ScottFromWI

Let's keep the comments constructive folks. And please remember our forum policy

Debating controversial subjects should be taken elsewhere. Limited references are allowed, but the forums should not be used to convert others. Do not post content or links or materials to and from sites that flame someone's person, religious beliefs, race, national background, sexual orientation, or recovery program/method.

mfanch

I'm a non-theist and AA works just fine for me. Glad you are here, OP.

mfanch

stevieg46

[QUOTE=Squizz;5790671]That's a pretty fair assesment I would say. I've been to literally thousands of AA meetings, and the last couple of years, I've come to the realization that I actually function a lot better away from AA meetings. I still go a couple of times a month, but I've went months without going, and *GASP* stayed sober. Just look around when you go: A bunch of people saying "Hi Joe! (or whoever)" in unison, and it really comes across as a bunch of people who are completely brainwashed. A bunch of drones who don't think well for themselves. Just quit on your own. I have the upmost faith you are capable of doing sob.

Brainwashed ? oh well maybe that's a of putting things when your mind is closed , but you are entitled to your opinion naturally .

Personally I popped into laundromat countless times for a ''quick spin dry '' span round out the revolving doors and repeated that many times .

Ten years ago I decided to go for the ''special offer '' The Full Treatment and ''instructions '' I went for the full wash , the full cycle with ''stain remover formula '' my brain badly needed this as it was full of S###, take care.

Regards Stevie . recovered alcoholic 12 03 2006 .

Thumpalumpacus

<edited once I read the moderator's note>

Thumpalumpacus

The thing is that Music's take on it ignores the fact that there are other roads to sobriety than the one he himself is taking -- and condescension does no one any good.

How many lurkers here might have been turned off from going to their first AA meeting thanks to his snide invitation to continue drinking? Is he doing Step 12 justice?

tomsteve

it may not be in your nature to take your ball and go home
but in could be in your character defects/shortcomings, which the great fact is the program will help you with that.


So our troubles, we think, are basically of our own making. They arise out of ourselves, and the alcoholic is an extreme example of self-will run riot, though he usually doesn't think so. Above everything, we alcoholics must be rid of this selfishness. We must, or it kills us! God makes that possible. And there often seems no way of entirely getting rid of self without His aid. Many of us had moral and philosophical convictions galore, but we could not live up to them even though we would have liked to. Neither could we reduce our self-centeredness much by wishing or trying on our own power. We had to have God's help.

This is the how and why of it. First of all, we had to quit playing God. It didn't work.......

more revealed in the bb.


ya know, one of the great things this site has done for me is to help me realize there are other ways to get sober than aa. there are members here that were bottom of the bottom, lowest of the lowest......
and they got sober without aa.

just took me a lil humility to get openminded and investigate.

im just very glad people are getting sober no matter how they do it.

Andante

The fact is, I had to be beaten to my knees by my alcoholism before I was ready to quit drinking. I had to reach a point of desperation at which I was willing to let go of my preconceived notions about, well, a lot of things. I had to make a transition into a state of open-mindedness and willingness before I could make any headway in sobriety.

No belief in a sentient interventionist deity was required, but I did have to open my mind to possibilities that went beyond my previous ways of thinking.

Another interpretation of Music's comments might be: "If you haven’t yet reached the point where you’re ready to discard preconceived notions and be open-minded in your quest for sobriety, then perhaps you haven’t become desperate enough."

Just for the record, I don’t attend meetings or "work" any kind of formal program, nor do I believe in God in the traditional sense, but I consider my sobriety to be built in large part upon the principles which underlie the 12 Steps of AA.

awuh1

Thanks music. I appreciate the content and tone your last two posts. I must admit that I was frustrated with the way you were responding in this thread prior to that. Your reply was thoughtful and to the point.

My concern centers on the way new people, who do not understand AA, perceive it. Quite naturally these new people have questions. There are times when these questions may seem designed to find a way to criticize AA (or the people in it) and to dismiss it as a solution. However, even when that is the case, using phrases like "pi$$ up a rope" and "picking the fly poop out of the pepper" don't help. At least that's my opinion.

I take issue with the idea that, "You're not God and you have no right to stand in the way of someone hitting his bottom." My response is "so you gave them a shovel?" The whole idea of AA is to help people stop digging. I find that if I'm not not doing that, then I'm looking for excuses.

You often have some really good things to say music. That takes obvious effort. I truly do appreciate your thoughtfulness.

AnonSara

When I was drinking I could give you a million reasons why AA was not for me, including the spiritual aspect of the program. The reality was AA was not for me because I had more of a desire to be drunk than to be sober. Now that has changed and there are still things that I can choose to fight against in the program if I choose. I simply choose not to because when that happens I know it's my EGO. So... with that said, explore it for yourself. Come with an open mind any you can choose to change. If not, keep searching. AA will always be there.

Dee74

Let lay off the free character assessments guys.
It's particularly galling when a member has apologised.

Dee
Moderator
SR

Thumpalumpacus

It's a shame he didn't think to phrase it as you did, because it's much less off-putting.

The principles are indeed sound, and don't require a belief in anything other than the principles themselves, to my mind.

I'm new to recovery and attend AA as an atheist, not to find any god of my own understanding, but to learn more about the principles which matter to sobriety, and to be around people who have navigated the changes I'm going through myself.

ru12

When I first got sober I went to AA meetings and it was such a relief to just sit and BE with people that had a similar problem that I did. Most of the people I met were kind. Even though my path to sobriety lead in a different direction, I'm glad tha AA was there for me. And am glad it will be there for the next guy/gal too. There aren't too many places that actually really care about drunks.

if you are curious abou AA why not go to a few different meetings?

Soberpotamus

That was my experience as well.

Soberpotamus

Another suggestion for the OP: Why not grab yourself a copy of the Big Book and see what you think. The stories in the back alone were worth it to me.

bradly22

Yes, it is religious. I gave it a shot still.

fini

ohwell,

hello, it's been a while since you made your opening post, and you've certainly had a lot of feedback. ahem, gulp. maybe more than you expected

how's it all shaking out for you? and how are you doing with what you see as options for yourself?

Thumpalumpacus

^^^^ This ^^^^

dox

.
I don't need to qualify for AA membership in any other way than having a desire to stop drinking.

Not everyone needs to be beaten to their knees.

Some of us made a decision to stop before that point.

And some of us choose to kneel in prayer.

Others choose to stand on their own two feet.

Rather than eliminating or limiting choices in life.

Alcoholics Anonymous makes life choices possible.

Fly N Buy

Nice = Dox, like it...

The bottom certainly has been raised in AA - use to be if one still had a watch or gold tooth they weren't ready.

I still favor the Big Book statement - most alcoholics had to be pretty badly mangled ...... I find this to be interpretative , however. It is personal as is the God of my understanding.

Even coming in later in my life, ironically I identify with the section of stories entitled They Stopped in Time. We don't have to loose it all to change, thank God (of my understanding )

Ken33xx

Yes, I hope for an update too.