A mid-stage alcoholic?
Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 2,579
Sounds like a lot of work ("controlling methods") if drinking is such a casual part of your life....JMHO
I had some of these questions about my own drinking in the past and have decided not to chance it. I played these mind games with cigarettes for awhile before I committed myself to quitting (still miss the "effect" but not the rest of it
).
Thanks for this insight;it had helped me today. I have seen my exAH do almost all of these things (and until I came to these boards did not realize much about alcoholism and what and why he did them) over the course of the 30yrs we were together. Some "worked" longer and better than others for him. He is still trying new methods! He did a "geographic" (moved out of our house),divorced me after 27yrs, is still alienating our children with his ever-increasing irrational behavior,sold his business and now may be in trouble of keeping the job at the place he started and ran (very successfully!) for 20yrs,(oh,yes...workaholism helped modify the drinking for awhile,too),etc.,etc.,etc. Only one thing is constant....he still feels not drinking is not an option (more now than in the earlier days when he could and would stop for awhile) and he just has to find the "right" circumstances or way....all these other things and people are the "trouble" in his mind. Very sad to watch from the sidelines.
p.s. glad you are here!
I had some of these questions about my own drinking in the past and have decided not to chance it. I played these mind games with cigarettes for awhile before I committed myself to quitting (still miss the "effect" but not the rest of it
). Thanks for this insight;it had helped me today. I have seen my exAH do almost all of these things (and until I came to these boards did not realize much about alcoholism and what and why he did them) over the course of the 30yrs we were together. Some "worked" longer and better than others for him. He is still trying new methods! He did a "geographic" (moved out of our house),divorced me after 27yrs, is still alienating our children with his ever-increasing irrational behavior,sold his business and now may be in trouble of keeping the job at the place he started and ran (very successfully!) for 20yrs,(oh,yes...workaholism helped modify the drinking for awhile,too),etc.,etc.,etc. Only one thing is constant....he still feels not drinking is not an option (more now than in the earlier days when he could and would stop for awhile) and he just has to find the "right" circumstances or way....all these other things and people are the "trouble" in his mind. Very sad to watch from the sidelines.
p.s. glad you are here!
Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 2,126
Hey Mattman ---
You said,
1) "...I'm probably not going to find the answer today.... or many sympathetic ears to the guy who wants to moderate (I'm not dumb, this IS an alcoholism forum with the prescription du jour being total abstinence) But I will read that book and I will keep searching..."
and
2) "...The only reason I'm posting here is the blackouts (and it's probably more like 20 in the past 10 months, not 40 - still a HUGE number IMHO). It could be a sign of alcoholism or it could just be my low tolerance..."
and, finally
3) "The real question then is that genetic difference and whether I fall into the alcoholic camp. Sounds like a "normal" person can control drinking through behavior, an alcoholic can not..."
Obviously, your last post included much more, but these are just the ones I wanted to address....for me (after all, it IS all about moi.......isn't it?.....lol) As for:
1) You've got my sympathetic ear..... (o: Yes, the prescription du jour here would be for abstinence......FOR THE ALCOHOLIC.....and regardless how folks may perceive you (or anyone, for that matter, even their dear ole sainted auntie), or what those folks may say..........YOU are the only person who can say that you are or are not an alcoholic.....nothing more need be said....least by me;
2) I'm not going to go into the causes of blackouts, or whether only alcoholics have blackouts, or whether blackouts are a precurser of alcoholism.....all I'll say here is that they are way more common than most folks think, and I'm going to send you a 'PM' with a couple of links regarding blackouts, and let you decide. If nothing else, they're quite informative.....and more links can be gotten by just using 'Blackouts' in a search engine.....; and finally
3) It may look like a normal drinker 'controls' their drinking, but to me, a normal drinker just stops at a certain point because they just don't WANT any more.....(kinda like you said about being on the beach, finishing a bottle of wine with a girl, and not wanting more, but.......&*^%$# .......lol). And again, let me say, that only you can say whether you fall into the 'alcoholic camp' or not; not anyone else, here or elsewhere.....
Now....just a wee bit about me, regarding your many statements, and your question to all.....'can an alcoholic do that?' Well, to some of those I might answer yes, IMHO, and to some I might answer no.....
Yes, alcoholism is a progressive disease, and for me it did progress to 24/7; 365/366, but then it regressed (digressed?) back to binging......not through control (per se), but because it was just easier to get through the weeks' work without drinking everyday.....although I surely did miss my morning coffee w/Southern Comfort to take the edge off, and get me going........lol My problem, in the end, was that my weekends became a wee bit longer than just Fri/Sat/Sun.....and I kept waking up in jail..........and I'm such a nice girl, too........lol ...........
Sooooooo, the way I see it, and the way it's been defined in the BB of AA, it's not how much I drank, or how often, but when I drank, could I control the outcome.....obviously NOT...........and since I didn't like the outcome (I can't tell you of many who could honestly say they like Texas jails....lol)......I QUIT!
I hope this helps you, in some small way.....do check out the two books mentioned here.....and if you haven't read the BB, check it out too........of course it was written by alcoholics, for alcoholics, it can still be educational for non-alcoholics.... (o:
In Recovery (however you see it....abstinence or moderation, whatever works, and makes you happy)....
NoelleR
DOS: 6/23/86
P.S. Now that I'm finished here, I'll just pop over and 'PM' you those links I promised, and I promise, you'll find them interesting..... (o:
You said,
1) "...I'm probably not going to find the answer today.... or many sympathetic ears to the guy who wants to moderate (I'm not dumb, this IS an alcoholism forum with the prescription du jour being total abstinence) But I will read that book and I will keep searching..."
and
2) "...The only reason I'm posting here is the blackouts (and it's probably more like 20 in the past 10 months, not 40 - still a HUGE number IMHO). It could be a sign of alcoholism or it could just be my low tolerance..."
and, finally
3) "The real question then is that genetic difference and whether I fall into the alcoholic camp. Sounds like a "normal" person can control drinking through behavior, an alcoholic can not..."
Obviously, your last post included much more, but these are just the ones I wanted to address....for me (after all, it IS all about moi.......isn't it?.....lol) As for:
1) You've got my sympathetic ear..... (o: Yes, the prescription du jour here would be for abstinence......FOR THE ALCOHOLIC.....and regardless how folks may perceive you (or anyone, for that matter, even their dear ole sainted auntie), or what those folks may say..........YOU are the only person who can say that you are or are not an alcoholic.....nothing more need be said....least by me;
2) I'm not going to go into the causes of blackouts, or whether only alcoholics have blackouts, or whether blackouts are a precurser of alcoholism.....all I'll say here is that they are way more common than most folks think, and I'm going to send you a 'PM' with a couple of links regarding blackouts, and let you decide. If nothing else, they're quite informative.....and more links can be gotten by just using 'Blackouts' in a search engine.....; and finally
3) It may look like a normal drinker 'controls' their drinking, but to me, a normal drinker just stops at a certain point because they just don't WANT any more.....(kinda like you said about being on the beach, finishing a bottle of wine with a girl, and not wanting more, but.......&*^%$# .......lol). And again, let me say, that only you can say whether you fall into the 'alcoholic camp' or not; not anyone else, here or elsewhere.....
Now....just a wee bit about me, regarding your many statements, and your question to all.....'can an alcoholic do that?' Well, to some of those I might answer yes, IMHO, and to some I might answer no.....
Yes, alcoholism is a progressive disease, and for me it did progress to 24/7; 365/366, but then it regressed (digressed?) back to binging......not through control (per se), but because it was just easier to get through the weeks' work without drinking everyday.....although I surely did miss my morning coffee w/Southern Comfort to take the edge off, and get me going........lol My problem, in the end, was that my weekends became a wee bit longer than just Fri/Sat/Sun.....and I kept waking up in jail..........and I'm such a nice girl, too........lol ...........
Sooooooo, the way I see it, and the way it's been defined in the BB of AA, it's not how much I drank, or how often, but when I drank, could I control the outcome.....obviously NOT...........and since I didn't like the outcome (I can't tell you of many who could honestly say they like Texas jails....lol)......I QUIT!
I hope this helps you, in some small way.....do check out the two books mentioned here.....and if you haven't read the BB, check it out too........of course it was written by alcoholics, for alcoholics, it can still be educational for non-alcoholics.... (o:
In Recovery (however you see it....abstinence or moderation, whatever works, and makes you happy)....
NoelleR
DOS: 6/23/86
P.S. Now that I'm finished here, I'll just pop over and 'PM' you those links I promised, and I promise, you'll find them interesting..... (o:
Follow Directions!
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Fredericksburg, Va.
Posts: 9,730
Thanks Noelle, great articles which I have to say I concur with. I replied to your PM, thanks again.
I am still shaking my head..... how in the world could that test say my drinking was dangerous and hazardous to my health?
I am still shaking my head..... how in the world could that test say my drinking was dangerous and hazardous to my health?
Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Anytown, USA
Posts: 264
Originally Posted by mattman 
I started drinking "weekends only" because it seemed like a bad habit drinking during the week.
...On the nights I've tried a beer-water-beer-water approach, I have MUCH more control. I seem to be on pace with everyone else in the bar and can decide when I've had enough.
... Maybe all I need to do is stop pre-boozing??
...I made a "NO SHOTS" rule for myself a couple years ago and that has eliminated many of the blackout nights
.... no pre-boozing could probably get rid of the rest of them.
....The "no shots" has helped me tremendously. Maybe I just need to implement "no pre-boozing" to finish the job?
"Despite all we can say, many who are real alcoholics are not going to believe they are in that class. By every form of self- deception and experimentation, they will try to prove themselves exceptions to the rule, therefore nonalcoholic. If anyone who is showing inability to control his drinking can do the right-about- face and drink like a gentleman, our hats are off to him. Heaven knows, we have tried hard enough and long enough to drink like other people!
"Here are some of the methods we have tried: Drinking beer only, limiting the number of drinks, never drinking alone, never drinking in the morning, drinking only at home, never having it in the house, never drinking during business hours, drinking only at parties, switching from scotch to brandy, drinking only natural wines, agreeing to resign if ever drunk on the job, taking a trip, not taking a trip, swearing off forever (with and without a solemn oath), taking more physical exercise, reading inspirational books, going to health farms and sanitariums, accepting voluntary commitment to asylums we could increase the list ad infinitum."
~From the Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous
You can read the whole chapter here. Lots of good stuff here: http://www.recovery.org/aa/bigbook/ww/chapter_3.html
You might find it interesting.
Good luck to you, keep reading & keep asking questions. Information is always a good thing to have! All the best.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: SAN DIEGO, CA
Posts: 379
Hey Matt -
Welcome to SR. You've made some interesting observations and asked some pointed questions.
My name is Liz and I'm an alcoholic. I've been sober for 36 days and I attend AA or outpatient rehab everyday. At an AA meeting the other day a man said that he started drinking just to calm down and mellow out. And, it worked. He was calm and serene for awhile. But, by the time he realized it was no longer working, he also realized that it was too late to quit. It was well beyond his willpower at that point. Quite an observation I thought.
No one can tell you if you're an alcoholic. I would recommend that you add the Big Book to your reading list! If nothing else, its a good read -
TinLizzy
Welcome to SR. You've made some interesting observations and asked some pointed questions.
My name is Liz and I'm an alcoholic. I've been sober for 36 days and I attend AA or outpatient rehab everyday. At an AA meeting the other day a man said that he started drinking just to calm down and mellow out. And, it worked. He was calm and serene for awhile. But, by the time he realized it was no longer working, he also realized that it was too late to quit. It was well beyond his willpower at that point. Quite an observation I thought.
No one can tell you if you're an alcoholic. I would recommend that you add the Big Book to your reading list! If nothing else, its a good read -
TinLizzy
Member
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 183
Here's a list of things that made me decide I'm an alcoholic:
1) I can never have just one or two. It doesn't matter how hard I try to moderate, it doesn't happen.
2) I would spend all the cash I had on me on alcohol, even if I gave myself a limit walking in. I never brought my debit/credit card because I knew I would open a tab.
3) Even not bringing cash, not planning on drinking, I always ended up drunk because other people would by me drinks. I must be cute lol
4) I blacked out every time after a night of drinking.
5) Then the cravings started and I knew that definitely was not "normal".
The excuse I kept giving, trying to explain why I wasn't an alcoholic, was that I didn't drink every day. I only drank on weekends, how could I possibly be an alcoholic right? It doesn't matter how often you drink, it's how much you drink and how your body handles it.
I hope that helps you decide either way.
1) I can never have just one or two. It doesn't matter how hard I try to moderate, it doesn't happen.
2) I would spend all the cash I had on me on alcohol, even if I gave myself a limit walking in. I never brought my debit/credit card because I knew I would open a tab.
3) Even not bringing cash, not planning on drinking, I always ended up drunk because other people would by me drinks. I must be cute
lol4) I blacked out every time after a night of drinking.
5) Then the cravings started and I knew that definitely was not "normal".
The excuse I kept giving, trying to explain why I wasn't an alcoholic, was that I didn't drink every day. I only drank on weekends, how could I possibly be an alcoholic right? It doesn't matter how often you drink, it's how much you drink and how your body handles it.
I hope that helps you decide either way.
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