Why do they see it in other people?
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Why do they see it in other people?
IDK if I have mentioned before (I think I have) that my SIL and her husband are way worse with alcohol than my AH and that's pretty freaking bad. Anyway SS came back from his mom's and wanted to go watch the game at SIL's because they usually have football parties. AH, SS and DS went. (I was at work) They ended up leaving early because SS and AH were annoyed by SIL and her husband's behavior.
1. AH rejected SIL's offer of wine, beer and liquor. (Silent yay!? I wanted to kill her though, how can she complain about his drinking but offer him alcohol-I know they are illogical but #()*&$(*#%)@$&!!!!!!)
2. AH mentioned that SIL is SUPER obnoxious when she's drunk. (Yep she really is and so are you but I didn't say that)
3. His BIL was so drunk he could barely talk (Yep deal with that too but then you get mad when we ask you to repeat yourself because we can't understand you)
3. He also mentioned that BIL has gotten a huge stomach (AH has too, probably more so because he has a ton of GI issues and isn't supposed to be drinking)
4. Their daughters seemed super uncomfortable (Yea I told you kids know more than you think.) At Christmas my 10 year old niece said "all daddy cares about is guns and beer" and the older niece 14 said "mama drinks A LOT of wine, like a lot, like I think 2 bottles a day" So yea they were probably uncomfortable.
He does all of the same garbage why does he see it in them? It is because he can't remember what he's done? Is it because while doesn't have any great length of sobriety, he's been sober 30 days and is maybe a little clearer? He's never mentioned SIL's crappy behavior before. He's usually drinking with them and engaging in the same ridiculous behavior.
1. AH rejected SIL's offer of wine, beer and liquor. (Silent yay!? I wanted to kill her though, how can she complain about his drinking but offer him alcohol-I know they are illogical but #()*&$(*#%)@$&!!!!!!)
2. AH mentioned that SIL is SUPER obnoxious when she's drunk. (Yep she really is and so are you but I didn't say that)
3. His BIL was so drunk he could barely talk (Yep deal with that too but then you get mad when we ask you to repeat yourself because we can't understand you)
3. He also mentioned that BIL has gotten a huge stomach (AH has too, probably more so because he has a ton of GI issues and isn't supposed to be drinking)
4. Their daughters seemed super uncomfortable (Yea I told you kids know more than you think.) At Christmas my 10 year old niece said "all daddy cares about is guns and beer" and the older niece 14 said "mama drinks A LOT of wine, like a lot, like I think 2 bottles a day" So yea they were probably uncomfortable.
He does all of the same garbage why does he see it in them? It is because he can't remember what he's done? Is it because while doesn't have any great length of sobriety, he's been sober 30 days and is maybe a little clearer? He's never mentioned SIL's crappy behavior before. He's usually drinking with them and engaging in the same ridiculous behavior.
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That sounds incredibly frustrating. Its enough to make you bang your head on a wall. Even if they are sober it takes months for the fog to clear enough for them to think, much less think clearly. Also he may still be in denial. Is he working some kind of program? If not he may never see himself in that light. I feel so sorry for those kids. They can't escape, they have no choice in the matter. 😢
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Originally Posted by Wamama48 
That sounds incredibly frustrating. Its enough to make you bang your head on a wall. Even if they are sober it takes months for the fog to clear enough for them to think, much less think clearly. Also he may still be in denial. Is he working some kind of program? If not he may never see himself in that light. I feel so sorry for those kids. They can't escape, they have no choice in the matter. 😢
He did agree to go see our doctor for his anxiety and panic attacks. His appointment is next week. I do hope he eventually finds his way into a program but I'm not going to hold my breath.
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"First the addict lies to himself about his addiction, then he begins to lie to others. Lying, evasion, deception, manipulation, spinning and other techniques for avoiding or distorting the truth are necessary parts of the addictive process. They precede the main body of the addiction like military sappers and shock troops, mapping and clearing the way for its advance and protecting it from hostile counterattacks".
Addiction, Lies and Relationships
"One of the chief ways the addiction protects and strengthens itself is by a psychology of personal exceptionalism which permits the addict to maintain a simultaneous double-entry bookkeeping of addictive and non-addictive realities and to reconcile the two when required by reference to the unique, special considerations that - at least in his own mind- happen to apply to his particular case.
The form of the logic for this personal exceptionalism is:
Under ordinary circumstances and for most people X is undesirable/irrational;
My circumstances are not ordinary and I am different from most people;
Therefore X is not undesirable/irrational in my case - or not as undesirable/irrational as it would be in other cases".
Addiction, Lies and Relationships
"One of the chief ways the addiction protects and strengthens itself is by a psychology of personal exceptionalism which permits the addict to maintain a simultaneous double-entry bookkeeping of addictive and non-addictive realities and to reconcile the two when required by reference to the unique, special considerations that - at least in his own mind- happen to apply to his particular case.
The form of the logic for this personal exceptionalism is:
Under ordinary circumstances and for most people X is undesirable/irrational;
My circumstances are not ordinary and I am different from most people;
Therefore X is not undesirable/irrational in my case - or not as undesirable/irrational as it would be in other cases".
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alwayscovering…..(1)--Yeah---as per trailmix….they are exceptional cases, in their own mind.
(2)….Denial--the major defense of alcoholics. They HAVE to use denial...because, otherwise, they would have to blame themselves....
(3)…..I think you are right that when they are drunk, they don't see themselves and don't remember much, or, or almost none
of the things that happen. People are usually very shocked when their filmed behavior is shown to them...…
I think that it is sooo easy for the sober one to forget that the drunk person doesn't remember the same things that they do.....
(2)….Denial--the major defense of alcoholics. They HAVE to use denial...because, otherwise, they would have to blame themselves....
(3)…..I think you are right that when they are drunk, they don't see themselves and don't remember much, or, or almost none
of the things that happen. People are usually very shocked when their filmed behavior is shown to them...…
I think that it is sooo easy for the sober one to forget that the drunk person doesn't remember the same things that they do.....
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Oh my goodness, XA was a bartender.
The few brief hours in the morning( before he starting drinking for the day) he always had a story to share, about previous nights customers. So, and so was so flipping drunk all they wanted to do was argue, or so and so was so loud and obnoxious, nobody had a chance to speak. Oh and why do drunks become experts on every subject, and if someone disagrees with them all hell breaks loose.. and my personal favorite, so and so was so loaded he / she pissed their pants.....
And all I could think have you looked in the damn mirror lately? Holy crap.
They are clueless, they really never see themselves as having a problem, it the rest of the world that is all screwed up.
The few brief hours in the morning( before he starting drinking for the day) he always had a story to share, about previous nights customers. So, and so was so flipping drunk all they wanted to do was argue, or so and so was so loud and obnoxious, nobody had a chance to speak. Oh and why do drunks become experts on every subject, and if someone disagrees with them all hell breaks loose.. and my personal favorite, so and so was so loaded he / she pissed their pants.....
And all I could think have you looked in the damn mirror lately? Holy crap.
They are clueless, they really never see themselves as having a problem, it the rest of the world that is all screwed up.
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I was talking to a friend the other day about an incident that happened with her XABF. They were at a party, talking to a couple they knew. My friends XABF, who was drunk, was telling the other couple how great he was doing, and hadn't had an alcoholic drink in two months. While holding an open beer in his hand. Delusional. She ended up leaving him because of his alcoholism, and he died several years later because of his alcoholism.
"O you must wear your rue with difference".
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,146
The worst is when they turn around and viciously attack you when you try to talk about your concerns. I wasn't even allowed to use the word "addict".
I started to see a pattern of projection. Whenever the addict criticized another person, he was projecting his insecurities onto them. One day he randomly started ranting about the infidelity depicted in various TV shows. That was when I knew I was not the only one. That was also when I figured out that his ex-wife had once had the same realisation.
They just don't live on the same planet as normies. They live on a planet with a population of one where injury and death, they think, are both only theoretical.
I started to see a pattern of projection. Whenever the addict criticized another person, he was projecting his insecurities onto them. One day he randomly started ranting about the infidelity depicted in various TV shows. That was when I knew I was not the only one. That was also when I figured out that his ex-wife had once had the same realisation.
They just don't live on the same planet as normies. They live on a planet with a population of one where injury and death, they think, are both only theoretical.
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Posts: 1,618
Given that alcoholism is often intergenerational, plenty of alcoholics grew up with parents who were also alcoholics. It always amazes me when they can identify so clearly the damaging behaviors connected to alcohol in their childhood, and then turn around and do the same things (if not worse) themselves.
My brain says: if I know that behavior X leads to self destruction and produces misery in other people, then I will avoid engaging in behavior X. But my brain is not an addict brain. I think AA calls it "terminal uniqueness": I am different from THOSE people, the judgments that apply to THEM do not apply to me because I am the exception to every rule.
My brain says: if I know that behavior X leads to self destruction and produces misery in other people, then I will avoid engaging in behavior X. But my brain is not an addict brain. I think AA calls it "terminal uniqueness": I am different from THOSE people, the judgments that apply to THEM do not apply to me because I am the exception to every rule.
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