Codies have weak backbones?
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I'm new here but I've been lurking for a couple of months now. I'll introduce myself soon in another thread. I am so grateful this board exists, it's been a great source of information and comfort to me.
I just wanted to share what friend of mine (who's 23 yrs sober) shared with me the other night on the topic of codie's...
He said, "Feelings can be our downfall, and feelings are not facts....feelings change, facts are constant. Do not over analyze, being co-dependent is no more than trying to live/improve someones life who is not helping themselves. Making excuses, changing plans, foregoing our own needs for the bent ones of the dependent. Not a dirty word or concept, just a brick wall unless we change tact."
This made sense to me.
I just wanted to share what friend of mine (who's 23 yrs sober) shared with me the other night on the topic of codie's...
He said, "Feelings can be our downfall, and feelings are not facts....feelings change, facts are constant. Do not over analyze, being co-dependent is no more than trying to live/improve someones life who is not helping themselves. Making excuses, changing plans, foregoing our own needs for the bent ones of the dependent. Not a dirty word or concept, just a brick wall unless we change tact."
This made sense to me.
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Originally Posted by lillamy 
It doesn't matter what you start out with.
Alcoholism breaks you down, whether you're a frightened little wallflower or Chuck Norris in drag.
I've always been strong and independent.
It was what attracted AXH to me -- and it was what made me proud enough not to see the warning signs and take them seriously.
I thought I was strong enough to handle it all.
But alcoholism broke me.
And I wasn't even the alcoholic.
Alcoholism breaks you down, whether you're a frightened little wallflower or Chuck Norris in drag.
I've always been strong and independent.
It was what attracted AXH to me -- and it was what made me proud enough not to see the warning signs and take them seriously.
I thought I was strong enough to handle it all.
But alcoholism broke me.
And I wasn't even the alcoholic.
Yeah, you nailed it. It breaks even the strongest down.
Elaborate on how your strength made you proud enough not to see the warning signs and take them seriously? I may have this trait too...but I can't wrap my head around it and understand what you are saying.
What I do know is that growing up in a very dysfunctional home caused me to have to endure. I had no other choice. abuse was everywhere, but as a child, there is no way out. Suffer and endure.
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Originally Posted by Thumper
I don't know about backbone but for me I think it was a combination of stubbornness, ego, and the ease with which I live in the land of magically thinking versus the land of reality.
It wasn't that I couldn't stand up to him (although it felt that way a lot of the time - I have very very weak boundaries) it was that I was not ready to admit defeat.
It wasn't that I couldn't stand up to him (although it felt that way a lot of the time - I have very very weak boundaries) it was that I was not ready to admit defeat.
Originally Posted by LifeRecovery
In relationships that I don't have some much intimacy with I don't struggle with mine/theirs as much (and don't get into as much trouble as a result). I can be definitive and decisive in those relationships easier as a result.
Great question, and great answers.
There's so many great posts as replies thanks to everybody I couldn't quote them all
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Weak backbone? For me, I don't know, I feel mine was more bend but NEVER EVER break backbone. I couldn't allow myself to break, ever. There was to much weight there to let it. How could I let everything go tumbling off my back? What a waste of everything I was fighting so hard for! By my own shear will I would not let that weight go. Maybe it cracked a few times, but I'd be damned if I ever let anyone know about it! Too proud. A man should be able to make it on his own. Stupid male pride.
Yes, never admit defeat, lick yer wounds & get back into battle! That was how I had to "live". What a horrible place to be.
Alcoholism held my face to floor for many years but I couldn't scream uncle. One day I whispered it & walked into Alanon.
Yes, never admit defeat, lick yer wounds & get back into battle! That was how I had to "live". What a horrible place to be.
Alcoholism held my face to floor for many years but I couldn't scream uncle. One day I whispered it & walked into Alanon.
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Join Date: Sep 2012
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You know, truthfully - there is a condition called 'codependency' BUT it is the human condition. And I'll venture to say that about 90% of humanity reacts the exact same way to a loved one's addiction. Baffled, angry, worried, hopeful, hopeless, fearful, relieved - confused. And then we wake up and are told it's a disease, which it is, and we do what comes naturally to the majority of humans, we instinctively try to help them. If a spouse has a disease- yes, we drive them to the doctor. We clean up our child's vomit. We help them with their pain. We take a parent to treatment. We make excuses for a sick sibling. That's how help is given to a loved one who has an illness.
But here with this disease we're told to go completely opposite of our instinct. We're told - let them go. Let them fall. Watch them lose their job, their income, their home, their hope. They could die from this - but you can't stop it. They're sick and there is zero that you can do except . . . stand back, suggest a treatment then watch them fail and let them land hard. The harder they fall, the better the chance of recovery. And if they die from it - so be it.
And add in that their disease is encourage every where we turn. There is no avoiding this murderer - every event, grocery store, drug store, gas station, restaurant, church, kitchen cabinet, their killer is applauded and celebrated, offered up at every turn.
Like - that's easy? We're swimming upstream. We're supposed to somehow remove out biology and go against our nature? And society. No, our world tips, we stumble, we vent, we work at letting go, we try to make logic out of the illogical but anyway you cut it's a life changing, butt kicking, difficult and arduous task.
Truthfully - I think we all have to stop beating ourselves up. This is a fricking, weird, mind boggling, senseless, murderous illness that the medical profession has yet to find a cure for. Someday, there will be a pill or a vaccine but right now no one on this Planet has it figured out - so how would we?
We do our very best. That's all we can do and you know, I'm proud of all the work I've done, the love I've given, the growth I've created and the challenges that I've tackled. Going through my spouse's addiction made me a better person and I can live with that. I think I've been pretty darn brave.
It's a hell of a medal to have survived and more than that - thrived. I reject calling myself a "codie", I'll take the word "conqueror"!
But here with this disease we're told to go completely opposite of our instinct. We're told - let them go. Let them fall. Watch them lose their job, their income, their home, their hope. They could die from this - but you can't stop it. They're sick and there is zero that you can do except . . . stand back, suggest a treatment then watch them fail and let them land hard. The harder they fall, the better the chance of recovery. And if they die from it - so be it.
And add in that their disease is encourage every where we turn. There is no avoiding this murderer - every event, grocery store, drug store, gas station, restaurant, church, kitchen cabinet, their killer is applauded and celebrated, offered up at every turn.
Like - that's easy? We're swimming upstream. We're supposed to somehow remove out biology and go against our nature? And society. No, our world tips, we stumble, we vent, we work at letting go, we try to make logic out of the illogical but anyway you cut it's a life changing, butt kicking, difficult and arduous task.
Truthfully - I think we all have to stop beating ourselves up. This is a fricking, weird, mind boggling, senseless, murderous illness that the medical profession has yet to find a cure for. Someday, there will be a pill or a vaccine but right now no one on this Planet has it figured out - so how would we?
We do our very best. That's all we can do and you know, I'm proud of all the work I've done, the love I've given, the growth I've created and the challenges that I've tackled. Going through my spouse's addiction made me a better person and I can live with that. I think I've been pretty darn brave.
It's a hell of a medal to have survived and more than that - thrived. I reject calling myself a "codie", I'll take the word "conqueror"!
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Alcoholism is addiction. The addiction is what drives them, it overpowers and dictates their lives until one day they MIGHT hit bottom. This is why it is SO important to take care of ourselves. It has nothing to do with a weak backbone.
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Originally Posted by MadeOfGlass
I don't know, I'm just asking, and basically accusing myself of having a weak backbone.
I like to think of myself as a strong woman with an assertive personality. Maybe I simply found someone with a bigger and stronger assertive personality. bit off more than I could chew?
I keep thinking about how the A really doesn't give a damn what we think of their drinking, else they would do something about it. Most of them continue on doing what they want to do, regardless of what we want. Yet at the same time, we panic, worry, fear, etc. , leave them, get weak, miss them horribly, focus on the pain of losing our love, cry, etc., and return to them as if we were bad, our tails between our legs....which I haven't done this time...YET, maybe never.
How do they have the ability to continue living just like they want to, regardless of what we want, when we are afraid half the time to even bring up the elephant in the room?
It's just a discussion is what I am looking for. How we endure and suffer, while they look at us with that kiss my ass look.
Maybe it's just my story, since the A never even tried to quit drinking. The message seemed to be clear--what are you going to do about it since you love me so much?
I like to think of myself as a strong woman with an assertive personality. Maybe I simply found someone with a bigger and stronger assertive personality. bit off more than I could chew?
I keep thinking about how the A really doesn't give a damn what we think of their drinking, else they would do something about it. Most of them continue on doing what they want to do, regardless of what we want. Yet at the same time, we panic, worry, fear, etc. , leave them, get weak, miss them horribly, focus on the pain of losing our love, cry, etc., and return to them as if we were bad, our tails between our legs....which I haven't done this time...YET, maybe never.
How do they have the ability to continue living just like they want to, regardless of what we want, when we are afraid half the time to even bring up the elephant in the room?
It's just a discussion is what I am looking for. How we endure and suffer, while they look at us with that kiss my ass look.
Maybe it's just my story, since the A never even tried to quit drinking. The message seemed to be clear--what are you going to do about it since you love me so much?
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Originally Posted by outtolunch
For me, codependency is the disease of the ego, my ego.
Originally Posted by OhBoy
Weak backbone? For me, I don't know, I feel mine was more bend but NEVER EVER break backbone. I couldn't allow myself to break, ever. There was to much weight there to let it. How could I let everything go tumbling off my back? What a waste of everything I was fighting so hard for! By my own shear will I would not let that weight go. Maybe it cracked a few times, but I'd be damned if I ever let anyone know about it! Too proud. A man should be able to make it on his own. Stupid male pride.
Yes, never admit defeat, lick yer wounds & get back into battle! That was how I had to "live". What a horrible place to be.
Alcoholism held my face to floor for many years but I couldn't scream uncle. One day I whispered it & walked into Alanon.
Yes, never admit defeat, lick yer wounds & get back into battle! That was how I had to "live". What a horrible place to be.
Alcoholism held my face to floor for many years but I couldn't scream uncle. One day I whispered it & walked into Alanon.
My ego feels bruised because my backbone seems weak compared to the A. He holds himself together (seemingly) trudges on, adjusts to me being gone, and doesn't appear to even have a ruffled feather. I know it's difficult for him, but he will never say "uncle" to his alcoholism.
I remember when my older brother would hold me down on the floor and beat me up, and insist I say "uncle" which I never would...crying or not, my ego was not going to give in to his.
For that I considered myself strong.
I'm just not sure when I am supposed to say uncle.
I'm thinking it is time to go back to alanon and whisper "uncle" myself. thank-you, OhBoy, for that. I learned early on to never give in, never admit defeat...my dignity depended upon it.
I am thinking the A in my life feels the same way.
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This bully beats on the A and the family. This bully's beating becomes more and more senseless as one resists or fights back. This bully eventually will kill those who stay out in the playground, one by one.
The one who has the strongest backbone is the one who cries "Uncle" first, and runs to the classroom, AA/NA or Al-Anon as the case may be.
The one who has the strongest backbone is the one who cries "Uncle" first, and runs to the classroom, AA/NA or Al-Anon as the case may be.
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Originally Posted by Titanic
This bully beats on the A and the family. This bully's beating becomes more and more senseless as one resists or fights back. This bully eventually will kill those who stay out in the playground, one by one.
The one who has the strongest backbone is the one who cries "Uncle" first, and runs to the classroom, AA/NA or Al-Anon as the case may be.
The one who has the strongest backbone is the one who cries "Uncle" first, and runs to the classroom, AA/NA or Al-Anon as the case may be.
totally contrary to what life taught me. time to rethink!
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