Am I crazy?
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Charleston S.C.
Posts: 1,461
Am I crazy?
They tell me to share and when I do I worry about crazy things. I feel I might have been stupid or small for sharing. Many times I have to keep watching for an answer. Are they going to hate me, ridicule me for sharing things about me? I shared a bunch of feeling with family members about my combat experence. Facts I always hid or buried with alcohol. Now I'm worried that they and even you might hate me for killing people. I watch news show talk about people killing others. I've even joined others confirming I could never bring myself to kill someone. The truth is I was able to do it. Do any of you share, even with counselors, and then afterward wish you never told them? Or, is this just me crazy Don.
To Life!
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Rhode Island
Posts: 9,293
(((Don)))
I'm thinking that, when *I* have to keep watch for an answer, (and yes, that is often), it's an issue of trust. I, too, fear being ridiculed; rejected; humiliated and/or having things I've said in trust used against me later on. So, the answer to your question is, yes, there have been times I've shared and later wished I never had. Those people I've shared with, when I discover I regreted doing so, turned out to be untrustworthy -- and sadly, that *does* include counselors too! :>(
You're not crazy Don...
Not unless we all are!
You just have reason to fear. For that, I"m really really sorry.
When you Vietnam Vets came home, you were treated horribly. There is nothing we can do to change that now. I only hope that you can see many Americans have grown up as a *result* of the treatment you received. It's why people today can say, "Support the troops; Leave Iraq."
I am *NOT* trying to start a political debate here at all. What I"m refering to is the very real growth in American attitude from the Vietnam Era to today's times. Back then, you were personally held responsible for doing what you thought was right; what you thought was your patriotic duty; or even just because you refused to resist or dodge the draft. That is not happening today because, in a large part, Americans saw what happened to you and recognized our collective responsibility for your plight -- for the part we played in it.
Don, I know you; we've met each other and shared time with each other.
I could never hate you...
You did what you had to do. And I certainly don't have to tell you that, in your situation, you were able to do it in one measure cuz it was you or them! That's reality! Survival instinct is strong, Don. And you were in Hell.
And now you are no longer there.
I hope you can come to recognize that fact and relax enough to enjoy once more...
Love you, Don...
Shalom!
I'm thinking that, when *I* have to keep watch for an answer, (and yes, that is often), it's an issue of trust. I, too, fear being ridiculed; rejected; humiliated and/or having things I've said in trust used against me later on. So, the answer to your question is, yes, there have been times I've shared and later wished I never had. Those people I've shared with, when I discover I regreted doing so, turned out to be untrustworthy -- and sadly, that *does* include counselors too! :>(
You're not crazy Don...
Not unless we all are!
You just have reason to fear. For that, I"m really really sorry.
When you Vietnam Vets came home, you were treated horribly. There is nothing we can do to change that now. I only hope that you can see many Americans have grown up as a *result* of the treatment you received. It's why people today can say, "Support the troops; Leave Iraq."
I am *NOT* trying to start a political debate here at all. What I"m refering to is the very real growth in American attitude from the Vietnam Era to today's times. Back then, you were personally held responsible for doing what you thought was right; what you thought was your patriotic duty; or even just because you refused to resist or dodge the draft. That is not happening today because, in a large part, Americans saw what happened to you and recognized our collective responsibility for your plight -- for the part we played in it.
Don, I know you; we've met each other and shared time with each other.
I could never hate you...
You did what you had to do. And I certainly don't have to tell you that, in your situation, you were able to do it in one measure cuz it was you or them! That's reality! Survival instinct is strong, Don. And you were in Hell.
And now you are no longer there.
I hope you can come to recognize that fact and relax enough to enjoy once more...
Love you, Don...
Shalom!
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: My House
Posts: 1,122
Don,
I don't know you, but you seem like such a wonderful person. IMHO, there is a huge difference between going to war, where you have to kill your opponents to survive yourself, and being a murderer. In the first scenario, the killing is little short of self defense; if you didn't kill them, they would have eagerly killed you. And you did our country such a large service by being over there. Thank you for that.
You deserve our most sincere gratitude, not judgment. And gratitue and honor, my friend, are all you will find here.
I know what you mean, though, about opening up to someone and then being nervous about it. But, whether they judge me or not, at least then it's off my shoulders, and out in the open, and I can breathe much more easily. And I'm sure your family feels honored that you shared such a dark and deep part of your past with them. It probably makes them feel important, knowing that you love them enough to trust them with that kind of information. If my father, who is also a Vietnam Vet, was to share war stories with me like that, I know I could never judge him for anything he did in battle... or anything my grandfather did, either, who was an Army Ranger.
I hope something in my rambling has been of use to you. I'm tired and it's past my bedtime hehe... but I just had to thank you for your hard work and service to our country.
*hugs and prayers*
I don't know you, but you seem like such a wonderful person. IMHO, there is a huge difference between going to war, where you have to kill your opponents to survive yourself, and being a murderer. In the first scenario, the killing is little short of self defense; if you didn't kill them, they would have eagerly killed you. And you did our country such a large service by being over there. Thank you for that.
You deserve our most sincere gratitude, not judgment. And gratitue and honor, my friend, are all you will find here.
I know what you mean, though, about opening up to someone and then being nervous about it. But, whether they judge me or not, at least then it's off my shoulders, and out in the open, and I can breathe much more easily. And I'm sure your family feels honored that you shared such a dark and deep part of your past with them. It probably makes them feel important, knowing that you love them enough to trust them with that kind of information. If my father, who is also a Vietnam Vet, was to share war stories with me like that, I know I could never judge him for anything he did in battle... or anything my grandfather did, either, who was an Army Ranger.
I hope something in my rambling has been of use to you. I'm tired and it's past my bedtime hehe... but I just had to thank you for your hard work and service to our country.
*hugs and prayers*
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Charleston S.C.
Posts: 1,461
Thankyou very much. Much of the road I'm traveling is an uncharted course for me. Although, much of what is happening has been told to me before. The words of Morning Glory still come into play years later. Afew years ago she spoke of the need for me to seperate the 2 Don's.
On Nov. 10th they are going to have an 25th anniversary of the Vietnam Wall in Washington. During which they are finally going to have a welcome home for the Vietnam Veteran. I'm planning on going. I've never been to the wall. Thank you History for all your encouragement over the years. You are a true friend. Thank you lady also. And that you to your father and Grandfather for their service.
On Nov. 10th they are going to have an 25th anniversary of the Vietnam Wall in Washington. During which they are finally going to have a welcome home for the Vietnam Veteran. I'm planning on going. I've never been to the wall. Thank you History for all your encouragement over the years. You are a true friend. Thank you lady also. And that you to your father and Grandfather for their service.
Belgian Sheepdog Adictee
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: In Today
Posts: 6,101
Don, I would hope that the Doctors at the VA have told you by now that you are experiencing some of the side affects of PTSD. Vietnam caused a lot of it, and many of the cases didn't show up until years later, after therapists and doctors got passed the alcoholism, the drug usuage, the inability to keep a job etc. It is not always flashbacks of incidences that happened.
PTSD can make a person doubt, make a person distrust, make a person have trouble seeing a 'true' reaction.
I have followed your threads over the last few years and have had great empathy for you as PTSD flashed at me from almost the first post of yours I read. No I am not a therapist, but over these many years have worked with PTSD victims in recovery and have come to understand a lot.
NO, YOU ARE NOT CRAZY. You will slowly learn to trust. Probably only one person at a time. It will come. The more you can speak of these incidents that still seem to bother you and that until recently you haven't talked about, the LESS IMPORTANCE THEY WILL HAVE. i also know that even the 'younger' therapists at the VA are much more aware of PTSD because of Desert Storm and the ongoing Iragi War.
NO, YOU ARE NOT A KILLER. You did what you had to do as you were an employee of the United States Government. You were in the military and this was part of the job. You are not required no do you have to make ANY APOLOGIES for what happened in Viet Nam. Instead, this country still OWES A BIG APOLOGY to the vets who served in Viet Nam and how they were treated upon their return.
As a side note, I still believe that Jane Fonda should have been in prison for the rest of her life for treason.
Don you are recovering. As you continue down the recovery road, what other people think will no longer be a problem. You will slowly come to some acceptances and knowledge of yourself. You did NOTHING WRONG.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
PTSD can make a person doubt, make a person distrust, make a person have trouble seeing a 'true' reaction.
I have followed your threads over the last few years and have had great empathy for you as PTSD flashed at me from almost the first post of yours I read. No I am not a therapist, but over these many years have worked with PTSD victims in recovery and have come to understand a lot.
NO, YOU ARE NOT CRAZY. You will slowly learn to trust. Probably only one person at a time. It will come. The more you can speak of these incidents that still seem to bother you and that until recently you haven't talked about, the LESS IMPORTANCE THEY WILL HAVE. i also know that even the 'younger' therapists at the VA are much more aware of PTSD because of Desert Storm and the ongoing Iragi War.
NO, YOU ARE NOT A KILLER. You did what you had to do as you were an employee of the United States Government. You were in the military and this was part of the job. You are not required no do you have to make ANY APOLOGIES for what happened in Viet Nam. Instead, this country still OWES A BIG APOLOGY to the vets who served in Viet Nam and how they were treated upon their return.
As a side note, I still believe that Jane Fonda should have been in prison for the rest of her life for treason.
Don you are recovering. As you continue down the recovery road, what other people think will no longer be a problem. You will slowly come to some acceptances and knowledge of yourself. You did NOTHING WRONG.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: With any luck, I'm lost in a view finder
Posts: 2,954
not crazy Don. not crazy at all....just new. this is new to you. For SO many years you have kept these things safe and hidden from the world and i'm guessing yourself even. It must feel like being naked in public.
Anytime anyone has shared something difficult for them...no matter what it was...i only thought respect for them. Strength and courage. And i felt honored they felt safe opening up to me.
Don, i pray some day you will be able to forgive yourself totally and completely for doing what you had to do so many years ago. All of us can tell you that you are not crazy or a bad person or anything, but until you can forgive yourself....none of it will ever matter.
And the more you can talk about your feelings and past issues....the less power they will have over you. That i can promise. They have held you captive for too many years. In letting them free by sharing...you will let yourself free in the process.
(((((((((((((((((((HUGS)))))))))))))))))))))))
Anytime anyone has shared something difficult for them...no matter what it was...i only thought respect for them. Strength and courage. And i felt honored they felt safe opening up to me.
Don, i pray some day you will be able to forgive yourself totally and completely for doing what you had to do so many years ago. All of us can tell you that you are not crazy or a bad person or anything, but until you can forgive yourself....none of it will ever matter.
And the more you can talk about your feelings and past issues....the less power they will have over you. That i can promise. They have held you captive for too many years. In letting them free by sharing...you will let yourself free in the process.
(((((((((((((((((((HUGS)))))))))))))))))))))))
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: birmingham, AL
Posts: 2
I am new to the forum and wanted some help on where to find others in my situation. I have married three times, divorced twice all to the same man. i am guessing we are both co-dependent. He has a homosexual background and has violated our marriage more than once. He is not an alcoholic but the son of one and I believe his premature birth resulted from parental acoholism. What type of forum can I look for to find others in this situation. Our marriage is in peril again due to my distrust of him, his refusal to care about my distrust and his angry outbursts and mood swings
Life the gift of recovery!
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Home is where the heart is
Posts: 7,061
Welcome to SR!
I am sorry you are having such a struggle right now. I could not image walking in your shoes.
It might be a good idea to start a thread stating what you have stated here in the "Friends and Families of alcoholics" forum. There are many people ther with similiar experiences that can share their support and hope with you. Do you know how to start a new thread? There is a button at the top of each forum that says "New thread". Just click on it and it will open a box just like what you typed into to make your post. Write what you want in it and place a title to your thread then hit post and you will have started a new thread.
I am sorry you are having such a struggle right now. I could not image walking in your shoes.
It might be a good idea to start a thread stating what you have stated here in the "Friends and Families of alcoholics" forum. There are many people ther with similiar experiences that can share their support and hope with you. Do you know how to start a new thread? There is a button at the top of each forum that says "New thread". Just click on it and it will open a box just like what you typed into to make your post. Write what you want in it and place a title to your thread then hit post and you will have started a new thread.
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 862
Thank you don, for serving America even though many at the time didn't appreciate it. Veterans coming home from Iraq now have it much better, as even most everyone who is against the war supports the soldiers. I've always thought that the way Vietnam veterans were treated was one of the worst social atrocities of the last century.
I have a story about someone who had wished he hadn't done things he had done in World War 2. Marijan Kvaternik, my grandfather, was a regular officer attached to a civilian militia division of the axis-allied Ustasa movement in Croatia. He said the things he saw them do, rip children apart with horses, grab babies by the feet and smash their heads on rocks (and I'll leave out some of the really brutal things) he was initially appalled by, but eventually found himself participating in, and it was only during one of these acts of barbarism that he realized what he was doing. Shortly afterward he stole a horse and deserted to join Tito's partisans.
He told me that for years after the war he had wanted to kill himself for what he had done with the Ustasa. Just to give you an idea of what these people did, even visiting german Nazi officers were enraged and disgusted by the brutality the Ustasa regulars and militia engaged and delighted in. It was said that the happiest day of Ante Pavelic's life was when he was presented with a wicker basket full of serbian eyeballs.
My grandfather never got over it and he ended up being a heavy alcoholic his entire life, dying at the age of 96. He always thought of the negative aspects of his participation in the war, never thought that he was told "do this or die" by the Ustasa warmongerers and never thought that he eventually aided in stopping them.
I don't know if you were drafted or not, don, or went voluntarily or were already in the service, but whatever the case may be, despite what you may have done, you did it in the service of the United States Government. Whomever you may have killed, their blood is on the politicians' hands, not your own.
I have a story about someone who had wished he hadn't done things he had done in World War 2. Marijan Kvaternik, my grandfather, was a regular officer attached to a civilian militia division of the axis-allied Ustasa movement in Croatia. He said the things he saw them do, rip children apart with horses, grab babies by the feet and smash their heads on rocks (and I'll leave out some of the really brutal things) he was initially appalled by, but eventually found himself participating in, and it was only during one of these acts of barbarism that he realized what he was doing. Shortly afterward he stole a horse and deserted to join Tito's partisans.
He told me that for years after the war he had wanted to kill himself for what he had done with the Ustasa. Just to give you an idea of what these people did, even visiting german Nazi officers were enraged and disgusted by the brutality the Ustasa regulars and militia engaged and delighted in. It was said that the happiest day of Ante Pavelic's life was when he was presented with a wicker basket full of serbian eyeballs.
My grandfather never got over it and he ended up being a heavy alcoholic his entire life, dying at the age of 96. He always thought of the negative aspects of his participation in the war, never thought that he was told "do this or die" by the Ustasa warmongerers and never thought that he eventually aided in stopping them.
I don't know if you were drafted or not, don, or went voluntarily or were already in the service, but whatever the case may be, despite what you may have done, you did it in the service of the United States Government. Whomever you may have killed, their blood is on the politicians' hands, not your own.
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
Thank you deeply for that post. A great deal of my husband's problems and behavior stem from being a Vietman Veteran....it's effect on him seem to grow worse with time rather than better. He suffers everyday, physically and mentally.
I really respect your taking the time to post that.
I really respect your taking the time to post that.
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