Confused..?
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: crazy in NY
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Confused..?
I am starting to understand the co-dependency thing and Im trying by best not to be one (and its sooo hard) But if I act like Im not mad and just continue to have dinner on the table when he gets home, and talk to him like everything is cool isnt he going to think Im ok with what he does (weekend episodes)? Im thinking he may think OH she didnt tell me I did anything wrong and If I did she would tell me then just think his behavior is ok and acceptable to me? How do you all act towards them after an episode?
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Join Date: Mar 2005
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Hi Labby...and welcome!
I know it sound so illogical to *not* react to thier drinking, or behavior. I mean, we need to LET THEM KNOW what they are doing to us, right?
Well.....yes and no.....I feel that I have the right to voice my concern or complaint about thier behavior, drinking..whatever..once. If they do not choose to make a change in thier behavior, and we stay in the relationship, then we must accept that exactly how it is.
They are not our prisoners, we dont get to punish them. They know inside what theyre doing is hurting themselves and others. Its a disease.....knowing this, however, we dont have to stay around for unaccepetable behavior..we can leave, for a few hrs, day, or forever,,whatever is in our best interest. But...if we stay, we have to accept that they are doing what theyre doing, probably mightnot change, and that we have made a conscious choice to stay. We have choices....
Might I suggest Al-anon to you as a way to deal with this? GOod luck
I know it sound so illogical to *not* react to thier drinking, or behavior. I mean, we need to LET THEM KNOW what they are doing to us, right?
Well.....yes and no.....I feel that I have the right to voice my concern or complaint about thier behavior, drinking..whatever..once. If they do not choose to make a change in thier behavior, and we stay in the relationship, then we must accept that exactly how it is.
They are not our prisoners, we dont get to punish them. They know inside what theyre doing is hurting themselves and others. Its a disease.....knowing this, however, we dont have to stay around for unaccepetable behavior..we can leave, for a few hrs, day, or forever,,whatever is in our best interest. But...if we stay, we have to accept that they are doing what theyre doing, probably mightnot change, and that we have made a conscious choice to stay. We have choices....
Might I suggest Al-anon to you as a way to deal with this? GOod luck
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Anaheim,CA
Posts: 549
FOB said:
I agree. You also have no obligation to rescue them when they find themselves drunk somewhere, call their work for them, lie for them, or in any way shape or form accept any responsibility for the choices an A makes.
Let the A own his or her own actions and you own your own. Al-anon can really help with this!
we dont have to stay around for unaccepetable behavior..we can leave, for a few hrs, day, or forever,,whatever is in our best interest. But...if we stay, we have to accept that they are doing what theyre doing, probably mightnot change, and that we have made a conscious choice to stay. We have choices....
Might I suggest Al-anon to you as a way to deal with this? GOod luck
Might I suggest Al-anon to you as a way to deal with this? GOod luck
Let the A own his or her own actions and you own your own. Al-anon can really help with this!
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Somewhere, Outthere Minnesota
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I think it really doesn't matter in the big picture if YOU tell him he has done something wrong. HE needs to decide that HE did something wrong. Otherwise we tie ourselves in to the game of hide and seek with our behaviors. Don't we all really want someone in our lives that behaves naturally in a way we like?
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Join Date: May 2004
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labby, I think the replies that you have gotten are great so far. Something I'd like to add though - it's not just about detaching from the A, in my opinion. It's also about finding your own life.
I found that when I highly obsessed about AH's drinking, it was because I was living my life around AH. I was living through each of the crises of his making. I was living through him!!!! I had no life of my own.
Part of learning to detach from the A means that you don't obsess over him. You just go on about your life as he is his own. You'll find that the more things you have to do, join Alanon - spend time with friends - etc. it gets easier in time to have your own life which allows you to obsess about his a little less often. Granted, it's no quick-fix. It does take time.
But regardless of the fact of if you say something to him or not about his drinking - it may stay the same. That's something you really have to learn to accept. You cannot change him, you cannot control the A and his alcohol. Step One: Admitting you are powerless over alcohol.
I know you are confused about this - I was too for a long time. I've also come to realize that sometimes my perceptions of things aren't the same as others. I just feel that you have to have your own life in order to not obsess about someone else's.
I hope I've helped to make some sense for you and not confused you more.
I found that when I highly obsessed about AH's drinking, it was because I was living my life around AH. I was living through each of the crises of his making. I was living through him!!!! I had no life of my own.
Part of learning to detach from the A means that you don't obsess over him. You just go on about your life as he is his own. You'll find that the more things you have to do, join Alanon - spend time with friends - etc. it gets easier in time to have your own life which allows you to obsess about his a little less often. Granted, it's no quick-fix. It does take time.
But regardless of the fact of if you say something to him or not about his drinking - it may stay the same. That's something you really have to learn to accept. You cannot change him, you cannot control the A and his alcohol. Step One: Admitting you are powerless over alcohol.
I know you are confused about this - I was too for a long time. I've also come to realize that sometimes my perceptions of things aren't the same as others. I just feel that you have to have your own life in order to not obsess about someone else's.
I hope I've helped to make some sense for you and not confused you more.
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And that's the thing...living your own life while allowing him to live his. That's the control part. OMG I have been working these steps for what feels like a hundred years sometimes and I still catch myself "correcting" or "advising" and what I get back is resentment. I don't want to be resented...but I don't want to be used either. Neither one feels good to me so I read my book and hope he doesn't break anything on the way to bed...lol!
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: England
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Live and Let Live - yup. Funnily enough, this was the topic at my al-anon meeting this week.
When I was with my ex, my life revolved around his drinking and associated behaviours, as SS said. I thought I knew what was best for him and how he should live his life. But did I really? What if the pain of facing his demons was far greater than the pain of living with the after affects of hiding from those demons (drinking)? What right did I have to demand that he dealt with his problems? What an arrogant so-and-so I had become.
He has (and still has) every right to drink himself right into the grave. And I have the right not to be there whilst he does.
The more I focus on living my own life, the less time I have to focus on anyones elses. And that can only be a good thing for the relationships in my life.
When I was with my ex, my life revolved around his drinking and associated behaviours, as SS said. I thought I knew what was best for him and how he should live his life. But did I really? What if the pain of facing his demons was far greater than the pain of living with the after affects of hiding from those demons (drinking)? What right did I have to demand that he dealt with his problems? What an arrogant so-and-so I had become.
He has (and still has) every right to drink himself right into the grave. And I have the right not to be there whilst he does.
The more I focus on living my own life, the less time I have to focus on anyones elses. And that can only be a good thing for the relationships in my life.
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Join Date: Nov 2004
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Originally Posted by labbylover01
How do you all act towards them after an episode?
My RAH now was a dry drunk. He was mean and belligerent every day. If I said black, he said white even if white was flat out dead wrong. I tried every move a human could make. Now my boundary is that I will not be involved with an active alcoholic, period. Codependency is based on another person being the captain of your ship. A person gives their decisionmaking powers to another and expects that person to steer them in the right direction. It is a position of weakness. To not be codependent is to become the captain of your own ship. Then you start making decisions for yourself. You stop "acting" around him and start taking action for yourself. It is really the maturing of the codependent that ultimately breaks the cycle. Then you are coming from a position of power. As he sees this, he will escalate his efforts to sabotage you. That is the process of the disease -- it takes prisoners. When you stop being a prisoner to *his* actions then you start being a captain of your own ship.
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A/H divorced me this week. He chose his first love, alcohol, over me and the kids....just made it legal, I guess. And, (typically,it seems) just prior and since, he is now worried how I am doing, the kids,etc (guilt thing, no doubt) wanting to do things for me; took us to dinner, etc. (He has been out of the house a long time ,over his anger at me re: the drinking-related problems) . He has lived near-by, paid all bills, been "available" and amicable relationship...just I have let him for the most part contact me, etc;let him do what he wanted to do, and stayed out of it. Now; he finally starts to remember I am alive. We had dinner Friday (our 27th wedding anniversary); court date Tuesday morning where he divorced me, and he asked the kids and I to have dinner with him that night. We did. Actually, he was the most "normal" that I have seen him for years..we all enjoyed it (which hasn't happened in years.)
Part of me doesn't want him to try to "pull us out" (our kids are 17 and 23 so they decide pretty-much their own "rules" with him) when he still wants his family. On the other hand; besides the fact that we have two children together........I love this sick man; we have been together 30 years. I don't want to prevent him from his bottom,either. I am afraid of allowing him to continue to lean on me; I must stop leaning on him. Although separate, we really are not.
So; if it is something that I chose to do, no strings attatched......no manipulations, etc on my part....no expectations .........that is not enabling, or is it?
He wants to fix the garage door; it needs it. I think it is nice. ok,right....no strings. He initiated divorce, so he is not trying to get me back..if it helps his guilt, and fixes my door, ok? right?
It feels like so much game-playing this enabling stuff.......probably because evidently my "auto-pilot" needs its co-ordinates reprogramed. Is what I just need to remember; "is this in MY best interest?" .....I thought I had, but sometimes I did go along rather than waste my energy. I stopped some, and here is the result (divorce). I know there is a difference between "selfish" and self-interest/love. Before active alcoholism I knew it even better..........I got tired and lazy in my boundaries.
This question has been in my mind the past few days.....seemed a good place to ask. Basically I think xah (wow---I hate to write/see that) still thinks somehow he can still keep things with me and the kids "normal" ......aka. there for him when he needs or wants us/not bothering him, worrying about him, basically not interfering in his drinking or selfish behavior or hurting us by it (HIS thoughts......lalaland). I do not want to alienate him (even if I could; we have two dependent children , one still at home full time) BUT i don't want to make it easier to destroy himself. Can I trust that to Let go,let God and just do what works for me and forget how or if it "effects" him....let that be HIS consequence,good or bad? Is that all I need as my guideline? That is my thinking;am I wrong? I got to this board, so you know my thinking/descion-making can use some "fine-tuning" at the very least! I am working on that......it is getting better, but I know I will be working on it the rest of my life. The more I learn, the less I know.
Thank you, kind folks, for your input and experience. It helps.
Hope this didn't highjack this thread.
Part of me doesn't want him to try to "pull us out" (our kids are 17 and 23 so they decide pretty-much their own "rules" with him) when he still wants his family. On the other hand; besides the fact that we have two children together........I love this sick man; we have been together 30 years. I don't want to prevent him from his bottom,either. I am afraid of allowing him to continue to lean on me; I must stop leaning on him. Although separate, we really are not.
So; if it is something that I chose to do, no strings attatched......no manipulations, etc on my part....no expectations .........that is not enabling, or is it?
He wants to fix the garage door; it needs it. I think it is nice. ok,right....no strings. He initiated divorce, so he is not trying to get me back..if it helps his guilt, and fixes my door, ok? right?
It feels like so much game-playing this enabling stuff.......probably because evidently my "auto-pilot" needs its co-ordinates reprogramed. Is what I just need to remember; "is this in MY best interest?" .....I thought I had, but sometimes I did go along rather than waste my energy. I stopped some, and here is the result (divorce). I know there is a difference between "selfish" and self-interest/love. Before active alcoholism I knew it even better..........I got tired and lazy in my boundaries.
This question has been in my mind the past few days.....seemed a good place to ask. Basically I think xah (wow---I hate to write/see that) still thinks somehow he can still keep things with me and the kids "normal" ......aka. there for him when he needs or wants us/not bothering him, worrying about him, basically not interfering in his drinking or selfish behavior or hurting us by it (HIS thoughts......lalaland). I do not want to alienate him (even if I could; we have two dependent children , one still at home full time) BUT i don't want to make it easier to destroy himself. Can I trust that to Let go,let God and just do what works for me and forget how or if it "effects" him....let that be HIS consequence,good or bad? Is that all I need as my guideline? That is my thinking;am I wrong? I got to this board, so you know my thinking/descion-making can use some "fine-tuning" at the very least! I am working on that......it is getting better, but I know I will be working on it the rest of my life. The more I learn, the less I know.
Thank you, kind folks, for your input and experience. It helps.
Hope this didn't highjack this thread.
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What if the pain of facing his demons was far greater than the pain of living with the after affects of hiding from those demons (drinking)? What right did I have to demand that he dealt with his problems?
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