What's next
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 256
What's next
Things have been at a standstill with AH. We have been separated (living in different towns even) for over 7 months. AH calls DS and DD nightly and visits a few times a week. It has worked good for me so far and am content with the arrangements. Sure I would like some more time for me/help with the kids but that's about it. If I need a babysitter, I find one.
This weekend we took a family trip to an amusement park and things were good. I was hesitant to have AH go at first, but we made great memories for the kids and I feel like that is what my life needs to focus on- making wonderful memories for the kids! I am very thankful that things went so well this weekend, especially after hearing that AH had been drinking earlier in the week (not that I was convinced that he's had any type of long time sobriety during these months. It was just a gut feeling I had sometimes during phone calls.) AH was very helpful as we could split up taking the kids to different parts of the park as well. He did his fair share of rides too!
I have been getting counseling on an ongoing basis and we have weaned it back to monthly and my counselor said the next step for me is to figure out what I want with AH in the future. Problem is I still don't know what I want for the future. At this point I don't see him moving back in ever, and the kids have stopped asking about that. They are used to the routine we have now. But I am not sure I want a divorce either. How would that benefit me? We already have separate bank accounts, the kids and I are on his insurance, he pays a good chunk of the bills monthly (more than the minimum it I took him to court for child support.) There is very little equity, if any, in the house either and the kids and I live there now even though AH's name is on the house. He comes and takes care of mowing the lawn when needed.
Anyone else ever been stuck in this limbo for an extended time?
This weekend we took a family trip to an amusement park and things were good. I was hesitant to have AH go at first, but we made great memories for the kids and I feel like that is what my life needs to focus on- making wonderful memories for the kids! I am very thankful that things went so well this weekend, especially after hearing that AH had been drinking earlier in the week (not that I was convinced that he's had any type of long time sobriety during these months. It was just a gut feeling I had sometimes during phone calls.) AH was very helpful as we could split up taking the kids to different parts of the park as well. He did his fair share of rides too!
I have been getting counseling on an ongoing basis and we have weaned it back to monthly and my counselor said the next step for me is to figure out what I want with AH in the future. Problem is I still don't know what I want for the future. At this point I don't see him moving back in ever, and the kids have stopped asking about that. They are used to the routine we have now. But I am not sure I want a divorce either. How would that benefit me? We already have separate bank accounts, the kids and I are on his insurance, he pays a good chunk of the bills monthly (more than the minimum it I took him to court for child support.) There is very little equity, if any, in the house either and the kids and I live there now even though AH's name is on the house. He comes and takes care of mowing the lawn when needed.
Anyone else ever been stuck in this limbo for an extended time?
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: South Central USA
Posts: 1,478
Sorry, I haven't been in that particular situation. The good news is that you don't have to make any decision until you're ready and, as I have been told many times by wise SR folks, you have permission to change your mind!
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Western US
Posts: 9,012
Hey Kids#1, I haven't been in your particular situation so can't be much help. I hope others chime in who have more experience.
I liked what Katchie said. It doesn't seem like there is any reason to make an immediate decision unless you are unhappy with something.
Sounds like fun at the park!
I liked what Katchie said. It doesn't seem like there is any reason to make an immediate decision unless you are unhappy with something.
Sounds like fun at the park!
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
Posts: 3,581
At this point I don't see him moving back in ever, and the kids have stopped asking about that. They are used to the routine we have now. How would that benefit me?
You ask how it would benefit given the current scenario - it appears that you are operating financially and in every other way as if you are already divorced. He does not live with you, He is helping financially, you are sharing custody of the children. This IS what an amicable divorce looks like.
I suppose to you divorcing would just be "getting that piece of paper". It would entail attorneys, costs for those attorneys, it may result in change of living situation, it might affect your finances to either the positive or negative. So why do it?
There is a very good reason to since he is actively drinking, you are betting on a lame horse. Your current situation is dependent on your AH maintaining employment (insurance), and meeting his financial obligations with the children and you. At this time you have nothing at all that obligates him to pay anything other than his good will to do so. We know that his alcoholism will progress eventually. He has slid down a bad road before inclusive of a DWI, it looks like he may have lost a job before due to it, he has attended 2 rehabs, and he is still drinking.
In many of the scenarios like yours a spouse will go along with status quo because in their mind financially it is the better choice to make. Then it happens, the alcoholism progresses, a job could be lost, another DUI or other legal problem. The spouse now finds themselves in a position divorcing someone who is unemployed
and whom THEY have to pay alimony to, who may have tapped into retirement savings unbeknownst to them, who might have charged up massive credit card debt unbeknownst to them, who might have pawned a car title, taken out a loan, gotten a secondary mortgage, bought another property, All of a sudden the divorce takes on a new meaning, DEBT, no income, no money for attorneys, bills not paid, insurance cancelled, home going in foreclosure and bankruptcy.
This happens to many, many people. You don't live with him, you have NO idea what he is up to or what the status of his drinking is.
So I advise you move forward with divorce since you have stated you don't see him ever moving back in. It sounds like you have emotionally detached from him and are completely checked out of the marriage. In your past threads it appears you have come close to divorce before and went to mediation. That experience appeared to be amicable.
No, you don't have to do anything about it today, or even in a month. But the longer you wait, the more you risk.
You ask how it would benefit given the current scenario - it appears that you are operating financially and in every other way as if you are already divorced. He does not live with you, He is helping financially, you are sharing custody of the children. This IS what an amicable divorce looks like.
I suppose to you divorcing would just be "getting that piece of paper". It would entail attorneys, costs for those attorneys, it may result in change of living situation, it might affect your finances to either the positive or negative. So why do it?
There is a very good reason to since he is actively drinking, you are betting on a lame horse. Your current situation is dependent on your AH maintaining employment (insurance), and meeting his financial obligations with the children and you. At this time you have nothing at all that obligates him to pay anything other than his good will to do so. We know that his alcoholism will progress eventually. He has slid down a bad road before inclusive of a DWI, it looks like he may have lost a job before due to it, he has attended 2 rehabs, and he is still drinking.
In many of the scenarios like yours a spouse will go along with status quo because in their mind financially it is the better choice to make. Then it happens, the alcoholism progresses, a job could be lost, another DUI or other legal problem. The spouse now finds themselves in a position divorcing someone who is unemployed
and whom THEY have to pay alimony to, who may have tapped into retirement savings unbeknownst to them, who might have charged up massive credit card debt unbeknownst to them, who might have pawned a car title, taken out a loan, gotten a secondary mortgage, bought another property, All of a sudden the divorce takes on a new meaning, DEBT, no income, no money for attorneys, bills not paid, insurance cancelled, home going in foreclosure and bankruptcy.This happens to many, many people. You don't live with him, you have NO idea what he is up to or what the status of his drinking is.
So I advise you move forward with divorce since you have stated you don't see him ever moving back in. It sounds like you have emotionally detached from him and are completely checked out of the marriage. In your past threads it appears you have come close to divorce before and went to mediation. That experience appeared to be amicable.
No, you don't have to do anything about it today, or even in a month. But the longer you wait, the more you risk.
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Midwest
Posts: 11,481
I'd like to reiterate all the things redatlanta said. I narrowly dodged a bullet of expensive medical procedures that XAH incurred several months after we were divorced, and I was dang glad not to be in the line of fire for that.
You may want to consult an attorney about separation, if that is an option in your state. I did this initially so I could remain on his insurance (I had none of my own and no option at the job I had then). I probably could have remained separated from XAH indefinitely (attorney told me it does offer financial separation also) but did end up converting to divorce after it became clear that I was only postponing what I felt was inevitable. Again, as redatlanta said, an active A is only going to get worse over time.
Like you, now that XAH lives elsewhere and contact is limited and largely via email/phone, I find myself thinking "he's not doing so badly, did I over react?" But I'm not front and center for his show any more--I didn't have any idea what was going on when I lived w/him, and I certainly would be foolish to think I have a clue now!
Our divorce was amicable and we did it pro se, w/an attorney involved only for consultation, to make sure forms were filled out properly, etc. Don't know that you can go that route w/kids and so on, but divorce does not HAVE to mean thousands of dollars in attorney fees and bitter battles about the silverware and lawn chairs.
You may want to consult an attorney about separation, if that is an option in your state. I did this initially so I could remain on his insurance (I had none of my own and no option at the job I had then). I probably could have remained separated from XAH indefinitely (attorney told me it does offer financial separation also) but did end up converting to divorce after it became clear that I was only postponing what I felt was inevitable. Again, as redatlanta said, an active A is only going to get worse over time.
Like you, now that XAH lives elsewhere and contact is limited and largely via email/phone, I find myself thinking "he's not doing so badly, did I over react?" But I'm not front and center for his show any more--I didn't have any idea what was going on when I lived w/him, and I certainly would be foolish to think I have a clue now!
Our divorce was amicable and we did it pro se, w/an attorney involved only for consultation, to make sure forms were filled out properly, etc. Don't know that you can go that route w/kids and so on, but divorce does not HAVE to mean thousands of dollars in attorney fees and bitter battles about the silverware and lawn chairs.
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: uk
Posts: 665
The red flag on it for me is that it may well be fine and amicable now but what if he gets involved in a new relationship. I worked in this field and found that new partners tended to change the whole dynamic. He might not be so reasonable then.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
I would be that eventually he will make that decision for you. Not many men would stick around long term, paying bills, etc once they realize there is no chance of them coming back home. Now, there is the odd man out there who I am sure would, I just don't know of any.
Once my X met his now wife and started dating her, he became a different person as far as his demands, money, shared time, etc.
Keep taking good care of you!
Once my X met his now wife and started dating her, he became a different person as far as his demands, money, shared time, etc.
Keep taking good care of you!
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Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 166
Yes I've been in a similar situation (with some differences). Got legally separated 5 years ago after AH lost his job due to his drinking. Then he went to rehab, stayed sober a few years. We have a young son. He kept sober for 3+ years, got a low paying new job (but still a job), and would spend weekends on some weeknights with us. Financially the separation protected my money (I have much more than him) but I still kept him on my health insurance. He only had enough money for groceries, etc. - honestly it didn't make a dent but I thought it made him feel better so I let him pick up that.
I stayed legally separated til now and, while it always nagged me a bit, I thought we could just stay status quo. I mean, he was sober, we were financially separated but still operated as a family in some ways. I would foot the main bills and he would just help me with our child and be like a husband.
Not a very normal situation - but I thought why rock the apple cart if it's working. I mean, all I demanded was that he stay sober.
He relapsed about 3 years later. Once in November (I took him back after he went to detox and promised he would be ok now), and again, last month - right before I was scheduled for hip surgery!! I needed him then as I would not be able to move around and really, really needed his help.
So, I am going to divorce now. Basically, he left me no choice. I feel awful, still love him, and hope for his sake and our son that he sobers up for good, but realize that it is totally, completely out of my control and any attempts to do so (or even worry about it) are futile. It sucks and I am in immeasurable pain, but I would be out of my mind to take him back now and go back to the status quo of the last years.
I know there are differences in our situations, but I was living in that limbo stage. It is harder to cut the cord completely when kids are involved, and I still don't know exactly how I will handle that. However, I think limbo doesn't usually last - especially not with an A who has not found true sobriety. There is always some kind of crisis. In your case, I would agree that you don't want to be stuck with any financial fallout from his drinking, should it occur (I got ambulance bills from his last relapse, since he was still on my insurance).
Sometimes staying in the same position is easier, but not better. With an A, the decision is usually made for you. It was in my case. Wishing you the best.
I stayed legally separated til now and, while it always nagged me a bit, I thought we could just stay status quo. I mean, he was sober, we were financially separated but still operated as a family in some ways. I would foot the main bills and he would just help me with our child and be like a husband.
Not a very normal situation - but I thought why rock the apple cart if it's working. I mean, all I demanded was that he stay sober.
He relapsed about 3 years later. Once in November (I took him back after he went to detox and promised he would be ok now), and again, last month - right before I was scheduled for hip surgery!! I needed him then as I would not be able to move around and really, really needed his help.
So, I am going to divorce now. Basically, he left me no choice. I feel awful, still love him, and hope for his sake and our son that he sobers up for good, but realize that it is totally, completely out of my control and any attempts to do so (or even worry about it) are futile. It sucks and I am in immeasurable pain, but I would be out of my mind to take him back now and go back to the status quo of the last years.
I know there are differences in our situations, but I was living in that limbo stage. It is harder to cut the cord completely when kids are involved, and I still don't know exactly how I will handle that. However, I think limbo doesn't usually last - especially not with an A who has not found true sobriety. There is always some kind of crisis. In your case, I would agree that you don't want to be stuck with any financial fallout from his drinking, should it occur (I got ambulance bills from his last relapse, since he was still on my insurance).
Sometimes staying in the same position is easier, but not better. With an A, the decision is usually made for you. It was in my case. Wishing you the best.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 256
Thanks
Thanks for all the input. I know the kids and I can get back on fidelis/Medicaid quickly if health insurance is lost. Have done that in the past and is something I am very knowledgeable with as part of my job.
I had consulted with a lawyer in January and she said separation isn't an option in NY or it wouldn't change anything for me ( I can't remember.) She said we could go to court for child support, but since he is in the banking field he knows what he would be required to pay and gives us more then that. He had to signed a statement regarding that for me to get HEAP and weatherization.
Plus since he is in banking, he actually has to keep a good credit report for his job. We have no joint CC bills, just the mortgage in both our names.
Appreciate all the input.
I had consulted with a lawyer in January and she said separation isn't an option in NY or it wouldn't change anything for me ( I can't remember.) She said we could go to court for child support, but since he is in the banking field he knows what he would be required to pay and gives us more then that. He had to signed a statement regarding that for me to get HEAP and weatherization.
Plus since he is in banking, he actually has to keep a good credit report for his job. We have no joint CC bills, just the mortgage in both our names.
Appreciate all the input.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 256
Was I wrong?
my BIL is hosting a surprise party this weekend for his wife and today he told me he was not sure he wanted AH there. He was pretty upset that to him, AH had been drinking before they went to the races with other guys, last week. BIL felt it ruined the mood of the night, even though AH was in a really good mood.
So tonight I was talking to AH on the phone and told him that I got a sitter so that I could go the party. I asked him if something had happened with his brother last week. he said things were great! I asked if he had been drinking prior to meeting up and he told me he never drank at the races, and skirted answering the question for a bit. I told him that based on our brief phone call that day before going to the races I had had a hunch he had been drinking, which he denied. It then turned into an "I don't care about him, he can't win with any of us, we don't trust him" type of rant. He said he isn't going to the party of course now too, not that he was really invited in the first place.
I asked him how long he has been sober. His story changed a few times and each time it changed I pointed out that honesty/transparency is a step towards earning trust in my eyes.
I was pretty point blank with him that I have told him before that it would take awhile to earn trust. He said his sponsor, who he doesn't meet with like he used to, has said that it takes awhile to earn trust again too.
He assumed because we had a great weekend as a family that he was going to be able to stay over a few nights sometime. I apologized and told him that I am sorry if I gave that impression but I am not even close to considering that. (classic give them an inch and they want a mile!)
He then went on about being offered a job in another state and may take it. I told him, as I always have, to do what he feels is best for him with his sobriety/recovery. Then he went on how he wants to see the kids more often but that while I have said he can come over whenever to see them when we are home, he told me the 45 min drive was too long. Told me to go ahead and find someone else, file for divorce, all I want is his money, etc. He was really trying to make me feel guilty. Even told me that he tried to find his wedding ring, that he hasn't worn in 15 years, last week when he was at the house.
Is this all called gas lighting? Since he kept defecting, isn't that a sure sign he isn't in recovery? Was I wrong to bring up about my thoughts on whether he has been drinking?
So tonight I was talking to AH on the phone and told him that I got a sitter so that I could go the party. I asked him if something had happened with his brother last week. he said things were great! I asked if he had been drinking prior to meeting up and he told me he never drank at the races, and skirted answering the question for a bit. I told him that based on our brief phone call that day before going to the races I had had a hunch he had been drinking, which he denied. It then turned into an "I don't care about him, he can't win with any of us, we don't trust him" type of rant. He said he isn't going to the party of course now too, not that he was really invited in the first place.
I asked him how long he has been sober. His story changed a few times and each time it changed I pointed out that honesty/transparency is a step towards earning trust in my eyes.
I was pretty point blank with him that I have told him before that it would take awhile to earn trust. He said his sponsor, who he doesn't meet with like he used to, has said that it takes awhile to earn trust again too.
He assumed because we had a great weekend as a family that he was going to be able to stay over a few nights sometime. I apologized and told him that I am sorry if I gave that impression but I am not even close to considering that. (classic give them an inch and they want a mile!)
He then went on about being offered a job in another state and may take it. I told him, as I always have, to do what he feels is best for him with his sobriety/recovery. Then he went on how he wants to see the kids more often but that while I have said he can come over whenever to see them when we are home, he told me the 45 min drive was too long. Told me to go ahead and find someone else, file for divorce, all I want is his money, etc. He was really trying to make me feel guilty. Even told me that he tried to find his wedding ring, that he hasn't worn in 15 years, last week when he was at the house.
Is this all called gas lighting? Since he kept defecting, isn't that a sure sign he isn't in recovery? Was I wrong to bring up about my thoughts on whether he has been drinking?
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
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I'm puzzled by what you all are exactly. You have said in this post you "don't want to him to move back in ever".
However, it appears in your conversation that you all are discussing him building back trust. Trust for?? Moving back in together? Resuming the marriage? I'm not sure. Because you then say that he thought he might be able to stay over a couple nights a week, but that you are not even close to ready for that.
It sounds like there are many mixed signals here, that your husband still thinks you all are headed toward reconciliation. You seem to want to live as if divorced while remaining married. Hopeful4 makes a good point, and I wonder if its not accurate, the complicity you are getting is simply because he wants to move back, home and thinks you may let him.......
I think its very clear he is drinking. Your BIL said he was, he didn't answer if he was sober, he changed the subject, then he attacked you.
I don't consider what he did to be gas lighting. That would be him making you feel you are crazy - like seeing him in a bar through a window, seeing him drinking a beer, confronting him, then him telling you he was not there, it wasn't him, and you are nuts. That's gas lighting.
I see him blame shifting that you are attacking him, deflecting, projection, and just plain old manipulation. He's going to Move!!! He wants to see the kids!!! Go FIND SOMEONE ELSE!!!! His wedding ring, (sniff sniff tearing up) he tried to find it!You greedy woman you only want my MONEY!!!! Yawn. Oldest lines in the book.
Is it your business if he is drinking? It is if he has the kids. It is if you are trying to reconcile. If you have no intention of reconciling then no, its not your business except in custodial arrangements of your children, and when he has contact or custody of them.
Plus since he is in banking, he actually has to keep a good credit report for his job.
Legal, financial, familial, or employment, has never stood in the way of any active alcoholic in the history of the world. Please don't pin your security on this.
However, it appears in your conversation that you all are discussing him building back trust. Trust for?? Moving back in together? Resuming the marriage? I'm not sure. Because you then say that he thought he might be able to stay over a couple nights a week, but that you are not even close to ready for that.
It sounds like there are many mixed signals here, that your husband still thinks you all are headed toward reconciliation. You seem to want to live as if divorced while remaining married. Hopeful4 makes a good point, and I wonder if its not accurate, the complicity you are getting is simply because he wants to move back, home and thinks you may let him.......
I think its very clear he is drinking. Your BIL said he was, he didn't answer if he was sober, he changed the subject, then he attacked you.
I don't consider what he did to be gas lighting. That would be him making you feel you are crazy - like seeing him in a bar through a window, seeing him drinking a beer, confronting him, then him telling you he was not there, it wasn't him, and you are nuts. That's gas lighting.
I see him blame shifting that you are attacking him, deflecting, projection, and just plain old manipulation. He's going to Move!!! He wants to see the kids!!! Go FIND SOMEONE ELSE!!!! His wedding ring, (sniff sniff tearing up) he tried to find it!You greedy woman you only want my MONEY!!!! Yawn. Oldest lines in the book.
Is it your business if he is drinking? It is if he has the kids. It is if you are trying to reconcile. If you have no intention of reconciling then no, its not your business except in custodial arrangements of your children, and when he has contact or custody of them.
Plus since he is in banking, he actually has to keep a good credit report for his job.
Legal, financial, familial, or employment, has never stood in the way of any active alcoholic in the history of the world. Please don't pin your security on this.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 256
I can see how I have maybe sent him mixed messages by keeping the peace with the kids and not making any move towards a divorce so he assumes a reconciliation.
While I see the vacation as a way to create memories for the kids as a family, he obviously took it as a direction of him moving back in. He was the one who had suggested the vacation and I went along with it as I thought we would have a nice time.
When I say I don't ever see him moving back in, it is partly because I don't think that far ahead now. I have been disappointed too many times when I dream about our future. If he got a year or 2 of sobriety maybe I would consider him moving back home, but I also have seen that just because they have that much sobriety time isn't a guarantee that they won't relapse. I also know the back and forth is not good for the kids either.
This is definitely an area of something to explore with my therapist.
While I see the vacation as a way to create memories for the kids as a family, he obviously took it as a direction of him moving back in. He was the one who had suggested the vacation and I went along with it as I thought we would have a nice time.
When I say I don't ever see him moving back in, it is partly because I don't think that far ahead now. I have been disappointed too many times when I dream about our future. If he got a year or 2 of sobriety maybe I would consider him moving back home, but I also have seen that just because they have that much sobriety time isn't a guarantee that they won't relapse. I also know the back and forth is not good for the kids either.
This is definitely an area of something to explore with my therapist.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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KidsR#1...it sounds like your husband is an alcoholic who is still under the control of the disease. Who is still in denial and desperately wishes to do controlled drinking.....the fondest desire of every alcoholic.
sounds like he would like the status quo back...and the family restored to former status...but, doesn't comprehend what genuine recovery means...beyond just not drinking or "cutting back" or hiding it from others.
As far at the BIL-party situation.....I think that it probably works best to leave his social situations to him to manage...(or not...lol)....just let people, who plead the case to you, know that he is a grown man and that you have no controlover what he does.....
You can see where it gets you to get between your husband and his drinking....his defensive anger.....
Anyone who gets between the alcoholic and their ability to drink....they become the "enemy"....
You will probably never understand what it feels li ke to be an alcoholic....the overwhelming compulsion to drink...because alcohol is to the alcoholic like oxygen is to you.....Like water is to the fish....It is the only way that they can feel normal and manage their feelings on a day to day basis.....
I know this is all very hard for you.....
dandylion
sounds like he would like the status quo back...and the family restored to former status...but, doesn't comprehend what genuine recovery means...beyond just not drinking or "cutting back" or hiding it from others.
As far at the BIL-party situation.....I think that it probably works best to leave his social situations to him to manage...(or not...lol)....just let people, who plead the case to you, know that he is a grown man and that you have no controlover what he does.....
You can see where it gets you to get between your husband and his drinking....his defensive anger.....
Anyone who gets between the alcoholic and their ability to drink....they become the "enemy"....
You will probably never understand what it feels li ke to be an alcoholic....the overwhelming compulsion to drink...because alcohol is to the alcoholic like oxygen is to you.....Like water is to the fish....It is the only way that they can feel normal and manage their feelings on a day to day basis.....
I know this is all very hard for you.....
dandylion
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
Posts: 3,581
Therapist sounds like a great idea.
Perhaps it would be best to have a conversation with your A regarding a future reconciliation. You have a map, you require 1 to 2 years of adhered sobriety and a recovery program.
Yes, unfortunately there is always potential for a relapse. My husband relapsed after 10 years sober. Some people, once they sink their teeth into it don't relapse. I do believe its more common than not. Once you see the red flags and know what to look for I think it is helpful, a relapse happens in the brain long before it ever hits the lips. I was uneducated about it when my husband relapsed though there were many, many signs he was headed that direction. Now I do feel that if he started walking that path again I would be able to recognize it. I can' stop him from relapsing, but I can enforce my boundary which is "I am outta here".
Its hard to fathom that you have to always worry at least when he initially got sober I still worried. I worried for a long time. Even a missed phone call for several months would raise my BP a little. As I worked my own recovery that feeling lessened and is no longer a part of my life. I do not worry if he will relapse because I have a plan. I have already made my decision what I will do if he does - and he KNOWS it.
Perhaps it would be best to have a conversation with your A regarding a future reconciliation. You have a map, you require 1 to 2 years of adhered sobriety and a recovery program.
Yes, unfortunately there is always potential for a relapse. My husband relapsed after 10 years sober. Some people, once they sink their teeth into it don't relapse. I do believe its more common than not. Once you see the red flags and know what to look for I think it is helpful, a relapse happens in the brain long before it ever hits the lips. I was uneducated about it when my husband relapsed though there were many, many signs he was headed that direction. Now I do feel that if he started walking that path again I would be able to recognize it. I can' stop him from relapsing, but I can enforce my boundary which is "I am outta here".
Its hard to fathom that you have to always worry at least when he initially got sober I still worried. I worried for a long time. Even a missed phone call for several months would raise my BP a little. As I worked my own recovery that feeling lessened and is no longer a part of my life. I do not worry if he will relapse because I have a plan. I have already made my decision what I will do if he does - and he KNOWS it.
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Location: Florida
Posts: 6,781
I'm of the opinion that his generosities have been offered less out of a desire to do the right thing & more from a place of manipulation. If he does x, y, z then surely you'll see the light, allow him back & things will go right back to how they'd been in time. Just checking off the boxes, no recovery work, no REAL changes. Kind quacking, so to speak.
The distance is also affording him time & space to continue drinking so no matter how badly he wants back in the family home, a part of him is very, very happy to be unregulated - just look at his reaction to your questions on the phone!
What do you think would happen if you were to tell him that you do not see a reconciliation in the future at all - that it's not possible based on where you both are right now? I'm betting you'd start seeing VERY different attitude & behavior from him. I'm willing to bet it's close to a 180 from what you're seeing right now.... this is something you NEED to be prepared for, for you & the boys. Even without saying all that outright, he's bound to grow tired of "jumping through hoops" to make you happy (which is how I'm sure he sees all of this).
But it sounds like you don't really know what you want either so without being pushed to decide, you kinda got stuck on the fence..... and eventually that gets very uncomfortable.
Yes - anyone CHOOSING a relationship with a recovering addict HAS TO ACCEPT the potential for relapse. Otherwise you're building off of unrealistic expectations from the get-go. Accepting that fact doesn't mean giving permission for it to happen, nor is it anything I've sat & discussed with RAH. That's very firmly on MY side of the street here & it's definitely not an easy point to get to. (for me)
But the facts are that you say you can "maybe consider or start thinking about maybe having a relationship with him if he's maybe 1-2 yrs sober" and he hasn't even stopped drinking yet. How long are you willing to wait for that just to BEGIN? Does that model behavior you want your boys to emulate (him) or look for in their future partners (you)? Now is when they are building definitions for the words they've been learning - family, love, obligation, guilt, boundaries, etc.
Please don't depend on this - it's actually a false sense of security. While these regulations are in place for good reason you'd be amazed how things can still slide out of control very quickly. I've seen horror stories that make me marvel at what people are capable of. What happens to the 3 of you if/when he can no longer maintain a high-functioning state? (because that's all he is right now - a high functioning addict operating under some illusion of having control which you are actually starting to see unravel as in the incident with BIL, this is a giant Red Flag to me.)
(((((Hugs)))))) I know this is hard stuff!
The distance is also affording him time & space to continue drinking so no matter how badly he wants back in the family home, a part of him is very, very happy to be unregulated - just look at his reaction to your questions on the phone!
What do you think would happen if you were to tell him that you do not see a reconciliation in the future at all - that it's not possible based on where you both are right now? I'm betting you'd start seeing VERY different attitude & behavior from him. I'm willing to bet it's close to a 180 from what you're seeing right now.... this is something you NEED to be prepared for, for you & the boys. Even without saying all that outright, he's bound to grow tired of "jumping through hoops" to make you happy (which is how I'm sure he sees all of this).
But it sounds like you don't really know what you want either so without being pushed to decide, you kinda got stuck on the fence..... and eventually that gets very uncomfortable.
Yes - anyone CHOOSING a relationship with a recovering addict HAS TO ACCEPT the potential for relapse. Otherwise you're building off of unrealistic expectations from the get-go. Accepting that fact doesn't mean giving permission for it to happen, nor is it anything I've sat & discussed with RAH. That's very firmly on MY side of the street here & it's definitely not an easy point to get to. (for me)
But the facts are that you say you can "maybe consider or start thinking about maybe having a relationship with him if he's maybe 1-2 yrs sober" and he hasn't even stopped drinking yet. How long are you willing to wait for that just to BEGIN? Does that model behavior you want your boys to emulate (him) or look for in their future partners (you)? Now is when they are building definitions for the words they've been learning - family, love, obligation, guilt, boundaries, etc.
Plus since he is in banking, he actually has to keep a good credit report for his job
(((((Hugs)))))) I know this is hard stuff!
Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,434
Speaking as a now sober but once "high-functioning" alcoholic,
he isn't going to last with the functioning part all that long if he's still drinking
and in denial he's got a problem--controlled drinking
is simply not an option for alcoholics, period.
he isn't going to last with the functioning part all that long if he's still drinking
and in denial he's got a problem--controlled drinking
is simply not an option for alcoholics, period.
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