Cunning and baffling indeed
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 157
Cunning and baffling indeed
I haven't been on here much in the last couple of weeks, which I feel is a good thing because I can honestly say, I've been feeling much better and starting to get comfortable in my new life as a single mom.
Initially, when the divorce was decided, I had pushed for the SoberLink monitoring when he was with the kids. Of course, he pushed back hard, assured me that he wasn't going to be drinking around the kids and of course, he has to have the ignition interlock device on his car for a year. I think I was just so exhausted from it all, I wanted to believe him, so I let it go.
He's been moved out now for about 1.5 months and the kids spent Friday night as his place. Today, I notice there's a receipt laying next to the bag he brought back with their clothes. I look at it and realize it's from Friday, just after he picked up the kids and low and behold, beer is listed on there.
So, I then ask my 5-year-old if dad was drinking beer and he tells me no, he was drinking "Rock Star". So, I ask if it was in a can, and he says no, a bottle, but not like a baby bottle. LOL. I then show him pictures of a couple different beer bottles on my phone and he points out the bottle of bud light as the one, after saying no to others.
So, I text STBXAH about him drinking around the kids and he assures me he hasn't. At this point, he has no idea about the receipt. He claims my son must have made it up. I then ask if he bought beer and he flat out lies and says no (big surprise.) So, then we talk and I tell him about the receipt. I ask him about his lying and he says it's none of my business what he does in his own apartment. I point out, it IS my business if it's around the kids. I think he also texted me that I'm unstable and that I just can't let go and quit trying to control him.
He still swears up and down that he didn't drink around the kids. Yes, he bought it, but didn't drink any until they were gone. (Um, ok.) Claims 5-year-old saw him putting it in the fridge and asked what it was so he told him it was Rock Star. So, one last time I ask my son if Dad was actually drinking the Rock Star or just putting it away and again, he tells me he was drinking it.
So, now I'm back to insisting on the SoberLink. STBXAH doesn't like it, of course, and is making it out like I'm some delusional person who just wants to control him. He's insinuating that I just can't move on with my own life and let him live his. Ha. I can honestly say, I DO NOT CARE A BIT if he drinks in his own time, just not around the kids!
I just can't get over his arrogance. He has so little respect for me, I really don't think he sees anything wrong with lying to me at all. I realize it's impossible to be married to someone you can't trust, but now I can include co-parenting with someone you can't trust. However, I'm looking at this incident as a sign from my higher power. I mean, how random is it that the receipt happened to be in the bag? This wasn't a grocery bag either...it was a regular bag that I had packed. I think I finally get what my therapist has been telling me all along about addicts...if their lips are moving, they're lying.
Initially, when the divorce was decided, I had pushed for the SoberLink monitoring when he was with the kids. Of course, he pushed back hard, assured me that he wasn't going to be drinking around the kids and of course, he has to have the ignition interlock device on his car for a year. I think I was just so exhausted from it all, I wanted to believe him, so I let it go.
He's been moved out now for about 1.5 months and the kids spent Friday night as his place. Today, I notice there's a receipt laying next to the bag he brought back with their clothes. I look at it and realize it's from Friday, just after he picked up the kids and low and behold, beer is listed on there.
So, I then ask my 5-year-old if dad was drinking beer and he tells me no, he was drinking "Rock Star". So, I ask if it was in a can, and he says no, a bottle, but not like a baby bottle. LOL. I then show him pictures of a couple different beer bottles on my phone and he points out the bottle of bud light as the one, after saying no to others.
So, I text STBXAH about him drinking around the kids and he assures me he hasn't. At this point, he has no idea about the receipt. He claims my son must have made it up. I then ask if he bought beer and he flat out lies and says no (big surprise.) So, then we talk and I tell him about the receipt. I ask him about his lying and he says it's none of my business what he does in his own apartment. I point out, it IS my business if it's around the kids. I think he also texted me that I'm unstable and that I just can't let go and quit trying to control him.
He still swears up and down that he didn't drink around the kids. Yes, he bought it, but didn't drink any until they were gone. (Um, ok.) Claims 5-year-old saw him putting it in the fridge and asked what it was so he told him it was Rock Star. So, one last time I ask my son if Dad was actually drinking the Rock Star or just putting it away and again, he tells me he was drinking it.
So, now I'm back to insisting on the SoberLink. STBXAH doesn't like it, of course, and is making it out like I'm some delusional person who just wants to control him. He's insinuating that I just can't move on with my own life and let him live his. Ha. I can honestly say, I DO NOT CARE A BIT if he drinks in his own time, just not around the kids!
I just can't get over his arrogance. He has so little respect for me, I really don't think he sees anything wrong with lying to me at all. I realize it's impossible to be married to someone you can't trust, but now I can include co-parenting with someone you can't trust. However, I'm looking at this incident as a sign from my higher power. I mean, how random is it that the receipt happened to be in the bag? This wasn't a grocery bag either...it was a regular bag that I had packed. I think I finally get what my therapist has been telling me all along about addicts...if their lips are moving, they're lying.
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Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,872
^ yep. If they open their mouth, they are lying. I filed for a protective order over a year ago from my ex due to his extreme actions, threats and stalking bc I feared for my safety and the safety of my children. After he was served? He sent me a note mocking me and telling me to move on, we are divirced.
Yep. Not kidding.
My ex lied and still lies to this day about drinking. It's what he does best! Literally. I heard a story from a lawyer friend that had a client with an alcoholic ex-wife was very suspicious and hired a PI. PI videos ex husband drinking beer in the bathroom at a local kids joint while leaving the kids alone to play. Video is introduced in court, photos, receipts, etc-exs response ? "That's not me! My ex wife just can't get over me and move on ". Uh huh, buddy.
Please-please see this as a sign to NOT back down and take chances with your kids safety.
Hugs, friend.
Yep. Not kidding.
My ex lied and still lies to this day about drinking. It's what he does best! Literally. I heard a story from a lawyer friend that had a client with an alcoholic ex-wife was very suspicious and hired a PI. PI videos ex husband drinking beer in the bathroom at a local kids joint while leaving the kids alone to play. Video is introduced in court, photos, receipts, etc-exs response ? "That's not me! My ex wife just can't get over me and move on ". Uh huh, buddy.
Please-please see this as a sign to NOT back down and take chances with your kids safety.
Hugs, friend.
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
Posts: 3,581
Lying is a hallmark of addiction. Not really about being sociopathic though I get where you are coming from.
before my husband admitted to relapsing (i knew he had though) we were on vacation and he took off on the golf cart to go to the marina to get a bag of ice we did not need. Its 1 mile from our house. He was gone an hour and a half. When he got back he was so drunk he could not speak and had a drink in his hand. "You're drunk". "NO I AM NOT"!!! "That's alcohol I can smell it" "NO ITS NOT ITS WATER TASTE IT!!! (I taste it yep pure vodka) "um this is vodka" "NO ITS NOT YOU ARE F'ING CRAZY" "okie, well I am calling an ambulance because you have had a stroke". Crickets chirping. "ok I had a couple drinks".
That's how is goes.
before my husband admitted to relapsing (i knew he had though) we were on vacation and he took off on the golf cart to go to the marina to get a bag of ice we did not need. Its 1 mile from our house. He was gone an hour and a half. When he got back he was so drunk he could not speak and had a drink in his hand. "You're drunk". "NO I AM NOT"!!! "That's alcohol I can smell it" "NO ITS NOT ITS WATER TASTE IT!!! (I taste it yep pure vodka) "um this is vodka" "NO ITS NOT YOU ARE F'ING CRAZY" "okie, well I am calling an ambulance because you have had a stroke". Crickets chirping. "ok I had a couple drinks".
That's how is goes.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
Oh how many times I have went through this. My X drinks hard apple cider. Told my daughter it was apple cider. She knew, so she asked for a drink LOL. He said no, but that is how she would confirm her suspicions. I have went through this a million times w/him. ALWAYS believe your kids, and move forward with Sober Link!
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 8,674
Wow, Jada - I am so sorry for your situation.
I read your OP first in hurt for you but it quickly dawned on me I had been through the same situation - as the new GF of the alcoholic ex husband. The utter drama I got myself involved in, in my relationship with him, was bad enough; looking back on the whole scenario with his ex wife - who was horrible to me (I was around her children every other weekend when he had them, as well as around his family with them whether he was there or not) - I am 100% sure other than my initial attempts to introduce myself and establish a polite relationship with her (I was around her children, for heavens' sake- I was sure she would want to know I treated them well and deferred to her, etc and she was beyond rude to me, so that perspective on her was my own along with the "things" I did see acted out by her with the kids- she didn't seem as rational as you because they were still embroiled in their toxic relationship) everything I "knew" about her was filtered by him, and their whole toxic scenario (mostly his doing, I now see) was much like yours. It was a mess and 6yrs later I still think of those children and wonder how they are with the two parents' dynamic.
Stick to your guns and try to filter out his abuse.
I read your OP first in hurt for you but it quickly dawned on me I had been through the same situation - as the new GF of the alcoholic ex husband. The utter drama I got myself involved in, in my relationship with him, was bad enough; looking back on the whole scenario with his ex wife - who was horrible to me (I was around her children every other weekend when he had them, as well as around his family with them whether he was there or not) - I am 100% sure other than my initial attempts to introduce myself and establish a polite relationship with her (I was around her children, for heavens' sake- I was sure she would want to know I treated them well and deferred to her, etc and she was beyond rude to me, so that perspective on her was my own along with the "things" I did see acted out by her with the kids- she didn't seem as rational as you because they were still embroiled in their toxic relationship) everything I "knew" about her was filtered by him, and their whole toxic scenario (mostly his doing, I now see) was much like yours. It was a mess and 6yrs later I still think of those children and wonder how they are with the two parents' dynamic.
Stick to your guns and try to filter out his abuse.
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Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 158
Jada,
Itīs so good you believed your son! I was reminded of my own childhood with my pathological lying father - you canīt believe how damaging it is when a parent gives you BS and everybody prefers to believe him, because "of course children make things up". It is beyond frustrating and crushes your self-esteem. I think Iīm still damaged from this experience, and my father wasnīt even an alcoholic, just a regular narcissist.
Your kids need all your support to deal with their dad and I think youīre doing great. Itīs very important for them to feel youīre on their side.
Itīs so good you believed your son! I was reminded of my own childhood with my pathological lying father - you canīt believe how damaging it is when a parent gives you BS and everybody prefers to believe him, because "of course children make things up". It is beyond frustrating and crushes your self-esteem. I think Iīm still damaged from this experience, and my father wasnīt even an alcoholic, just a regular narcissist.
Your kids need all your support to deal with their dad and I think youīre doing great. Itīs very important for them to feel youīre on their side.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
I think that HealthyAgain makes a good point! They are lying to THEMSELVES , first! So, by logic....they "have" to lie to us to keep their personal story straight.....
"I lie to myself to protect my drinking....so, I have to lie to you in order to be consistent"
Yea, for consistency.
Maybe, we could change our refrain from "he lies"...to...."he is consistent"...
lol...lol...lol......
"I lie to myself to protect my drinking....so, I have to lie to you in order to be consistent"
Yea, for consistency.
Maybe, we could change our refrain from "he lies"...to...."he is consistent"...
lol...lol...lol......
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 157
Originally Posted by August252015 
everything I "knew" about her was filtered by him, and their whole toxic scenario (mostly his doing, I now see) was much like yours. It was a mess and 6yrs later I still think of those children and wonder how they are with the two parents' dynamic.
Stick to your guns and try to filter out his abuse.
Stick to your guns and try to filter out his abuse.
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,792
Jada,
It's just not fun. I have letters from my AXH back from 1982 that I was calling him out for his lying. Thirty-four years he has been continually lying to me, like a 7 year old would do. It is a very long time.
Nothing changes, so we need to lower our expectations and stop expecting a normal healthy relationship with our very sick spouses.
They lie, don't question your sanity!!
It's just not fun. I have letters from my AXH back from 1982 that I was calling him out for his lying. Thirty-four years he has been continually lying to me, like a 7 year old would do. It is a very long time.
Nothing changes, so we need to lower our expectations and stop expecting a normal healthy relationship with our very sick spouses.
They lie, don't question your sanity!!
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 157
Thanks everyone. I just checked the court records because he had his final hearing on his DUI recently and the results of his chemical dependency evaluation have been filed. LOL. More lies! Claiming his usage of alcohol peaked when he was 19-22 when he'd drink 2x per week. Also, that he has not sought any type of treatment before, even though he's been to multiple therapists and we have gone together.
Of course, I've saved this, if needed to prove his history of lying in court, if needed.
Of course, I've saved this, if needed to prove his history of lying in court, if needed.
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Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 6,902
Alcoholic in recovery here (2 years 3 months sober).
I was incapable of telling the truth if it wasn't the 'right' answer, ie what I felt people would want to hear. It was only when I got sober and caught myself thinking "what should I say about X", "will this sound better or this?" It was actually such a relief to learn that actually, the truth is generally best. Some of this was covering my misdemeanours up, but sometimes it was just stupid stuff, anything that I thought would be the most acceptable thing. Seems crazy to me now of course, but I think it is what active alcoholics do. And do it so often that it's as natural as breathing (or drinking) and they don't even notice they're doing it.
I was incapable of telling the truth if it wasn't the 'right' answer, ie what I felt people would want to hear. It was only when I got sober and caught myself thinking "what should I say about X", "will this sound better or this?" It was actually such a relief to learn that actually, the truth is generally best. Some of this was covering my misdemeanours up, but sometimes it was just stupid stuff, anything that I thought would be the most acceptable thing. Seems crazy to me now of course, but I think it is what active alcoholics do. And do it so often that it's as natural as breathing (or drinking) and they don't even notice they're doing it.
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Central O-H-I-O
Posts: 1,689
My wife tends to exaggerate about, everything. Not only stuff that relates to her, but me as well. I don't need my life exaggerated, and I've told her - of course, she blows it off.
Unless it comes to drinking, then it's total downplaying!!
Unless it comes to drinking, then it's total downplaying!!
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