage until *poof* we all transformed into that picture in my head.
Ego - It would happen if only I could get him on board and to see that I alone had the magic wand of rightness.
Seems ridiculous writing it out there like that but that was basically it. It wasn't that I couldn't stand up to him (although it felt that way a lot of the time - I have very very weak boundaries) it was that I was not ready to admit defeat.
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It's not a lack of backbone in my case, it's maybe that mine was just too rigid (with pride).
See, I felt I was so much better than women who left their husbands when the going got tough. I used to tell my friends that "marriage is for life and divorce is not an option, and once you set that straight in your mind, you are forced to find other solutions."
I felt so superior and so much better than women who left when their husbands cheated or drank or ended up in jail. I was never going to do that because I was stronger and better than that.
A little bit of humility is a good thing. And pride goeth before the fall.
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[QUOTE=lillamy;3571720]It doesn't matter what you start out with.
Alcoholism breaks you down, whether you're a frightened little wallflower or Chuck Norris in drag.
Chuck Norris in drag--Ha,Ha,HA,HA! Sorry---I just lost it on that!:rotfxko
dnadylion
Alcoholism breaks you down, whether you're a frightened little wallflower or Chuck Norris in drag.
Chuck Norris in drag--Ha,Ha,HA,HA! Sorry---I just lost it on that!:rotfxko
dnadylion
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My bf is a recovering drug addict/alcoholic, sober 4 years now. We just started dating a few months ago but I have known him for years. Even though he is clean he still struggles with his past and has emotional problems that effect our relationship almost daily. I have been noticing some "codie" characteristics in myself lately as I try to "help" him through his issues.
In response to your post, I think even the strongest people can become co-dependent. Maybe for different reasons, or maybe we are linked with common factors. Too caring, skewed idea of what "love" is, scared, stubborn, don't want to feel like we gave up, not sure what else to do, lack of boundaries, used to these types of things happening to us, etc. Whatever it is it doesn't make us weak people. It's our version of addiction. Now it's up to us to do something about, whether our addicted loved one has or not.
I love the insight I gain from coming here. You are all so great
In response to your post, I think even the strongest people can become co-dependent. Maybe for different reasons, or maybe we are linked with common factors. Too caring, skewed idea of what "love" is, scared, stubborn, don't want to feel like we gave up, not sure what else to do, lack of boundaries, used to these types of things happening to us, etc. Whatever it is it doesn't make us weak people. It's our version of addiction. Now it's up to us to do something about, whether our addicted loved one has or not.
I love the insight I gain from coming here. You are all so great
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In my case it was certainly a lack of a backbone but I can't speak for anyone else...
I put up with way too much verbal and emotional abuse all for the sake of "love". I should have decided a long time ago his behavior was unacceptable and let him go. I am trying to learn how to have better boundaries so it doesn't happen again.
I put up with way too much verbal and emotional abuse all for the sake of "love". I should have decided a long time ago his behavior was unacceptable and let him go. I am trying to learn how to have better boundaries so it doesn't happen again.
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Basically, I just want to add one of my observations to the others here.
Co-dependent "types" so often make up the good citizen population of this world. They are the ones one would want to be stranded on a deserted island with. Often admired by others because of their Pro-social traits.
It seems that the trouble comes when they enter into intimate relationships. It is then that the unresolved pain and fears from (mostly) unresolved childhood traumas are triggered and begin to show. Addicts can "smell" a codependent person from a mile away and hit on them.
I would not say that codependents are weak---I think they are strong people who have been wounded. They would have to be strong in order to just survive the environments they were forced to grow up in.
These are just some of my thoughts.....
dandylion
Co-dependent "types" so often make up the good citizen population of this world. They are the ones one would want to be stranded on a deserted island with. Often admired by others because of their Pro-social traits.
It seems that the trouble comes when they enter into intimate relationships. It is then that the unresolved pain and fears from (mostly) unresolved childhood traumas are triggered and begin to show. Addicts can "smell" a codependent person from a mile away and hit on them.
I would not say that codependents are weak---I think they are strong people who have been wounded. They would have to be strong in order to just survive the environments they were forced to grow up in.
These are just some of my thoughts.....
dandylion
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 391
Dandylion,
That makes two lightbulbs for me with this thread.
As I read your post I thought " I agree with this about 60% as far as this being a descriptor of me"
I've struggled with this concept of "who a codependent often is" in the past and could never fit myself into the mold because I was very loved as a child and there was no abuse or addiction in my home at all. So, the trauma piece never fit.
I thought, the only trauma I can think of is that my father (a wonderful man and husband) died after a brief cancer fight when I was 13. He was only 49.
DUH!!!!!
Why I never considered that trauma before I don't know.
Goodness do I have a lot to chew on as I make my commute home from work tonight.
Thank you
MamaKit
That makes two lightbulbs for me with this thread.
As I read your post I thought " I agree with this about 60% as far as this being a descriptor of me"
I've struggled with this concept of "who a codependent often is" in the past and could never fit myself into the mold because I was very loved as a child and there was no abuse or addiction in my home at all. So, the trauma piece never fit.
I thought, the only trauma I can think of is that my father (a wonderful man and husband) died after a brief cancer fight when I was 13. He was only 49.
DUH!!!!!
Why I never considered that trauma before I don't know.
Goodness do I have a lot to chew on as I make my commute home from work tonight.
Thank you
MamaKit
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Originally Posted by PohsFriend 
Backbone is acknowledging our shortcomings and doing something about them ;-)
sometimes, I feel, its the FEAR of the unknown...what happens if i stop this behaviour, what happens when i dont react...what happens IF i do start to apply my boundaries...
or some will just say, your plain lazy(well, thats from a NORMIE)
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I don't look at it like I do not have a backbone.
I look at it like my sorter is broken....and I don't know what to put my significant energy towards. In the case of my AexH I was directing the energy outward, not toward what I had a say over....myself.
In relationships that I don't have some much intimacy with I don't struggle with mine/theirs as much (and don't get into as much trouble as a result). I can be definitive and decisive in those relationships easier as a result.
Also trauma is something unresolved (it does not even have to be something bad), but something that we have not been able to resolve in our nervous system, brain etc. I have not had traditional "trauma" in my life (which I always thought of had to be like war time stuff). I am so conscious of others trauma that I often am working on healing that (again something I have no say over).
Great question, and great answers.
I look at it like my sorter is broken....and I don't know what to put my significant energy towards. In the case of my AexH I was directing the energy outward, not toward what I had a say over....myself.
In relationships that I don't have some much intimacy with I don't struggle with mine/theirs as much (and don't get into as much trouble as a result). I can be definitive and decisive in those relationships easier as a result.
Also trauma is something unresolved (it does not even have to be something bad), but something that we have not been able to resolve in our nervous system, brain etc. I have not had traditional "trauma" in my life (which I always thought of had to be like war time stuff). I am so conscious of others trauma that I often am working on healing that (again something I have no say over).
Great question, and great answers.
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Join Date: Jan 2011
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Originally Posted by lillamy
It doesn't matter what you start out with.
Alcoholism breaks you down, whether you're a frightened little wallflower or Chuck Norris in drag.
I've always been strong and independent.
It was what attracted AXH to me -- and it was what made me proud enough not to see the warning signs and take them seriously.
I thought I was strong enough to handle it all.
But alcoholism broke me.
And I wasn't even the alcoholic.
Alcoholism breaks you down, whether you're a frightened little wallflower or Chuck Norris in drag.
I've always been strong and independent.
It was what attracted AXH to me -- and it was what made me proud enough not to see the warning signs and take them seriously.
I thought I was strong enough to handle it all.
But alcoholism broke me.
And I wasn't even the alcoholic.
I now believe it!
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