Realest

On page 88 it says “We do not tire so easily, for we are not burning up energy foolishly as we did when we were trying to arrange life to suit ourselves.”.

How do we alcoholics try to arrange life to suit ourselves?

Tommyh

good question
I go with the flow of what`s happening in the day, I don`t try to manipulate people or force things

Gottalife

Start at the bottom of page 60. It soon becomes clear that a lot of energy must be consumed trying to play God, what with the resulting failures, resentments, manipulations, and fears that crop up when the world fails to comply with our plans and even strikes back at us.

So we go through the process (steps four to nine) of appointing a new manager who takes all this stuff off our shoulders.

What you are quoting is one of the 11th step promises which come as a result of putting the third step decision into practice.

Grungehead

When I was drinking I had to expend a lot of energy cleaning up the messes I kept making along the way from my alcoholic behavior. Being able to now walk through life with a clean conscience takes a lot less energy, both mentally and physically.

Edit to add: what Mike said is very true as well. I also spent a lot of energy trying to get my way and manage the show. It was never ending, either trying to get my way, or trying to patch things up after not getting my way and acting like an arse about it, which usually included getting good and drunk...and all that comes with that.

Realest

It was a lot of drinking. Lying, stealing, hiding, shame, remorse. Now I still get mad when I don’t get my way but it’s not as bad. And I can sleep with a clear conscience.

August252015

I read 84-88 every day as part of my routine. Have done since my first sponsor (so almost 3 yr ago) - and this part among others have evolved in meaning.

For me, the essence of this is that I wanted things my way, the way I thought they should be, and spent incredible mental gymnastics on that stuff. So, I have much more energy in all ways when I .... don't do all that.

Acceptance flips the effort to control or the inclination to self-centered efforts on its head. The burden and fatigue of "trying to fit life to suit myself" are relieved when I let God handle it.

DayTrader

I'll just list some of the selfish and/or self-centered things I've discovered I do when I'm trying to arrange life to suit me:
I get angry at -
1. drivers who drive too slow in the "fast lane"
2. ppl who don't use their blinkers to make a turn
3. ppl in AA meetings who share stuff that contradicts the big book.
4. ppl in AA who share stuff from the program but talk for too long.
5. ppl in AA who tell newcomers to take what they want and leave the rest.
6. ppl in AA who tell newcomers they MUST do every single thing in the book "or else"
7. ppl in line at the store who take forrrrrrrreverrrrrrrrrr to unload their cart - selfishly burning up my time.
8. coworkers who are screwing around while I'm right next to them working my butt of.
9. customers who treat me and/or my coworkers like garbage
.....and many more.....

I get disappointed in:
1. ppl who aren't as considerate as I expect them to be.
2. ppl who don't love me the way I want them to.
3. ppl who don't respect me the way I feel i deserve
4. my spouse when she's not as attentive to me as I want her to be
5. myself when I'm not doing what I feel I should be doing.
6. God when God isn't fixing what I know needs to be fixed.
7. God when God isn't fixing things as quickly as I know they should be fixed.
8. myself when I fail at things.
......and maaaaaaaaaaaany more

I get jealous at -
1. at ppl who have more money than me.
2. ppl who run businesses but do a crappy job of it - knowing I'd do MUCH better if only.....
3. guys with hotter girlfriends than me.
4. people with more spiritual maturity than me
and guess what..... a million more here too........

These are all pretty basic things, items on most anyone's 4th step inventory. All of these things, and a whole lot more, are things I dislike, find hurtful, find embarrassing, think shouldn't happen or should happen more often, etc - all in an attempt arrange the world as I want it to be - TO SUIT ME.

These are the areas I find I tend to exhibit a lot of "lack of power"
They're areas were my current agnosticism is at it's highest.
They're areas where I think God is slacking off.
They're areas where I try to play God myself - to arrange things to make me happy / happier.
They're the things I can get caught dwelling on for hours and hours of the day......
And they're the things in my life that have replaced God and become my new higher powers. Yup, these are the things I worship, these are the things I focus on, these are the things I think about all day, so these things have become my god -- even though I'd tell you I believe in God and pray often. My actions throughout the day often indicate it's my resentments and my desires that are my REAL god...........

.....and we wonder why we're having such a hard going at life? LOL. Take a look at what I worship (via the actions I take during the typical day) and anyone can see why our lives can become so messy.

Realest - based upon this question and some of the others you've asked recently. If you're not already, I'd HIGHLY suggest hunting down a sponsor who's intimately familiar with the book and asking them to take you through the steps. I get the feeling you're trying to figure it out on your own with some occasional guidance from us here online and my experience with folks who've tried to do that leads to my cautioning against it.

I could be wrong, I often am. And that last part is just my opinion. Feel free to disregard it if you would like to.

Realest

How does god make you not mad at people who don’t use blinkers and the rest of stuff. I understand the lizngo but how exactly can god remove these things

turniptheheat

You realize you're not in charge of things with step 3. Your HP or God is in control. You cannot control other people, whether they use their blinker or whatever else, but you can change your reaction to them.

Also, check out page 417 on acceptance.

Ken33xx

God removes them when we die. Until such time learning to deal with unpleasant human emotions is an important part of the program.

I have a big day of outdoor activities planned but when I wake up it's pouring rain. Nothing I can do about this except change my schedule. It get that.

I hire a contractor to do a roof repair and the job isn't done right. Do I tell myself I'm can't control the show or do I consult a lawyer? I contact a lawyer

Say the wife is cheating. Do I tell myself I can't control her actions and go to Al-Anon. Or do I tell myself I don't have to be treated this way? Ans: I won't allow myself to be treated that way.

For me sobriety is about learning to live life on life's terms. Asking for help, using common sense and living outside my comfort zone are keys to trudging the road toward a happy destination.

Outside of not picking up that first drink I find much of the AA program subjective. I recall my first year hearing shares that were often in direct contradiction. However, what I learned is how members work the program can vary. There is no right/wrong way.

I have found myself just as surprised over the years by those who stayed sober as by those who went back out.

Gottalife

There is a clue in the seventh step prayer where we ask Him to remove every single defect of character that stands in the way of our usefulness..... That is not the same as removing every defect.

Usefulness is the key word. What could be meant by that? I reckon we get used by God, and it may be good or bad for us as individuals. One useful feature of a defect is that through the pain of repeatedly and willfully practicing a defect we suffer pain and may eventually learn an important lesson.

From another point of view, that same defect may serve as a great lesson to others about what not to do. I am pretty sure my defects have at times been a great example to others of what not to do. The I learnt my lesson and changed, becoming a positive example.

There were some defects removed without my cooperation. They were a great example of God's Power. Others I managed to hang on to for a bit and they became great examples of my lack of power, to me and those around me.

Sounds like you are surrounded by some great, if unwitting, teachers. The only problem wit that is the temptation to judge, which I am sure some of those teachers probably exhibit. When we get to the point of judging others, the sole prerogative of the Big Guy, we need to be mindful that when we point the finger, there are three pointing back at us. The defects of others are used to make us aware of our own shortcomings.

Ken33xx

Good point. Because I've become better at recognizing character defects or flaws I don't necessarily act on them.

But when I do it's usually not an over the top reaction.

Pipefish

How does god make you not mad at people who don’t use blinkers and the rest of stuff. I understand the lizngo but how exactly can god remove these things

God doesn’t make me not mad at people as such, as much as enlighten me to what it is like when I am mad. This awareness, this recognition is the work of spirit. That shift in perception, any change that arises from it, is not of my own volition, it’s the spirit working in me. I can’t take credit for it, and I don’t change through an effort to be more of this, or less of that.

That this change is not of my own volition doesn’t mean I take no action, but it’s not of the ‘I must be more patient’ variety, walking the earth generously bestowing my patience on others, and then getting ratty when they don’t see it - that is the stuff of the show not coming off very well. It doesn’t mean either having a ‘good’ opinion of myself, particular not in comparison to others. In a sense, God makes you and I not mad at people by guiding us to see ourselves as we really are, and having us turn to a spiritual solution, not just once, not only when we’re troubled, but as a matter of course, all day, every day. This is good for me, because it means I don’t have to understand it all right now, I just have to trust, and do it. Lifetime’s work, just like it says.

Personally, I don’t believe in a God of human dimension – that is, one who makes the same kind of judgements I do, has the same small-mindedness I do, one who can be punishing, In fact, I couldn’t ‘believe’ in God at all, as something out there, watching and keeping score. That’s what human beings do. This tells us we have entered the world of the spirit. That’s a game changer.

Do read Appendix II in the Big Book Spiritual Experience; it was helpful to me in understanding that the programme, a belief in a higher power, isn’t a magic wand, and for one prone to magical thinking, that was much needed.

awuh1

I think it's a different way of saying essentially what the serenity prayer does.

A more ancient expression of the same thing is the TaoTe Ching, which states,
"Act in accordance with the nature of things".

DayTrader

That's what step 2 and 3 are all about - primarily the 2nd step question and even moreso the 2nd step proposition. Eh..... that's only partially true. Once things like I listed are inventoried the way they're supposed to be in an AA 4th step, you'll come to the conclusion that it's not the other person you resent, it's not what they did that you resent and they didn't really hurt you. Basically almost everything in the first 3 columns is false.......though we believed it thoroughly. A solid 4th step will help you come to the realizeation that your problems with that person not using the blinker is NOT of that other person's making but your own....... Our troubles arise out of ourselves, not other people.

Once this is realized, one can take a proper 6th and 7th step and then begin to practice the spiritual path we said we'd go to any lengths in step 1 to walk.

What I've seen over the years is that sometimes right away and sometimes a little later.......those resentments begin to melt and fade away. I believe the BB says something very similar too. You are of course welcome to work on them all you care to but when I'm practicing the AA program, I go to God for those things first, not me.

I saw above - "God removes them when we die." I've not found this to be wholly true. True on occasion sure. if it were completely true, then God can F-off as far as I'm concerned. What good is choosing a God who has no interest in removing any defects, solving any of your problems, or providing you with the power to do-so yourself? If I'm powerless over alcohol, have an unmanageable life drunk AND sober and suffer from lack of power in all sorts of areas of my life........... isn't the solution Power and manageability? Didn't God remove the obsession that we're powerless over? That's a defect of character. Hasn't God premitted many of us to have very long moments of sanity and peace of mind - things we couldn't seem to manifest on our own previously? I mean, that's exactly what the AA program promises. Understand though, it's not OUR power - it's power on loan. Like a car you get to drive even though you haven't paid it off. it's yours, kinda.

Ken33xx

Like it or not human emotions good and bad will be with us until we die. However, we can learn to identify and not necessarily act out as they flair up.

As far as God solving one's problems or giving one the power to do so themselves. God does. God helps those who help themselves. Faith without doing the homework and /or footwork generally won't get you far.

God has granted me the gift of sobriety and an opportunely to toss my hat into the ring. To be able to fully participate in life.

It's up to me to do the rest.

DayTrader

I understand.... like I said though, my personal history and that of a lot of my friends has been quite different. Maybe we just made different choices in step 2? I can't say. Neither is right or wrong as far as I'm concerned. In my case, I ditched the God who only helps those who help themselves a long time ago - especially after I realized He'd been helping me for years and years of me doing the opposite of helping myself. The more I've looked, the more I've found God helps those who help themselves......but He REALLY helps those who don't help themselves. If he hadn't, I don't think a single one of us would be sober.

Ken33xx

Yes, I was granted the gift of sobriety which wasn't my doing and I've not forgotten this.

However, to fully participate in life I've got to get out there and do the footwork, do the homework.

Besides what is there to complain about? Ans. Well, for me the list goes on and on.

But I can't think of a single issue which isn't of a quality nature. Problems which are a direct result of being sober.

I've never forgotten where my life was 26 some years ago just before I walked into the rooms of AA.

And it wasn't pretty.

tomsteve

God
grant me the serenity
to accept the people i cant change
courage to change the one i can
and wisdom to know thats me.

what God has done has given me a different viewpoint.
back to one of my favorite stories in the BB:
Shakespeare said, “All the world’s a stage, and all
the men and women merely players.” He forgot to
mention that I was the chief critic. I was always able
to see the flaw in every person, every situation. And I
was always glad to point it out, because I knew you
wanted perfection, just as I did. A.A. and acceptance
have taught me that there is a bit of good in the worst
of us and a bit of bad in the best of us; that we are all
children of God and we each have a right to be here.
When I complain about me or about you, I am complaining about God’s handiwork. I am saying that I
know better than God.

Perhaps the best thing of all for me is to remember
that my serenity is inversely proportional to my expectations. The higher my expectations of Max and other
people are, the lower is my serenity. I can watch my
serenity level rise when I discard my expectations.
But then my “rights” try to move in, and they too can
force my serenity level down. I have to discard my
“rights,” as well as my expectations, by asking myself,
How important is it, really? How important is it compared to my serenity, my emotional sobriety? And
when I place more value on my serenity and sobriety
than on anything else, I can maintain them at a higher
level—at least for the time being.
Acceptance is the key to my relationship with God
today. I never just sit and do nothing while waiting
for Him to tell me what to do. Rather, I do whatever
is in front of me to be done, and I leave the results up
to Him; however it turns out, that’s God’s will for me.
I must keep my magic magnifying mind on my acceptance and off my expectations, for my serenity is
directly proportional to my level of acceptance. When
I remember this, I can see I’ve never had it so good.
Thank God for A.A.!