Expectations
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Expectations
One of the biggest stumbling blocks seems to be in placing unrealistic expectations on ourselves or others. Relationships can be a terribly painful area. We tend to fantasize and project what will happen. We get angry and resentful if our fantasies are not fulfilled. We forget that we are powerless over other people.
From the Basic Text-Chapter 7, Recovery and Relapse
This grabbed my attention, and I posted it, because I can relate to "expecting" things from others, placing "demands" on them they may, or may not know about, and then how I would let it affect me when they didn't do what I wanted.
Sure there are some basic expectations for example in a relationship, but are they open and out on the table, as boundary's, and are they realistic?
Or, do you end up being alone alot, because other people can't meet your "fantasy"?
Just wondering; thought I'd toss it out.
From the Basic Text-Chapter 7, Recovery and Relapse
This grabbed my attention, and I posted it, because I can relate to "expecting" things from others, placing "demands" on them they may, or may not know about, and then how I would let it affect me when they didn't do what I wanted.
Sure there are some basic expectations for example in a relationship, but are they open and out on the table, as boundary's, and are they realistic?
Or, do you end up being alone alot, because other people can't meet your "fantasy"?
Just wondering; thought I'd toss it out.
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Location: S.E. Mich.
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This is from the JFT Book, Nov. 24-
When the world doesn't measure up to our expectations, it's often our expectations that need adjusting, not the world. We can start by comparing our lives today with the way they used to be, developing gratitude for our recovery. We can extend this exercise in gratitude by counting the good things in our lives, becoming thankful that the world does not conform to our expectations but exceeds them.
When the world doesn't measure up to our expectations, it's often our expectations that need adjusting, not the world. We can start by comparing our lives today with the way they used to be, developing gratitude for our recovery. We can extend this exercise in gratitude by counting the good things in our lives, becoming thankful that the world does not conform to our expectations but exceeds them.
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Harwich, MA
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You know Doug? Since I started going to meeting, and really listening, I'm getting so much better at expections. I figured out that all of us, (strangers, family, etc) are making our way in this world as best we all can and that's all I can expect of them and me. It really helps. I'm not so angry anymore when someone lets me down or treats me not so great.
P.S. My husband is really happy about that!
P.S. My husband is really happy about that!
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: seattle
Posts: 468
It took me time to get a handle on my expectations.
Workiing through the steps helps me keep a reasonable mindset.
I used to hear that in early recovery, expectations were planned resentments, that is not to rely too much on my plans for others actions., that that could and would get me high again. Alot of my resentments were around my perception that others performance and behavior, in my mind, MADE me miserable. Expectations could in face be planned resentments...
That has helpes me set reasonable boundries, and keep "safe" from my feelings. Which swang wildly expecially in early recovery. THat swing has gotten better over time.
Recently, i have addopted a new attitude of expectations, that is that expectations are something that I can rely on to feel secure and stabel. Now that my motives are "clean", so to speak. That happened over time, and i had to get out of the drivers seat of the bus, or steamroller as it was in my case. I had to put faith into my higher powers will for me, to be happy. To look at my part, adjust my actions, sweep my side of the street.
I had to discover gratitude, as being happy wasnt something i was very good at while actively using. My friends said to try gratitude. Happiness was on its way, if I stuck to the steps. Being a part of the fellowship, working steps, has brought me the gift of being human once again. My demands list has gotten shorter, i feel a sense of live and LET live.
Workiing through the steps helps me keep a reasonable mindset.
I used to hear that in early recovery, expectations were planned resentments, that is not to rely too much on my plans for others actions., that that could and would get me high again. Alot of my resentments were around my perception that others performance and behavior, in my mind, MADE me miserable. Expectations could in face be planned resentments...
That has helpes me set reasonable boundries, and keep "safe" from my feelings. Which swang wildly expecially in early recovery. THat swing has gotten better over time.
Recently, i have addopted a new attitude of expectations, that is that expectations are something that I can rely on to feel secure and stabel. Now that my motives are "clean", so to speak. That happened over time, and i had to get out of the drivers seat of the bus, or steamroller as it was in my case. I had to put faith into my higher powers will for me, to be happy. To look at my part, adjust my actions, sweep my side of the street.
I had to discover gratitude, as being happy wasnt something i was very good at while actively using. My friends said to try gratitude. Happiness was on its way, if I stuck to the steps. Being a part of the fellowship, working steps, has brought me the gift of being human once again. My demands list has gotten shorter, i feel a sense of live and LET live.
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Live and let live is what I try to practice now. When I expected "specific's" from others, I was often left feeling let down, wronged, resentful, and/or hurt.
Since I'm married, I "expect" my wife to be faithful to me. Is that wrong? I don't know, I don't think so, but it's possible. I of course give her my entire faithfulness.
Do I expect her to always be right here for me, whenever I need? Nope.
To me, that's unrealistic. That's not allowing her to have any life, or problems, or hobbys', or fun of her own. I'm not letting her be her own person.
Friends. (male friends specifically), what do I expect from them? That they won't intentionally hurt my family. Is that wrong? Maybe...
Do I expect them to put me first, always, or mostly always? Nope. Again, seems unrealistic to me. And again, it's another two way street.
Which makes me think of another point, (another thread maybe). These things I do expect, am I willing to carry half of that load myself, or is the entire "burden" of the relationship on them? (maybe burden isn't the right word)
Anyway, yes I am willing. Willing to do my part in and for the relationship. I won't ask them to do it, if I'm not willing to do it. And there are various reasons at any given time why I can't be everything, to everybody all the time. That's just not possible, and in return, I don't expect that either.
*sigh* rambling now...time for a break. LOL
Since I'm married, I "expect" my wife to be faithful to me. Is that wrong? I don't know, I don't think so, but it's possible. I of course give her my entire faithfulness.
Do I expect her to always be right here for me, whenever I need? Nope.
To me, that's unrealistic. That's not allowing her to have any life, or problems, or hobbys', or fun of her own. I'm not letting her be her own person.
Friends. (male friends specifically), what do I expect from them? That they won't intentionally hurt my family. Is that wrong? Maybe...
Do I expect them to put me first, always, or mostly always? Nope. Again, seems unrealistic to me. And again, it's another two way street.
Which makes me think of another point, (another thread maybe). These things I do expect, am I willing to carry half of that load myself, or is the entire "burden" of the relationship on them? (maybe burden isn't the right word)
Anyway, yes I am willing. Willing to do my part in and for the relationship. I won't ask them to do it, if I'm not willing to do it. And there are various reasons at any given time why I can't be everything, to everybody all the time. That's just not possible, and in return, I don't expect that either.
*sigh* rambling now...time for a break. LOL
It is what it is!!!
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Sobriety
Posts: 5,767
Alot of my resentments were around my perception that others performance and behavior, in my mind, MADE me miserable. Expectations could in face be planned resentments...
I dont think 'expecting' my H to be faithful is an unrealistic expectation. He promised to when we married, that is a promise not an expectation I have of him.
My expectations of others usually come as AV said out of how I perceive others make me feel.....which is of course BS.
They also come out of my thinking of how people should respect others and me. And those are definately just resentments waiting to happen.
Today, I dont expect my happiness to come from someone else, and that is a good thing. But I do expect my sense of security to and I think that is wrong and something I definately need to work on.
Evolving Addict
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New York State
Posts: 3,067
When (and if) my expectations are based on total self-centeredness, I'm usually preparing myself for a let-down. In situations like that, I'm probably not looking at the big picture. I'm probably not considering the flip-side and only focused on what I want. For the most part, I keep my expectations to a minimum and I've learned that it's best for me to just do the best I can with what I have and leave the results up to my HP. Sure...relationships can be very painful if we allow them to be. On one hand, some things are common sense stuff, while other things require open and honest communication. Through trial and error we discover how to minimize the pain we receive and cause.
I've often discussed how I've had realistic expectations not be fulfilled. I'm talking about people NOT DOING what they swore they would, and the hurt, disappointment, inconvenience and distrust that resulted. People are notoriously unreliable and I have to remember that, above all else, they're human and flawed...just like me.
I've often discussed how I've had realistic expectations not be fulfilled. I'm talking about people NOT DOING what they swore they would, and the hurt, disappointment, inconvenience and distrust that resulted. People are notoriously unreliable and I have to remember that, above all else, they're human and flawed...just like me.
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Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: anomaly
Posts: 2,180
yeah but there has to be a balance in there somewhere.
I don't know...there is a significant different between AA and NA...
There's the SELF stamp on the diamond.
it's unrealistic of me to not expect my GF to be fateful to me.
If i don't admit that to myself than I'm lying to myself.
I don't know...the last i checked she say it wasn't an open realtionship.lol
I trust in myself..it's her god damn problem if she cheated on me
and then wanna shift or project herself or the lack trust of herself on
to me..i don't know...she's the one that said..no cheating..
wtf...dose those guildlines or perimeters only apply to me ???lol
To give love and not expect it in return ????
f-that !!! that's unrealitic...and that's up in the perimeter
of me playing god and acting like god..that i don't need any love
in return or being numb to everything and not processing my
emotions and feelings. at the very least..no balance.
hell even the bill collectors expect me to pay up.
even society at large expect me to be a decent human being
of couse i don't expect her to crawl up my butt everyday.
i don't need that..i need time alone. I have my own hobbies, interest
and goals. A healthy relationship is like so. and she agrees with
that.
I don't expect myself to be damn saint either just becuase
i got clean and sober.
i don't know i expect myself to be clean and sober today and be honest
with myself today.
Alot of it has to do with appropricate..i think
if taken in proper context..sure, it would makesence to me not to expect myself
to be perfect because i have flaws.
but i can also use that of not having any expectations of myself..and not do a damn thing
and revert. kind of like going from one extreem to the other.
Hopefully i find a balance in there somewhere after many, many heart aches and mistakes.
The gray aera....holly schmolly.
I don't know...there is a significant different between AA and NA...
There's the SELF stamp on the diamond.
it's unrealistic of me to not expect my GF to be fateful to me.
If i don't admit that to myself than I'm lying to myself.
I don't know...the last i checked she say it wasn't an open realtionship.lol
I trust in myself..it's her god damn problem if she cheated on me
and then wanna shift or project herself or the lack trust of herself on
to me..i don't know...she's the one that said..no cheating..
wtf...dose those guildlines or perimeters only apply to me ???lol
To give love and not expect it in return ????
f-that !!! that's unrealitic...and that's up in the perimeter
of me playing god and acting like god..that i don't need any love
in return or being numb to everything and not processing my
emotions and feelings. at the very least..no balance.
hell even the bill collectors expect me to pay up.
even society at large expect me to be a decent human being
of couse i don't expect her to crawl up my butt everyday.
i don't need that..i need time alone. I have my own hobbies, interest
and goals. A healthy relationship is like so. and she agrees with
that.
I don't expect myself to be damn saint either just becuase
i got clean and sober.
i don't know i expect myself to be clean and sober today and be honest
with myself today.
Alot of it has to do with appropricate..i think
if taken in proper context..sure, it would makesence to me not to expect myself
to be perfect because i have flaws.
but i can also use that of not having any expectations of myself..and not do a damn thing
and revert. kind of like going from one extreem to the other.
Hopefully i find a balance in there somewhere after many, many heart aches and mistakes.
The gray aera....holly schmolly.
Last edited by SaTiT; 12-07-2007 at 11:07 AM.
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: seattle
Posts: 468
Originally Posted by Paulie 
They also come out of my thinking of how people should respect others and me. And those are definately just resentments waiting to happen.
Originally Posted by Doug
Friends. (male friends specifically), what do I expect from them? That they won't intentionally hurt my family. Is that wrong? Maybe...
Do I expect them to put me first, always, or mostly always? Nope. Again, seems unrealistic to me. And again, it's another two way street.
Ive been off the hook mad about this sort of behavior recently, although NOT expressed at meetings, OR face to face, not my place to fix him.
neither do I want to sober up either one of them after the breakup...
Still upsetting...though.
Originally Posted by GarryW
I've often discussed how I've had realistic expectations not be fulfilled. I'm talking about people NOT DOING what they swore they would, and the hurt, disappointment, inconvenience and distrust that resulted. People are notoriously unreliable and I have to remember that, above all else, they're human and flawed...just like me.
As for flawed, ive given up on thinking of other as flawed and sick. There just humans, to me.
Originally Posted by SaTiT
yeah but there has to be a balance in there somewhere.
I don't know...there is a significant different between AA and NA...
There's the SELF stamp on the diamond.
I don't know...there is a significant different between AA and NA...
There's the SELF stamp on the diamond.
finding use for all 3 fellowships, recovery from addiction in all those places.
NA isnt too terribly happenin here in ********, but i carry the message and literature around anyway...
CA is pretty jammin up here,
AA is the foundation for me, and where i met my addict sponser. however, AA meetings seldom carry the "depth" and "Weight" of experience necessary to lead a newcomer addict to recovery through 12 steps.
IMO, its true what it says in the basic text, that they (aa) can relate to to the solution, but many have no idea how sick i was as an addict.
I refuse to muddy my shares there as and ADDICT/ALCOHOLIC or WHATEVERAHOLIC. Singleness of purpose has the greatest benifit for newcomers in AA. but THE SOLUTION IS IN THE HALLS, SPONSERS< LITERATTURE< STEPS
This (quote from the basic text)still totally moves me to tears, though, sometimes. I now understand FREEDOM. I'm tired of the stigma. Im tired of the sick individiduals mentality. WE DO RECOVER>
Originally Posted by
"Our Symbol
Simplicity is the keynote of our symbol; it follows the simplicity of our Fellowship. We could find all sorts of occult and esoteric connotations in the simple outlines, but foremost in our minds were easily understood meanings and relationships. The outer circle denotes a universal and total program that has room within for all manifestations of the recovering and wholly recovered person. The square, whose lines are defined, is easily seen and understood; but there are other unseen parts of the symbol. The square base denotes Goodwill, the ground of both the fellowship and the member of our society. Actually, it is the four pyramid sides which rise from this base in a three dimensional figure that are the Self, Society, Service and God. All rise to the point of Freedom. All parts thus far are closely related to the needs and aims of the addict seeking recovery and the purpose of the fellowship seeking to make recovery available to all. The greater the base, as we grow in unity in numbers and in fellowship, the broader the sides and the higher the point of freedom. Probably the last to be lost to freedom will be the stigma of being an addict. Goodwill is best exemplified in service and proper service is "Doing the right thing for the right reason". When this supports and motivates both the individual and the fellowship, we are fully whole and wholly free. "
Simplicity is the keynote of our symbol; it follows the simplicity of our Fellowship. We could find all sorts of occult and esoteric connotations in the simple outlines, but foremost in our minds were easily understood meanings and relationships. The outer circle denotes a universal and total program that has room within for all manifestations of the recovering and wholly recovered person. The square, whose lines are defined, is easily seen and understood; but there are other unseen parts of the symbol. The square base denotes Goodwill, the ground of both the fellowship and the member of our society. Actually, it is the four pyramid sides which rise from this base in a three dimensional figure that are the Self, Society, Service and God. All rise to the point of Freedom. All parts thus far are closely related to the needs and aims of the addict seeking recovery and the purpose of the fellowship seeking to make recovery available to all. The greater the base, as we grow in unity in numbers and in fellowship, the broader the sides and the higher the point of freedom. Probably the last to be lost to freedom will be the stigma of being an addict. Goodwill is best exemplified in service and proper service is "Doing the right thing for the right reason". When this supports and motivates both the individual and the fellowship, we are fully whole and wholly free. "
Last edited by Aa_vark; 12-07-2007 at 11:36 AM.
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Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: anomaly
Posts: 2,180
There's has to be me in there somewhere..without me..i would have...
i don't know..nothing.
NA is an entity..However similar to AA...NA is still an entity.
I'm an entity...however much i love and care for my gf or partners.
I'm an enitiy.
However much i love and care about my sponsee...My recovery/program
won't save them. I had to work om my program and my recovery
and my sponsor made sure of that...my recovery not his.
I had to find my own HP...not his
I go to AA,NA,Al-anon...if there was GA here i'd go there too.
and i can appriciate the principles of it all.
i don't know, my sponsor say;
don't wear a diamond to a triangle unless you're asking for
it...in other words dress appropricately..as a simple instruction
and the principle of the thing.
The moola I put in an NA basket gose to NA and support NA services
world wide.
The moola I put in AA basket gose to AA,
I don't expect everybody to know the different.
i don't know..nothing.
NA is an entity..However similar to AA...NA is still an entity.
I'm an entity...however much i love and care for my gf or partners.
I'm an enitiy.
However much i love and care about my sponsee...My recovery/program
won't save them. I had to work om my program and my recovery
and my sponsor made sure of that...my recovery not his.
I had to find my own HP...not his
I go to AA,NA,Al-anon...if there was GA here i'd go there too.
and i can appriciate the principles of it all.
i don't know, my sponsor say;
don't wear a diamond to a triangle unless you're asking for
it...in other words dress appropricately..as a simple instruction
and the principle of the thing.
The moola I put in an NA basket gose to NA and support NA services
world wide.
The moola I put in AA basket gose to AA,
I don't expect everybody to know the different.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: seattle
Posts: 468
thanks satit.
I can see the pyramid just fine.
I do know freedom. i do have a new happyness. i do have a new love for people and i do not regret my path.
I am very much trying to see only 2 spirits in the world, myself and my god's. true unity. Simplicity. only 2 souls.
Oh, and no, i do not, either, expect anybody to know the difference. I hear ya, man.
I can see the pyramid just fine.
Originally Posted by
The square base denotes Goodwill, the ground of both the fellowship and the member of our society. Actually, it is the four pyramid sides which rise from this base in a three dimensional figure that are the Self, Society, Service and God
I am very much trying to see only 2 spirits in the world, myself and my god's. true unity. Simplicity. only 2 souls.
Oh, and no, i do not, either, expect anybody to know the difference. I hear ya, man.
Last edited by Aa_vark; 12-07-2007 at 12:02 PM.
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: seattle
Posts: 468
Originally Posted by Paulie
Today, I dont expect my happiness to come from someone else, and that is a good thing. But I do expect my sense of security to and I think that is wrong and something I definately need to work on.
I found the "fourth column" useful, how did self-will fail me in whatever resentment... and what kind of fear was at the root.
Originally Posted by SaTiT
love
in return or being numb to everything and not processing my
emotions and feelings.
in return or being numb to everything and not processing my
emotions and feelings.
such as that. I can still get pretty rightously peeved but must consider the extreme results i could get with that type of thinking. Either way. Love me my way or loose me forever. Doesnt work for me. I never was a doormat, but still cary very rigid expectations.
Last edited by Aa_vark; 12-07-2007 at 05:20 PM.
Evolving Addict
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New York State
Posts: 3,067
I agree with SaTiT that there has to be a balance. For me, finding a balance in all things is a desirable endeavor. Yet, I have come to understand that the only "thing" that creates and maintains the balance I seek is me. I mean, no one can give it to me...I have to develop it. Also, for me, this is where the steps come in to play. The principles of open-mindedness, surrender, acceptance, humility, willingness, forgiveness, empathy, consideration, integrity, fidelity, responsibility, faith, simplicity, etc..., when practiced in all my affairs, allow me to stay on a level basis inside and outside.
As I said before, we humans are inherently flawed (meaning, not perfect). We all have defects (addict or non-addict). I can choose to accept this reality, or live in denial. We humans are also self-centered...whether we want to admit it or not. And more times than not, we base our expectations on what we want. I'll use my previous example, for instance: If someone swears they'll do something with me or for me (and I believe it), I believe it because I WANT TO, not because I have to. And when they fail to live up to their promise, are they totally to blame for my feelings? I doubt it. To say so would imply that they're responsible for my emotions and/or reactions and I have no responsibility for them. It's like the commonly used saying, "YOU made me mad!!" Yeah...whatever.
This is just what the JFT and Basic Text is talking about - separating fantasy (what I want, that hasn't happened yet) from reality (what is). The world (and the people in it) doesn't have to conform to my expectations, rather I need to adjust my expectations and deal with what's real...hence, the balance.
Today, I don't give love tied to a condition that I be loved in return. Why? Because I love myself today and understand that "conditional love" isn't real love anyway. I desire to be loved, but it's not a requirement for existence. If a GF cheats and I get hurt because of it, I probably ignored something about her based on my own self-centered desires. I don't know about "love" being blind, but my experience has proven to me that lust sure is.
Bill collectors certainly do expect me to pay for the services rendered. If I don't pay, I need to expect those services to be terminated. The balance is maintained as long as I remain responsible and pay my debts.
All my relationships require me to play my part. I didn't get clean and recovering to become the 1st perfect person on the planet. For me, staying clean isn't as much an expectation as it is a goal or desire. I don't know what tomorrow will bring. Tomorrow is the fantasy and today is my reality. Just for today I choose not to use and the balance is achieved. As a non-perfect human (flawed), I'm just doing the best I can with what I have and all is well.
As I said before, we humans are inherently flawed (meaning, not perfect). We all have defects (addict or non-addict). I can choose to accept this reality, or live in denial. We humans are also self-centered...whether we want to admit it or not. And more times than not, we base our expectations on what we want. I'll use my previous example, for instance: If someone swears they'll do something with me or for me (and I believe it), I believe it because I WANT TO, not because I have to. And when they fail to live up to their promise, are they totally to blame for my feelings? I doubt it. To say so would imply that they're responsible for my emotions and/or reactions and I have no responsibility for them. It's like the commonly used saying, "YOU made me mad!!" Yeah...whatever.
This is just what the JFT and Basic Text is talking about - separating fantasy (what I want, that hasn't happened yet) from reality (what is). The world (and the people in it) doesn't have to conform to my expectations, rather I need to adjust my expectations and deal with what's real...hence, the balance.
Today, I don't give love tied to a condition that I be loved in return. Why? Because I love myself today and understand that "conditional love" isn't real love anyway. I desire to be loved, but it's not a requirement for existence. If a GF cheats and I get hurt because of it, I probably ignored something about her based on my own self-centered desires. I don't know about "love" being blind, but my experience has proven to me that lust sure is.
Bill collectors certainly do expect me to pay for the services rendered. If I don't pay, I need to expect those services to be terminated. The balance is maintained as long as I remain responsible and pay my debts.
All my relationships require me to play my part. I didn't get clean and recovering to become the 1st perfect person on the planet. For me, staying clean isn't as much an expectation as it is a goal or desire. I don't know what tomorrow will bring. Tomorrow is the fantasy and today is my reality. Just for today I choose not to use and the balance is achieved. As a non-perfect human (flawed), I'm just doing the best I can with what I have and all is well.
cunning. baffling. powerful.
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 183
Weird. I was just thinking about the whole expectations thing, but in reverse. As in, what do you do when someone grafts their expectations on to you and treats you accordingly regardless of your actual behavior.
Until recently, I owned a large web forum similar to this one and for many years I put a lot of heart and soul into it. With the responsibilities of veterinary school etc., I realized that I couldn't stay as actively involved and I started to delegate responsibility, slowly scaling back my level of control over the site. It was a difficult transition in the beginning because it was comparable to having a living room where you feel at home and everyone is welcome to hang out. And they start moving furniture, inviting strangers you don't like in, spilling grape juice on the carpet... The only hitch is, you told them to make themselves at home. You can't fault people for listening.
I let go more and more over the years. I watched the site change its focus, the way it was run, and the kind of subjects discussed. I had the choice to leave behind my expectations that the new admin team would run the site like I did or forever be resentful that they had "ruined my work". I chose the former. I stopped comparing their moderation decisions to mine, stopped expecting them to treat me differently because of my history with the site, and even stopped expecting them to show me respect for the work I did in the past (since it was clear they weren't going to). The more I let go, the easier it was to do so and I enjoyed being there again.
Dropping any expectations gave me room to trust their decisions even when I didn't understand them and let me praise their work for what it was: theirs. I still owned the site, but I made it clear in the beginning that they were in charge and I would always respect their authority. I did this by continuing to support the site monetarily, openly showing my praise and gratitude.
I probably held on as owner a little too long, but I finally made the decision to pass that on too when I realized that site was leaning more and more towards content and attitudes that offended my moral sensibilities as a Catholic. I had the choice to censor (which I am heavily opposed to - the site doesn't even have a filter for obscenities, just a request that people don't go overboard) or stop paying for content I didn't feel comfortable providing. I think I did the right thing. I have nothing against those ideas and attitudes being out there, I just didn't want them there on my dime. I made it very clear that I did this for me as well as the benefit of the site. They work hard, the membership is obviously happy, and the issue was 100% mine. I did not abandon them with unpaid bills, but gave to them a server that was paid up for 3 years.
The only problem is that, despite years of demonstrating my trust in them, years of praise for their efforts, and years of gratitude for keeping something I love so much going; they behave towards me as though I'm doing the opposite. They believe my praise is false - an attempt to manipulate them and often take things I say out of context, accusing me of undermining their authority. While I have given them my support, I feel like I have not received theirs in return.
I have put the serenity prayer into action to the best of my ability here; accepting that these are things I cannot change and therefore do not wish to change. For years I have attempted to be both honorable and honest, keep my promises to them, and remain a participant. For even though this difficulty exists, I still have a lot of love for the site, its membership and staff, and most of all, I enjoy being there.
This evening I found myself in a discussion with one the administrators about this very topic; that I was constantly disappointed in them. I tried to explain that one can't be disappointed if they have no expectations; that my only expectation was that they do the right thing for the site and its membership and what that right thing was was up to them, not me. I was asked a series of direct questions in an admitted attempt to "call me out" on all the various times I'd been angry or disappointed with them. Most of her examples, I had no recollection of, let alone having a strong emotional reaction to. And when I finally explained that my only reason for being on the site at all was: "To enjoy myself collaborating creatively with others. And when it doesn't work out that way I say 'that's life' and look forward to returning on another day to enjoy myself then. No big deal." (It's a site for budding and hobbyist comics writers to share and write collaboratively.) She didn't believe me, insisting that no one could be that simple.
But that's the thing, I am. I'm at one of those times in my life where if things aren't simple and enjoyable, I don't do them. Vet school is difficult and I have been blessed with an interesting life where things are always going wrong. I don't want high school style layers of gossip and second guessing over silly little short stories on a web site; I want to take an hour or two on an evening and write or read or talk about things I've written or read. I don't care about the politics!
I feel stuck. I still have a lot of love for my "home on the internet" and my feelings about it, the members, and the Administration are all genuine. Unfortunately, as my level of frustration rises it becomes more and more difficult to enjoy myself there. I suppose this is the only thing that truly disappoints me; the reasonable expectation that if I treat people well and with respect, I will at best receive the same in return and at worst be ignored. Instead I am being singled out an targeted for things I have not done by the very people I granted authority.
It leaves me in a difficult situation. I do not want to lose yet another thing I love. Is there any hope or do I just need to accept this as another thing I cannot change?
~SK
Until recently, I owned a large web forum similar to this one and for many years I put a lot of heart and soul into it. With the responsibilities of veterinary school etc., I realized that I couldn't stay as actively involved and I started to delegate responsibility, slowly scaling back my level of control over the site. It was a difficult transition in the beginning because it was comparable to having a living room where you feel at home and everyone is welcome to hang out. And they start moving furniture, inviting strangers you don't like in, spilling grape juice on the carpet... The only hitch is, you told them to make themselves at home. You can't fault people for listening.
I let go more and more over the years. I watched the site change its focus, the way it was run, and the kind of subjects discussed. I had the choice to leave behind my expectations that the new admin team would run the site like I did or forever be resentful that they had "ruined my work". I chose the former. I stopped comparing their moderation decisions to mine, stopped expecting them to treat me differently because of my history with the site, and even stopped expecting them to show me respect for the work I did in the past (since it was clear they weren't going to). The more I let go, the easier it was to do so and I enjoyed being there again.
Dropping any expectations gave me room to trust their decisions even when I didn't understand them and let me praise their work for what it was: theirs. I still owned the site, but I made it clear in the beginning that they were in charge and I would always respect their authority. I did this by continuing to support the site monetarily, openly showing my praise and gratitude.
I probably held on as owner a little too long, but I finally made the decision to pass that on too when I realized that site was leaning more and more towards content and attitudes that offended my moral sensibilities as a Catholic. I had the choice to censor (which I am heavily opposed to - the site doesn't even have a filter for obscenities, just a request that people don't go overboard) or stop paying for content I didn't feel comfortable providing. I think I did the right thing. I have nothing against those ideas and attitudes being out there, I just didn't want them there on my dime. I made it very clear that I did this for me as well as the benefit of the site. They work hard, the membership is obviously happy, and the issue was 100% mine. I did not abandon them with unpaid bills, but gave to them a server that was paid up for 3 years.
The only problem is that, despite years of demonstrating my trust in them, years of praise for their efforts, and years of gratitude for keeping something I love so much going; they behave towards me as though I'm doing the opposite. They believe my praise is false - an attempt to manipulate them and often take things I say out of context, accusing me of undermining their authority. While I have given them my support, I feel like I have not received theirs in return.
I have put the serenity prayer into action to the best of my ability here; accepting that these are things I cannot change and therefore do not wish to change. For years I have attempted to be both honorable and honest, keep my promises to them, and remain a participant. For even though this difficulty exists, I still have a lot of love for the site, its membership and staff, and most of all, I enjoy being there.
This evening I found myself in a discussion with one the administrators about this very topic; that I was constantly disappointed in them. I tried to explain that one can't be disappointed if they have no expectations; that my only expectation was that they do the right thing for the site and its membership and what that right thing was was up to them, not me. I was asked a series of direct questions in an admitted attempt to "call me out" on all the various times I'd been angry or disappointed with them. Most of her examples, I had no recollection of, let alone having a strong emotional reaction to. And when I finally explained that my only reason for being on the site at all was: "To enjoy myself collaborating creatively with others. And when it doesn't work out that way I say 'that's life' and look forward to returning on another day to enjoy myself then. No big deal." (It's a site for budding and hobbyist comics writers to share and write collaboratively.) She didn't believe me, insisting that no one could be that simple.
But that's the thing, I am. I'm at one of those times in my life where if things aren't simple and enjoyable, I don't do them. Vet school is difficult and I have been blessed with an interesting life where things are always going wrong. I don't want high school style layers of gossip and second guessing over silly little short stories on a web site; I want to take an hour or two on an evening and write or read or talk about things I've written or read. I don't care about the politics!
I feel stuck. I still have a lot of love for my "home on the internet" and my feelings about it, the members, and the Administration are all genuine. Unfortunately, as my level of frustration rises it becomes more and more difficult to enjoy myself there. I suppose this is the only thing that truly disappoints me; the reasonable expectation that if I treat people well and with respect, I will at best receive the same in return and at worst be ignored. Instead I am being singled out an targeted for things I have not done by the very people I granted authority.
It leaves me in a difficult situation. I do not want to lose yet another thing I love. Is there any hope or do I just need to accept this as another thing I cannot change?
~SK
Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: anomaly
Posts: 2,180
Recovery is a trip... it is what it is
A trip of hills and valleys, twist and truns.
Sometimes i like it, sometimes i don't. Sometime i feel like dance on top
of the world, other times my ass just falls off.
Sometimes i savor the goodtimes enjoy them with everybreath..
it's helps me gets through the rainy days.
As soon as i think i have it all figure out..no matter how far I've traveled.
the wheel of life keeps on spining..the wind changes directions...
and sometimes I don't adjust my sails fast enough.
Other times there's just no damn wind at all.lol
I don't know...i never consider myself to be a doormate..but i imagine
my dealers had a different perspective when i was using
As bad as the **** gets sometimes in recovery...
There's always going to be a saying to make me feel like crap even
more..
" MY WORST DAYS CLEAN and SOBER is BETTER than MY BEST DAYS
DRINKING and USING".lol
Nope..never liked pain. But i guess feeling pain is better than being dead.
My spirit is still alive...so i guess sometimes pain can be growth.lol
Didn't exactly wake up every morning hoping and praying that
someone i love and care for would actually cheat on my ass..
it's a wierd experince. you don't know wheater to laugh or cry.
so you do both...lol
well....I didn't plan it that way that's for damn sure.
yeah...didn't plan on loosing another thing that i love either,
especailly in recovery, eapecially after all these years.
Rocketed 2 the 4th into the spirit of the sunlight..so hangon2urass.
mmm..what would I expect when i get there.lol
A trip of hills and valleys, twist and truns.
Sometimes i like it, sometimes i don't. Sometime i feel like dance on top
of the world, other times my ass just falls off.
Sometimes i savor the goodtimes enjoy them with everybreath..
it's helps me gets through the rainy days.
As soon as i think i have it all figure out..no matter how far I've traveled.
the wheel of life keeps on spining..the wind changes directions...
and sometimes I don't adjust my sails fast enough.
Other times there's just no damn wind at all.lol
I don't know...i never consider myself to be a doormate..but i imagine
my dealers had a different perspective when i was using
As bad as the **** gets sometimes in recovery...
There's always going to be a saying to make me feel like crap even
more..
" MY WORST DAYS CLEAN and SOBER is BETTER than MY BEST DAYS
DRINKING and USING".lol
Nope..never liked pain. But i guess feeling pain is better than being dead.
My spirit is still alive...so i guess sometimes pain can be growth.lol
Didn't exactly wake up every morning hoping and praying that
someone i love and care for would actually cheat on my ass..
it's a wierd experince. you don't know wheater to laugh or cry.
so you do both...lol
well....I didn't plan it that way that's for damn sure.
yeah...didn't plan on loosing another thing that i love either,
especailly in recovery, eapecially after all these years.
Rocketed 2 the 4th into the spirit of the sunlight..so hangon2urass.
mmm..what would I expect when i get there.lol
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