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Old 09-08-2015, 06:41 PM
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anger

Alcoholics and drug addicts have an innocent quality. They expect the sun to shine on them and when it doesn't they get pissed at the world. But their tantrums are also expressions of wild optimism. The tantrum is full of outrageous hope: that the world will finally behave itself, that people are innately good and will come around.

It's like their minds, my mind, can't contain a mature apprehension of people, but needs to swing from feeling like a piece of shi* to throwing a spiritual tantrum at god.

The rub is that what purports to describing a situation only obscures the actual situation. Neither point of view, the victim position or that of righteous indignation, captures how truly 100% loathsome people can be, or how noble they can be.
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Old 09-08-2015, 06:56 PM
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Hi davaidavai did something happen today that brought this to mind?
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Old 09-08-2015, 07:07 PM
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Not much happens. Maybe I'm just trying to find my way into a rich experience as an observer. No one is ever around, and that is unavoidably painful, but if I can see the full spectrum of humanity then maybe I wont feel like getting drunk. Maybe it's what Buddhists talk about when they talk about the present, although every Buddhist I've ever met has been a yuppie scenester with a mortgage and an ex wife.
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Old 09-08-2015, 07:08 PM
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It's true that words can't capture things, but they are all we have. Although some might argue quite soundly we'd do best to just shut up, I'm still for trying to thrash things out :-)

I wasn't able to maturely apprehend my narcissistic mother until around age 45. The relationship got much better and more enjoyable after that point. In that context, resignation is much easier than hope, I've found. Like I said to my sister once but she can't do it (fair enough); lower your expectations :-)
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Old 09-08-2015, 07:21 PM
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The confusion, the frustration, the sense that people are unreliable. Welcome to the fun zone. Here, junior, you go and live in this crazy, house of mirrors world that's inside my head that I don't even live in. --Narcissistic parent
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Old 09-08-2015, 07:24 PM
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Who is talking to Junior there? God?
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Old 09-08-2015, 07:27 PM
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My father, I guess.
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Old 09-08-2015, 07:29 PM
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So you still have a fair bit to do with him? I think I read elsewhere he is a meth addict. How are things going? Geez, the thought of my mother on meth makes me shudder....
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Old 09-08-2015, 07:32 PM
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I have one of those too.
I cut off all contact many years ago.
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Old 09-08-2015, 07:37 PM
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Yup. I've cut people out of my life before from being deeply hurt. I always felt/feel guilty about that though. Like it's some kind of failure on my part. I think the fantasy is I *should* be big, forgiving, and loving enough to look past it. Should is a dangerous word.
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Old 09-08-2015, 09:36 PM
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Maybe anger helps with awakening, as awful as that sounds. Like a cranky child waking up in the morning. We are all nestled in beds made up for us by our parents, society, human history. 'Positive thinking' is certainly a theraputic misunderstanding, although it makes great market sense. Eat drink pray puke
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Old 09-08-2015, 09:49 PM
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I like that. I think everything helps with awakening - anger included. Perhaps anger especially.

I've never seen Eat, drink, pray, puke, and I hope to never :-)
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Old 09-08-2015, 10:14 PM
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It's awful, it's Julia Roberts eating pizza in Italy dressed in a Free People top and *Spoiler Alert* buying bigger pants so she can eat more pizza and it's liberating or something.

I've been eating pizza and buying bigger pants since 1992... Where's my movie?
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Old 09-08-2015, 10:25 PM
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Oh Gosh, that sounds so charming. Julia Roberts buying bigger pants so she can eat more pizza....NOT!!!!

Your movie is coming, Sleepie, and when it comes......LOOK OUT!!!
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Old 09-09-2015, 05:02 AM
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It's that book with the smug rich white lady on the front: Eat, Pray, Love. The name of the book should really be, Eat, Pray, Love, Be Blond, Skinny, From a Good Home, Have Enough Leisure Time and Economic Security to pursue a Satisfying Career in Writing.
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Old 09-09-2015, 05:42 AM
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davaidavai love your posts and how you put things. I had to try and not allow the frustrations of reality sink there claws into me too deeply if that makes any sense.

More and more often i'd see situations and rather then it getting to me i'd b liek pff ths BS.. thats BS too whats that matter. what does this matter nothing matters what does it matter? I started seeing the contradictions in evrything and realizing yeah for the most part a lot of it is a load of crap and why am I going to burden myself with poo anymore unless I wanna feel like crap?

But then yeah there is the other side that buddahism side if you will. IE things cant be perfect without imperfection etc.. so the combo of them both must be perfection. How great it is that we can have some crummy stuff to help us better appreciate the good stuff. Or good stuff so we can see the bad stuff.

Someone one time told me that they think god made people so that he could expierience imperfection. I thought yeah thats an interesting concept. I've read that now in many books basicly it almost seems as if others feel the same way. who knows.
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Old 09-09-2015, 05:30 PM
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Buddhism is a radical rejection, way beyond calling BS. The Veil of Maya, suffering, life is a dream, non being is bliss. It's extreme. It's nihilistic and radical and reasoned out. Reasoned out intellectual arguments for rejection. Although I doubt any Buddhist would accept the relevancy of anger, even an non white, non rich, non convertible driving non womanizing non tofu mispreparing Buddhist.

Families are like civilizations. They rise and fall. And a narcissistic parent creates a house of mirrors for his child to live in and that child thinks he is escaping but is just in the process of forming his own house of mirrors world view for his own progeny to sort through.

I felt good today. You feel good with a richer understanding of yourself, even if it's bleak. Because you realize you're not to blame for everything and in fact you didn't deserve the things other people deserved because you and your family weren't there yet. But you've got the seedy underbelly of human experience, and there are gems of mystery unfolding these parts that surface dwellers can't access.
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Old 09-10-2015, 01:50 PM
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Yes! Here's to the bottom feeders with soul!
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Old 09-10-2015, 04:23 PM
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Speak for yourself tooshabby. I consider myself a tramp, not a bottom feeder.
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Old 09-10-2015, 05:20 PM
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Lol you guys... I'm with the bottom feeders too... Tramps have charm, I got none of that!
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