help for friend with abusive AH?
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 188
help for friend with abusive AH?
Hello everyone,
I saw a sticky on this which is related to my question but I wanted to see what my fellow SR posters have to say about this.
One of my good childhood friends is married to an active alcoholic. However, it wasn't until last year that she confided in me that he was an alcoholic---I had no idea that it was that bad. The breaking point occurred when he got a DUI and they were having a heated argument about his alcoholism/the DUI and he pushed her down in front of their three young children. After that happened, she took the kids and stayed with her mother for a few weeks. After he swore that he would change, they both became born-again Christians and she moved back with the children. He quit drinking and they attended Christian marriage counseling for a few months.
Now, my friend recently confided in me that he has been drinking again, about a 12 pack a day plus shots of hard liquor, after he gets home from work, i.e. he drinks and gets drunk in front of the children. They were having another argument and he grabbed two ice-cold beers and poured them all over her head. She went to take a shower, and he followed her and slammed her fingers in the sliding glass shower door.
I told her that I am there to support her. That she did NOTHING to justify his abuse, although she seems to think she is responsible for setting him off. I want the best for her and the kids, but I am absolutely disgusted and angered by her husband's abusive and unacceptable actions.
I know she is doing the best that she can and I should divert my focus to supporting her rather than waste my precious energy and time being angry at him---but it's still heartbreaking!
Aside from how to best support her, I have another question. My friend has now turned to smoking weed daily to cope with her anxiety and stress (her husband buys it for her from a co-worker, she does not get this legally from a doctor). However, she told me that she has taken to taking a few hits every day and she is around the children while she does it since she is a stay-at-home mom. I don't want to judge her, but I feel terribly for the children and I don't think it's right that she is high around them. Also, this is a recent thing, she hasn't done anything like this in all the years that I've known her.
Thoughts?
I saw a sticky on this which is related to my question but I wanted to see what my fellow SR posters have to say about this.
One of my good childhood friends is married to an active alcoholic. However, it wasn't until last year that she confided in me that he was an alcoholic---I had no idea that it was that bad. The breaking point occurred when he got a DUI and they were having a heated argument about his alcoholism/the DUI and he pushed her down in front of their three young children. After that happened, she took the kids and stayed with her mother for a few weeks. After he swore that he would change, they both became born-again Christians and she moved back with the children. He quit drinking and they attended Christian marriage counseling for a few months.
Now, my friend recently confided in me that he has been drinking again, about a 12 pack a day plus shots of hard liquor, after he gets home from work, i.e. he drinks and gets drunk in front of the children. They were having another argument and he grabbed two ice-cold beers and poured them all over her head. She went to take a shower, and he followed her and slammed her fingers in the sliding glass shower door.
I told her that I am there to support her. That she did NOTHING to justify his abuse, although she seems to think she is responsible for setting him off. I want the best for her and the kids, but I am absolutely disgusted and angered by her husband's abusive and unacceptable actions.
I know she is doing the best that she can and I should divert my focus to supporting her rather than waste my precious energy and time being angry at him---but it's still heartbreaking! Aside from how to best support her, I have another question. My friend has now turned to smoking weed daily to cope with her anxiety and stress (her husband buys it for her from a co-worker, she does not get this legally from a doctor). However, she told me that she has taken to taking a few hits every day and she is around the children while she does it since she is a stay-at-home mom. I don't want to judge her, but I feel terribly for the children and I don't think it's right that she is high around them. Also, this is a recent thing, she hasn't done anything like this in all the years that I've known her.
Thoughts?
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,256
Hi Butterfly,
I could really identify with your post. I am currently married to a functional alcoholic. He has made a physical threat to me when drunk, but has never touched me yet. He has been sober for a little over a week now since I told him that I cannot be in a relationship with an active alcoholic. I had relapsed to alcohol a few months ago to also cope with the stress and anxiety he was causing me, which is what your friend does with pot. I am currently, however, close to 30 days sober.
I guess all you can do is be there for your friend and offer her support. You could also go to Al-Anon to help get support for yourself. I feel sorry for your friend, though. Physical violence for me would be a dealbreaker, and it sounds like he has reverted to physical violence and humiliation after she got back with him.
And I guess it could be unhealthy for the kids to be around a stoned mother, although it would probably depend how stoned she is getting. What a messy situation this is. I guess you could always file a confidential CPS report if things got way too out of hand. I think your friend needs to understand that self-medicating with pot is not going to help the situation. She needs to get through this situation sober and make sober choices.
I could really identify with your post. I am currently married to a functional alcoholic. He has made a physical threat to me when drunk, but has never touched me yet. He has been sober for a little over a week now since I told him that I cannot be in a relationship with an active alcoholic. I had relapsed to alcohol a few months ago to also cope with the stress and anxiety he was causing me, which is what your friend does with pot. I am currently, however, close to 30 days sober.
I guess all you can do is be there for your friend and offer her support. You could also go to Al-Anon to help get support for yourself. I feel sorry for your friend, though. Physical violence for me would be a dealbreaker, and it sounds like he has reverted to physical violence and humiliation after she got back with him.
And I guess it could be unhealthy for the kids to be around a stoned mother, although it would probably depend how stoned she is getting. What a messy situation this is. I guess you could always file a confidential CPS report if things got way too out of hand. I think your friend needs to understand that self-medicating with pot is not going to help the situation. She needs to get through this situation sober and make sober choices.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
A lot of abuse victims turn to alcohol or drugs to cope with their situations--and for some it does lead to addiction.
I'd encourage your friend to call the DV hotline or local women's shelter and talk with an advocate about her options. They won't push her to do anything she isn't ready to do, but they can help with safety planning and refer her to other resources that can help so she doesn't have to turn to drugs to cope. The drugs are obviously problematic when she is caring for the children, but it also is a setup for the abuser. The abuser might threaten to have the children removed, for example, because he knows about the drug use. It also weakens her ability to take action to protect herself.
Please do what you can to encourage her all you can, but be careful, yourself, too. Abusers sometimes turn on anyone they perceive as interfering in their relationship.
I'd encourage your friend to call the DV hotline or local women's shelter and talk with an advocate about her options. They won't push her to do anything she isn't ready to do, but they can help with safety planning and refer her to other resources that can help so she doesn't have to turn to drugs to cope. The drugs are obviously problematic when she is caring for the children, but it also is a setup for the abuser. The abuser might threaten to have the children removed, for example, because he knows about the drug use. It also weakens her ability to take action to protect herself.
Please do what you can to encourage her all you can, but be careful, yourself, too. Abusers sometimes turn on anyone they perceive as interfering in their relationship.
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Join Date: Oct 2006
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I know what it's like to live in an abusive marriage, and this is difficult. What helped me was people naming the abuse. Telling me it was abuse. Telling me I did not have to put up with it. That I had the right to leave. Because when you're in that situation, you have a tendency to blame yourself for the abuse. I needed someone from the outside to tell me it was unacceptable.
Depending on what church they belong to, she may or may not get help there. I got no help, only harm, from the church we belonged to. The pastor even assisted in the abuse by suggesting that a nice man like my husband would never be abusive without reason. Basically, it was my fault. I should pray harder and become a better wife.
As for calling CPS, I have mixed feelings. On the one hand, I believe the children are in a terrible unsafe situation. On the other hand, if someone had called CPS when I was still very deep in codependency, it would have made me do everything to close ranks with AXH and cover up the abuse.
Depending on what church they belong to, she may or may not get help there. I got no help, only harm, from the church we belonged to. The pastor even assisted in the abuse by suggesting that a nice man like my husband would never be abusive without reason. Basically, it was my fault. I should pray harder and become a better wife.
As for calling CPS, I have mixed feelings. On the one hand, I believe the children are in a terrible unsafe situation. On the other hand, if someone had called CPS when I was still very deep in codependency, it would have made me do everything to close ranks with AXH and cover up the abuse.
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,388
I feel horrible for the kids, but I simply cannot justify her substance abuse. And I do not think that smoking pot is so innocent. Living with an abusive person is horrible and devastating on so many different levels, and it took me years to realize and accept that my husband tended to be abusive and controlling in a very covert way. As his alcoholism is progressing, his baiting into fights is becoming more and more obvious, especially because I was ready "to fight back" and fight fire with fire. In his head, this was only justifying his drinking. I was the bad one.
When we try to numb our pain, whether it is through alcohol, or pot, or excessive shopping, or hard work, it is not productive. It does not stop the abuse. It just helps us cope. But that does not solve the problem. And it certainly does not help the children.
If things do get out of the control, and you know about the details, you should notify the CPS.
When we try to numb our pain, whether it is through alcohol, or pot, or excessive shopping, or hard work, it is not productive. It does not stop the abuse. It just helps us cope. But that does not solve the problem. And it certainly does not help the children.
If things do get out of the control, and you know about the details, you should notify the CPS.
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Join Date: May 2013
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 188
Thank you, everyone, for these valuable insights. I appreciate it very much.
I will say that I won't call CPS, at least not now, but I'll reserve that as a very last resort, because I personally do not trust that agency. But should I say anything to her about her weed habit at all and how it's very likely affecting the children? Or is this an instance where it's better to keep on my side of the street? But, if I don't say anything, I do think that it will affect our friendship because I just don't agree with a parent being high while caring for children. In that sense, I am losing respect for her, and I feel terrible even admitting it
Although I completely understand that she is a victim of verbal/physical abuse, that doesn't excuse her own daily self-medication with weed.
As far as how to support my friend, I think naming the abuse is a good idea, like healthyagain mentioned. When my friend was telling me about the latest episode of abuse, she said, "But he does everything for his family." I replied, "You mean financially? A lot of men work to support their wife and kids. That does not justify abuse or alcoholism." She said, "Wow, I never thought of it that way before. I guess I kind of believe it when he's says that I'm selfish and that I'm a bad wife." She also said that it was an "accident" that he slammed her fingers in the sliding glass door but, again, I said it was not an accident because he purposely followed her into the bathroom.
She will see the truth and take action only when SHE is ready, but as her friend, it's so hard for me watch things escalate, especially when three innocent children are involved. On the one hand, like dandelion said, all I can do is listen with empathy and point to help with the other hand. But, I also fear that I may alienate her even when I point out that her husband's actions are abusive or even suggesting to her that she can call a domestic violence hotline. But she's still in denial...for instance, after this latest episode, she forgave him after he bought her flowers and she said, "Well, he said that he's sorry and that he won't do anything like that again."
When I was googling, I came across the National Domestic Violence hotline and they have some good info on defining abuse and creating a safety plan. It's pretty useful:
The National Domestic Violence Hotline | Path to Safety
Thanks again for the insights, everyone. An Al-Anon meeting for me sounds very helpful, especially since I haven't been in a few weeks.
I will say that I won't call CPS, at least not now, but I'll reserve that as a very last resort, because I personally do not trust that agency. But should I say anything to her about her weed habit at all and how it's very likely affecting the children? Or is this an instance where it's better to keep on my side of the street? But, if I don't say anything, I do think that it will affect our friendship because I just don't agree with a parent being high while caring for children. In that sense, I am losing respect for her, and I feel terrible even admitting it
Although I completely understand that she is a victim of verbal/physical abuse, that doesn't excuse her own daily self-medication with weed.As far as how to support my friend, I think naming the abuse is a good idea, like healthyagain mentioned. When my friend was telling me about the latest episode of abuse, she said, "But he does everything for his family." I replied, "You mean financially? A lot of men work to support their wife and kids. That does not justify abuse or alcoholism." She said, "Wow, I never thought of it that way before. I guess I kind of believe it when he's says that I'm selfish and that I'm a bad wife." She also said that it was an "accident" that he slammed her fingers in the sliding glass door but, again, I said it was not an accident because he purposely followed her into the bathroom.
She will see the truth and take action only when SHE is ready, but as her friend, it's so hard for me watch things escalate, especially when three innocent children are involved. On the one hand, like dandelion said, all I can do is listen with empathy and point to help with the other hand. But, I also fear that I may alienate her even when I point out that her husband's actions are abusive or even suggesting to her that she can call a domestic violence hotline. But she's still in denial...for instance, after this latest episode, she forgave him after he bought her flowers and she said, "Well, he said that he's sorry and that he won't do anything like that again."
When I was googling, I came across the National Domestic Violence hotline and they have some good info on defining abuse and creating a safety plan. It's pretty useful:
The National Domestic Violence Hotline | Path to Safety
Thanks again for the insights, everyone. An Al-Anon meeting for me sounds very helpful, especially since I haven't been in a few weeks.
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,038
I lived with escalating abuse and four young children for years and even now that Xah has been out of the family house for two years, I still don't see things completely clearly. And I wasn't smoking pot during any of it...
The smoking is going to numb your friend and may make it harder for her to get out of a bad situation. He's getting it for her certainly to keep her quiet and in the home, knowing it will make her getting out with the children more complicated, she'll feel guilty for the drug use, she'll want to keep the family secrets buried...
My ex used to try to get me to physically resist/fight him so then I would feel like I was as bad as he. He would also tell the children I hit him and he was afraid of me, and they wouldnt know what to believe. To this day one of them still wonders. And I am half their father's size and have been terrified of him...
Your friend has to be told that the pot smoking is his way of keeping her feeling guilty, dependent, stuck. She has to stop!!!
You are a good friend. I hope she can hear you. If you explain it as a mechanism her husband is using to control her, rather than as something you personally fibd offensive (and you have every reason to) maybe she will be abke to hear you. Maybe not.
The smoking is going to numb your friend and may make it harder for her to get out of a bad situation. He's getting it for her certainly to keep her quiet and in the home, knowing it will make her getting out with the children more complicated, she'll feel guilty for the drug use, she'll want to keep the family secrets buried...
My ex used to try to get me to physically resist/fight him so then I would feel like I was as bad as he. He would also tell the children I hit him and he was afraid of me, and they wouldnt know what to believe. To this day one of them still wonders. And I am half their father's size and have been terrified of him...
Your friend has to be told that the pot smoking is his way of keeping her feeling guilty, dependent, stuck. She has to stop!!!
You are a good friend. I hope she can hear you. If you explain it as a mechanism her husband is using to control her, rather than as something you personally fibd offensive (and you have every reason to) maybe she will be abke to hear you. Maybe not.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2013
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Posts: 188
Originally Posted by PippiLngstockng 
I lived with escalating abuse and four young children for years and even now that Xah has been out of the family house for two years, I still don't see things completely clearly. And I wasn't smoking pot during any of it...
The smoking is going to numb your friend and may make it harder for her to get out of a bad situation. He's getting it for her certainly to keep her quiet and in the home, knowing it will make her getting out with the children more complicated, she'll feel guilty for the drug use, she'll want to keep the family secrets buried...
My ex used to try to get me to physically resist/fight him so then I would feel like I was as bad as he. He would also tell the children I hit him and he was afraid of me, and they wouldnt know what to believe. To this day one of them still wonders. And I am half their father's size and have been terrified of him...
Your friend has to be told that the pot smoking is his way of keeping her feeling guilty, dependent, stuck. She has to stop!!!
You are a good friend. I hope she can hear you. If you explain it as a mechanism her husband is using to control her, rather than as something you personally fibd offensive (and you have every reason to) maybe she will be abke to hear you. Maybe not.
The smoking is going to numb your friend and may make it harder for her to get out of a bad situation. He's getting it for her certainly to keep her quiet and in the home, knowing it will make her getting out with the children more complicated, she'll feel guilty for the drug use, she'll want to keep the family secrets buried...
My ex used to try to get me to physically resist/fight him so then I would feel like I was as bad as he. He would also tell the children I hit him and he was afraid of me, and they wouldnt know what to believe. To this day one of them still wonders. And I am half their father's size and have been terrified of him...
Your friend has to be told that the pot smoking is his way of keeping her feeling guilty, dependent, stuck. She has to stop!!!
You are a good friend. I hope she can hear you. If you explain it as a mechanism her husband is using to control her, rather than as something you personally fibd offensive (and you have every reason to) maybe she will be abke to hear you. Maybe not.
And again, PippiLngstockng, thanks for sharing your experiences, too. I'm happy that you and your children are in a better place, even though dealing with the aftermath of an alcoholic is a process that can take years. But even though it's hard and we have setbacks, we keep going, don't we? Sending you light on your journey!
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Join Date: Apr 2013
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Can you get her set up with Celebrate Recovery or Al Anon? Take her there or watch her kids so she can slip out to a meeting?
Also I found this wheel helpful in visually seeing how abuse impacted me.
http://www.ncdsv.org/images/powercon...lnoshading.pdf
Personally I am not sure I'd say anything about the weed at this point. Getting her to recognize her need for help might be a big enough hurdle initially.
Also I found this wheel helpful in visually seeing how abuse impacted me.
http://www.ncdsv.org/images/powercon...lnoshading.pdf
Personally I am not sure I'd say anything about the weed at this point. Getting her to recognize her need for help might be a big enough hurdle initially.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
I tend to agree with CodeJob. For many people pot doesn't impair them significantly (though no one should drive under the influence). It might not be a bigger deal than having a glass or two of wine in the afternoon for a non-alcoholic, and I don't think most of us would be inclined to call CPS on everyone who does that. It isn't a good habit to get into as a coping mechanism, and of course, if there is any indication the children are actually in danger of abuse or neglect, that's a different story. I, too, have the feeling that he is trying to trap her by providing the marijuana.
You're a good friend to try to help. One of the main tools in the abuser's arsenal is isolation. Keep talking to her, even if you feel exasperated. Keep telling her she's strong, and that you will support her. Keep urging her to seek help.
Feel free to pm me if you need any resources nearby.
You're a good friend to try to help. One of the main tools in the abuser's arsenal is isolation. Keep talking to her, even if you feel exasperated. Keep telling her she's strong, and that you will support her. Keep urging her to seek help.
Feel free to pm me if you need any resources nearby.
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Thanks, CodeJob and LexieCat, for your input! I don't think weed is terrible (it's increasingly becoming legalized for a reason) but, like alcohol, it's sometimes hard to draw the line between casual use and addiction, when it does or does not affect children, etc. Unfortunately, she has admitted that to me that she has driven high while she's been with the children Another one of our close friends said that she once smoked with her and the friend had a terrible reaction to it (she had heart palpitations and she couldn't breathe) and this friend strongly feels that her weed is laced with something. Not good.
And thanks for the encouragement, I will keep talking with her. I have suggested Al Anon and the domestic violence hotline but she hasn't taken up either yet. But I will keep being there and keep trying.
Another one of our close friends said that she once smoked with her and the friend had a terrible reaction to it (she had heart palpitations and she couldn't breathe) and this friend strongly feels that her weed is laced with something. Not good.And thanks for the encouragement, I will keep talking with her. I have suggested Al Anon and the domestic violence hotline but she hasn't taken up either yet. But I will keep being there and keep trying.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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butterfly.....sometimes, a person will accept seeing a private individual counselor because they feel less threatened by this. Also, selected reading materials that support her emotionally....sometimes, a person doesn't take material written in a book as a personal assault---or feel as ashamed and embarrassed like they might from a person that they know, personally.
dandylion
dandylion
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Hello Butterfly, and pleased to "meet" you 
I think it is awesome that you are willing to help your friend. So many people will do _nothing_ in that situation.
In addition to what has already been suggested I highly recommend this sticky:
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ml#post5051669
Another thing you might want to consider, because you are talking about a friend in real life instead of just online, is for _you_ to educate yourself about how to help her. Many of the DV organizations, as well as the Crisis Phone lines, provide free training to the community. These folks can help you learn how to best be supportive of your friend without scaring her away.
The short version is this. You have two "roles" that you can follow in order to help her. You can either be a "pusher" or a "puller".
The "pusher" is the one that tries to give her advice, tells her about DV organizations, offers to drive her to the shelter. This is an "active" person trying to influence your friend. Most of the time the "pusher" will be rejected and eventually avoided, but the _information_ provided will remain and someday, maybe, your friend will remember what you said and go get help.
The "puller" is the one that _never_ gives advice, _never_ makes suggestions, never becomes "active". The purpose is to always be a "connection" to the outside world, because the #1 weapon of the abuser is isolation. As others have said, the "puller" provides perspective, _names_ the abuse, and becomes an emotional shelter for the victim. The "puller" says things like "I've heard that ....", "I read in the paper that... ", but never says anything that may remotely be interpreted as judging, suggesting or prodding the victim.
Being a "puller" is _much_ harder, because it can be _years_ before a victim can break thru the "brain washing" that has her stuck in the first place. Even after a victim does ask for help it can still be years before she can set up enough resources, financial and physical, to actually leave the abuser in a _safe_ manner.
Whatever role you choose, the #1 rule you must _never_ forget is that _leaving_ the abuser is the single most dangerous thing your friend will ever do in her life. Therefore _anything_ that involves leaving him _must_ be done with extensive support of community resources. The #1 _worst_ thing anybody can do is encourage a victim to leave the abuser, that is 100% guaranteed to get her injured, if not killed. The victim can only leave _with_ the support of DV shelters, police, lawyers, etc.
It's very easy to run away. What well meaning but un-educated bystanders don't understand is that leaving is just the beginning. The real challenge lies in _surviving_ after leaving.
Please do continue to share here on SR. Here on SR you can get support and some good ideas. However, the _best_ sharing you can do is with local DV organizations that can give you _specific_ advice that is directly relevant to what help is available to your friend. These are trained and experienced professionals that _know_ what needs to be done.
Mike
Moderator, SR
I think it is awesome that you are willing to help your friend. So many people will do _nothing_ in that situation.
In addition to what has already been suggested I highly recommend this sticky:
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ml#post5051669
Another thing you might want to consider, because you are talking about a friend in real life instead of just online, is for _you_ to educate yourself about how to help her. Many of the DV organizations, as well as the Crisis Phone lines, provide free training to the community. These folks can help you learn how to best be supportive of your friend without scaring her away.
The short version is this. You have two "roles" that you can follow in order to help her. You can either be a "pusher" or a "puller".
The "pusher" is the one that tries to give her advice, tells her about DV organizations, offers to drive her to the shelter. This is an "active" person trying to influence your friend. Most of the time the "pusher" will be rejected and eventually avoided, but the _information_ provided will remain and someday, maybe, your friend will remember what you said and go get help.
The "puller" is the one that _never_ gives advice, _never_ makes suggestions, never becomes "active". The purpose is to always be a "connection" to the outside world, because the #1 weapon of the abuser is isolation. As others have said, the "puller" provides perspective, _names_ the abuse, and becomes an emotional shelter for the victim. The "puller" says things like "I've heard that ....", "I read in the paper that... ", but never says anything that may remotely be interpreted as judging, suggesting or prodding the victim.
Being a "puller" is _much_ harder, because it can be _years_ before a victim can break thru the "brain washing" that has her stuck in the first place. Even after a victim does ask for help it can still be years before she can set up enough resources, financial and physical, to actually leave the abuser in a _safe_ manner.
Whatever role you choose, the #1 rule you must _never_ forget is that _leaving_ the abuser is the single most dangerous thing your friend will ever do in her life. Therefore _anything_ that involves leaving him _must_ be done with extensive support of community resources. The #1 _worst_ thing anybody can do is encourage a victim to leave the abuser, that is 100% guaranteed to get her injured, if not killed. The victim can only leave _with_ the support of DV shelters, police, lawyers, etc.
It's very easy to run away. What well meaning but un-educated bystanders don't understand is that leaving is just the beginning. The real challenge lies in _surviving_ after leaving.
Please do continue to share here on SR. Here on SR you can get support and some good ideas. However, the _best_ sharing you can do is with local DV organizations that can give you _specific_ advice that is directly relevant to what help is available to your friend. These are trained and experienced professionals that _know_ what needs to be done.
Mike
Moderator, SR
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Thread Starter
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Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 188
Thank you, dandelion and DesertEyes! I will keep trying with her and not give up. I will keep offering info, here and there, and articulating my role as a supportive friend through "pusher" and "puller" roles really helps me clarify my boundaries.
And, although I feel like it is so difficult to do so, I must detach with love and trust that her HP is guiding her to her highest good---this is definitely a test of my faith but I do believe that things will hopefully work out for the best.
Thanks, everyone!
And, although I feel like it is so difficult to do so, I must detach with love and trust that her HP is guiding her to her highest good---this is definitely a test of my faith but I do believe that things will hopefully work out for the best.
Thanks, everyone!
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 188
Thank you, dandelion and DesertEyes! I will keep trying with her and not give up. I will keep offering info, here and there, and articulating my role as a supportive friend through "pusher" and "puller" roles really helps me clarify my boundaries.
And, although I feel like it is so difficult to do so, I must detach with love and trust that her HP is guiding her to her highest good---this is definitely a test of my faith but I do believe that things will hopefully work out for the best.
Thanks, everyone!
And, although I feel like it is so difficult to do so, I must detach with love and trust that her HP is guiding her to her highest good---this is definitely a test of my faith but I do believe that things will hopefully work out for the best.
Thanks, everyone!
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butterfly,
First I want to say, I don't know why your post posted twice, when I tried to post here twice and my post disappeared. (lol)
From reading what you wrote I think you have a good head on your shoulders.
I was your friend. I was the one in an abusive relationship, except I didn't smoke pot, I drank to numb myself. Not good, not good at all. I would lock myself in my car almost every night, with my beer and the radio blasting with the windows closed, so that I could block out the world.
By the time I got to this point I was already diagnosed with anxiety, panic attacks and PTSD , all due to the abuse. More like Stockholm Syndrome. I isolated myself, I didn't want to talk to anyone, I was afraid of other people telling me how wrong I was also. I just wanted to die. at I was an absolute terrible person. At least thats what he told me. I couldn't cook right, I couldn't clean right, I couldn't do anything right. He told me I was insane and needed a keeper.
What I needed most was someone to talk to, but I was afraid to open up to anyone. I was afraid they would tell me how stupid I was also.
Abuse breaks you down. You don't know what to do or who to trust. You trust no one. You isolate, if you isolate, then there is only one person telling you what a horrible person you are.
Your friend is past that point. She began talking to you. She is not afraid of you.
My suggestion is to keep validating her. Don't push her to do more then she is capable of doing. If you feel her life or her childrens life are in immediate danger, then do what you can, if not, get her trust. Let her open up to you. Validate her. Validation is important. One of the reasons that a victim accepts the blame, is because, they feel if it is them, they have the power to change this. But I think you can see where that keeps them in it deeper and deeper.
This is the sticky thing here. You really don't know when to tell a person to run. With an abuse victim, they may leave, but they return many times, each times they return the abuse is worse. You kind of want to make sure that they are sure that when they leave, that this is it.
I would like to give you step by step, but most times it is your own instinct that you have to go by. Yes, as soon as you think it will be accepted give the DV #. Suggest other resources. Tell her that you will stand by her, that you will be there for her, but then again always make sure that you are protected.
First just try to build up her self-esteem, it's not that hard to do. Thank her for things, ask for her opinion, tell her thats a great idea.
(((((((((((hugs)))))))))))))
amy
First I want to say, I don't know why your post posted twice, when I tried to post here twice and my post disappeared. (lol)
From reading what you wrote I think you have a good head on your shoulders.
I was your friend. I was the one in an abusive relationship, except I didn't smoke pot, I drank to numb myself. Not good, not good at all. I would lock myself in my car almost every night, with my beer and the radio blasting with the windows closed, so that I could block out the world.
By the time I got to this point I was already diagnosed with anxiety, panic attacks and PTSD , all due to the abuse. More like Stockholm Syndrome. I isolated myself, I didn't want to talk to anyone, I was afraid of other people telling me how wrong I was also. I just wanted to die. at I was an absolute terrible person. At least thats what he told me. I couldn't cook right, I couldn't clean right, I couldn't do anything right. He told me I was insane and needed a keeper.
What I needed most was someone to talk to, but I was afraid to open up to anyone. I was afraid they would tell me how stupid I was also.
Abuse breaks you down. You don't know what to do or who to trust. You trust no one. You isolate, if you isolate, then there is only one person telling you what a horrible person you are.
Your friend is past that point. She began talking to you. She is not afraid of you.
My suggestion is to keep validating her. Don't push her to do more then she is capable of doing. If you feel her life or her childrens life are in immediate danger, then do what you can, if not, get her trust. Let her open up to you. Validate her. Validation is important. One of the reasons that a victim accepts the blame, is because, they feel if it is them, they have the power to change this. But I think you can see where that keeps them in it deeper and deeper.
This is the sticky thing here. You really don't know when to tell a person to run. With an abuse victim, they may leave, but they return many times, each times they return the abuse is worse. You kind of want to make sure that they are sure that when they leave, that this is it.
I would like to give you step by step, but most times it is your own instinct that you have to go by. Yes, as soon as you think it will be accepted give the DV #. Suggest other resources. Tell her that you will stand by her, that you will be there for her, but then again always make sure that you are protected.
First just try to build up her self-esteem, it's not that hard to do. Thank her for things, ask for her opinion, tell her thats a great idea.
(((((((((((hugs)))))))))))))
amy
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 188
amy55, thank you so much for sharing! What a beautiful post and thank you for sharing your experience. Congrats on how far you have come!
And thanks for sharing what it's like to be "on the other side" as a married woman in an abusive and alcoholic marriage. I do find it a little hard to personally relate to my friend because while I have an XABF who is the father of my son, I was never married to him and we never lived together. My friend is a stay-at-home mom to three young children and she only has a high school diploma with very limited work experience. In that sense, I can understand how she feels like she is stuck in her marriage.
And thanks for pointing out how important it is that she is talking to me and speaking the truth about what is happening with her husband. It must be very scary for her to open up. I will make it a point to keep validating her and supporting her through thick and thin. She is dealing with so much and she is doing the best that she can. She may be taking baby steps right now, but progress is progress. I am proud of her! In fact, I should give her a call and tell her how much her friendship means to me
And thanks for sharing what it's like to be "on the other side" as a married woman in an abusive and alcoholic marriage. I do find it a little hard to personally relate to my friend because while I have an XABF who is the father of my son, I was never married to him and we never lived together. My friend is a stay-at-home mom to three young children and she only has a high school diploma with very limited work experience. In that sense, I can understand how she feels like she is stuck in her marriage.
And thanks for pointing out how important it is that she is talking to me and speaking the truth about what is happening with her husband. It must be very scary for her to open up. I will make it a point to keep validating her and supporting her through thick and thin. She is dealing with so much and she is doing the best that she can. She may be taking baby steps right now, but progress is progress. I am proud of her! In fact, I should give her a call and tell her how much her friendship means to me
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pa
Posts: 4,872
I need to say this, I think you are a terrific friend !!!!! Always remember though to protect your own safety and that of your child. I'm not trying to scare you, just telling you the truth. Sometimes you can't judge how a person will react when they feel their partner is getting stronger and may leave.
In my situation, my ex actually without knowing it, gave me the person to talk to and my way out.
After a fight one time, I was unmovable. He told me to call S. That she will tell me that this is how marriages work. That you fight, he can say and do anything he wants, then make up and have sex. I knew this was wrong, but I wasn't going to call anyone to ask them. I was just going to hide away some more. But, he kept insisting, so I did call S to shut him up already.
I called her in front of him, asked her the question that he told me to. There was some silence on her part of the phone. Then she just said "What????, That's insane". I then walked to my safe place in the house. The garage. She then validated everything that I was thinking and feeling. I didn't feel crazy anymore.
I got off the phone with her, because the ex kept coming into my safe place, the garage. He wanted to know what she said. I never did tell him, I let him assume that he was right. I never did have that make up sex. Hate to say this, but I grabbed a beer instead. See, not only was I using beer to self medicate and numb myself, I also used it as a reason to not have sex with him. I told him that I didn't feel anything at all with sex if I was drinking. I did know at that time that drinking was not the best thing to do, I was beyond caring. I really didn't care if he killed me that night. Instead he left me alone.
I thought a lot that day. I thought about my other friend that I was talking to. I thought about how it was to her benefit that I stay with my ex, or at least I stay where I was, and he leaves so that she could move in with me. I thought about all the self help books that I was reading, and that I was reading them all wrong. I was looking for ways to change him, and not me. I thought about if I had called my other friend that I was talking to about this for years, that she would have told me to just have sex with him, and things would be OK.
I admit, I might have went back to what I was doing previously. My friend S didn't give up. She would call me once or twice a week to just talk, and email me everyday. She didn't push. We would talk about the kids, the weather, gardening. But she was persistent, she kept in contact with me everyday.
At first, I was apprehensive. I was even embarrassed that I had called her with that stupid question. My ex was a "runner". He disappeared a lot. I mentioned this to my friend S. in email. She called me. That was when I knew I could trust her. Everything came out, years and years of everything. She still didn't push, she validated. She told me it wasn't normal, and that I wasn't crazy.
I would like to say that was my wake up moment for me, but it wasn't. I still kept accepting crumbs, and any affection he might show me. My ex was the silent treatment type of person. I just wanted to feel loved. I wanted to feel cared about. It was so hard for me to accept that there was nothing I could do. My friend S. stuck with me through all of that.
He wasn't hitting me anymore, it was more emotional abuse. How stupid I was, that I couldn't survive without his paycheck. I had an income, not much, I didn't feel I could afford to leave. I was too stupid to get a job. I only had a HS education, while he had a college education. I just couldn't do anything right.
Thing is, when I was working, we both worked together, doing the same job. I climbed the latter a lot faster then him, and I earned a lot more money then him. HS diploma vrs college education.
Why would I tell you this????? I tell you this because you are a kind and loving person. Perhaps to give you incite into what you may be dealing with. (Stockholm Syndrome) Just know that you can walk away if it becomes too much for you.
I am now divorced, own my own house, fixed it up, and doubled it's value if not more.
Just a lot of thanks for what you are doing for your friend.
((((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))))
amy
In my situation, my ex actually without knowing it, gave me the person to talk to and my way out.
After a fight one time, I was unmovable. He told me to call S. That she will tell me that this is how marriages work. That you fight, he can say and do anything he wants, then make up and have sex. I knew this was wrong, but I wasn't going to call anyone to ask them. I was just going to hide away some more. But, he kept insisting, so I did call S to shut him up already.
I called her in front of him, asked her the question that he told me to. There was some silence on her part of the phone. Then she just said "What????, That's insane". I then walked to my safe place in the house. The garage. She then validated everything that I was thinking and feeling. I didn't feel crazy anymore.
I got off the phone with her, because the ex kept coming into my safe place, the garage. He wanted to know what she said. I never did tell him, I let him assume that he was right. I never did have that make up sex. Hate to say this, but I grabbed a beer instead. See, not only was I using beer to self medicate and numb myself, I also used it as a reason to not have sex with him. I told him that I didn't feel anything at all with sex if I was drinking. I did know at that time that drinking was not the best thing to do, I was beyond caring. I really didn't care if he killed me that night. Instead he left me alone.
I thought a lot that day. I thought about my other friend that I was talking to. I thought about how it was to her benefit that I stay with my ex, or at least I stay where I was, and he leaves so that she could move in with me. I thought about all the self help books that I was reading, and that I was reading them all wrong. I was looking for ways to change him, and not me. I thought about if I had called my other friend that I was talking to about this for years, that she would have told me to just have sex with him, and things would be OK.
I admit, I might have went back to what I was doing previously. My friend S didn't give up. She would call me once or twice a week to just talk, and email me everyday. She didn't push. We would talk about the kids, the weather, gardening. But she was persistent, she kept in contact with me everyday.
At first, I was apprehensive. I was even embarrassed that I had called her with that stupid question. My ex was a "runner". He disappeared a lot. I mentioned this to my friend S. in email. She called me. That was when I knew I could trust her. Everything came out, years and years of everything. She still didn't push, she validated. She told me it wasn't normal, and that I wasn't crazy.
I would like to say that was my wake up moment for me, but it wasn't. I still kept accepting crumbs, and any affection he might show me. My ex was the silent treatment type of person. I just wanted to feel loved. I wanted to feel cared about. It was so hard for me to accept that there was nothing I could do. My friend S. stuck with me through all of that.
He wasn't hitting me anymore, it was more emotional abuse. How stupid I was, that I couldn't survive without his paycheck. I had an income, not much, I didn't feel I could afford to leave. I was too stupid to get a job. I only had a HS education, while he had a college education. I just couldn't do anything right.
Thing is, when I was working, we both worked together, doing the same job. I climbed the latter a lot faster then him, and I earned a lot more money then him. HS diploma vrs college education.
Why would I tell you this????? I tell you this because you are a kind and loving person. Perhaps to give you incite into what you may be dealing with. (Stockholm Syndrome) Just know that you can walk away if it becomes too much for you.
I am now divorced, own my own house, fixed it up, and doubled it's value if not more.
Just a lot of thanks for what you are doing for your friend.
((((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))))
amy
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