sordid places.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: uk
Posts: 2,548
sordid places.
Your job now is to be of maximum helpfulness to others, so never hesitate to go anywhere if you can be helpful.
You should not hesitate to visit the most sordid spot on earth on such an errand.
Keep on the firing line of life with these motives and god will keep you unharmed.
I think this statement asks more of me than sitting in AA on a comfy seat trying to find a prospect.........never hesitate to go "anywhere"..
the sordid places are places i drank and slept......recently ive been losing my nerve....after some dangerous episodes...
Any experience or pointers would be gratefully received...
Where did you find yourself most useful...?...
whats your sales pitch?........and how long do you leave it before mentioning god?..if indeed you do "leave it"...
or......what was it that your sponsor said to you that got your attention..
the underlined quotation above is taken from the Book alcoholics anonymous 1st edition.
You should not hesitate to visit the most sordid spot on earth on such an errand.
Keep on the firing line of life with these motives and god will keep you unharmed.
I think this statement asks more of me than sitting in AA on a comfy seat trying to find a prospect.........never hesitate to go "anywhere"..
the sordid places are places i drank and slept......recently ive been losing my nerve....after some dangerous episodes...
Any experience or pointers would be gratefully received...
Where did you find yourself most useful...?...
whats your sales pitch?........and how long do you leave it before mentioning god?..if indeed you do "leave it"...
or......what was it that your sponsor said to you that got your attention..
the underlined quotation above is taken from the Book alcoholics anonymous 1st edition.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 26,425
my first sponsor told me that he drank like me...that all the desire in the world, all the pshycology, all the fellowship...couldn't keep him sober....yet he clearly was no longer suffering from alchoholism.
And he told me it was ok to be agnostic and that god already had me
I believed him.
I felt no judgement...
And he told me it was ok to be agnostic and that god already had me
I believed him.
I felt no judgement...
Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Lowell
Posts: 345
Trucker, very good question. I know I don't have the answer you want and I really don't think I can possibly come up with the answer you may need.
I agree with you that it seems like more is being asked of us, not quite sure what. I have gone to prisons, to a detox, to a nursing home, a 30 day drug and alcohol addiction program at the Veterans Administration and even to a home for the mentally ill to share and try to pass the message of AA and the 12 Steps.
When I was homeless, the shelter has an AA open discussion meeting there everyday. I remember this guy coming in after a few months I was there and sharing about the Big Book and the 12 Steps and repeatedly the first 164 pages. He would come in a couple of times a week.
This is the part that I like. This guy comes in sharing a message about the 12 Steps was 2 years sober. He was the only one there that ever came to that meeting sharing a message of a program of recovery, out of the 5 months I was there. And you know what, I went to that meeting everyday for it was right there where I lived. And there were people there with some years of sobriety. I counted like 100 years of sobriety just between 5 or 6 of them. And a lot of people just like me, homeless, just getting sober and trying to make it through one more day. And he was the only one sharing a new way of living from the Big Book.
Several months later I started going to a Big Book Step Study meeting, he was there, came up to me and welcomed me. He remembered me from the shelter meeting. I learned that he was one of the people that started this Step Study meeting in the area I live. One day talking to him I asked him about going to the shelter. He told me, his sponsor suggested it to him, said it was someplace that could hear the message of recovery. And would probably be the only time that they might hear about the Big Book.
After going through the process, I returned to that meeting at the shelter and tried to pass on the same message. After going through the process, I never feared talking about God. For me, without God, there isn't a program. And that is only for me, I need God in my life.
This probably doesn't help, I sure can't think of any place that would come close to what is described.
Harry
I agree with you that it seems like more is being asked of us, not quite sure what. I have gone to prisons, to a detox, to a nursing home, a 30 day drug and alcohol addiction program at the Veterans Administration and even to a home for the mentally ill to share and try to pass the message of AA and the 12 Steps.
When I was homeless, the shelter has an AA open discussion meeting there everyday. I remember this guy coming in after a few months I was there and sharing about the Big Book and the 12 Steps and repeatedly the first 164 pages. He would come in a couple of times a week.
This is the part that I like. This guy comes in sharing a message about the 12 Steps was 2 years sober. He was the only one there that ever came to that meeting sharing a message of a program of recovery, out of the 5 months I was there. And you know what, I went to that meeting everyday for it was right there where I lived. And there were people there with some years of sobriety. I counted like 100 years of sobriety just between 5 or 6 of them. And a lot of people just like me, homeless, just getting sober and trying to make it through one more day. And he was the only one sharing a new way of living from the Big Book.
Several months later I started going to a Big Book Step Study meeting, he was there, came up to me and welcomed me. He remembered me from the shelter meeting. I learned that he was one of the people that started this Step Study meeting in the area I live. One day talking to him I asked him about going to the shelter. He told me, his sponsor suggested it to him, said it was someplace that could hear the message of recovery. And would probably be the only time that they might hear about the Big Book.
After going through the process, I returned to that meeting at the shelter and tried to pass on the same message. After going through the process, I never feared talking about God. For me, without God, there isn't a program. And that is only for me, I need God in my life.
This probably doesn't help, I sure can't think of any place that would come close to what is described.
Harry
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Colorado Prairie
Posts: 1,417
Your job now is to be of maximum helpfulness to others, so never hesitate to go anywhere if you can be helpful.
You should not hesitate to visit the most sordid spot on earth on such an errand.
You should not hesitate to visit the most sordid spot on earth on such an errand.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,095
I hear what you are saying, Trucker. It hasn't been the dangerous part lately, but the frustration sometimes of carrying a message few want to hear.
I find over and over that the directions in Chapter 7 are right on. And a person not interested in our solution is the same regardless of whether I meet them in a meeting, in treatment, or at the homeless shelter.
What helps me is knowing that I need that newcomer. I can not act spiritually in a vacuum. If I carry that need into my approach, it seems to work better.
Wasn't it Bill D., alcoholic #3, who only gave Bill and Bob the time because it seemed like the least he could do to help these two well meaning guys stay sober? They approached him out of their own need.
And that leveling of the playing field makes the approach more effective in my experience.
I find over and over that the directions in Chapter 7 are right on. And a person not interested in our solution is the same regardless of whether I meet them in a meeting, in treatment, or at the homeless shelter.
What helps me is knowing that I need that newcomer. I can not act spiritually in a vacuum. If I carry that need into my approach, it seems to work better.
Wasn't it Bill D., alcoholic #3, who only gave Bill and Bob the time because it seemed like the least he could do to help these two well meaning guys stay sober? They approached him out of their own need.
And that leveling of the playing field makes the approach more effective in my experience.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: uk
Posts: 2,548
Thanks..
I have been foolish......continuing to take risks regardless of my wifes concerns.
I still have the ability to be a blinkered old donkey sometimes..
part of me feels i owe it to those guys....problem is most dont wanna listen.
i questioned my approach often......and whether there is ego intertwined.
I guess what i was trying to say....sh@t, this talking to drunks is frustrating sometimes.......
i remind myself i dont have the key.......god does.......im just a drunk with a story.....a sign post for the right direction.
i remind myelf that a desperate drunk can live in a house and sit in AA...Not just in a shelter or on the street.
desperate is the key, i guess not the situation....
I have been foolish......continuing to take risks regardless of my wifes concerns.
I still have the ability to be a blinkered old donkey sometimes..
part of me feels i owe it to those guys....problem is most dont wanna listen.
i questioned my approach often......and whether there is ego intertwined.
I guess what i was trying to say....sh@t, this talking to drunks is frustrating sometimes.......
i remind myself i dont have the key.......god does.......im just a drunk with a story.....a sign post for the right direction.
i remind myelf that a desperate drunk can live in a house and sit in AA...Not just in a shelter or on the street.
desperate is the key, i guess not the situation....
Adventures In SpaceTime
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 5,827
Tough Choices
Having been in those sordid places myself as well, I know for a fact guys and gals from those particular hells have every defense and offense at the ready to survive whatever might come up. Including any and all help most times. I was no different. Helping me was impossible back when. I was savvy to all offers to stop drinking. My drunkeness supported my street living like a hand in a glove. Sobriety would have ruined my miserable existence. I would have been completely off my game and that is a huge problem on a street level life of staying alive. Not much of a life, you know, looking back with 20/20, but I at least understood it, accepted it, lived it, and it felt right and true. To me and my buddies. We really didn't care about others helping us too much. 
All things have a season I have come to understand. Everything in its own time, good, bad or otherwise. My drunkeness was not a matter of denial of alcoholism, it was a simple wanting to be drunk to live, and then just keep dying. How strange, eh?! So help for (from) me could only come from another drunk of the same stripes. I had to be shown that dying was the option i didn't want to choose. Shown, not told. I needed real life evidence that sobriety was real and life-lasting, not just some jacked-up easy-life fantasy for wannabee stupid losers living in the clouds with Jesus and the angles. So for me, reformed street users were my only salvation. I needed real examples of sobriety. So when they read from the big book to me I demanded that they give examples from their own lives of what they were reading to me. I really worked them over. Most learned to just leave me alone. Some though actually did live what they were preaching. Those guys and gals (and God) saved me from myself. They met me in my own world and showed me the path out. I had to follow not because I wanted to be sober so much but because at the end of the day I didn't want to die drunk and alone if there existed an actual true way out. I'm not stupid after all. And that simple understanding of dying drunk knowing a real way out may be in hand was what gave me the small desire to stop drinking for real and do the sober thing.
The thing is, if their sobriety could not safely find their way into my world, be with me there and help me start from there, and find their own safe and true way out again, and them blazing the traill, then they were of no help to me or others like me. Period.
So helping others in sordid places is what I did myself in return for me getting a start on living the sober life. And I helped others just like me for many years and I got pretty good at it. Got paid to do it actually. Worked in a street level residential rehab for years. I lived with others wanting what we had in real recovery side by side 24/7. We helped many hundreds of street lifers get a chance of their own to live with the Right Stuff.
Sordid alcoholics drink in sordid places. They live and die hard. They know the real deal when they see it, and to believe otherwise is to fall into a foolish game of wanting to help as distinct from actually helping. Any one who is real gets their attention. Real people just stand out. On the street real people rule. Everyone living the hard life knows that real people own.
Just be real about yourself. About what exactly you have to give, where and how you got it to give, and do you have respect and empathy for their real life plights and miserable lives. Just another wannabee helper to earn self-esteem kudos no one wants. Having said all that, you'll help others if they want it, which is the other side of the coin. If they don't want what you have, don't take it personally. Understand why they just can't roll over and wag their tales because help as arrived. Live and let live even if some choose to die. Let go and let God. Walk away satisfied with true humility with honor when you know your offering is being purposely kicked to the curb. Move on with Grace and Serenity. Don't give up. Seek and you shall find. You'll never run dry of others to help if you have something to real and true to give. Love will always find the way through all situations. It's not about us the helper but about them the helpee. Always. Keep the faith.
with all respects,
RobbyRobot
All things have a season I have come to understand. Everything in its own time, good, bad or otherwise. My drunkeness was not a matter of denial of alcoholism, it was a simple wanting to be drunk to live, and then just keep dying. How strange, eh?! So help for (from) me could only come from another drunk of the same stripes. I had to be shown that dying was the option i didn't want to choose. Shown, not told. I needed real life evidence that sobriety was real and life-lasting, not just some jacked-up easy-life fantasy for wannabee stupid losers living in the clouds with Jesus and the angles. So for me, reformed street users were my only salvation. I needed real examples of sobriety. So when they read from the big book to me I demanded that they give examples from their own lives of what they were reading to me. I really worked them over. Most learned to just leave me alone. Some though actually did live what they were preaching. Those guys and gals (and God) saved me from myself. They met me in my own world and showed me the path out. I had to follow not because I wanted to be sober so much but because at the end of the day I didn't want to die drunk and alone if there existed an actual true way out. I'm not stupid after all. And that simple understanding of dying drunk knowing a real way out may be in hand was what gave me the small desire to stop drinking for real and do the sober thing.
The thing is, if their sobriety could not safely find their way into my world, be with me there and help me start from there, and find their own safe and true way out again, and them blazing the traill, then they were of no help to me or others like me. Period.
So helping others in sordid places is what I did myself in return for me getting a start on living the sober life. And I helped others just like me for many years and I got pretty good at it. Got paid to do it actually. Worked in a street level residential rehab for years. I lived with others wanting what we had in real recovery side by side 24/7. We helped many hundreds of street lifers get a chance of their own to live with the Right Stuff.
Sordid alcoholics drink in sordid places. They live and die hard. They know the real deal when they see it, and to believe otherwise is to fall into a foolish game of wanting to help as distinct from actually helping. Any one who is real gets their attention. Real people just stand out. On the street real people rule. Everyone living the hard life knows that real people own.
Just be real about yourself. About what exactly you have to give, where and how you got it to give, and do you have respect and empathy for their real life plights and miserable lives. Just another wannabee helper to earn self-esteem kudos no one wants. Having said all that, you'll help others if they want it, which is the other side of the coin. If they don't want what you have, don't take it personally. Understand why they just can't roll over and wag their tales because help as arrived. Live and let live even if some choose to die. Let go and let God. Walk away satisfied with true humility with honor when you know your offering is being purposely kicked to the curb. Move on with Grace and Serenity. Don't give up. Seek and you shall find. You'll never run dry of others to help if you have something to real and true to give. Love will always find the way through all situations. It's not about us the helper but about them the helpee. Always. Keep the faith.
with all respects,
RobbyRobot
Adventures In SpaceTime
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 5,827
Originally Posted by Pinkcuda 
Some of the meetings I've been to seem to be among the most sordid spots on earth. I try to carry the message there but all I get are dumb looks and cheap coffee.
warmly,
Rob
Adventures In SpaceTime
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 5,827
Originally Posted by keepcominback
But she said drinking is her solution. How do I combat this?
I asked others in AA just what do you say to someone when they say, "Yes, but drinking is my solution....You understand...you did it...."...
I asked others in AA just what do you say to someone when they say, "Yes, but drinking is my solution....You understand...you did it...."...
always,
Robby
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: uk
Posts: 2,548
I wasnt intending to stop doing what im doing rob.
i was looking at what i do.......am i effective......do i take unnecessary risks.
Do i mention god to much... to early....
and where am i most effective.........just because i was a vagrant doesnt me i can be most effective on the street.......
thanks for your thoughts ....i will continue to question and re question how i might be of ultimate usefulness ...
i was looking at what i do.......am i effective......do i take unnecessary risks.
Do i mention god to much... to early....
and where am i most effective.........just because i was a vagrant doesnt me i can be most effective on the street.......
thanks for your thoughts ....i will continue to question and re question how i might be of ultimate usefulness ...
Adventures In SpaceTime
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 5,827
Originally Posted by trucker
just because i was a vagrant doesnt me i can be most effective on the street.......
And yeah, I didn't think you were giving it up today, at any rate, fwiw. Godspeed, Trucker.Rob
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 26,425
Just wanted to point out trucker..the message you carry to people like me on the boards makes a real difference
I'm not sure i'll ever really understand what gods will for me is, or how he is using me.
Yeah i bet your wife worries....use some care (hug)
I'm not sure i'll ever really understand what gods will for me is, or how he is using me.
Yeah i bet your wife worries....use some care (hug)
It`s ok to stay sober
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Central NC
Posts: 20,903
trucker,
we can do like Bill W did for 6 months and preach to them about God and drag them off bar stools and get no results but staying sober ourselves and some frustrations to go with it
or what I do is talk straight from the heart about my drinking and my many,many failures.I throw myself wide open out there to them and if they are alcoholic,they will identify with my drinking,empty promises,and failures sooner or later.Once you get that connection,I believe if you speak the language of the heart to them and can connect there,at the heart level,you got their attention,but if I cannot connect there,I probably lose em.I have talked too much about God and AA in the past to several guys and they disappeared ......
I try and talk what they desire,sobriety,and a decent way of life,so they don`t have to keep living that way anymore unless they just insist.When you was brand new,what did you want?
Did you want the hurt inside to stop?
Did you want to be sober?
Did you want the relationship with that Lady of yours to be better?
If we stop and think what got us,we can get a better foothold
when approaching others.Sometimes it is good to think with your heart and past experience of what attracted you when you was down and out and hurting like ..well you know..
we can do like Bill W did for 6 months and preach to them about God and drag them off bar stools and get no results but staying sober ourselves and some frustrations to go with it
or what I do is talk straight from the heart about my drinking and my many,many failures.I throw myself wide open out there to them and if they are alcoholic,they will identify with my drinking,empty promises,and failures sooner or later.Once you get that connection,I believe if you speak the language of the heart to them and can connect there,at the heart level,you got their attention,but if I cannot connect there,I probably lose em.I have talked too much about God and AA in the past to several guys and they disappeared ......
I try and talk what they desire,sobriety,and a decent way of life,so they don`t have to keep living that way anymore unless they just insist.When you was brand new,what did you want?
Did you want the hurt inside to stop?
Did you want to be sober?
Did you want the relationship with that Lady of yours to be better?
If we stop and think what got us,we can get a better foothold
when approaching others.Sometimes it is good to think with your heart and past experience of what attracted you when you was down and out and hurting like ..well you know..
12-Step Recovered Alkie
Join Date: May 2010
Location: West Bloomfield, MI
Posts: 5,797
Great post and great questions Trucker. I don't really have anything to say - I'm a bit too fried at the moment.
It's good (as you know) to question what you're doing. Familiarity breeds comfort and comfort can lead to laziness which rarely yields the results were got when we started.
It's good (as you know) to question what you're doing. Familiarity breeds comfort and comfort can lead to laziness which rarely yields the results were got when we started.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: uk
Posts: 2,548
Thankyou all for your time......in replying to this thread.
I checked in often last night and it gave me plenty to think about while driving.
I have a message to give and will continue to give it....freely like it was given to me...i have guys im working with....some are working with others and have found the freedom i found...
i will continue to call into dark corners.........maybe not alone again.
I checked in often last night and it gave me plenty to think about while driving.
I have a message to give and will continue to give it....freely like it was given to me...i have guys im working with....some are working with others and have found the freedom i found...
i will continue to call into dark corners.........maybe not alone again.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
