OctoberKayte

Hey, everyone-

Three weeks sober today. But, things are a little edgy on the home front. We haven't been "out" in over a month (last time I drank was at the neighbor's). My spouse REALLY wants to go to a music fest or firemen's picnic with the gang tonight. I just want to stay home. He doesn't want to go if I don't come along- but I am just not up to that yet. He's like, "Well, you're going to have to face it at some point.". I know we need to compromise- I guess I could handle going out for dinner and a movie (and I'll suggest that), but I can tell that he's missing the old routine.

I know that we will get through this somehow-I am just wondering if anyone has any relationship tips for this stage of recovery?


Thanks, all!

Kayte

Anna

Hi Kayte,

There are definitely growing pains involved in discovering the new you. And, compromise can help. But, if you feel uncomfortable going out right now, then you need to stay true to yourself. I didn't want to be around alcohol for a long time after I stopped drinking. I tried it once, early on, and it just made me so emotional, it was not worth it.

Bottom line, you'll probably find that there will be changes in your relationship. I know there are in mine, because I am just not the same person anymore.

nocellphone

Hi Kayte...

It can be tough for the loved one of a newly-sober person to cope with the inevitable changes that recovery brings. If he hasn't yet, he could benefit from attending some Al-Anon meetings. The link can help you find some meetings in your area, if he's interested.

Peace!

earlybird

He needs Al-anon. He obviously doesnt know the first thing about addiction. Yes,....you must face things sooner or later. But given how fragile sobriety is in the early stages,...why does he insist that it be "sooner"? Ill tell you why. Because addiction is a selfish disease. And since OUR disease sickens the ones around us, he as become sick and selfish, too. He wants it to be "sooner", for HIS benefit. Think about it,...he wants to go out NOW. You tell him flat out,...that you arent ready. You said it in plain English. Yet he still says to you "You have to face it sometime" meaning he wants you to go out NOW. Again,.........why? For HIS benefit. Just like addiction is selfish,...so is recovery. Stick to your guns. If you dont feel you are ready,....then you aint ready. Dont let someone sabotage what you've begun building,..regardless of whom it is.

CarolD

Well done on the 3 weeks!!

No relationship tips from me...I've been happily divorced for years!

aloneagainor

Kayte,
There's a tone in your message that resonates with me, I'd be interested to know if I'm picking up on this accurately or not, and it's a valid point for you to consider as well. The "gang", are these your friends, or his? Are you avoiding the alcohol, the scene, those particular people, or life in general? I certainly relate to the mentality of wanting to avoid everyone and everything so not to have to deal with it.

Keep in mind this is a time of change for your husband too. When confronted with change we all go on-guard, to protect ourselves, it's simply human nature to be self-centered that way. Your husband is concerned, perhaps afraid of these unknown changes in you, how they'll affect him. Open, honest communciation, letting each other know you understand the others position, should help dissipate some of that tension that arises out of fear of the unknown. Our fears too often rule us, unnecessarily. Tips for this stage of recovery? Honesty and open-mindedness. Without that your marriage will fail. So you really have nothing to lose in trying.

earlybird

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Good point, aloneagainor......

If he wants you to accompany him out to visit with drinking friends, so he can drink, than have you asked yourself if maybe he isnt bummed that he lost a drinking buddy in you?

gypsyrose

I really had no idea how hard it was going to be for my AH to get sober. I thought he was just being moody as usual when he said he couldn't go out to dinner because he couldn't go out to dinner without drinking. A few months later and he still hasn't been able to stop even though he's trying. He attends cognitively based recovery meetings twice a week and is hoping they'll start up a third because he wants to go more (which is amazing considering how anti-social he usually is). He's talking to his doctor about taking anti-abuse medication. So now I understand how hard it is to quit even though he's trying and I don't ask him to go places he's not ready to. On the other hand, that doesn't mean I have to stay home (btw I don't drink when I go out). We each have to do what is good for ourselves.

We have been making Friday night movie night because there are no meetings for him to attend and it's something we can do together without him feeling the need to drink.

You could let him know how much work it is for you to stay sober, encourage him to do go out and do things on his own and then maybe think of things you can do together that are good for both of you.

aloneagainor

Yes, this is definitely something to be aware of! In my marriage, the last remaining common bond my husband and I shared was in smoking pot. Even though even this we each did alone (he watching TV upstairs while I sat downstairs listening to music) the fact that I'm changing threatens him, and the nature of our relationship. Dishonesty and deception/ withdrawl on both our parts destroyed the marriage. It didn't have to be that way.

earlybird

Totally!!!! Change is threatening to some. They had something about them,....and you shared that something WITH them. Now,....you DONT share that something with them anymore. To some,...it looks as though YOU quitting that something means you view that something as bad. And since HE still does that something that you must view HIM as bad. He maybe starting to view recovery as a living, breathing being that is now threatening his way of living. His very marriage. That breeds resentment.

aloneagainor

Yep. Resentment, visciousness, hostility, sadness. How dare this character Sobriety threaten me and my marriage this way, he thinks. It has no right! And then he's on a mission to move me (first tried guilt, then force, then depression, went through all techniques to convince) in a different direction back into use, so things can get back to "normal" again. Honestly Kayte, your husband will feel threatened by the changes your making. Be aware of this so to stay a step ahead of it, anticipate the games, the techniques, and patiently work through each of them, knowing the end result that you seek is POSITIVE change. He might not be able to see the potential for improvement yet, but you know it's real, and what you need to do to get there.

earlybird

My little brother hated my drinking problem. I was second born,...he was third. My older brother gets to be known as "Their first born"......while my little brother was supposed to be getting showered with attention for being "the baby" of the family, I stole that attention with my drinking escapades. The trouble, the courts, the money, the probation, the community service, the crying, the worrying, the yelling, the screaming, all negative attention, yes, but attention taken away from him and put unto me. Then,....years go by of my little brother and I not speaking,...then he gets married, and has a baby with his new wife, giving my parents their very first grandchild. Surely this will get him in good graces with the parents and get him showered with envy and attention. Now,...only 8 months after this all takes place,...I get sober. Im changing. Mom and Dad are taking an interest in my recovery. My role in the family dynamic is changing after years of being the f@@Q up. My parents now are starting to view me differently. In a better light. In my brothers mind, ....once again, I have swooped in and stole his thunder. Sadly, my recovery has soured even further my brothers resentment and hatred towards me. And you know what?.......Thats on him. Not me. I knew all of this when I woke up this morning, and I STILL had a wonderful day today. This is HIS demon to work out. Im not going to stay a drunk so my brother doesnt feel threatened.

Kellye C

Kayte, one of the first few things I learned in sobriety I will share with you. You have to change people, places and playmates. I went out to sing kareoke very early in sobriety and had no intentions of drinking. The people where I went knew me as a drinker and next thing I know a drink is plopped down next to my Diet Coke. What do you think I chose? Yep. Set up a month long drinking period that turned out to be my last (so far by God's grace anyway).

Second is FIRST THINGS FIRST. Recovery is selfish and it has to be especially in the beginning. You have to protect yourself and your sobriety at all costs. I personally would not suggest to anyone that they go out WITH THE GANG at 3 weeks sober if it's going to even have the possibility of alcohol being involved.

Having said that, what about your spouse? He's not the one in recovery so what's he supposed to do now that you've gone and changed all the rules? I think you already had a good idea when you said you would suggest dinner and a movie. Compromise in some form or fashion is going to be key here. If he wants you to be involved in the activities then they need to be safe activities. If he is determined he wants to go OUT WITH THE GANG then he needs to understand that you can't do that right now and that if he really wants to do this he is going to have to do it alone.

Another alternative would be to have friends over to your place making it very clear that there is to be no alcohol involved (don't know what your friendship dynamics are so this may not be a viable option).

This is all a big change for you AND him. That is a given. You might want to check out the Friends and Family board. Even if he doesn't want to go to Al-Anon there are reading materials they could suggest for him to read to give him an idea of where you're coming from and what you're facing. I think one may be a book called "Getting Them Sober". I never read it since I am an alcoholic and left my ex-ah without him getting sober. But it is a suggestion.

Bottom line, communicate with him, explain your fears and why it isn't safe or healthy for you to be in environments where there is alcohol this early in sobriety. Explain that you know this is all different for him too. Let him know that you are sensitive to his concerns but that right now you have to keep yourself safe at all costs.

I hope some of this helps!

With almost 2 years of sobriety I still find it difficult at times to be around alcohol. Some times its not too big of a deal but sometimes it really bothers me. At that point I get up and LEAVE!!! There is nothing worth me going back to the hell I was in when I was drinking. If I ruffle a few feathers, tough. Better that than die which is where I was heading!

Hugs,
Kellye

temlin3

Hey Kayte,

Your relationship issues are very similar to my own right now. (Of course, there are also many things that differ.)

First, my significant other has NEVER used any drug besides alcohol. (He did have an abusive relationship with it in the past, but he is very healthy with his drinking habits now. I, on the other hand, have been involved with all kinds of drugs since I was 13 and it has always been an issue of some sort for me. He is EXTREMELY OVERprotective of me — although when we first got together we went out a lot to bars, clubs, etc. The more he got to know me, the more he realized I had a very significant problem with escaping my reality with any "mood-altering" substances. Since then he is very attentive to any out-of-the-ordinary behavior I present. But then I chose to quit smoking cigarettes and pot a little over a year ago — not for him but for me. I knew in my head that I wanted to change, but I could never get started. So one random evening, by myself, I got high... and realized how mad and frustrated with the whole thing I was, how obsessed I was, how horrible it was not to have any, the anxiety over where and when I would find it again, not being able to go even one day without it, etc. I wound up flushing $100 worth of high-grade pot that night, only two days after I bought it.

So, here's the relation to your current situation... My boyfriend and I DID try to go out as much as we did before, but it was completely intolerable and damaging to me (and him, for that matter). I had to watch people smoking cigarettes and smell them right next to me. This was tempting in itself, but the worst was hanging out with the people I used to take smoke breaks at work with. It is SO hard to quit these substances, as most people (everyone here) knows, and if you can push through the beginning without changing any part of life temporarily (or permanently if need be) — I must applaud you. To me, that is amazing, and almost impossible!

I actually did slip a few times and have a cigarette or two, maybe 4 or 5 times, but at those points I was nicotine-free for so long that it tasted horrible and made me feel sick. But wow, did my boyfriend flip out... hard-core. (I am sure it would have been 100 times worse if I had smoked pot, but I haven't since I quit — Wahoo!) I am the "rebellious" type, so I didn't want to listen to him, and I kept insisting that we go out. But you know what? We'd be in the middle of a pool game, and all of a sudden I'd remember this time I was "trying" to play pool when I was very high on pot So there's the thought, infecting my brain. Then there were a few drinks, which only exacerbated my cravings. Back then (about 6 months after I quit), I had so, so many problems being around anything involving drugs. I couldn't even watch movies with marijuana in them. In part, I do have my boyfriend to thank for that... He prevented me from entering situations where drugs were going to be present so I wouldn't have to deal with the negativity and issues with self-control. Once he even talked me out of going to see a friend, just because I bought pot from her once (actually the same bag I flushed when I quit)... I was SO angry with him, yet I think a part of me DID want to escape to my previous habit. And I might have. Who knows? You seem to be more fortunate than I was because you don't want to be around it. You've already learned that lesson. It took me a long time to get over the idea of not hanging around with frinds who were also drug abusers. (Come to think of it, I don't even speak to any of them anymore... )

So... I APOLOGIZE for being so "long-winded," but it's hard for me to leave things out. I may have just been cooped up with my addictions so long that I am literally exploding with things to say.

My opinion (not advice because I still deal daily with relapses, cravings, etc.)... People who develop addictions usually end up following certain "rituals" when they use. Whether it's a place, a person, an environment, or anything else, I DON'T think it's a good idea at all to return to them too close to your "sobriety date." I know friends and numerous other things are very important in life, but your health must be first. I used to live in a house at college with 7 other women, all of whom smoked pot and cigarettes — and other drugs on occasion. I was ALWAYS right there, using whatever substance we chose for that night. One day, I realized tat my living quarters were horrible for me. I could not handle being around so many drugs without using, and it was negatively affecting every aspect of my life. So this one particular day, I moved out. Just like that... extremely impulsive, but honestly one of the best decisions I have ever made. That was when I quit abusing the "harder" drugs (cocaine, ecstasy, etc.)

OK, I am stopping rambling now, but I have one last thing to say... More than anything on this subject, I believe in the most amazing self-help there can be: changing your lifestyle. By this, I mean surrounding yourself with positive things, healthy things, etc. that will help you, not hurt you. And starting to see and experience the "good ole' days" can be extremely nostaglc, and possibly the source of relapse. Your partner is right, you do have to do deal with and face certain situations eventually... but not immediately. Each person heals and grows differently, so there is no telling how long it will take. But if you really want it and put your best efforts out there, you'll have already won half the battle. When you overcome your addiction(s), as he puts it, you will be "facing it," and the routine you both lived by will return. It probably won't be exactly the same, but it will be BETTER!

As for your significant other: If he truly cares for you he'll want the best for you, which includes good health and happiness. He may not understand at first, but if he does want what you want for yourself, he'll educate himself and provide support. [One quick example... In December 2005 my boyfriend and I went to a work party, at which I got very plastered on alcohol. I had a few cigarettes with another guy, and immediately afterward he found me and practically carried me to the car. He flipped out incredibly bad and totally overexaggerated the situation in my opinion. I think it was partly because he had never smoked cigarettes and slumped them right in with the "drug" category. Well, I got so angry and literally combative toward him that I ran away from the house, was found by the police (who the neighbors and my boyfriend called on me), and ended up in a psychiatric ward for 48 hours. Now, here's the amazing part... I have recently developed an "addiction" of sorts to snorting Adderall. I don't have a prescription for it... I have been stealing my boyfriend's pills for about 3 months now. I finally broke down crying and admitted the truth to him about 2 weeks ago. He was 100% mature and respectful about it, even though I don't think I deserved it. Now, for someone who is 200-plus % anti-drugs, extremely with me, this was a "jaw-dropper." He was never closely associated with anyone who did drugs, and I think seeing that I was not the "negative druggie stereotype" helped him understand that his almost-denial, nontolerant, walk-away reaction to drug users was not healthy either. People truly do have the power within themselves to change things.]

OK — finally — the "bottom line":
1. Definitely keep your partner as informed as possible, without going overboard or scaring him. He should be a secure support sdystem for you.
2. Allow him some time to adjust and deal with the "situation," especially if he isn't well-educated or experienced with addiction.
3. If an innumerable amount of days go by and he is still pushing you to be in damaging environments for your addiction(s) — or if he's being a jerk and not being compassionate or understanding at all — LEAVE HIM BEHIND YOU. He is actually right about dealing with reality, but he HAS to be patient and supportive.(Also, the more negative impact on you, the harder it will be for you to get yourself permanently clean and happy.)

Everyone has vices, and for many, many, many people addiction to something is one of them. It's human nature to mess up lots and lots of times in your life, and someone you want to spend your life with should be on that page with you. There is nothing wrong with you as an individual or your personality. "Manure" happens, and unfortunately there are many people who don't understand us. But: There are people who do. For example, SR!

I hope I didn't get too personal or offend you at all... I just have this neverending need for expression lately... and this is an incredible forum to do just that.

Thanks for reading/listening. Best wishes for your recovery and your relationship. Remember: You deserve happiness and the ability to be and become who you are completely.

Sorry for the insane length of this... But I have and still do experience similar problems. They SUCK! But hang in there.

Take care,
Jennifer

... If only things were as simple as "The Smurfs" —

OctoberKayte

You have all illustrated aspects of change that I had not considered. It will really be a new life all around!

The "gang" can be divided into two groups- One is made up of people who are my husband's friends from work (he's in the building trades) or have known him since high school- some of them are OK, but some are BIG trouble. The other group is people that we have met as a couple since moving here- neighbors, bowling partners, water-skiers.
I only have two friends- my BF from high school that I see 1X/year and a woman who is about 20 years older than me who I met where I used to work. She's married, but does not have kids, doesn't drink - we get together and go to lunch or shopping every other month or so. She also teaches me things like canning and gardening- my H says she's like a surrogate mom- maybe so, but I don't confide in her.

Friends are hard for me. I have problems with women in particular. There are actually two in my neighborhood who from day one (though they've never even MET me) have said cruel things and make damn sure not to acknowledge me-ever. e.g.- I wave driving by and they will look away- there are other things, but, whatever- I'm used to it and I don't really mind being by myself for the most part. BUT- the drinkers have never had a problem accepting me (go figure....). I even have some women "friends" in the drinking group (friends in "" cause we never get together outside of the drinking). I know that part of my friendship issue is that I rarely share problems or feelings with anyone. Mostly because I don't trust easily and also because I am pretty much focused on presenting a perfect image. I guess I'm kind of like a well-wrapped present under the tree, but if you opened it, it would be some kind of disgusting dead thing (maybe that's why I like the movie The Nightmare Before Christmas?!). My whole life is like that, really. My house is very neat, but I can't keep my desk or dresser drawers organized to save my life!

Last night- we resolved the issue by going out to dinner and meeting another couple for one drink (I had iced tea the whole time), then we picked up a six-pack for my H and Snapple for me and came home. We hung out in our hot tub for a while(and talked about many of the things y'all shared with me), then watched an old movie.

Tonight we are having dinner with a couple from Ohio that we met in Jamaica this spring. They are visiting family in our state and will just be an hour away. Although there was a lot of drinking when we met, I am not worried about not drinking tonight. I also didn't do anything stupid around them-that's funny, too. When we are on vacation, I am not a drunk idiot. I am totally focused on my H. Maybe that's all I need to do to get better- leave Wisconsin and move to the Caribbean!

So thanks for reading my ramble and for your helpful words of wisdom. Things are getting better-I have a class reunion next week and I am SO looking forward to saying, "No, thanks, I don't drink".

Have a great day!

Kayte

aloneagainor

Kayte,
You sound well. Like you're feeling well, convinced that you're moving in a positive direction, making good healthy choices for yourself, Very Good! Though do go EASY on yourself, that's quite an observation you made about yourself there in the package under the tree. That illusion of perfection we present to the world, while secretly hiding all our imperfections; the dichotomy makes us feel disintegrated, deceptive, like a "bad" person. But of course no-one is perfect (or even near perfect), some are just more BOLD about showing their imperfections than others, and that's not necessarily a good trait, either. Be gentle with yourself (yes, something I'm learning too.)

Very interesting to note how many female addicts seem to have problems relating to other women. Myself included, so I've really had to look at this. Best I can figure, women are generally socially interactive, they are the foundation of family and home and community, gatherers and caretakers, they are social glue. I am not social glue. For women who do not intimately engage in social bonding that way, we fail to connect. But that's OK. There are some women out there who also are outside that circle, you have a friend in one, and can assocaite with others. I don't get the impression you need a lot of friends, but rather, a few close GOOD friends. Accepting this about yourself might provide you some peace, so you don't feel so compelled to be someone that you're not. It's not an imperfection, it's simply who you are. Acceptance really is a difficult issue, for everyone. It's not just an addict's concern, it's a human condition.

c'est la vie

Count me in on this tally. I like to say that I like being a loner, but why in the heck do I feel so lonely all the time. I think there must be a difference that I need to learn to be comfortable with.

temlin3

Hello everyone...

I can absolutely identify with your comments about being a loner yet feeling lonely. I have always been very independent, like a "loner" I guess... and I am actually extremely happy to be this way. But, on the negative side, it also spreads into my ability to meet and become close to new people, especially women. I find I have a hard time "letting go" and allowing people into my life. I've had some negative experiences with women in my past (and ... I've been hurt and betrayed... I've been let in the dust by a parent... but I still don't understand. I want so much to have a true friend. Someone who accepts me for who I am and who will not run away if things get difficult. (Sorry, I am not searching for pity, etc. I am only telling the truth. Besides, I am such a control freak that I can barely stand other people closely involved in my life! )

In my opinion, it is harder today than ever before for women to become true friends. There is alway some kind of competition going on. Honestly, I am repulsed by the way young girls are brought up these days, with all the importance of physical attractiveness, etc. I cannot imagine what it is like growing up as a young woman in today's society.

Sorry! I got off on a tangent there... but hey, life is complicated. And difficult. And impossible. And mentally challenging. And incredibly amazing... All at the same time. It's so hard for me to sum things up quickly, so I apologize for that. I wish for all of us to find someone who accepts and respects our independence, yet is capable of being a true, close friend. (Our families hopefully provide some of that too.) I know I'm a bit eccentric, and I have my vices, but I truly believe that I am deserving of true, lasting friendship. Everyone is.

Thanks for listening to me ramble on...

Take care.

Jennifer