occupational health interview....aaagh...help!
hippy
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 492
occupational health interview....aaagh...help!
I got a call today from the company who deals with my work's occupational health. I hadn't even been told I am being referred! However, I made an appt for the 5th of August for a telephone consultation. Should it get to the 5th and I still haven't seen a copy of my works report, I am going to refuse to go through with the interview as I am not answering anything that I haven't had prior written notice of.
My problem is this. I started to get ill a while back, some of you may remember my paranoia about my mental health team spying on me? My pdoc said my med wasn't working effectively and was going to change me but I wouldn't let him at that time. Then I decided to go my own way. Part of that is because I was paranoid the drugs were poisoning me, part of it is cos I am a pig headed monster! I stopped my meds and started to rapidly cycle between thinking there were angels and demons inside me, to wanting to kill myself and take my children with me (I know how evil that sounds....that is why I got myself hospitalised) I don't know whether to tell them this. If I don't, they may seek info from my pdoc who might tell them. I can't ask him beforehand as he is on annual leave.
My main concern is that occ health will think I brought it all on myself. Which to a large degree is true, but I don't think I would have stopped my meds if I had been completely well.
My other problem is my manager does not know I have bi polar. her husband had it I think and he comitted suicide so I have always tried to protect her from knowing about me, as I think I will just be a painful reminder. I think I am as it is and all she knows is that I have 'a significant depressive illness'. It sounds silly I know, but I worry that if she knows, she will treat me in a more negative way as she will want rid of me. I suspect she does as it is. The previous occ health company was happy to leave it as 'significant depressive illness' but I don't know that the new company will. Yet, I think maybe the time has come to stop hiding behind a vague title and let her know just what is wrong with me?????
Also, my manger will no doubt say that she has put into place all reasonable adjustments as it is. She has reduced my hours, stopped me working a late followed by an early shift and worked my hours around therapy. The only other adjustment I can think of is for to accept that I may well at times be off ill as such is the nature of my illness. Does that sound reasonable?
They have already been advised by the previous occ health company that my illness should be considered under the disability discrimnation act. I know you can still be fired though if you are not living up to the job. I am however, good at my job when I am well. I also work for a local government dept, so it is actually quite hard to fire me!
The other thing I am wondering is this. I have always protected my senior colleagues when I have been at these appts before. I have not let on that I have not been receiving regualr supervision and that I find the culture of management-plebs quite stressful, depending on who I am on shift with. I don't think I should do that this time. I returned in March and have not had supervision once, even though I should receive it every six weeks. problem being, my supervisor I would also consider to be a pal and I don't want to get her into bother. I do however think that lack of supervision has contributed to my stress at work and possibly to my mental health. I think the culture in the workplace also contributes to my stress depending on who I am on with as all they do is moan about management. If I had had regular supervision, this would have been dealth with there.
One last thing. In my work, I deal with some people who demonstrate challenging behaviours. The behaviours that I find particularly challenging since being ill are aggression and noise. I feel since first becoming ill, I am particularly sensitised to aggression and it fills me with absolute fear. When we have an aggressive client in, I feel positively ill. Noise....again, since becoming ill, I find noise pollution a real problem. It is like I have too much mental noise going on and the physical noise overloads me. Again, it makes me feel positively ill. If I admit to this, then I am admitting that I can't do my job completely and a re deployment may be suggested which would no doubt involve a serious drop in pay.
What do people think about the points I have made and is there anything else people think is important to point out?
Sorry it is so long but I am stressing out big time and I am going on holiday tomorrow and I want to de escalate before I go!
Hippy
xxx
My problem is this. I started to get ill a while back, some of you may remember my paranoia about my mental health team spying on me? My pdoc said my med wasn't working effectively and was going to change me but I wouldn't let him at that time. Then I decided to go my own way. Part of that is because I was paranoid the drugs were poisoning me, part of it is cos I am a pig headed monster! I stopped my meds and started to rapidly cycle between thinking there were angels and demons inside me, to wanting to kill myself and take my children with me (I know how evil that sounds....that is why I got myself hospitalised) I don't know whether to tell them this. If I don't, they may seek info from my pdoc who might tell them. I can't ask him beforehand as he is on annual leave.
My main concern is that occ health will think I brought it all on myself. Which to a large degree is true, but I don't think I would have stopped my meds if I had been completely well.
My other problem is my manager does not know I have bi polar. her husband had it I think and he comitted suicide so I have always tried to protect her from knowing about me, as I think I will just be a painful reminder. I think I am as it is and all she knows is that I have 'a significant depressive illness'. It sounds silly I know, but I worry that if she knows, she will treat me in a more negative way as she will want rid of me. I suspect she does as it is. The previous occ health company was happy to leave it as 'significant depressive illness' but I don't know that the new company will. Yet, I think maybe the time has come to stop hiding behind a vague title and let her know just what is wrong with me?????
Also, my manger will no doubt say that she has put into place all reasonable adjustments as it is. She has reduced my hours, stopped me working a late followed by an early shift and worked my hours around therapy. The only other adjustment I can think of is for to accept that I may well at times be off ill as such is the nature of my illness. Does that sound reasonable?
They have already been advised by the previous occ health company that my illness should be considered under the disability discrimnation act. I know you can still be fired though if you are not living up to the job. I am however, good at my job when I am well. I also work for a local government dept, so it is actually quite hard to fire me!
The other thing I am wondering is this. I have always protected my senior colleagues when I have been at these appts before. I have not let on that I have not been receiving regualr supervision and that I find the culture of management-plebs quite stressful, depending on who I am on shift with. I don't think I should do that this time. I returned in March and have not had supervision once, even though I should receive it every six weeks. problem being, my supervisor I would also consider to be a pal and I don't want to get her into bother. I do however think that lack of supervision has contributed to my stress at work and possibly to my mental health. I think the culture in the workplace also contributes to my stress depending on who I am on with as all they do is moan about management. If I had had regular supervision, this would have been dealth with there.
One last thing. In my work, I deal with some people who demonstrate challenging behaviours. The behaviours that I find particularly challenging since being ill are aggression and noise. I feel since first becoming ill, I am particularly sensitised to aggression and it fills me with absolute fear. When we have an aggressive client in, I feel positively ill. Noise....again, since becoming ill, I find noise pollution a real problem. It is like I have too much mental noise going on and the physical noise overloads me. Again, it makes me feel positively ill. If I admit to this, then I am admitting that I can't do my job completely and a re deployment may be suggested which would no doubt involve a serious drop in pay.
What do people think about the points I have made and is there anything else people think is important to point out?
Sorry it is so long but I am stressing out big time and I am going on holiday tomorrow and I want to de escalate before I go!
Hippy
xxx
A picture's worth a 1000 words
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: With any luck, I'm lost in a view finder
Posts: 2,954
Sweetie, i'm sorry to say that having been thru such similar work issues....that i really don't know what to tell you - especially since you are in the UK and i don't know what differences there are over there from here in the US (although it seems you have SO MUCH more help and support than we tend to get over here).
the noise issue really really bothered me at work a lot too and when i could remember/think to do so I would plug in some headphones and listen to music off the internet so i could focus more on my work.
if you don't have to or need to tell your supervisor about the 'actual' BP diagnosis....i don't know that i would. it seems to me that most of my hardest work experiences have been with people who HAD or HAVE a significant other or family member with BP (my first editor or fired me and made life totally horrid....had a bipolar brother; at this last job....my 'friend/smoke buddy' was the assistant managing editor who's husband is bipolar and she 'ratted me out' several times to upper management about things that didn't concern her or my job....and SHE is why i got fired on the day that i did!!)
My theory on that is this: it's MUCH easier for them to ACT on their thoughts, feelings, anger, worry or whatever toward a co-worker rather than their family member!! This last 'friend' kept telling me she understood and was my 'friend' BUT at EVERY opportunity possible she stomped on me and either hurt me on a very emotional level or went behind my back to tattle on me for what 'she thought was the right thing to do.' She even said i was acting like a "victim" and she wasn't going to watch me act that way.
She had NO clue!!! Because she had HAD to MAKE her husband get on meds after they got married!!!! So she put ME in that same kind of 'forced to help the bipolar' mind-frame b/c of her only personal dealings with how she ASSUMED all bipolars act and are. I TRIED explaining to her how seriously i have taken my illness over the past 5 years and have struggled to constantly make certian i could stay on my meds (even when having no insurance), BUT her personal life experiences totally over-road everything and anything i told her.
Oh, and i don't know much about the background of my first editor who fired me after I revealed my bipolar disorder except that he told me his brother had been bipolar and he came across very angry toward mention of that (as if his brother had been some horrid person or something) and he IMMEDIATELY started treating me in that same manner until he finally convinced the publisher, and corporate, to fire me.
Both firings came within about 6 months time from my return to work from medical leave (in which i'd disclosed the mental illness right before going on leave).
---
That's the only 2 cents i have.
Sorry that i can't be any more helpful.
Just know that i completely understand the weight of all the stress and anxiety you are going through!!! I too and VERY good at what i do when i am well (among the top 10-20 in my state actually), but none of that matters when supervisors can't "see" the illness or even understand it. Bipolar disorder isn't viewed to be as life-threatening and difficult as cancer or MS or AIDS or even pnemonia!!!!!!!
All we can do is keep trying to get well, hang on and accept whatever happens as being something that was meant to happen for whatever reason we don't yet understand.
I ended up with a MUCH MUCH better job and work environment after my first editor fired me (plus i got to recieve unemployment income while i continued to get through my major depressive episode...which mostly involved LOTS of sleeping).
(oh...and I was hired onto the next job at a salary of $8,000 a year more and then given a $2,000 raise after the first year. So after 2 years at the new job I was making $32,000 plus benefits (and LOTS of extra freelance gigs that paid really good), instead of only around $22,000 a year and having to work nearly twice as hard also...often putting in 60, 70 or 80 hours a week!!)
And I have a LOT more quality images i've produced and published from this last job i was just fired from for my illness....which will help me probably get an EVEN BETTER JOB!!!
It's hard, but i TRY to view both my discriminatory firings as "forced personal growth." LOL
Really, that's the ONLY way i've been able to even handle this last one in the slightest.
So just remember that, no matter what happens, "forced personal growth" can OFTEN lead us to such bigger and better things than we would have even realized was there for us to grab hold of!!!
(BTW, this last job....was the first job i'd been hired on as a full-time photojournalist, which is what i'd been working toward for about 8 years at that point. AND, since it's such a SMALL career market, i had actually applied to the paper because of an ad stating they were looking for a reporter. The editor looked over my resume and responded by asking if i'd rather work for them as a photographer b/c the opening had just become available and they hadn't even had time to advertise the opening yet!!!!"
the noise issue really really bothered me at work a lot too and when i could remember/think to do so I would plug in some headphones and listen to music off the internet so i could focus more on my work.
if you don't have to or need to tell your supervisor about the 'actual' BP diagnosis....i don't know that i would. it seems to me that most of my hardest work experiences have been with people who HAD or HAVE a significant other or family member with BP (my first editor or fired me and made life totally horrid....had a bipolar brother; at this last job....my 'friend/smoke buddy' was the assistant managing editor who's husband is bipolar and she 'ratted me out' several times to upper management about things that didn't concern her or my job....and SHE is why i got fired on the day that i did!!)
My theory on that is this: it's MUCH easier for them to ACT on their thoughts, feelings, anger, worry or whatever toward a co-worker rather than their family member!! This last 'friend' kept telling me she understood and was my 'friend' BUT at EVERY opportunity possible she stomped on me and either hurt me on a very emotional level or went behind my back to tattle on me for what 'she thought was the right thing to do.' She even said i was acting like a "victim" and she wasn't going to watch me act that way.
She had NO clue!!! Because she had HAD to MAKE her husband get on meds after they got married!!!! So she put ME in that same kind of 'forced to help the bipolar' mind-frame b/c of her only personal dealings with how she ASSUMED all bipolars act and are. I TRIED explaining to her how seriously i have taken my illness over the past 5 years and have struggled to constantly make certian i could stay on my meds (even when having no insurance), BUT her personal life experiences totally over-road everything and anything i told her.
Oh, and i don't know much about the background of my first editor who fired me after I revealed my bipolar disorder except that he told me his brother had been bipolar and he came across very angry toward mention of that (as if his brother had been some horrid person or something) and he IMMEDIATELY started treating me in that same manner until he finally convinced the publisher, and corporate, to fire me.
Both firings came within about 6 months time from my return to work from medical leave (in which i'd disclosed the mental illness right before going on leave).
---
That's the only 2 cents i have.
Sorry that i can't be any more helpful.
Just know that i completely understand the weight of all the stress and anxiety you are going through!!! I too and VERY good at what i do when i am well (among the top 10-20 in my state actually), but none of that matters when supervisors can't "see" the illness or even understand it. Bipolar disorder isn't viewed to be as life-threatening and difficult as cancer or MS or AIDS or even pnemonia!!!!!!!
All we can do is keep trying to get well, hang on and accept whatever happens as being something that was meant to happen for whatever reason we don't yet understand.
I ended up with a MUCH MUCH better job and work environment after my first editor fired me (plus i got to recieve unemployment income while i continued to get through my major depressive episode...which mostly involved LOTS of sleeping).
(oh...and I was hired onto the next job at a salary of $8,000 a year more and then given a $2,000 raise after the first year. So after 2 years at the new job I was making $32,000 plus benefits (and LOTS of extra freelance gigs that paid really good), instead of only around $22,000 a year and having to work nearly twice as hard also...often putting in 60, 70 or 80 hours a week!!)
And I have a LOT more quality images i've produced and published from this last job i was just fired from for my illness....which will help me probably get an EVEN BETTER JOB!!!
It's hard, but i TRY to view both my discriminatory firings as "forced personal growth." LOL
Really, that's the ONLY way i've been able to even handle this last one in the slightest.
So just remember that, no matter what happens, "forced personal growth" can OFTEN lead us to such bigger and better things than we would have even realized was there for us to grab hold of!!!
(BTW, this last job....was the first job i'd been hired on as a full-time photojournalist, which is what i'd been working toward for about 8 years at that point. AND, since it's such a SMALL career market, i had actually applied to the paper because of an ad stating they were looking for a reporter. The editor looked over my resume and responded by asking if i'd rather work for them as a photographer b/c the opening had just become available and they hadn't even had time to advertise the opening yet!!!!"
hippy
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 492
Thanks Jenna, (for two or four cents worth!LOL)
it helps hearing the point of view of someone who has been through similar. I am sorry, I didn't realise you had lost your present job? Or have I misread that? Concentration just now is terrible.
I suspect my boss knows what is wrong with me but doesn't want confirmation. I don't really want her to know either as I know she once said that she looked on it as a terminal illness as it helped her cope. I couldn't stand the thought of her thinking that about me. I find it hard enough thinking about the rate of suicide amongst bi polar people, without thinking someone was expecting it of me.
I understand what you mean about people finding it easier to treat people in a particular way that they maybe couldn't with a family member.
I can't avoid noise at work. I am a carer and it is my job to just deal with it. At times when I am completely well, it is ok, but at others I have like a constant buzz in my brain....it is not quite noise but it feels like it. Noise becomes magnified to me and it really is a sensory overload.
We do get a bit of help in UK. Or at least I do. It is only because I work for local government and we have the disability discrimination act, under which bi polar is covered. I am fortunate in that I get disability benefits from the government which is around £250 ($500) a month, regardless of whether I work or not. That is reviewed on an annual basis and if I become more well, they will take it away though. I also get child care benefits because I am on a low income and have a disability. Again, if I lose the disability benefits, I lose part of the child care benefits.
Also, there is obviously the free health care. I pay £50 ($100) a year for ALL my meds, regardless of what they are and how many I have. (At the mo, I am getting for this month, Lamotragine, Quetiapine, Nitrazepam and diazepam) Hospital care is free, but nowhere near as pleasant a place as it would be in US. Hospital I have just been in had 3 sinks, two wc's and one shower between 12 women. Windows that don't close, doors that bang shut so have towels wrapped round the handles to muffle them, bedding and curtains that are threadbare, staff that think checking on you once an hour will stop you comitting suicide....I made it clear to one when I was there that all I needed was little more than four minutes.......resulted in me getting practically everything I owned confiscated, furnishings that are filthy....I could really go on! In fact, when I was in there, I had cause to get up through the night and the night shift were sitting on the sofa's that are for the patients. They actually had sheets draped over them as they obviously thought they were too dirty to sit on! That really got me....too dirty for staff, but ok for the patients.
Anyway, I digress!
Part of me wants to be re deployed/fired as then I would have to take stock of my life and decide what I want to do.
thanks
Hippy
xxx
it helps hearing the point of view of someone who has been through similar. I am sorry, I didn't realise you had lost your present job? Or have I misread that? Concentration just now is terrible.
I suspect my boss knows what is wrong with me but doesn't want confirmation. I don't really want her to know either as I know she once said that she looked on it as a terminal illness as it helped her cope. I couldn't stand the thought of her thinking that about me. I find it hard enough thinking about the rate of suicide amongst bi polar people, without thinking someone was expecting it of me.
I understand what you mean about people finding it easier to treat people in a particular way that they maybe couldn't with a family member.
I can't avoid noise at work. I am a carer and it is my job to just deal with it. At times when I am completely well, it is ok, but at others I have like a constant buzz in my brain....it is not quite noise but it feels like it. Noise becomes magnified to me and it really is a sensory overload.
We do get a bit of help in UK. Or at least I do. It is only because I work for local government and we have the disability discrimination act, under which bi polar is covered. I am fortunate in that I get disability benefits from the government which is around £250 ($500) a month, regardless of whether I work or not. That is reviewed on an annual basis and if I become more well, they will take it away though. I also get child care benefits because I am on a low income and have a disability. Again, if I lose the disability benefits, I lose part of the child care benefits.
Also, there is obviously the free health care. I pay £50 ($100) a year for ALL my meds, regardless of what they are and how many I have. (At the mo, I am getting for this month, Lamotragine, Quetiapine, Nitrazepam and diazepam) Hospital care is free, but nowhere near as pleasant a place as it would be in US. Hospital I have just been in had 3 sinks, two wc's and one shower between 12 women. Windows that don't close, doors that bang shut so have towels wrapped round the handles to muffle them, bedding and curtains that are threadbare, staff that think checking on you once an hour will stop you comitting suicide....I made it clear to one when I was there that all I needed was little more than four minutes.......resulted in me getting practically everything I owned confiscated, furnishings that are filthy....I could really go on! In fact, when I was in there, I had cause to get up through the night and the night shift were sitting on the sofa's that are for the patients. They actually had sheets draped over them as they obviously thought they were too dirty to sit on! That really got me....too dirty for staff, but ok for the patients.
Anyway, I digress!
Part of me wants to be re deployed/fired as then I would have to take stock of my life and decide what I want to do.
thanks
Hippy
xxx
Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
I don't see why you should "protect" your superiors. Fight for yourself and what's best for you.
Jenna can tell you that I no longer receive my illness, but there is no additional help for it here....just discrimination....so I say I have a brain abnormality.
Jenna can tell you that I no longer receive my illness, but there is no additional help for it here....just discrimination....so I say I have a brain abnormality.
hippy
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 492
I had my interview today....via phone. it was the most horrendous interview.
She says there is no need for me to be re deployed as once my condition improves, there is no reason I cannot do my job. I explained I have been waiting for stability for 18 months, I find it stressful and I think it contributes to my ill health. She just said that I will not find it so once I stabilise. I told her I find myself highly sensitised to noise and aggression. She said again...I won't do once my condition has stabilised.
She said there is nothing she can do to stop my management taking disciplinary action against me, should they wish to do so. There is nothing she can do to have my present adjustments continued as my employers are under no obligation to do so, so in effect, I could go back and my working conditions could be made worse not better! I told her the present adjustments were also recommended by my pdoc and she just said that if my employers have done those adjustments then they are jolly nice and I should be saying 'thank you' ....she actually said that!
She said that my condition was covered by the disability discrimination act, but basically that meant nothing if I am not doing my job properly ie not attending due to ill health. She said that yes, there may be further absences due to my health but my employers are not obliged to accept this situation.
She really bullied me into telling my employers that I am bi polar, even though I said I did not want them to know. She said that for her to say that I had been off with depression was omitting part of the truth, but I said it wasn't as the times I have taken off it has been because of depression caused by bi polar, but she just kept at me until I agreed. This is causing me a huge amount of anxiety.
She said I am receiving the appropriate medical care....but hark at this....I need to be using my psychologist more effectively! I should be using him to help me come to terms with my bi polar. How dare she try to tell me what I should be using my psychologist for! She asked me what I was using him for......I don't really think her knowing that it is to deal with issues of childhood abuse and trauma was really for her to know, so I didn't tell her.
I just feel that it is all about my employers and now the thought of going back to work is an even bigger hurdle.
I am going away to have a damn good bubble.
I really think unemployment has to be my option.
Hippy
xx
She says there is no need for me to be re deployed as once my condition improves, there is no reason I cannot do my job. I explained I have been waiting for stability for 18 months, I find it stressful and I think it contributes to my ill health. She just said that I will not find it so once I stabilise. I told her I find myself highly sensitised to noise and aggression. She said again...I won't do once my condition has stabilised.
She said there is nothing she can do to stop my management taking disciplinary action against me, should they wish to do so. There is nothing she can do to have my present adjustments continued as my employers are under no obligation to do so, so in effect, I could go back and my working conditions could be made worse not better! I told her the present adjustments were also recommended by my pdoc and she just said that if my employers have done those adjustments then they are jolly nice and I should be saying 'thank you' ....she actually said that!
She said that my condition was covered by the disability discrimination act, but basically that meant nothing if I am not doing my job properly ie not attending due to ill health. She said that yes, there may be further absences due to my health but my employers are not obliged to accept this situation.
She really bullied me into telling my employers that I am bi polar, even though I said I did not want them to know. She said that for her to say that I had been off with depression was omitting part of the truth, but I said it wasn't as the times I have taken off it has been because of depression caused by bi polar, but she just kept at me until I agreed. This is causing me a huge amount of anxiety.
She said I am receiving the appropriate medical care....but hark at this....I need to be using my psychologist more effectively! I should be using him to help me come to terms with my bi polar. How dare she try to tell me what I should be using my psychologist for! She asked me what I was using him for......I don't really think her knowing that it is to deal with issues of childhood abuse and trauma was really for her to know, so I didn't tell her.
I just feel that it is all about my employers and now the thought of going back to work is an even bigger hurdle.
I am going away to have a damn good bubble.
I really think unemployment has to be my option.
Hippy
xx
To Life!
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Rhode Island
Posts: 9,293
You are not required to inform your employer about the nature of your illness.
At least not in the US.
I haven't told anyone about my depression, and I will never do so. In teaching, it would mean professional death.
Further, even if you consider your superiors "pals," they clearl are not treating *you* as a pal if they are not doing their job and supervising you. Keep that in mind, next time that you think of protecting them. They are not protecting YOU!
Just tell the truth; nothing more; nothing less.
I'm sorry it went so badly. I don't know the laws in the UK, though, so cannot speak intellegently. Perhaps you can get some legal advice? Here in the US, a call is free.
I am wishing you well...
Shalom!
At least not in the US.
I haven't told anyone about my depression, and I will never do so. In teaching, it would mean professional death.
Further, even if you consider your superiors "pals," they clearl are not treating *you* as a pal if they are not doing their job and supervising you. Keep that in mind, next time that you think of protecting them. They are not protecting YOU!
Just tell the truth; nothing more; nothing less.
I'm sorry it went so badly. I don't know the laws in the UK, though, so cannot speak intellegently. Perhaps you can get some legal advice? Here in the US, a call is free.
I am wishing you well...
Shalom!
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