New here...feeling helpless
 

Hi. I just spent an hour googling "husband sneaks alcohol" and reading posts on this forum about people going through the same thing I am. I'm so obviously not the only one here hurt and confused and not knowing what to do.

It would take me 16 years to write about all of the ups and downs with my husband, but no one has time for that. My husband is a secret drinker. I have never gotten him to admit that he has a problem, and so many of the same exact stories are here. I'm glad to know I'm not alone, yet sad that alcohol is such a prevalent problem for so many.

My husband is a professional. We have two children. Everyone thinks we are the perfect couple and he is an amazing leader in his position. Yet for some reason he feels the need to drink.

But I can't tell if he's an alcoholic. Most of me thinks yes. He hides it. When he walks in the door the first thing he does is grab a drink. He drinks in front of me, but then he also sneaks more drinks so he doesn't let me see how much he is drinking. He must think I'm stupid.

He holds his job together. He is fine during the day. Then evening comes. I dread the evening. It all starts then. But what makes them transition from a drinker to an alcoholic? Where is the line when it switches?

I read so many of these posts that say I can't change him. I believe that. I've tried saying things. But I'm so stuck. I have two children. I want so badly to leave him but what would that do to the kids? And all of the stuff we have together? It seems so daunting. And if I told him I was leaving he would not understand it at all. He truly doesn't think he drinks too much. But he can't go a day without drinking. And I don't want someone in my life or my kids' lives who is so weak he can't say no or admit something is wrong.

I can't live with the lies. But I don't know how to do it without our family unit together either.

I'm lost. I'm helpless. I'm stuck.

You made a good first step by reaching out here. I'm not clinically qualified to tell you if he's an alcoholic, but I can tell you that I too drank in secret. I drank in front of my wife in moderation, but always had another bottle handy for when she went to work (I work night shift so lots of free time for me). For me personally, I got tired of it all and quit. I don't even know if I'm an alcoholic, but certainly alcohol created more problems for me than it solved. Having a job, "things," etc., does not mean one doesn't have a problem. Alcoholics are masters of "holding it together," but it never lasts. Keep reaching out here. There are some good folks with tons of experience.

Welcome JeepGirl......I am glad you found us and have already been reading other people's posts......

If he is hiding it...it sounds like he is struggling with his alcohol use, and, has probably been for a long time....
Alcoholism is not a sign of "weakness" and it is no respecter of persons....it can happen to anybody....rich, poor, young, old, male, female, etc.....
It has been called "the disease of denial"....so, it is not surprising that he is not agreeing that there is a problem....

I doubt that he "thinks you are stupid"......probably, the opposite.
His drinking isn't about you....It is about what is within his self. For an alcoholic, there is a very powerful compulsion to drink....
It isn't just about logic....

It will help if you gain an understanding about the nature of alcoholim...so, you, at least know what to expect and what you are up against....
Also, it helps if you learn about how it affects the loved ones and the family....
Alanon would be a good idea for you, right now, because it focuses on the loved ones....and it is so supportive to be with others who have walked in your shoes and understand what you are going through...more than just mere words....

I can hear that you feel overwhelmed, right now...and, understandably so.

I am giving you a link to our extensive library of articles about alcoholism and the loved ones, as well. There are dozens and dozens. They are located in our "sticky" section...just above the threads.
It would be a good idea to start reading through them....

HERE IS THAT LINK
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...c-reading.html

I do hope that you stick around and keep learning and keep posting....

Jeepgirl......

Here are so me more things that can be helpful....
The book, "Co-dependent No More" is practically a "bible", around here. You can get it from the library, Amazon, and most any other book source. You can probably relate to it, quite a bit....

Also....please familiarize yourself with out "Sticky" section....just above the threads. There is sooo much information, located there...
Here is a diagram for you to find it....(the Classic Reading section that I recommended to you, in the prior link) is located within the bottom sticky).....just so you know...
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...find-them.html

The more you post, the better we can help you.

Thanks. I'll keep reading. I'll also keep crying. I just don't know how to live my life like this anymore. I'm in a no-win. All the reading does is solidify the fact that I can't help him. And that I have to make a change or accept my life as is. And that's probably the hardest realization to make.

sorry about the double post! I don't know what happened.....

Jeepgirl....you don't have to make a decision or take action, right away (unless you are in physical danger, of course).....
You can make the decision to get some support for yourself, so that you can get more clarity.....
alanon would be a good support for what you are feeling, right now....
You are not alone....

But what will support do? Nod and smile and say they understand what I'm going through. But I am so unbelievably unhappy. Leaving or staying will make me that way.

I'm not arguing. I hope it doesn't sound that way.

I've looked up meetings around me and there's only one. And it's in the evening and I don't know what I would do with my kids. Husband works that night usually.

If getting to meetings is an issue, keep reaching out here. I don't post a lot, but reading in the various forums has been a big help. I'm suspecting that you already feel like the marriage is over, or at least on life support, and that you are grieving that right now. Understandable, but also healthy.

Jeepgirl....you don't have to go....it is just a suggestion. It is just that so many people here, who have been through what you are now, going through, say that it helped them to be able to face and deal with their emotions and their lives.....

I know that you are feeling "stuck"......but, you won't stay stuck, forever.....
change will come. Nothing in life stays the same, forever....(LOL..the one thing that is constant is change)......
It is late at night, now....so, the forum is a little slow....but, more members will be along who will be able to relate to how you are feeling......
I know that you are feeling a great weight on your shoulders and are probably having a lot of fear.....that is common and very understandable....
Take this a day at a time, and you will get through this....

Hi, Jeepgirl--welcome to SR. Like dandy, I'm glad to hear you've been reading around the F&F section. Sometimes folks come in w/blinders on and only ever read/post in their own thread--they are missing the biggest part of the benefits to be gained here. You've got a head start on that, so good for you!

You've already received info regarding the "stickies" as well as suggestions to check into Alanon. . Alanon can be a great in-person resource and I would encourage you to pursue it if you possibly can. Unless you live in a very rural area, it's hard to imagine there is only one Alanon meeting near you. This is the link to locate meetings: https://al-anon.org/al-anon-meetings/

I have done some volunteering at our local Alanon office, and I have received more than one call from someone who was put off by by the designation of various meetings as "open" or "closed." I explained that "closed" doesn't mean that new members are not welcome; it just means that the group is only intended for those whose lives have been affected by someone else's drinking. So for instance, a student looking to write a paper should not attend a "closed" meeting but rather look for an "open" one--although since no one asks for credentials when you walk in, these designations are more of a courtesy than an actual requirement.

Anyway, my point is that if you are seeing Alanon meetings marked "closed", that doesn't mean you can't attend. And if there truly is only one meeting in your area, check out the suggestions for the virtual meetings. Maybe that would work for you. I also know that SR offers chat forums. Here is a link to that, although I can't offer any personal experience w/them: Chat Meetings and Chat Discussions - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information

As one of our members here likes to say, "Knowledge is power!" It's so true--when I was in my own little tiny world w/XAH, everything was an n of 1. I had no way to reality check what I was seeing, hearing, feeling, being told. I felt alone, scared, and constantly off balance and confused.

Once I got started in SR and Alanon, I began to see the patterns of behavior that A's seem to share. I felt a lot less crazy and alone. Then I began to see the patterns of behavior that I shared w/other spouses/partners/etc. of A's. Now that was truly eye-opening!

Again, to echo dandy, you don't have to make any big decisions right now. Take some time, adjust to your new reality, keep educating yourself. I came here in March of 2013 and it took till March of 2015 for me to separate from AH and then divorce in June of 2015. You'll begin to see your path much more clearly as you learn more. Your perspective will change, and you'll find strength and courage you never knew you had. There IS a peaceful, healthy life waiting for you and your kids on the other side of this alcoholic dysfunction.

Hope to hear more from you in the days to come!

PS: You mentioned being concerned about what a divorce would do to your kids. You can check this section Adult Children of Addicted/Alcoholic Parents - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information of the forum to see what others have to say about growing up in an alcoholic household. I don't know if I've ever seen anyone say they wished the sober parent had stayed with the alcoholic, but don't take my word for it, get it straight from the horse's mouth.

Hi Jeepgirl, it sounds to me like you're reaching crisis point. You've tried talking without getting through to him, and you shouldn't feel dread when evening comes. If you can't get to a meeting, maybe you could have individual counselling to sort out your thoughts? Sharing with a professional can be very helpful in relieving your feelings and sorting out a plan. If you've never tried counselling, give it a chance.
It never hurts to plan for your future by education, saving and finding out your rights. Give yourself options and take some power back.
Would it be worth talking very seriously to your AH again, or even writing him a letter, and spelling out how this affects you? Being very frank?

Hello Jeepgirl,

I'm so sorry you needed to find us, but glad you did. One of the most gut-wrenching things for me to realize early on is that there was nothing I could do to change the alcoholics and addicts in my life. I could remain in contact with them and accept them as is, or I could protect myself, my peace, and my sanity by limiting contact.

And yes, when we love someone, that is a gut-wrenching and painful idea to wrestle with. Believe me when I tell you, we get it--totally.

Many folks find a lot of comfort and support in face-to-face meetings, others have found one-on-one sessions with a counselor who specializes in addiction, some, like me, rely solely on SR for support and education. There are many options you can explore to find what works best for you, but you definitely deserve support!

Sending prayers for strength and clarity for you, your children, and your husband.

Educated yourself before you make any serious decisions. The most impotant thing you can do is learn how to take care of yourself. Then you can take care of your children. You cannot do anthing for your husband at this time so don't waste your time or energy. Reach out for help. There is so much support out there for you. Seek it out.

Jg,
Welcome, glad you found us. You have gotten some great advice from the posters above. I know you are overwhelmed with what you are reading. As with alcohlism, our part in this dance, is groomed over time, becoming an enabler. Then one day we wake up, 16 years later and go what has happened to my life. He is the addict but you are crazy, it is so out of control that you don't know where to turn.

Education is power!! You will realize that alcoholism is progressive, it will get worse, as you are living it. What we learn in alanon, open aa meetings, or through a therapist, is how to take care of ourselves and children. He is an adult and it is not your responsibility to monitor his drinking. Does it really matter if he has the title of alcoholic. If someone told you, no he wasn't, would you believe them? They don't live in your home and have seen what you have experienced. As said above, alcohol has caused problems in your life so it is an issue.

Take your time and make mindful decisions. I know you are worried about the kids and a broken home. I was with my axh for 34 painful years. I am seeing the affects of the "enabler" of me in my oldest daughter. I see what she is doing in her relationship and I know she codependent just like me. I stayed together for my kids (and of course because I was to sick to leave) but i am seeing the disfunctional decisions they are making because of the life we lived. Ugh!! Sometimes it's not always best to stay together just to have the "family" title. Families come in all shapes and sizes.

Do your homework, you are worth it!! Hugs

Thanks everyone for just reading, and replying, and not letting me feel alone. I know all of us are experiencing similar stories, but to feel like an individual with this struggle is also important.

The thing that started my post last night was that my husband ran up to my work to grab my computer and came back after an hour and fifteen minutes. My workplace is ten minutes away. He stumbled in the house, I asked him what took so long, and he made up some story about being on the phone with his parents. Long story short, I knew it was lies, and when my daughter woke me up with a stomach bug in the middle of the night (which I took care of myself because, as usual, my husband was passed out and snoring), I decided to do some investigating. There was no call log from his parents on his cell, his car had a lighter (he also secretly but not secretly smokes, which also peeves me), and a sonic drink. I picked up the sonic drink (a Route 44!), and sure enough, It was mixed with liquor. My heart dropped. Drinking and driving now?!? I'm devastated.

I asked him this morning to tell me the truth. What did he actually do last night when he was gone? Usually when this happens he will continue to lie to me, it turns into a fight, and I'm the paranoid one, and then it blows over and is ignored. This time, he said, very calmly, "I bought a pack of smokes." I said, "What else?" He quietly said, "I was drinking."

He said he couldn't believe he admitted it to me and that he thinks he has a problem. He said he has been hiding it quite a while (duh, he's a TERRIBLE hider!). He said he is scared because he doesn't know why he does it and he doesn't think he can stop. He also said he knows the consequences way outweigh the benefits, but even knowing that he could lose everything with his drinking (he works in a field that doesn't tolerate criminal/drinking/DWI/any type of records of any type and would be terminated immediately and he is the breadwinner), he still can't stop. Not to mention that he could kill someone drinking and driving. And that scares him. But he's NEVER verbalized this to me.

He's also worried that if he gets help he will run into people that won't keep it confidential and he could put his job at risk. He's even afraid our employer will look to see if he's gone to counseling and he will lose his job. Paranoia. I told him none of that will happen and we can even find somewhere in another town to get help or go to meetings.

I told him that I am not starting this cycle again with him and that I have very little time before I pick up the kids and dog and start a new life. I am not issuing him an ultimatum like to not drink because that doesn't work, but I must see him doing something to take the next step. AA meetings, counseling, couples counseling, heck, I am even willing to try sending him to rehab. I know it's expensive but I want for him to get better.

That being said, I still don't believe him. I think it's the cycle starting all over again. Only once before has he told me he thinks he drinks too much, and that was maybe about a year ago, when he was very lucid late at night and very drunk.

So there it is. There is the most current part of the story. My trust is shattered, my faith in everything is shattered, and honestly, I don't know if I want to help him, but I have no idea where to start in leaving him. Friends, colleagues (we work in the same field), family...what a nightmare. But that's why I'm still here, and someone up above said it best about how it's better once you're out. So many roadblocks to get there, though.

Life is hard. It really is. Kids have no idea how easy they have it.

Welcome Jeepgirl, I hope you stick around.

I stayed with my XAH until my youngest was almost 16 and the eldest had already left home. It was a shock to everyone when we split up. On the outside we looked like the perfect family, so often asked by people, " What's your secret? You guys are still so in love after all these years!"... Love wasn't the problem,we had plenty of that, unfortunately it wasn't enough and it certainly wasn't the cure for his alcohol addiction...and it certainly didn't help the special brand of crazy I became because of my codependency.

Like your husband, my XAH started out having a couple drinks or beers yet getting plastered... there was always something out in his shop he had to go check on or do. Of course he would lie if I accused him of going out there to drink more alcohol. Always with the lies, as his alcoholism got worse so did the lying. He lied about drinking, he lied about money, he lied about where he was and what he was doing, you name it, he lied about it. He would even lie about things that were utterly ridiculous and did not need to be lied about.. I could never understand that, I have since learned that this behavior is very common in addicted people. Ultimately it was the lack of trust because of the lies that broke us up. I couldn't trust him and I didn't trust myself any more either. I wanted to believe him but every time I did that got my heart broken all over again. Love isn't supposed to hurt like that.

I grew up with a mother who was/is codependent. A lot of what I learned about being a "strong" wife and mother I learned from her. I often felt like I wasn't living up to her example because she always sacrificed so much of herself and I wasn't being that "giving" ( or so I thought, the truth was I had given up so much of myself I was practically gone). So much of my decision to stay with my AXH as long as I did, was because I thought I had to live up to my promises and stay with him through thick and thin just like my mum did with my dad. I just had to , that's what "good" women do. My mum thought she was setting a good example for her kids, and in many ways she did, she raised us right... but when it came down to her relationship with an alcoholic spouse, she dropped the ball big time. I tried so hard not to marry a man like my dad, but that's exactly what I did. And then I turned into my mum. When my marriage fell apart and I drew those conclusions about my parents and how they helped form me, it was quite the painful epiphany. I didn't BLAME them, they both did the best they could with what they knew, but it sure opened my eyes to a lot of "whys".

It wasn't easy to turn a life-long, born and bred-in behavior, but I did it. When my daughter was 20 years old ( during and after my break up with her dad) she was living with a boyfriend ( mid 20s) who had a developing drinking problem. She listened to me when I talked to her about alcoholism and codependence, she read Codependent No More, she did her own research and then she broke her own heart by breaking up with the young man - because she didn't want to spend her life living like that. She even commented to me that she could learn by other people's mistakes. She learned at 20 , what I learned at 40, and what my mother still hasn't learned today at 70+... I like to think we have finally broken the cycle of codependent women in our line... my daughter has no children, but when she does, I have confidence she wont set the example myself and my mother set before her.

I told you all that to let you know you aren't alone. I have been exactly where you are. I had a husband with a good job, we loved each other, we had a nice home and a family. A beautiful property, great pets and a bunch of fun toys... but his alcoholism was ripping him apart and subsequently my codependence ended up doing the same to me. It got progressively worse for both of us. He refused to change so I had to if I wanted any kind of a happy existence. In MY case our marriage did not survive... It was not an easy life transition but I am a much happy, healthier woman than I was just a few short years ago.

I hope you keep reaching out and learning all you can about alcoholism and codependence.When I learned to erect boundaries for my life instead of trying to set rules or ultimatums for him, that's when my life started to turn around.

Good Luck, Jeepgirl. It's a rocky road being married to an alcoholic. Wishing Peace and Strength for you as you navigate all this stuff...no matter which road you choose.

Hugs.

thank you. seriously, thanks. :-)

JG,
Acknowleding that you have a drinking problem and doing something about it are two different worlds. It is common on these boards for an alcoholic, who is under "pressure" from a spouse, to "admit" that they might have a problem. Then the codies goes wow, he's an amazing man, so strong and sensitive accepting what "I" have known for a long time. But...... you know the story, nothing happens, no AA, no rehab, no out patient, just nothing.

Work on yourself. Educate yourself. Its God's plan not ours. Step back and let things fall as they may. Hugs!!

still dont know how to do that multi quote thing, but:
"He said he couldn't believe he admitted it to me and that he thinks he has a problem. He said he has been hiding it quite a while (duh, he's a TERRIBLE hider!). He said he is scared because he doesn't know why he does it and he doesn't think he can stop. He also said he knows the consequences way outweigh the benefits, but even knowing that he could lose everything with his drinking (he works in a field that doesn't tolerate criminal/drinking/DWI/any type of records of any type and would be terminated immediately and he is the breadwinner), he still can't stop. Not to mention that he could kill someone drinking and driving."

reads like he crossed the line into full blown alcoholism


"He's also worried that if he gets help he will run into people that won't keep it confidential and he could put his job at risk. He's even afraid our employer will look to see if he's gone to counseling and he will lose his job. Paranoia. I told him none of that will happen and we can even find somewhere in another town to get help or go to meetings. "

an excuse to not get help. ive met a surgeon, sheriff, prosecuting attorney, pharmacist, police officers, realtors,nurses, chemist....even a psychologist ...
in recovery programs.even in rehabs- i think theres been an article or 2 here and there on the web of famous/well off/professional people that went to rehab. no terminal uniqueness.alcoholism is an equal oppurtunity destroyer
i honestly dont thing there isnt a profession that isnt represented in them. and small town living would be a copout- i met the majority of those people in small town USA.
id rather people learn im getting help for an alcohol/addiction problem than
read about me inthe paper after having killed someone while drunk.
there are laws in place that protect a person that gets treatment for alcoholism/addiction.many employers have in their employee handbook something about the topic.
hopefully he gets more worried about losing his family than being recognized.


"That being said, I still don't believe him. I think it's the cycle starting all over again. "
reads like not the 1st time? it was quite common for me to be quite serious about not drinking.
until the heat was off.
even after i got sober, no one that was left around me believed i was serious. that trust/faith/belief had to be earned- earned with actions over T.I.M.E.
and not just a couple weeks or months.

rehab can be a great thing- IF the alcoholic/addict wants it for themselves and themsevles alone- no other motive.
which the alcoholic/addict can show how serious they are just in who makes the call.

please do whats right for you and the kids.

Jeepgirl....I'm in the medical profession (PA). It is one of those professions that has a zero toleration for anyone who gets a criminal record for anything....except for, maybe, a very minor traffic violation, like a speeding ticket, etc.
Same goes, if there is anything "suspicious" while on the job...like alcohol on the breath and any signs that something is amiss in that way.
Here is the thing...suppose something does come to their attention...there is a whole procedure and investigation and a hearing before a professional board...in short, what they can/usually do, if one is judged to have a substance abuse problem....is to suspend the medical license...order that one go to rehabilitation. and not be allowed to give any controlled substances...and report to someone in authority, about their compliance (lab tests, proof of therapy, etc). After about two years (I think)...if everything goes well, they can be given a provisional license....and, be on probation for a period of time.
All in all , it takes a long time...and it may be hard to get employment during that time, if not allowed to give certain medication (it all depends on circu mstances).

***In my profession, there is nothing that they can do if there is no criminal record...DWI, etc., and nothing comes to light in the workplace.
Going to treatment for anything is not punishable. Going to any kind of support program is not punishable.

I don't know what profession he is dealing with....but, I think that, if he really wants to preserve his work situation....that should be a big...really big reason for him to get sober, before anything worse than being recognized, happens. I can tell you, that he is fortunate, so far...because, in the workplace, it will be noticed, sooner or later...because alcoholism is progressive....

Even if he would feel better by going to another, distant community....that is really a small price to pay. I have known of people who did that.

I don't know if any of this is of help for you...but, I thought I would give it a shot.....

I know legally they can't do anything but people talk. and if they find out he has a problem he will not move up any more and they will do their darndest to make his life hard so he leaves. That's what he's stressed about. I know it's excuses, but I do get his concern in a way. I just don't care anymore. I will live in a cracker box and move across the country if that means I can get my family back.

Hi Jeepgirl,

Very similar situation. See my recent blog "Fear of unlocking the door".

The most important thing is to focus on you not him. Al anon may be helpful, SR is really helpful and professional counselling can help.

You are right to have the welfare and happiness of the kids at top of mind. I like the saying (airline analogy) "Put on your oxygen mask first" before helping others.

Don't punish yourself about what you could have done - the past is the past. It is the life you want in the future. At this point it may be better to think day at a time.

Take care

Speaking as the alcoholic, unless he gets help and WANTS to, you are better off without him. Losing my marriage was my biggest initial motivator, and then I realized all the other benefits of laying off the booze. Ask yourself if you'd want your kids to have partners like their father.....

Thanks. You're right. All of these things are on my mind. He said he doesn't want to lose us and will get help and is willing to change for us. I'm just not sure how much I believe. I'm also not sure how much time I should give him. I told him this time that he has to take the initiative. A couple years ago I printed out lists of AA meetimgs as well as substance abuse counselors on our insurance and he never did anything with it. His turn. He has to care enough to take care of it.

I'm not sure how much time I give him though. He will be fine not drinking for a couple of weeks but then what? Sadly, I already find myself looking for houses for my children and me and budgeting as a single mom. How long do I wait??? He seems more receptive than ever right now and has actually seemed to listen more to me and take me seriously for once so I feel like I need to give him time to heal/get treatment. I told him this is the last time we run this cycle again.

perhaps now is the time to give some serious thought, consideration and research into what "getting out" would entail. you'll need a plan. and there are lots of things to navigate. a visit to a divorce attorney would help you understand the legal issues and which steps to take, which obstacles to avoid.

you are not describing a person who is serious about changing or quitting. a single "honest" declaration of drinking is not a sign. statements of knowing he needs to do something is not a plan of action.

nothing about this is fun or easy. but then life is like that.

there are folks in texas who had homes yesterday, and today were plucked from that home by helicopter and are now in some shelter. they now have a whole new set of obstacles to overcome.

use the resources you have at your avail. don't look to him to FIX this....

Jeepgirl.....Once the alcoholic puts down the bottle AND begins working a strong program of recovery....it takes about one year for them to "level out"...but, most people who have worked closely with alcoholic , as well as long recovering alcoholics say that it takes tow or three years to really see the kinds of internal changes that recovery brings....like, changes in thinking; changes in attitude; and changes in behaviors.....
Those first 1-2-3yrs, is commonly referred to as :early recovery period". And, even with vigorous work, it can still be prone to relapse....

I think the question to ask yourself is this...Is he even working a program, and...how much time do you have to invest?

I think that the smartest and best thing that you can do for all involved is, to continue with your plan for your own future. That is the only thing you can really count on....
sometimes, the best thing a person can do for the alcoholic is to just get out of the alcoholic's way....that gives them the opportunity to face t hemselves.....

I am going to give you this link to an article from our Classic Reading collection..It is a pretty good yardstick.....

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...-reposted.html

Dandy,

Thanks. You didn't link the article! :-)

Jeepgirl......lol....I think the link is there, now. It takes a couple of minutes to post the links...because, one has to get out of the thread, and then, go back to it again....

Do you see it now??