DylanS

I'm not sure what to do here...I've been going to BB study meetings to try and find someone who's done the work as outlined in the BB, but have been unable to.

I listened to a presentation by "Mark and Dave" and downloaded their Step 1 paper (BB references and questions) and worked on it, but not sure how to proceed. (I've also ordered BB workshop tapes by Joe Hawk and the workshop tapes of Joe and Charlie).

I'm praying for God to put someone in my path, but does anyone have any practical suggestions at this point? Does one just follow the 'watered down' version of AA with that type of sponsor and hope for the best? Keep praying/waiting (I'm 14 days sober/clean today)? The suggestions I've had thus far are, "Your brain is still cloudy and recovering - just keep going to meetings for now." and "Just don't drink no matter what between meetings." Things of that nature.

I heard on a tape today that, for folks who have 10+ years that go out, only 3% make it back. I'm already an extreme minority. I'm really afraid if I don't get moving the insanity will return and I will just slip away.

Thanks,
Dylan

paulokes

Quick stupid question Dylan...when you say no-one in your circle has done the work, how are you qualifying that? You mean no-one at your BB study meeting has worked the steps?

P

Boleo

Check to see if their are any Back To Basics meetings in your area? They will take you through the the steps in about 4 weeks and at least give you a temporary sponsor.

DylanS

Boleo - thanks much for the suggestion! There's a Back to Basics meeting on Tuesday at the local Alano Club!

Paul - Sorry if I was unclear - I meant that I've been attending the BB study after trying several other types of meeting (Newcomers/Beginner's meeting, open meetings, topic discussions) to try and find a sponsor to guide me through the steps as outlined in the BB. Hard to believe, but that is proving to be difficult to find!

paulokes

Ok...keep hanging round the BB study meetings and even the normal meetings and see what happens I guess. Remember some folks are quieter than others, just because they're not shouting doesn't necessarily mean they haven't done the work. Listen close to the message...

Some of us alkies can be unassuming believe it or not. Something to do with growing in humility

Good luck

P

omegasupreme

You remind me of me and that can be deadly and comforting at the same time my friend. I'll take you through "The Work" if you wish.

DayTrader

Dylan, I'm gonna share my experience here.......so don't take it to mean I'm accusing you of anything. I only bring it up for two reasons: 1. I've experienced it myself 2. I know others I was around as they were experiencing it.

You underlined "as outlined in the book" above. I'd challenge you to consider if you've got some preconceptions of how "the work" is supposed to be done and until you can find someone who's working it the way you think the book tells them to work it you won't be able to do it?

For me, after I heard Mark and Joe (and some other popular speakers.....both in AA and in NA) I was convinced that until I had direction from one of these gurus, my goose was cooked. I'd never recover....or at least not get everything I could.

The good news in that fallacious thinking above is that my ability to work the steps was the only think keeping me sober I'm in trouble because I don't come close to doing everything I've learned to do. Being honest, if I did try to do everything......I'd have to make AA my sole vocation, give up living life, and I'd probably STILL not get it 100%.

As for finding the right person.....you probably already know them but think "nah, can't be that person." Welcome to the club. Dr Bob didn't want to meet with Bill Wilson (and Bill, btw, didn't do "the work" precisely out of the very book he came to write several years later!). Dr Bob didn't do "the work" precisely the way it came to be written in the book.......so on and so forth all the way through AA.

And the good news there is that it's NOT the steps that will keep you sober..... The steps and "the work" of the first 11 steps is designed to begin your spiritual awakening so that you can DO what's in the 12th step: carry the message of recovery to others and practice (because you didn't GET them 100% and never will) these principles in all of your affairs.

You mentioned Joe Hawk. Love that dude.....one of my AA heroes for sure. In one of his later talks he talks about "doing the work in aa to avoid doing the work of aa." Doing inventories incessantly, researching and digging into things designed to help him recover more, focusing on what he can do to grow and get better. Seemingly all good stuff......but all based in him doing stuff for himself so he can feel better. .....aka selfish motives. The real work.......the work that matters the most.......is that 12th step stuff. .......and BILL WILSON HAD DR BOB DOING IT AFTER 1 OR 2 DAYS IN THE PROGRAM. Prolly a good thing Bill didn't ask Bob if he thought he'd found a sufficient teacher to take him through the work that hadn't even been defined yet.

Boleo

More good news is you can have the worst possible sponsor and more than make up for it if you provide the best possible willingness.

IMNSHO 98% of the power comes from the receiving end of a sponsor/sponsee relationship.

Louise82

Welcome back to recovery Dylan! Congrats on 14 days sober.

I completely understand that you want a sponsor who's worked the steps as laid out in the BB, because that's what people in the meetings I go to keep suggesting in their shares and to me personally.

It's great that you're praying to your HP and have been going to different types of meeting. When we seek God, God provides. So keep praying and trust in God's timing. I'm 50 days back and God provided me with my current sponsor in a way I was not expecting. I would never even have considered the lady as a sponsor and didn't think she'd ever consider me as a sponsee, but my HP and her HP had other ideas.

Like others have said, keep an open mind, keep hanging around meetings, go to the Back to Basics meeting near you. You can also ask the secretary/chair at one of your meetings if they can help hook you up with a temporary sponsor.

You're probably already doing this but get to meetings early and stick around afterwards. Ask God to draw you to people to talk to both before and after the meetings. Someone you talk to and get to know may turn out to be a suitable sponsor or may be able to point you towards someone who is.

Grungehead

Dylan, that's how I found my current sponsor.

Threshold

The program is about turning our will and life over to our HP, not to our sponsor. The world's most amazing sponsor is still not what gets and keeps a person clean. If you don't want to slip back into insanity, then don't. Pray to your HP.

Have you found a sponsor and then found out that they don't have recovery? Or have you not yet asked anyone to be a F2F sponsor at all.

It's your working the steps to the best of your ability with the power of your HP that is going to lead to recovery.

I sense a need for perfection, from both yourself and others in your opening post. (I may be reading it wrong), what they are telling you is true (at least up to a point) the first thing you have to do is NOT drink no matter what. We have to be willing to give up at least that much to begin the process. If you already have the idea in your head that without the perfect sponsor leading you through the steps perfectly you might drink again...I'd take a serious look at what that is all about.

There is no perfect way to do the steps. We do them with the amount of honestly, open mindedness and willingness that we are blessed with. Throw in some trust and we are well on our way.

I hope that you soon connect with a sponsor you feel confident with. I truly believe you are ready to give yourself over to the sober life.

Tommyh

find someone here who can work with you on some kind of video chat

I have heard of that happening

muvinon

Personally, when I was 40 days sober and the fear was starting to grip me, I was told: "That's untreated alcoholism. Get a sponsor and work the steps." That day I had only 3 choices: Longtimer said she worried that she didn't help newcomers so much these days, chronic relapser and another longtimer who said yes. I didn't even much like her sharing, but she got me going.

She is still my sponsor today. It turned out to be a wonderful fit.

So......let go of preconceived notions is my suggestion. Ask, "Have you experienced the 12 steps?" If the answer is yes, then that person can help you if they are willing.

I found by opening up and just thinking, "I don't care who helps me, just so long as I receive help," I have benefitted.

FeenixxRising

Dylan, I would be extremely skeptical of that 3% statistic. Do you really know if it came from a reputable source? Some speaker stating it does not make it true (and I'm guessing it has little or no basis in actual research or facts).

You stated that you're already an "extreme minority", so it seems the 3% number has already taken hold in your head. Don't put yourself in some statistical compartment. If you do, you risk the danger of become a self-fulfilling prophecy. You may have urges down the road and sub-consciously think about that 3% number and then begin to feel "what's the point?".

The reality is, you're back working on recovery. That's all you need to focus on. Try not to concern yourself with any other alcoholics who've traveled a road similar to your road. Their outcome is not your outcome, no one is exactly alike. The reality is you're able to create your own 100% statistic.

yeahgr8

Hi Dylan

Good for you! It is, of course, the step work that will remove your obsession for alcohol as it says in the Books.

I was at a meeting the other day in an area i don't normally attend, far away from where i live. A guy was asking about the steps and no-one in the room of 10 people had done them. I felt awful and really didn't know what to say to him after the meeting other than he may have to go a bit further afield to find a sponsor.

If you have to travel a 100 kilometer round trip to get to someone who has done the steps and will sponsor you then that isn't actually that difficult to do! The steps, if you are really willing and ready, can be done very quickly, literally you can work through to step nine in a matter of weeks and a lot of the work after 4,5 and 8 can be done on the phone or through skype.

It is important IMO that you get a sponsor that you meet with face to face at least for a short while.

I'll tell you how bad AA is, the rehab i went to for 4 weeks when i first started thinking about getting sober now offers a pay per sponsor service and i think that is a great idea. Sure you are paying for someone's time but if it saves your life who cares!

Good luck man, the steps save my life, worked them in a couple of months with a sponsor, never had one thought about drink in 4 years apart from wow i am so grateful i don't have to do that anymore. Don't stray from your thinking and find that sponsor because i went to AA looking for a solution when i was 30 and bumped into some idiot dry drunk who told me that i didn't have to worry about buying a Big Book until i had been sober a while with a look of distaste on his face. I never went back to AA until 9 years later to try again, in a different country! I hear that guy died a horrible death so it's all good [joke - he was just one of the may sick ones who kill the real alcoholic looking for help!].

AA did save my life and i am grateful to it.

DylanS

Thanks everyone for the thought provoking and helpful posts.

I absolutely do have that perfection fear (self-reliance - when I know d*amn good and well I can't pull this thing off myself).

Feenix - thanks for that - man, it really had gotten into my head and was gripping like a vise. The statistic may or may not be true, but it's still me and my fear. If I'm back it's by grace so I need to accept it and move on.

DayTrader - yeah, there may well be some of that in there. My problem is, when sober before and just doing the 'majority AA' way, I was endlessly miserable and suicidal. The steps, to the best of MY ability, with a wishy-washy person...I dunno, man. Maybe it'd work. I did ask if I could go the jail with the group - my thinking being that I can, at the very least, share my experience so, hopefully, I won't be going down that long, useless road of seeking recovery to keep endlessly fixing ME - I've done that outside of AA and it's tiring to the point of sickening.

Threshold: yep, as I conceded above - I do think there may be some perfectionism that's being ground down out of my own desperation - which, painful as it is, is probably a very good thing. I have to respectfully disagree with you here: "first thing you have to do is NOT drink no matter what. We have to be willing to give up at least that much to begin the process". I am alcoholic. I have lost the power of choice over drinking, which is why I'm beginning to feel a bit panicked to get moving on the steps. The steps will remove what blocks me from God and, yes, it IS God (my HP) that will remove the obsession. Not me. I will, sooner or later, buckle beneath the weight of the obsession to drink. But I can't just NOT drink "no matter what". Being alcoholic, I eventually drink, no matter what.

As suggested, I'm continuing to pray for someone to be put in my path, and that I, as blocked/asleep as I am, will SEE it and KNOW it. I'm going to the B2B meeting tomorrow night and, if nothing arises, am grateful that someone has offered to get me through the steps non-F2F.

Thanks again, everyone. Your input is very much appreciated; prayers, as well, if you're so inclined.

paul99

I have worked someone through the steps this way. We still talk today, just not as often. He was a travelling salesperson and was stationed in different parts of the country (US) for weeks at a time, so that was the only way it worked for him. It is done often, and I see no reason for it not to work.

mick3580

Follow your conscience on this one. If it were me, I'd either do the steps myself or find a person who can state they have had a spiritual awakening as the result of the steps.

DayTrader

I was right there with ya Dylan... same fears for me and they're pretty valid fears.

That said, most of the hard stuff is on HP's shoulders. Re sponsors, home groups, marriages, job changes, etc....... I believe it's my responsibility to put in all the leg work I can: research, learn, ask around, and show up at places where God can put the person with the answers in my path. Sitting at home (and you're not doing that.....good!) waiting hasn't worked.

WHO it'll be.....that's on God. You're doing your end of the bargain already.

Music

That's good! Keep doing that and while you're at it, don't forget to ask God to help you stay sober in the meantime. I've found that when I Let Go and Let God, I get what I need. I try to keep three things in mind. I believe in God...meaning I believe there's only one God; I have faith in God...meaning I believe He's capable of doing all things; and most important I trust God...meaning I believe He will help me if I get out of the way and allow Him to do His will.