whalebelow

I tried "just not drinking" and I know that for me ... it was mentally exhausting.

Plus, I wasn't really "present" to those around me, family, colleagues etc, I was locked up in my own battle, going on between my ears.

Lacing up the mental gloves on a daily basis to battle away with the drinking thoughts.

What if I told you ... it doesn't have to be like that ?

matt4x4

"Just dont drink and you dont get drunk"
Sorry to say, your well drunk even before that 1st drink!

tomsteve

for someone who says "i refuse point blank to use the word god"
you sure do use it a lot.


if what you have is treated alcoholism, I will stick with living with untreated alcoholism.

desypete

yes the post was removed probably because i was out of order by telling you to shut up. : )

keep cominng back to aa my friend one day you will lose your obsessions

i didn't want to carry this on as i tire of you guys as i accept i can not change you

one thing that puzzled me was you comment saying i dont have the balls to say i dont believe in god in aa meetings etc

i have been and i am a very active member in aa for the last 10 years,
everyone knows me very well in aa around my area, and they know i dont believe in god

i have been aa intergroup rep for both probation, and prison service work with 5 years experience of doing them jobs
i didn't need to believe in god to get the job, i got the postions as the guys in inter group trusted my sobriety and trusted in how much i love the fellowship of aa

i never let them down and worked hard for aa and helped many prisoners find aa and a new way of life thats what carrying a message is all about,
trying to help people, and getting stuck in to help where i can
i am going to one guys wedding in october who came out of prison turned his life around thanks to aa he has a job and really enjoying living sober and free from the vicious cycle
thats what feeds my soul is seeing people turn there lives around coming from the gutter etc
i see it so much hence i believe in aa

your way of helping seems dependent on i have to do it your way, copy what you say and think like you think
i guess its all you know as you would of been shown that way by your own sponsor and those around in your cult following.
it seems they just can not seem to get to really understand just how controlling alcoholics are they haven't worked the program or got honest about there controlling ways they have just swapped one obsession for another in my view

i hope they just keep coming back and maybe one day they will finaly start to learn about themselves as its what i have to do daily at times as i can still behave like a drunk without a drink
but i can soon get back on track with my thinking, thanks to aa and how i have learned to live a sober life daily

Mountainmanbob

I have been to a lot of meetings over the years
and (the only one) of the above that I have heard often in meetings is

"just dont drink no matter what!"

well I guess a very few times I have heard someone say
that the "Group was their higher power"
kind of sad when we think about it

MM

Dee74

When a post is removed it's very bad cyber manners to refer to that post, and will usually result in me yanking your post as well.
.
Be good, guys.

D

Mountainmanbob

desypete

not sure why that needs to be shared in every one of your post ??
I guess that it is the message that you carry ??

MM

Dee74

I'm gone a week and everyone forgets the basics...

You can also PM members privately.

Lets not weigh down threads with personal asides- that's not fair to the OP or to newcomers who might be looking for guidance here.
D

whalebelow

Righto Pete.

I'm letting go of the rope in this "how to do AA " tug of war we seem to be having.

I know that plenty of people keep sober in AA with regular meetings, fellowship and service work, group as their higher power. Your an example of just that Pete, good stuff.

It's all good.

All I can say is, it didn't work for me, I still felt alone, even in meetings, I was angry inside, I pined for booze... grasping the spiritual part of the program worked for me. Saved me.

The difference was night and day.

I got plenty of advice from "older sober" members to not bother with the book, god and the steps.
My first sponsor told me point blank "first step and third tradition" that's all you need.

I guess my point is, you have to just be so careful what you tell people because my first sponsor had his heart in the right place.... I know that, but I ended up drinking again after I asked him to take me through the steps and he told me not to worry about them.

No matter.... I got back, so no real harm done, just a bit of material loss.

Anyway... Now you know a bit more of "my story" and have some more perspective on why the spiritual side of AA is so important to me.

I can respect your sobriety and long may it continue.

RumHound

In our personal stories you will find a wide variation in the way each teller approaches and conceives of the Power which is greater than himself. Whether we agree with a particular approach or conception seems to make little difference. Experience has taught us that these are matters about which, for our purpose, we need not be worried. They are questions for each individual to settle for himself.

Alcoholics Anonymous , p.50

whalebelow

I want to know what happens when someone with the group as their Higher power does their 5th step.

I have yet to hear of anyone who fronted up to their group and said "hey group, your my higher power, so here goes"

It seems to be that if your in aa and still talking about a "higher power" it's a half in approach that let's the others in your group know that your trying to be spiritual but that your not willing to progress past step 2.

Just a casual observation, there may be exceptions to it, but I think it's pretty accurate.

If you would like confirmation just ask anyone in aa straight out... How did you go with your 4th step inventory, what's it like to fess up all your stuff to God and your sponsor?

I'll be surprised if anyone who still talking "higher power" can give you a straight answer.

I know that will offend some people here, but all it really means is simply, some of us NEED to go to greater lengths than others..

If the group keeps you sober, box on, I'm sincerely happy for you.

awuh1

I must disagree. When I came into AA I was a firm agnostic. My sponsor asked me if I thought there was anything more powerful than I was. I said, "Sure there is. Gravity is more powerful." His response was "that's a start".

For me, that was a beginning. I began to ask questions. Lots of questions, about both the physical and about the metaphysical. My notion of a higher power has evolved ever since (as has my understanding of gravity. ).

I don't think anyone can claim to completely understand God. All we can hope for is greater understanding. IMO (and experience) the extent of that understanding seems directly proportional to urgency and open mindedness of the person asking the questions.

Anyone asking those questions is on the right path.

whalebelow

Did you replace God with gravity for the 3rd step prayer?

ow did you go telling gravity your 5th step?

awuh1

Gravity was a beginning. That's all that was needed, because it began a search.

"God could and would if...

whalebelow

"He were sought"

(not found)

Any how, you have a God of your own understanding now, it doesn't matter the path!

TSDD

Naught for nothing, but the way I read 'em, if you drank you missed the first one. Might want to get a firm grasp of that before running too far ahead of yourself. I'm told by people that do all 12 that they're put in order for a reason... Then again, I don't think there's any bad time to apply the principals to your life, it's not rocket science, but the people I've met who really feel that they have to do a bunch of book work mostly seem unanimous about doing it in order.


Have you ever considered that people who are atheist/agnostic simply don't worry about it?

What never ceases to amaze me, is that in 19 years of sobriety and regular attendance at AA/NA meetings, not a one of my family members, friends, business associates, or law enforcement persons have never once asked me if I believe in God, what step I'm on, whether or not I have a sponsor, if I read certain books, or anything of the sort. In fact, they're all just thrilled that I'm not ruining my life and the lives of those around me with drinking and drugs.

In fact the ONLY place I go where people seem to take exception to what I'm doing or not doing to stay sober is AA or NA meetings, and the ONLY people who have ever asked me what my faith is are people determined to sell me their version of God.

It's amazing how many people like to run down what someone else is or isn't doing to make themselves feel superior.

whalebelow

That's one way to look at it.

The way I look at it is that I became spiritually unwell again, self will ran riot and my will is to drink.

Kept my face to the light, my shadows fell behind me, turn from the light, my shadows fall in front again.

A committed atheist in aa, simply proves his will is not to drink, he has sufficient power of his own.

I don't prattle about God to bolster my ego, I do it because there are other alcoholics, like me, who lack sufficient power.

TSDD

This statement can be proven false by noting that such people could not stay sober before finding a defense against the first drink in the AA fellowship.

Is it possible that God helps people who DO NOT believe in him? Can you blame God for your drinking?

Really I'm glad you've got something that's working for you today, but don't for a minute insinuate that someone else is doing it wrong or not as much of an alcoholic as you are for using different tools to build their defense against drinking... that's just being a narcissist and a bully.

whalebelow

From a different thread


Originally Posted by dsmaxis10 View Post
AA says recovered.page ix To show other alcoholics precisely how we have recovered is the main purpose of this book.page 85 It is easy to let up on the spiritual program of action and rest on our laurels. We are headed for trouble if we do, for alcohol is a subtle foe. We are not cured of alcoholism. What we really have is a daily reprieve.- So even if you are recovered you can become unrecovered real quick if you don't stay spiritually fit."

whalebelow

No it is not, I credit God for being sober.

Narcissis was transfixed by his own image.

I think you'll find people who look in the mirror and see the being responsible for their sobriety should be the ones you level that at