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Just found this forum wanted to introduce myself. My name isn't Fred but since I need to keep my real name secret we can just call me Fred. Anyway wife has been an alcoholic for about 20 years I have been with her about 10. When we met I fell right into a co-dependent relationship. Last 10 years I have been enabling her to drink. She is able to still hold a job until last year the Alcohol has started to interfere with the job. Calling in Sick lot of Mondays and Panic attacks now. I have tried to get her to seek help but she refuses. Last few years her health has been a problem pains in the back and I was hoping the doctors would find something maybe get her to seek help. Even after telling them how much she drinks they found nothing wrong with her. I could not believe that her Liver was not fried. It wasn't after a Ultrasound of the liver no damage. She has been drinking hard stuff like rum, whiskey for years about a 1/5th bottle a week. This year she tried to cut back I found that if I tell her we aren't doing things together at all when she drinks it seems to work. A few weeks ago she spent all morning to go shopping with me and right before we leave she puts down 3-4 shots. I caught her doing it and I just told her we aren't going now. She was really mad at me but she won't drive after drinking so she was stuck I just told her flat out no. Same thing with sex if she has been drinking I just tell her nope. This is actually working somewhat because she has cut back. Instead of buying 5th size she is down to a 1/2 a pint a week. I point out to her all the problems Alcohol has brought her she agrees. She admits she is a alcoholic . She won't go to rehab I want to try and get her into AA she hasn't wanted to in the past because of the religious aspects of it. She was raised in a very fundamental strict religion and rejected it when she was in her late teens. I know people tell me to just leave her if she won't stop, but I think she can be helped. She is a wonderful person when she isn't drinking.
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
Hi, Fred, and welcome.
Your attempts to control your wife's drinking by "punishing" her are doomed to failure, I'm afraid. She will get better at hiding it from you, become resentful of your attempts to control her, and ultimately continue to progress in her disease until she, herself, has had enough.
I'd strongly suggest you check out Al-Anon, and stick around here, too. Even though you can't MAKE your wife choose recovery, there is a lot you can do to make your own life better in the meantime.
I know that it FEELS like what you are doing is "working" but I've been in two marriages to alcoholics and am almost seven years sober, myself. If you read the posts on this forum, I don't think you'll find anyone who successfully "trained" their alcoholic with rewards or punishment. It just doesn't work.
Your attempts to control your wife's drinking by "punishing" her are doomed to failure, I'm afraid. She will get better at hiding it from you, become resentful of your attempts to control her, and ultimately continue to progress in her disease until she, herself, has had enough.
I'd strongly suggest you check out Al-Anon, and stick around here, too. Even though you can't MAKE your wife choose recovery, there is a lot you can do to make your own life better in the meantime.
I know that it FEELS like what you are doing is "working" but I've been in two marriages to alcoholics and am almost seven years sober, myself. If you read the posts on this forum, I don't think you'll find anyone who successfully "trained" their alcoholic with rewards or punishment. It just doesn't work.
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Yes this has happened before I would pour out the bottles of what ever she had and she would hide it but I'm not doing that I leave it in plane sight so she doesn't really have to hide it. I can tell right away when she starts in with the drinking, so I just go do my own thing we are room mates at that point she ends up sleeping which is fine with me then I don't have to hear her being drunk. She can resent me all she wants she has no where to go her entire family is very stand off so she isn't going to get any help from them along with her friends as well don't want to be around her. The one thing this is helping me become less fearful that I control the situation not her drinking before I would plead for her not to drink she was controlling me.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
As long as these are boundaries for YOU rather than attempts to control HER, you're fine. What concerned me was that you said your telling her those things (won't do stuff with her when drinking, won't have sex with her when drinking) seemed to be "working." The point isn't to do those things to make HER not drink, it's to prevent her drinking from affecting YOU so much.
Have you been to Al-Anon? I found it to be VERY helpful in dealing with the insanity of someone else's drinking.
Have you been to Al-Anon? I found it to be VERY helpful in dealing with the insanity of someone else's drinking.
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
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Mmmm don't be so certain that just because her liver seems to be doing fine that she doesn't have other issues. Alcoholism affects the pancreas as well as high blood pressure, cardiac issues, and kidneys. I don't have a clue if it is - what I do know is that in general everyone thinks its liver, liver, liver. My Alcoholic destroyed his pancreas, but his liver is 5 star functioning.
Know that even if they found something wrong that in all likelihood it wouldn't matter. Normies think that surely if there is a physical issue associated with drinking then the alcoholic will surely do something about it. Not necessarily in fact too many times we see on the board that there are physical problems and it doesn't make a dent in alcohol consumption.
I hope that you have read enough about alcoholism to know that alcoholics cannot moderate long term. You may feel that because you leave the alcohol in plain sight that you are aware of how much she drinks. Perhaps - yet she does try to sneak doesn't she? I mean you have said to her you won't do things with her if she is drinking right? And your shopping trip didn't happen because you caught her doing 3 or 4 shots, not because she did them right in front of you before you left.
She admits alcohol has caused all her problems, she admits she is alcoholic. She refuses rehab or AA (because its religious based btw there are plenty of atheist that attend AA). There are also plenty of programs that are not religious based - what about those?
Some people do stay with their alcoholic spouses and manage to be ok for awhile anyway. I too suggest Al Anon for you.
As to your thoughts that "she can be helped" - any alcoholic can be helped. Its not about that - the question is does she WANT help and from what you have written I'd say no, she does not. That's the problem here.
Know that even if they found something wrong that in all likelihood it wouldn't matter. Normies think that surely if there is a physical issue associated with drinking then the alcoholic will surely do something about it. Not necessarily in fact too many times we see on the board that there are physical problems and it doesn't make a dent in alcohol consumption.
I hope that you have read enough about alcoholism to know that alcoholics cannot moderate long term. You may feel that because you leave the alcohol in plain sight that you are aware of how much she drinks. Perhaps - yet she does try to sneak doesn't she? I mean you have said to her you won't do things with her if she is drinking right? And your shopping trip didn't happen because you caught her doing 3 or 4 shots, not because she did them right in front of you before you left.
She admits alcohol has caused all her problems, she admits she is alcoholic. She refuses rehab or AA (because its religious based btw there are plenty of atheist that attend AA). There are also plenty of programs that are not religious based - what about those?
Some people do stay with their alcoholic spouses and manage to be ok for awhile anyway. I too suggest Al Anon for you.
As to your thoughts that "she can be helped" - any alcoholic can be helped. Its not about that - the question is does she WANT help and from what you have written I'd say no, she does not. That's the problem here.
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I think the issue with rehab is she doesn't want to be kept outside the home for extended periods of time. I have told her many times she has to stop completely and not be around it or people that are drinking. I'm going to try AA because even with the religious aspect it might work for her if she is around others who also have the same problems. She is un-happy about the area we live in wants to move but I have told her I'm not moving until she quits drinking. I'm just not going to do anything she wants until she quits , or we divorce. I will offer to help find an AA meeting for her that is all I will do. It's more for me being in control of the situation and to break the co-dependency. Thanks for the advice.
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Originally Posted by fred6699 
It's more for me being in control of the situation and to break the co-dependency. Thanks for the advice.
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 25,373
Originally Posted by fred6699
I think the issue with rehab is she doesn't want to be kept outside the home for extended periods of time. I have told her many times she has to stop completely and not be around it or people that are drinking. I'm going to try AA because even with the religious aspect it might work for her if she is around others who also have the same problems. She is un-happy about the area we live in wants to move but I have told her I'm not moving until she quits drinking. I'm just not going to do anything she wants until she quits , or we divorce. I will offer to help find an AA meeting for her that is all I will do. It's more for me being in control of the situation and to break the co-dependency. Thanks for the advice.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
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Originally Posted by biminiblue
but this whole post is the definition of codependency...
YOU are going to "try AA"? It doesn't work that way. SHE has to decide (a) that she is unhappy with her drinking (it sounds like she isn't, she's just unhappy with your reaction to it) and (b) that she is willing to do whatever it takes to get sober and stay that way.
Anything she does right now will be for the sake of getting you off her back. She might go to a meeting or two and say I'm not an alcoholic, those people are way worse than I am, I don't like the "religion stuff," it feels like a cult, I can do this on my own, yadayada. AA isn't for people who NEED it, it's for people who WANT it.
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Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Tinton Falls, NJ
Posts: 87
You can only change you. You can't punish her for drinking as that doesn't work. If she is refusing to get help, you really are left with no other choice than to walk away. If my recovering alcoholic husband was refusing to get help, I would be left with no choice but to leave. True it would break my heart to leave him but I can't reason with him or convince him or control his drinking. Only he can make the choice to get the help he needs. I have an 18 mos old and am pregnant with our second. I cannot and will not risk my childrens' well being because I love him in hopes he'll change. You can talk to her and set guidelines but you have to actually follow through or it doesn't matter. You are enabling her to drink by staying. She assumes you are okay with it because you don't do anything to change your situation. I'm sorry that you have to deal with this. You have to worry about your well being though and let her be.
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Originally Posted by fred6699
I think the issue with rehab is she doesn't want to be kept outside the home for extended periods of time.
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Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,854
Originally Posted by fred6699
Just found this forum wanted to introduce myself. My name isn't Fred but since I need to keep my real name secret we can just call me Fred. Anyway wife has been an alcoholic for about 20 years I have been with her about 10. When we met I fell right into a co-dependent relationship. Last 10 years I have been enabling her to drink. She is able to still hold a job until last year the Alcohol has started to interfere with the job. Calling in Sick lot of Mondays and Panic attacks now. I have tried to get her to seek help but she refuses. Last few years her health has been a problem pains in the back and I was hoping the doctors would find something maybe get her to seek help. Even after telling them how much she drinks they found nothing wrong with her. I could not believe that her Liver was not fried. It wasn't after a Ultrasound of the liver no damage. She has been drinking hard stuff like rum, whiskey for years about a 1/5th bottle a week. This year she tried to cut back I found that if I tell her we aren't doing things together at all when she drinks it seems to work. A few weeks ago she spent all morning to go shopping with me and right before we leave she puts down 3-4 shots. I caught her doing it and I just told her we aren't going now. She was really mad at me but she won't drive after drinking so she was stuck I just told her flat out no. Same thing with sex if she has been drinking I just tell her nope. This is actually working somewhat because she has cut back. Instead of buying 5th size she is down to a 1/2 a pint a week. I point out to her all the problems Alcohol has brought her she agrees. She admits she is a alcoholic . She won't go to rehab I want to try and get her into AA she hasn't wanted to in the past because of the religious aspects of it. She was raised in a very fundamental strict religion and rejected it when she was in her late teens. I know people tell me to just leave her if she won't stop, but I think she can be helped. She is a wonderful person when she isn't drinking.
Have you looked into Smart Recovery for you, and possibly your wife might also be interested in it at some point. It is science based, behavioral in approaches and reminds me more of things I learned in therapy.
Also the technique you are using, which appears to "reach" her on some level is recommended at Smart. Its done for two reasons. One is for you because going shopping or having sex while she is drinking is not what you want. But also this is reinforcing positive rewards for positive behavior. If you are not drinking, then we can spend a great day together. This can be motivation to look at her behaviors. To control what she can, and can also help awareness. SMART uses the stages of change model so at any given point a person is somewhere on the journey of change. (Of course people can get stuck at one place for a long time and it may SEEM hopeless). When a person is drinking then we disengage temporarily as a negative reinforcement. This looks like what you've described. The continued idea is if she realizes she calnt control her drinking to get what she wants, then she may decide on her own to seek help.
And yes this method does work. There is actually science to back it, and you will find people using these methods at Smart. But there is technique to it, so learn all you can.
I would encourage you to try out a Smart Meeting for Family and Friends either in person or online. They also have a nice website with forum and blogs. It can be found here: Self Help Addiction Recovery | SMART RecoveryŽ
Smart incorporates the Craft method, Community Reinforcement and Family Training into their program. This has been really helpful to me, dealing with my husbands addiction and recovery. There are some great books on this. Beyond Addiction, How Science and Kindness Help People Change by Jeff Foote. and Get Your Loved One Sober, Alternatives to Nagging, Pleading and Threatening by Robert Meyers. Both of these are very good and helped me learn a lot.
Good news about her test results.
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Join Date: Feb 2007
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A.A isn't religious and that's just an excuse.
Maybe it would be good if you tried Alanon for yourself?
You can't do anything about her if she isn't ready.
Maybe it would be good if you tried Alanon for yourself?
You can't do anything about her if she isn't ready.
Originally Posted by fred6699
Just found this forum wanted to introduce myself. My name isn't Fred but since I need to keep my real name secret we can just call me Fred. Anyway wife has been an alcoholic for about 20 years I have been with her about 10. When we met I fell right into a co-dependent relationship. Last 10 years I have been enabling her to drink. She is able to still hold a job until last year the Alcohol has started to interfere with the job. Calling in Sick lot of Mondays and Panic attacks now. I have tried to get her to seek help but she refuses. Last few years her health has been a problem pains in the back and I was hoping the doctors would find something maybe get her to seek help. Even after telling them how much she drinks they found nothing wrong with her. I could not believe that her Liver was not fried. It wasn't after a Ultrasound of the liver no damage. She has been drinking hard stuff like rum, whiskey for years about a 1/5th bottle a week. This year she tried to cut back I found that if I tell her we aren't doing things together at all when she drinks it seems to work. A few weeks ago she spent all morning to go shopping with me and right before we leave she puts down 3-4 shots. I caught her doing it and I just told her we aren't going now. She was really mad at me but she won't drive after drinking so she was stuck I just told her flat out no. Same thing with sex if she has been drinking I just tell her nope. This is actually working somewhat because she has cut back. Instead of buying 5th size she is down to a 1/2 a pint a week. I point out to her all the problems Alcohol has brought her she agrees. She admits she is a alcoholic . She won't go to rehab I want to try and get her into AA she hasn't wanted to in the past because of the religious aspects of it. She was raised in a very fundamental strict religion and rejected it when she was in her late teens. I know people tell me to just leave her if she won't stop, but I think she can be helped. She is a wonderful person when she isn't drinking.
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