doggonecarl

Alcoholism doesn't even make the top ten.

BeckoningCat

One of the biggest causes of alcohol-related deaths is drunk driving, which all alcoholics do not engage in. Drunk driving is absolutely a self-chosen and morally loaded choice, even if you feel you've no control over the drinking itself. I just want to mention that because drunk driving is included in those statistics. I have never related to drunk drivers. I was a little tipsy once in my late teens, pulled to the side of the road, and had someone pick me up. Never once did I leave a party or go on a wine binge and say "hey this would be a good time to drive, especially with some kids, or really anyone else's life in my hands."

But people who are addicts have a disease. I don't think alcoholism is a choice, if it were, everyone who drank alcohol at all would be an alcoholic. And it would be easier for alcoholics to stop drinking.

All that being said, this was understandable, that you want to draw attention to the deaths alcohol causes and that's very noble.

On the other hand, downplaying the seriousness of COVID-19 is really not accurate or helpful.

Rockbottom1964

I never said it was among the top 10, or even top 100, Carl. I said it’s a bigger killer – as quote-posted by yourself – than COVID19. And I meant that in a historical sense; over decades and centuries. Alcoholism will still be with us when COVID19 is just a dim memory.
Just to clarify – are you saying because alcoholism isn't up there among the top 10, it doesn’t kill enough people to justify it being compared to COVID19??
But there I go – chasing my tail again…

Rockbottom1964

Downplaying Covid19 was really not my intention, BCat. Pointing at the “downplaying” of Governments and individuals of Alcoholism as a disease is/was.

doggonecarl

What I'm saying is it doesn't make sense to compare any disease, malady, affliction, or whatever to another, or to name one "worse" than another.

You know what the worst disease is?


The one that kills you.

August252015

The only thing I will add is that CODs listed in top ten....some of them (I am not one to throw % or such around, y'all, so leave it alone) can actually directly attributed to alcohol. I think we all see the obits or hear about someone where it's just not mentioned....Alcoholism or not, drinking too much is an underlying cause of death for plenty of heart related issues, fatal falls, and so on.

RB - you ok? Echoing Nathan's question bc continuing on this line of argumentation is def something I did while drinking, or when struggling emotionally.

Peace
A

Rockbottom1964

RB - you ok? Echoing Nathan's question bc continuing on this line of argumentation is def something I did while drinking, or when struggling emotionally.

Peace
A[/QUOTE]

Hi, August. I’m all right, thank you. And I’m not drinking. Just find myself in a draconian lock-down situation (the strictest in the world, they say); decided on and enforced by a bunch of corrupt Kleptocrats with beach-houses and farms to run to.
So whereas I could at least take a walk for an hour or two (in daylight) to get away from the alcoholic surrounds I’m in, I now have to stay put. Not allowed to walk around the block; not allowed to walk my two dogs; no exercise; the huge public park across the road is completely deserted… To top it off, my dad (78 years old) is getting more argumentative and offensively foul-mouthed by the day - and there are still 17 bottles of brandy left. Last Thursday there were 27... 10 Bottles in 8 days…
Also – another reason I keep hammering (back) on this issue, is because I’m an alcoholic. Alcohol is my problem/sickness, not COVID19. The virus has added a restrictive element to my already s****y life, but alcohol was the causal agent. I HATE the one, the other leaves me cold.
Thanks for asking/caring.

113 Days sober today.

August252015

Thanks for answering RB! Hate it when we worry and get the no comment!

And being around alcoholics (not in recovery) would be tough. I'm always grateful my husband is too and for sure now.

I will say that we do have a choice to stop drinking and get help, and if we don't pick up again, we get free to choose life. I wouldn't have that same choice w any infectious disease.

Stay well.

TimeNeedsTime

Do you mean like liquor stores across the world being deemed an essential service like food and public health?

I know exactly what he means. The world is in complete denial and this covid event has exposed the elephant in the room yet again.

Youd be blown away by how many do not realise that drinking four nights a week means you have a serious problem.

TimeNeedsTime

With the greatest of respect my friend no one knows how long covid will be with us.

Although I do find it very alarming that the WHO released the news on new years eve last. The paranoia in me is screaming that covid20 is coming to town real soon. This is all speculation ofcourse because no one knows diddly squat about jack. But I firmly believe this is far from over. Social distancing will be here for a very long time at the least.

ICETHEKING

People get real. Everyone thinks and processes information differently. Rock was making a solid effort to make a statement about how devastating alcoholism is compared to a disease that has tactics that are far more obvious. He is not "chasing his tail" or comparing "apples and oranges" Rock is using the brain he was born with to extrapolate information and causality. This is one of the huge draw backs of SR. Anytime someone has a post slightly off center people feel the need to immediately shoot it down before they bother to think.

ICETHEKING

Alcohol could easily of played a role in a lot of the causes in the top ten that are listed Carl. That is what makes it so devastating. I believe that is a portion of what he is trying to say.

Rockbottom1964

Thanks, ICE, for the constructive support.
It’s sobering – pardon the pun – how many people are detractors of alcohol and alcoholism as a killer. The fact that alcohol is a mega-killer – directly or indirectly – elicits almost deafening silence from governments, business and individuals; or at best scoffing and/or “let’s change the subject”. Perhaps it’s the thought of all that profits and taxes disappearing? Taxes they are now spending to fight COVID19.
PS. I wonder if alcoholism is also among the “underlying issues” – like Asthma and Cancer – that is “contributing” towards a higher mortality rate for the COVID19 virus? It would be interesting to know how many of the dead had weakened immune systems due to alcohol-abuse…
Just chasing my tail…again…

August252015

In women, alcohol abuse (even if not alcoholics) is a growing problem and has been tied to higher rates of breast cancer. So I'd say yes to your questions as things that put us into higher risk categories for the virus could easily have underlying issues due to excessive drinking.

HeadEast

That was rude.

Dee74

Yes it was.

I think we can do better than squabbling amongst ourselves, especially now when people need help and guidance.

I understand that some of you find the issue important but from my perspective overseeing the arguments here is eating into time I could be spending elsewhere.

Both sides of the argument have been stated and restated.
I foresee ever diminishing returns here.

Lets go help someone else.
Thread closed.

Dee
Administrator
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