r36mx

I am rather angry at the moment. A relative newcomer at a "closed" meeting brought his young daughter to the meeting and has done so for several months. A member of the meeting told him this is not allowed. He used this as an excuse to drink.

This is not the first time I have heard of groups telling another member they are wrong for bringing young children to a meeting.

In my opinion such attitudes go against the AA program. The 12&12 states in tradition 1there are no rules in AA and that unity is of primary importance. Granted, tradition 2 says God as expressed through the group conscience is the the "one ultimate authority,"but, again, I would argue that traditions 1 and 3 (the only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking) must be taken into account.

Tradition 2 also states that "our society has no president having authority to govern it,""board of directors which who can cast an erring member into outer darkness."

Anyway it is my opinion that as long as young children are not destroying the meeting that their attendance at meetings is positive.

1. For starters it allows children to see AA working, so that if ever they need help for alcoholism in the future they have a safe place to come.

2. Allowing children at meetings negates excuses some alcoholics may use for not attending meetings and drinking(although it they could not think of other excuses for drinking I would be most surprised.)

3. It shows to outsiders that AA is friendly toward families.

Thanks for allowing this "bleeding deacon" to rant. Oh by the way I no longer have children. So this is not entirely about me I don't think. Of course I could be wrong here too.

Isaiah

I see a lot of kids at meetings, usually infants or toddlers, but I've seen some young kids too. I have actually come to appreciate their presence there. I've even watched a couple grow up. Like anyone would, sometimes when the baby starts crying and making noise I get the grimaces and thinking "how annoying." But what I always come to is the reminder that someone who is a parent to a young child needs sobriety far more than I do.

And if the kids are young kids I hardly think they are going to violate the spirit of anonymity in closed meetings. Is a five year old going to go out on the playground and divulge all the gossip they overheard? Up to a certain age I doubt most kids are even capable of understanding a meeting. But that would be something for a group conscience to decide, and not for one angry member to decide on his/her own.

shaun00

Thats a group decision.
On a personal level I think it's grand to see kids in a meeting.
Some love to make a drama out of it....if it is safe and appropriate .... It's great to see kids beaming....
Excuse to drink?????...maybe it's a book he needs more than a meeting.

Paraffinalien

I take pleasure from seeing children at a meeting and have nothing against it, what i have to remember is that my opinion does not really count for a whole lot.

What this boils down to for me is, where to draw the line? This is why we need a group conscience to make decisions for the group.

How come he can bring his five year old but i cant bring my nine year old? How come they can bring kids and i cant bring my infirm Mother?

Principles before personalities.

yeahgr8

That is really funny:-)

Kids? I dunno, who cares? Its not going to stop anyone from working the steps and recovering...i'm looking forward to going to my favourite meetings in spain (2 weeks left whoohoo), this lady brings her little dog and hes a blast...gives me something to do whilst they all have the inevitable talks about xmas and how to avoid alcohol whilst dismissing the steps...yes ill share and wait around after hoping;-)

Infirm mother, thats gonna be in my head for a while...classic!

Tommyh

I believe trad 4 makes the case each group can do as it wishs
allowing children,not allowing children....


I am for allowing children in closed meetings only if they do not disturb the meeting and if the parent(s) watch them closely
we have all kinds of people coming to meetings,registered sex offenders come too so children should always be in the company of a sober responsible adult for their protection

if a alkie wants to drink any excuse will do

Mark75

This person went out because of kids at a meeting? Man, I wonder what would happen of he lost his job, or got a traffic ticket or it rained or his football team lost.

This isn't about kids at a meeting. Myself, when I see people bring their kids I know that it must mean alot to them. I am cool with it, heck, I got four of them, some grown... Damn, I miss have 'em around!

spryte

I think it's fine.

However, if a child is of an age where they can really pay attention to what is being said, in my opinion, there should be caution, for the sake of the child, not the group.

I think there are some things that children really don't need to be privy to, beyond getting a very basic snapshot of the big picture. For example, talk about court proceedings (family law and criminal law) and talk about addiction. They are entitled to know the basics of what is going on (for example, Mom couldn't help drinking, Mom was sick, it made Mom act weird, and Mom is getting better with all the help of these nice people), but they don't need the nitty gritty. Exposing them to the nitty gritty creates a risk that they will misinterpret things and internalize things.

Just my opinion...

Ninsuna

Thank you, Spryte, for bringing up what I think is the most important thing to consider here. I feel pretty strongly about this, and it has nothing to do with the kids being disruptive. Hell, plenty of adults are disruptive.

I think a lot of AA folks like to pretend any child under 10 is deaf and dumb. Kids pick up and absorb things at meetings. I have learned about things in AA meetings my relatively sheltered self had never heard of before, and I'm in my 30's.

Even if everyone is careful not to swear or talk about sex (and if they resent your child there, they won't be) your kids can still hear a lot that they are liable to misinterpret. And that crap is in their head forever.

My friend stopped taking her daughter to meetings when her daughter heard a woman sharing about letting CPS take her child and being so wasted she didn't care. My friend's daughter was hysterical on the way home, convinced if her mother ever drank again, she would call CPS to come get rid of her.

Babies and very young ones that aren't talking yet are one thing, but I really wish people would consider how very little time we have to be ignorant of all the ugliness in the world. Let your kids have that time.

johndelko408

In my fellowship they announce at the beginning of the meetings "there is no problem with having children in the meetings, however if they are causing a disturbance please remove them for the greater good of the group." I really don't mind there being children in the meetings, I welcome it with the hopes that those children will grow up in sober households. For the most part people respect the rule, they take their kids out if they are being loud. At my Alano club the workers in the cafe usually are nice enough to watch peoples kids for them while they attend the meeting even though it's against club rules . But every once in a while you'll have someone in the meeting who just let their kids run rampant in the meeting and they don't do anything about it, not even an apology. That I find very annoying and selfish of the parents. There are other people there who are trying to hear the message. I just feel they should respect the rule. Other than that, being a parent of two, I love to see kids in the rooms. Especially if I'm not having the best day, children can always put a smile on my ugly face

NewGrowth

The only things I really think about it are- is it safe for the child? (some shares are inappropriate for young ears) is it helpful to the newcomer? (is the person bringing a child new or have they done the steps/my focus is on helping others not myself) does the meeting's group conscious allow children? (unity before what I want) if the child is bothering me- have I offered to help watch the child and be helpful?

About the guy who drank- I know when I wanted to drink I'd use anything as an excuse. Truth wasn't my strongpoint

r36mx

I agree with you all I think. I concur with those of you who say children ought to be watched, more for their own safety than anything else. As for the guy went out I did tell him that was only an excuse and nothing more. He did agree with that.

Thanks for all your input.

DayTrader

On that note, I'd LOVE to have more kids at meetings - ESPECIALLY the ones where it's war story after war story.....everyone trying to one-up the previous person. I don't need to hear the nitty gritty either -

Maybe if our meetings were more about the common solution and less about the common problem, this wouldn't be such an issue?

mrsfray

I used to bring my son to meetings.....(my husband works weird hours) I think I quit when he was 4, I feel like there is too much information in the meetings for him to hear. Plus people talk like there is no kid in the room anyway. I mean I guess that it isn't on any of them to clean up their language for my kid anyway.... Anyway he is 7 now and my sponsor told me she never brings her kids around the rooms, so I quit too. However I have NO PROBLEM w/ anyone who brings their kids in the meeting, but please if they are freakin out or interrupting, please like church, take them out.

digderidoo

I'd rather see a child in a meeting than a dog!

Dime

I never have really seen a child disturb a meeting but in some of the meetings I have attended people have shared things that could be very disturbing to a young child. What really gets me is when someone shares vulgar disgusting stuff right next to a child then says "excuse me" to the child like it's supposed to erase the child's memory. Fortunately in most of the meetings where children are in attendance most of the people in the meeting are respectful of children in the room.

johndelko408

I just went to an NA meeting last night and I'm not sure if it was the secretarys wife or girlfriend but she seemed to be there with him. Well she had a baby with her, cute I might add, but the baby was crying and being loud. Whenever someone would get up to share they would give her this look as if to be giving her a hint that her not taking the baby outside is quite rude. I could hear people cross talking about it because the crying was in my opinion causing a disturbance. I really don't mind kids and babies in the rooms, but when it's disturbing the group as a whole I think that people should have the common courtesy of taking them outside. I've never taken my kids to meetings because I know they would be disruptive, who am I to think I'm above everyone else there and thinkvthat the rules don't apply to me

shaun00

Maybe mum needs the meeting and can't get a sitter.
Maybe the baby is suffering because mom is always drunk and is looking for a solution.
So what do you do?...moan her out the room.
Or put up with a bit of noise from an innocent?
A baby crying in a room full of drunks would not bother me.
So it crys over my important speech...big deal.
A baby crying is tons better than some crap I hear.

onlythetruth

In my opinion, children have no place in meetings. Ever. Period. Here are a few recent examples of why I say this:

Staten Island firefighter accused of groping woman during Alcoholics Anonymous meeting | SILive.com

http://news.bostonherald.com/news/re...icleid=1290421

http://www.kcautv.com/Global/story.asp?S=13571619

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2...-shotgun-blast

http://www.recordonline.com/apps/pbc...327/-1/SITEMAP



The reality is, AA meetings are not reliably safe, and children shouldn't be there--for their own protection.

BP44

Amazing, just amazing. A lot of opinion on the virtues of "children in meetings" or in the other direction " no children allowed". Not once has the most important consideration been addressed. Is this your home group? And if so, are you an active participant in group conscience? The reason I ask is that I see opinion on traditions that don't line up with my experience with the exception of the poster that referenced tradition 4. If you don't like the format of the group, bring a motion in group conscience to change it, otherwise live with the format of the group. If the group's format doesn't allow children, then the person who insists they bring their child to the meeting is the one threatening the first tradition. Unity is about the greater good of the GROUP as opposed to the needs or desires of the INDIVIDUAL. By getting involved in group conscience regularly you will learn about the traditions by seeing them in action. Reading the 12x12 is fine and all, but experience with the traditions in action is a different animal. It's the kind of thing that compelled me to bring the traditions into my home.