GFORCE'S totally NEW, Totally AWESOME thread! ;)
 

Hey there Y'all,

O.k, I hope that some of you who were clamoring for me to start a new thread jump over here, and it's not just me twiddling my thumbs listening to crickets.

So, here I am am at almost 3 months sober.

I haven't been going to my meetings lately, because I have had my kid 24/7 over spring break, and my husband's now working away from home--and I'm wondering if that's contributing to some of the inner sobriety conflict I've been going through lately.

<<However, I just realized while typing this, that I do have the car this time around so maybe I could and should hit up a couple a' noon meetings.>>

Anyway, I'm experiencing a bit of what Robby Robot has called "Addiction Ambivalence." As in, I'm really fighting the part of my brain that wonders what I am doing this (not drinking) for, exactly. (Obvious reasons, not withstanding.)

Other than that, I have nothing exiting to report. I am watching the Jon Stewart/Stephen Colbert hour, and starting this thread about... nothing. It's like Seinfeld.

So, I'm pretty whooped after a big work out yesterday at the gym, and a few trail rides on my new MTB rig.

Nighty night. I hope no one was expecting a more exiting thread, based on the title. ;)

Cheers.

Ha ha ha!

I would love to get to the place where sobriety is just a given.
Where it's just like breathing.
It's taken for granted.
I'm still working at it though. Even though I just passed my first month mark. Yay!
I've got some songs to finish up and I really haven't picked up the guitar since I stopped drinking. Just got in the habit of drinking and playing and now that's a habit that I'm going to smash though. I want my playing to come from me - nothing else.

Seems to me like Addiction Ambivalence could be a plateau. A step on a ladder. A foundation to build on… sorry out of metaphors.

Sleepy time for me.

Pg. 324 Rational Recovery:The New Cure For Substance Addiction:
It's that experience of "being of two minds" and it can be maddening. Anyone who has ever been addicted is familiar with that ambivalence, to some degree.

Okay I have listened to that cricket one before going to sleep. Those nature sounds work!!

If I don't go to meetings I also get the weird thinking. I try to go 3 times a week if possible. Also the chat room meetings here rock!

THAT IS TOTALLY FR*&^%ING AWESOME Clearlight!!!! Way to go!

Woop WOOP!

:c029:

:You_Rock_

Seriously, congrats on one month :)

Now, I really, really, really am, going to bed.

Cheers!

Yeah - I find that I have to be involved in my sobriety everyday. That might mean coming to this site and posting or something that I physically do to keep it real in my life.

Maybe that's like working out - it has to became part of the daily routine.

Me too! I can't just stop drinking and not do anything. It just doesn't work for me. It took me 47 years to get screwed up, it will probably take that long to get my mind right again!

My dad quit drinking and he went to AA 3 times a week for 10 years before he passed away.

I come here everyday too! It keeps me sane.

MORNIN'!

I've been up since probably, 5:00 am! Yay, I love starting my day out tired. Yep, that was irony.

So, yeah, I hear everybody about staying connected with your sobriety and why your doing it. I may not have sponsor, and I don't really call people, but the meetings do really help me stay anchored in what I'm doing and why I'm doing it. Also, since I haven't been socializing much in any other way, I don't feel quite as isolated when I go to meetings, as it gets me out amongst people--and, as an added bonus, I don't have to explain myself to anyone there!

However, coming here has helped me at least as much, if not more. I've come here almost daily for three months--actually probably longer, as I was coming here while I was getting ready to make the leap. However, I think I'm going to suck it up and phone a few people this morning, just so their not worried about me (if indeed, they actually are...) and I think I'll go to a meeting today while my son's in school. I got caught up on most of my household chores yesterday, so I don't have anything to pressing I feel like I need to be doing here at the house... besides the fridge needing a clean-out and the recycling mess in the basement--but my kid likes to help with that, so we'll take care of it after school. He's trying to make more change for Lego, so I told him I'd give him a few loonies to help out. :)

Other than that, I also have some old friends who are very dear to me, who have been sober for 6 and a half, and 4 and a half years, respectively, who continue to really have my back and are there for me to talk to about what I'm going through whenever they have time. So, I may not have an official "sponsor" but I do have some "sober elder's" so to speak who have a lot credibility with me, because they are my good friends, and I've known them both long before they quit drinking. It actually helps me to think, well, if not one but TWO of the ladies I love and respect most in the world have done this and are doing it, then I can get over these hurdles and do it as well.

Anyway, SR chat rooms, you say? I've never been over there... maybe I'll check it out here at some point. I definitely feel the need to be doing more about what my mental processes have been, so I am open to anything.

Hey there Soberlicious, Yeah, it is maddening. I was just telling my aforementioned girlfriends that I wish I could just lobotomize the drinking part of my brain. However, it does help for me to think of it as a "wiring issue." Thinking about it as a biological/psychological brain wiring issue depersonalized it so that I don't start berating myself for there being something "wrong" with me. I find it helps to think of it like a medical problem--even though I don't really buy that alcoholics or alcohol abuser's have an "allergy" to alcohol, it is helpful to put it in that context whether it's technically true or not.

Anyway, gotta run folks--got to get out of this warm but frumpy housecoat, and into something more respectable to get my kid to school!

I'm really glad to see you all here. :)

I'm glad you have supportive friends. I only keep people around me who support me.

I haven't found a sponsor yet either. The meetings I go to don't have a lot of women in them and most of them are just starting out!

Hope you have a great day today!

Clearlight..That crickets and Neil Sedaka thing was hilarious :c031:

Yeah, Clearlight's talented with the hilarious and finding extremely random but appropriate song choices!

So,

About that social anxiety! Now, I've been looking forward to and preparing for, this whole ladies Wed. night group ride, since last year. It started up last week, but I had just gotten home from the Island, and I had just gotten my bike, so I didn't go. So, it's happening again tonight, and my son's grandmother is coming over to hang out with him, and I've got the jitters, and I keep finding myself coming up with "reasons" not to go!

What the heck! I have something in common with these ladies, and I'm trying to weasel out of it! For a while I wasn't even consciously aware that I was trying to weasel out, it's just that I had these really good reasons why I might not be able to make it, such as: I'm waiting for a new water bladder for my pack, as the one I have leaks all over me. So...you see--oh that, and my old red helmet does not "go" with my new bike...aha. So, I thought I'd wait till' next week when I get all my new gear. Right. Check. Do you see how crazy this is?

Anyway, I'll check back later!

Cheers guys, and thanks for popping over to my totally awesome, totally new thread!

Anyway.

The more sober I get the more crazy I get.

:bounce

G...you are absolutely right. Since you can't lobotomize (and that would cut out some other good necessary stuff anyway) you've figured out that you CAN separate from the part that wants to drink and make it "not you". This is very effective for the purpose of quitting. It's easy to recognize that side that's bugging you to drink, and just say "STFU..you're ideas are always dumb...NO" and go on about your day doing cool sh*t like mountain biking and playin guitar and being a mom and making new friends on the trail.....

Yeah Soberlicious,

That's what I keep doing. Fortunately, the day I decided to quit I was in X-TRA strength bad shape, so it's still pretty easy for me to drum up that memory when I need something to counter act all the other "but it would be so great" malarkey.

Speaking of guitar Clearlight: I noticed you said that you haven't played yours in a while--me neither. :( My callouses are gone, and stuff I worked so hard to nail, is eluding me again. I hate it when I put the thing down for a while. I was really prioritized playing for a couple of years, and now that I'm mountain biking and all the rest, my playing and my sewing/clothes making has fallen by the wayside. HOWEVER, I am going to pick up my Takemine today, and see if I can't learn to bang out Bob Marely's "Waiting in Vain," because it's a beautiful song, and since I heard it the other day, I can't stop walkin' around singing it! So, one of these days, I may start a new thread, called "Cafe ala Gforce," and post video's of me performing songs. I thought that would be fun, because I can't actually see any of you to wonder if you are thinking that I suck.

Anyway, I'm spring cleaning the house today, and thinking through my next chapter in not drinking. I was glad that I coincidentally talked to my old friend who is sober 4 and 1/2 years, and started my new thread today. Thanks for the sober safety net, everyone!

Cheers!

Hey Gforce, I'm rapt you've started this totally awesome new thread, m'dear!

Personally, I reckon your wonderfully droll sense of humour will keep you going - it certainly keeps me laughing, which is in very short supply in my current daily life.

So thank you!

And yeh, where DOES Clearlight FIND all these totally apt-for-the-moment youtube videos? Ya don't happen to have shares or something in YouTube do ya, Clear? :-)

bemyself- hey people aspire to greatness in different ways. Some transplant hearts, some seek the true nature of the universe - I find groovy videos on you tube. :Meditate:

Maybe that's like building a new self identity where you just don't envision yourself as a drinker. I know when I was living the bartender life I saw myself as a professional drinker.

Yey, Clear - well put: while I'm seeking the true nature of the universe, you just keep it up finding us the grooves on YouTube!!!

'God only knows where [we'd] be without you-uuuu....' (was also used on some fab fillum a while back....'Love Actually?')

heheh, bet you'll find that one too. Bless ya!

Anyway, carry on Gforce :-)

Hi all

And hey BeMyself! Nice to see you over here :)

So, everyone, I went on my first ladies night mountain bike ride. I was really nervous. I asked the British woman who was organizing the groups (beginner, intermediate, advanced) what group she thought I should go with, and she rattled off a bunch of questions in rapid succession with the efficiency of a military drill Sargeant:

"How long have you been riding?" "NO, how long this year." "ON these trails?" "No, where?" Arizona, Washington, all over, I tell her. "Right. What style, Cross Country? Are you in good shape?" Pretty good, I say. "Right, go with the intermediate group, they are leaving right now." "Sir yes SIR!" I said, and with a stiff two finger salute, I clicked my heels and took off on my bike with the intermediate group. (O.k, so, I did that last part in my mind.)

In any case, I kept up pretty well with the intermediate ladies. I struggled a lot on some of the technical bits, but considering I just started riding again last summer after 5 years off, with not much technical riding over the last stretch--and, oh yeah and I'm on a new bike. Given all that, I still did pretty darn good. But Lordy, those other ladies are some Mucho Macha Mujers!

So here's where this becomes relevant to my sobriety journey: The ladies group meets at the local pub here for some post-ride grub and beer, and I decided to go. This is the first time I've been to the pub since I quit drinking, and I was pretty worried. But I went, and the leader of my group who was sitting next to me ordered a ginger ale, so I did the same. It was definitely weird being in the bar. It was packed, and it was also the last bar I drank in! But I did all right. I felt extremely awkward around all those women I didn't know. But, a few on the group were really interested in me, (as a person, I think, though you never know...!) and asked me a lot of questions, and where also really encouraging. So, that felt nice. And, I made it through my first social outing at a bar, and didn't drink. I just kept telling myself, "I am a non-drinker... no biggie."

However, I did feel nervous, and I'm definitely seeing how I've used alcohol to deal with my anxiety around people.

You know, I just don't know what happened to me. I used to live in a place where it seemed like I knew everyone. I had tonnes of friends, and I was the music editor and writer for a smallish local indy newspaper, and I also did a few freelance articles for the local paper as well. I had friends at every bar, and ala Hunter S. Thompsan, I hung out at the crappiest ones in the afternoons, where I occasionally got some good news scoops. Everyone knew me. I had friends on every street corner, and when I walked around, there was always someone calling my name from across the street, or a passing car.

And now, what. I'm some lonely lady who's terrified of talking to people I don't know. What the hell happened to me?!

I've been doing a lot of internet research on Social Anxiety and Alcohol use disorders, and I'm coming up with some interesting information. However, I'm going to save that for tomorrow, because this post is A: already way to long, and B: I'm EXHAUSTED.

So, I'm working on a theme for the morning.

Cheers sober strivers!

GFORCE, Congratulations! This thread is not only new, but it is totally awesome as well!

It's a great way to head into spring and towards a fantastic summer!

:You_Rock_

Nighty night possum - but when you read this in (your) morning:

You have no idea how much those last few paragraphs resonated with me. The ones about having been [fill in the different blanks] into all manner of different things about town - I quite liked the Hunter S reference :-) - and so forth. And now, social anxiety. Ech?

A while ago either here on SR or in my own (rather poorly tended) journals, I remarked something similar. AKA 'maybe I've always been a bit of an introvert, more or less?'. And ergo: '....maybe my years of drugs / boozing fooled me into believing, even feeling, that I wasn't...or something?'

This topic, in itself, seems to preoccupy heaps of us, I've noticed. Not all, but a lot. Hummm. Yes, I've done quite a bit of research on this stuff too. And that's OK too, i.e. to wonder about how we change as the years go by.

That's good to do, and frankly, kinda healthy, regardless of our addict or otherwise 'conditions'. There are many other factors in play too in our kinds of society which make the imperative to / how to socialise really quite a drag imho.

Just my thoughts, blossom.

See you sometime in your tomorrow (or is that my tomorrow?). Anyway, see ya soon.

You're growing. You know how Hunter Thompson ended up - right?

It's going to take time to get the hang of a new way of doing things. When you were a little baby pooping in your diapers you didn't suddenly spring up and start strolling around the house. You tried to stand up and you fell down on your padded butt. You did that over and over and over again.

I think it's great you went with the gals on the ride. You had a good time at the bar and surprise(!) didn't drink. So, our little Gforce is growing up! So cute. Ha!

Good morning everyone, I personally am not having a good morning, as I couldn't sleep until 11:00 pm after a demanding ride, and then I woke up at 5:00am and couldn't get back to sleep. I woke up at 5:00am yesterday as well. Have you ever been so tired you just want to cry?

Clearlight Yes I do know how Hunter S. Thompson died: With gun in his mouth, just like Papa Hemingway,who's carefully crafted prose--understated metaphor's, and carefully chosen active verbs that cut like a knife-- makes him, in my opinion, one of the Grand Hero's of the written word.

However, those guy's had a thing or two in common, and I'd say they shared certain machismo and ego about them that didn't allow for much weakness, and I'm sure in their minds, there was nothing weaker than getting old.

While I am not thrilled with the idea of aging myself, I doubt that I'd choose to go out in the same way. I'm just to much of a chicken. Or maybe I'm just a woman. Men seem more prone to the trap of needing to live up to some impossible standard of manliness. Some more than others, I'm sure.

So, on the subject of Social Anxiety and Alcohol "Use" Disorders: (AUD's for short--just what I need, another acronym in my life.) it's interesting, because there have no thorough formal studies connecting the two, which I found extremely strange considering how many alcohol users, abusers, and alcoholics freely state that they use it to either "relax" socially or deal with social anxiety. The fact that those in the position to look into these things, quite simply haven't, is a real stumper, if you ask me.

In fact, researchers dismissed the idea that people used alcohol in this way, because despite the reams of anecdotal evidence, there is no scientific evidence supporting the theory that alcohol actually decreases anxiety! Besides the fact that you could have knocked me over with a feather when I read that, it appears that whatever benefit anxiety sufferer's believe they are getting from alcohol, apparently it is only a perceived benefit, and not an actual one! In that case, there seems to be a lot of very misguided alcohol users out there, sucking down their drinks in hopes that it will stop their heart from racing and their hands from shaking like an airplane hitting a rough patch of turbulence. (Actually, my hands shake like that whenever I'm actually on a plane, whether it is hitting a rough patch of turbulence, or flying smoothly through the air.)

So, I am to darn blasted tired to name my source or pull up the link to the research article, but when I'm not, I'll pull it up and put it in another post.

Anyway, that is my report this morning. This tired puppy is going to lay down. I was going to do recycling and go then go to the gym, but at the moment, that feels about as impossible to me as it would to flap my arms and fly.

Cheers!

Not only that, continued overuse of alcohol actually increases anxiety in most people.

You bet. That was certainly the case for me. The day after a strong drunk people could walk all over me. A combo of shame and physically dragging through the day. Or waking up and knowing you can't function at a decent level because you're so dragged out.

I'm a lot stronger in my head now that I've got some sober inside of me. And that let's me be even more "out there" than when I was drinking. My sober creative work is waaaay more crazy than work done while in the drinking lifestyle. Good crazy - not crazy crazy.

Which leads to a video I rediscovered recently! It's one of my favorite Frank Zappa songs. I'm not a big Zappa fan but this song, and the album it's on, really shine. The band for this album is stellar.

The song is called Inca Roads. It refers to the Nazca Lines - a series of ancient geoglyphs located in the Nazca Desert in southern Peru. Back when this was recorded there was rampant belief these were symbols made for, or by, aliens to use the mesas as a landing area. Zappa pokes fun at that idea in the song.

The music is really evocative. At one point 6:30' I swear it just sounds like you're in a spaceship flying around the Andes.



Did a vehicle Come from somewhere out there
Just to land in the Andes?
Was it round And did it have A motor
Or was it Something Different
Did a vehicle Did a vehicle Did a vehicle
Fly along the mountains And find a place to park itself
Or did someone Build a place To leave a space For such a vehicle to land
Did a vehicle Come from somewhere out there
Did a vehicle Come from somewhere out there
Did the indians, first on the bill Carve up the hill
Did a booger-bear Come from somewhere out there Just to land in the Andes?
Was she round And did she have a motor
Or was she something different
Guacamole Queen Guacamole Queen Guacamole Queen
At the Armadillo in Austin Texas, her aura,
Or did someone build a place Or leave a space for Chester's Thing to land
(Chester's Thing... on Ruth)
Did a booger-beer Come from somewhere out there
Did a booger-bear Come from somewhere out there
Did the Indians, first on the bill Carve up her hill
On Ruth On Ruth That's Ruth

Mornin."

While I'm not a fan of all of Frank's music, I'm a big fan of Frank Zappa the man. You've got to love his prodigious wit and wildly irreverent sense of humor.

However, I must say that alcohol did exactly what I was expecting it to at the time I was using it. It may be purely anecdotal evidence, but in social situations, it certainly seemed to calm my nerves and lube up my social skills. Now then, I'll freely admit that it often seems that I was merely kicking the anxiety can down the road, but it definitely seemed to do the job I was asking it to, while I was using it.

Now then, what baffles me, is that there has been hardly any research about people with Alcoholism or Alcohol Use Disorders who have a co-morbidity with anxiety and especially social anxiety. It's kind of forehead slapplingly obvious that people would and do use it that way-- whether they get they actual benefit or perceived one, does not, in my opinion, invalidate that they are indeed self-medicating with it. Also, in the discussion of the study, the author stated that traditional treatment of alcoholism or Alcohol Use Disorders is not always the best mode of treatment for those with social anxiety disorders, as it often requires being in large groups where you often encouraged to speak about yourself. Also, if the anxiety does get treated, the "relapse" rate of anxiety sufferer's is higher, because they are self-medicating.

I find personally, that since I've quit drinking, my "generalized" anxiety seems to have quieted down, but my Social Anxiety has gotten worse, not better.

Alcohol seemed to put a muzzle on the little evil leprechaun that sits on my shoulder and critiques not only everything I say and do, but also seems to give an unwanted play by play and detailed analysis of people's reactions. After a few beers, that little leprechaun b*st*rd shuts his big trap.

Now, I did mention kicking the can down the road, because precisely what would happen. While I may not have worried as much about what people thought at the time I was drinking, if I woke up after a night of heavy social imbibing, I woke up with extreme anxiety about the way I might have been perceived the night before. BUT--it did do it's job AT THE TIME.

So, the reason I'm avoiding socializing and social drinking situations, is not just because I've quit drinking, it's that with out drinking, I feel so uncomfortable, that I'm really only "getting through" the situation, I'm not really enjoying it. Socializing feels like torture to me. I actually get "performance" anxiety talking to people. I will be talking to someone, and often in the middle of a sentence, I will be struck with anxiety, and my mind will go completely blank. You have no idea how many times this happens to me. I'm talking to someone, my mind goes blank, and suddenly there is just a canyon of awkward silence. I'll try to recover, but it just sounds lame.

I'm also slightly neurotic. I often ruminate out loud with out even realizing it. I process my anxieties "should I/shouldn't I's) out loud, with out even being aware that I'm doing it. I think it turns people off. I just feel like a freak.

The guy's at the bike shop don't even want to give me the time of day, because I have so much anxiety about spending money, that they'll try to give me a deal something I'm looking at, and I'll tell them to hold it for me or that I'll come back for it, but I never do.

I worry out loud around people a lot, and I think it's probably annoying. But what's funny, is I am not actually THAT different of a person than the person I was 8 years ago with all those friends and all that popularity. I just don't know what happened. I still believe some of it is the "BC" culture. People are pretty reserved here, and they just have more "cool" way of interacting here in BC It's not as open as it was in the States, at least not where I'm from.

I'm not by any means calling Canadians jerks. They are not jerks, so don't anyone get offended, I'm just saying, that I think there is a subtle difference in the social culture here that often makes me feel like I'm left hanging out to dry.

My husband is always telling me, "just be yourself." Well, who is myself? I'm not sure who that is. I'm so many selves. The self I thought I was, seems like an illusion now.

You know, even on the ladies ride, though I ended up having a good time, when I went over there, I stood around on the edge of crowd of ladies, all of whom were talking to each other, but none of them even seemed to notice me standing there with my bike. I'm hard to miss in all black bike gear and my black and orange bike. I stood there and fiddled with my gear aimlessly for about 10 minutes, and then I decided to ask a woman a question about the ride. It was all I could think of to try and break the ice. But the ride started out awkwardly, because all the other 5 ladies knew each other, and there no introductions in the beginning of the ride.

I went to the pub afterwards, despite how uncomfortable I felt not knowing anyone, and though, I didn't have a bad time, I didn't want to stay long, because I wasn't really enjoying it, either.

I guess I'm in feelin' sorry for myself mode.

Well, I'm really tired, I've been going through a bout of severe insomnia. So this could be contributing to my current negative outlook. I haven't slept well in 4 days, and I have to get ready for my trip. I'm really, really tired, and my poor kid has been on the receiving end (you know, why the little ditty about "I" before "E" when there are so many bloody exceptions...) of my extremely low patience due to lack of sleep.

Anyway,

That's my report--I apologize if my report isn't very cohesive. I'm exhausted and I have a lot on my mind.

Cheers

Yes, this is true, but for me it eventully stopped consistently doing that too. I could be unexpectedly nasty, or weepy, or suddenly naked...toward the end it was anybody's guess. The drink doesn't turn on everyone, but it did me.

You haven't lost your "cool" just because you quit drinking. You may have misplaced your "cool" for a minute, and when you find it again, it may look different than you remember it. You've done harder things than this before. I think you are a survivor. You will figure this all out.

Thanks Soberlicious.

You know, when I talked in my second to last post about the kind of person I was about town, it wasn't so much about being "cool," as it was that I was totally comfortable in that town. I felt really comfortable, and I had great friends and had a lot of acceptance for me and my whatever my foibles are.

I traded that for a dream. Despite all my "coolness," and short term casual relationships in between longer term ones, I've always held a big secret. I just wanted happily ever with someone. I wanted a big fairy tale about girl meets boy, falls in love, has nice wedding, and then has kids, and lives the rest of their days a family. It was big secret, because, I guess part of me didn't really think I deserved it, and I didn't really live my life in a way that would attract that. That desire lived deep down inside of me where no could see it and make fun of me or reject me over it.

So, I got what I thought I wanted. I got a man to marry me, but it turns out, he never really wanted to be married in the first place. I left my wonderful REAL community and all my friends who loved me, warts and all, for something that might not even have been real.

I cannot tell you how many times in the first 2-3 years of living with my husband and going through what I was with him, that I cried myself to sleep with homesickness for my little town in Washington and all the people in it that I loved so dearly.

I've really been pretty alone since then, and I feel like I lost my Mojo, long before I quit drinking. I just wish, that my sense of self worth did not depend so much on feeling like I fit in and have friends.

On the other hand, my little heart just pines for people that I don't have to explain myself to. I had that once, in another lifetime.

I don't care about being "cool" anymore. I'd be happy to just have a few good friends.

I keep trying to connect with some of the other mother's in my kids class, and it's been so difficult. There is a couple that are major movers and shakers in the mountain bike community here, and their little girl goes to my boy's kindergarten. While the husband is nice and talks to me, no matter how hard I try, I cannot get any reciprocity from the wife. Their little girls love my son. They once invited him/us to to the playground (in front of their mom) after school, and she said, "Well, any one can come who wants to." Not, "Oh yeah, that would be great." Uh,wow, yeah great, I feel so personally invited. I went anyway because my son was so exited. I talked with the girls mom at the playground that day, but if I see her in the street, she'll barely give me eye contact, let alone wave at me.

I get this every so often. It's disheartening.

Sorry, I guess I'm feeling really down right now. 4 days of insomnia will do that to a person.

Cheers.