We CAN be social drinkers?
 

I know we don't need any more negativity, but this worries me, so thought I'd get your views. I just read about a book called "Phoenix in a Bottle", written by an alcoholic couple, Lillian & Murdoch MacDonald. (They have challeneged AA to a debate on this subject.) They maintain that Alcoholism is not a progressive or incurable disease, but a response to a dysfunctional childhood. We are not addicted to alcohol, but to the escape we find when drinking. If we get to the underlying problem of why we need that escape, we'll be cured of our drinking problems! The reason I'm concerned is, they are trying to convince us that once we find out what's causing us to self-medicate, we can then go on to be social drinkers - as they have done. I know we've said many times on here, whatever works for you is what matters, but how much damage will this "revelation" do?

uh uh. No way no how.

Might sell books but it makes my blood boil. It would kill many of us here if we followed that.
I have a certain sympathy with the dysfunctional childhood thing, and I certainly used alcohol to escape...but there are coping strategies that *won't* destroy your life and slowly kill you.

I don't want to drink alcohol any more. I don't know why anyone would, looking at the damage it does to ourselves our lives and our loved ones.

D

Hi Joanie,

Reminds me of the lady who founded Moderation Management or whatever it was - and she ended up killing someone while driving under the influence - and finally admitted that there is no moderating for an alcoholic.
I'm doing a lot of family of origin work - and I have no illusions about my alcoholism. My childhood may have been somewhat traumatic, but it was that, coupled with the disease of alcoholism, genetic factors, that made me an alcoholic.
There are many who had traumatic childhoods and didn't grow up to become addicted.
I suspect the authors are trying to make some money - and I'm sure they are speaking their truth - it worked for them. I would suggest, though, that they aren't alcoholics of my type. Maybe it will work for others - who knows.
It wouldn't work for me though.

Hi...I haven't become an alcoholic because i stopped before it became my main addiction..or for some other reason...

but to me there are destructive paths i know i can never go back to..no matter what..once you see the real dark, you can never, ever go back there...

that's my opinion...for now...

I know for me I will NEVER be a social drinker. For some, however returning to social drinking may be an option. Everyone is entitled to their point of view, hopefully no one will get hurt in the process.

It just made me angry the way they attacked AA as being too religious (half of the 12 steps mention "God" according to them), and too out-dated. As we said when we were recently discussing Rational Recovery, why is there a need to bash another program? For me, yes - I had overprotective parents who inadvertently kept me from growing up in a healthy way, but I don't see how that could be an excuse for me to go on and nearly destroy myself decades later. I also know many with terrible backgrounds who never touch it. Sadly, I have a friend who is all excited about this book and sees it as a way around facing the inevitable. Meanwhile, what a great excuse for him to keep on drinking. Also, how many of us are in a position to be psychoanalyzed in order to dig for the root of our problems? I sure never was.

Leave it to someone that wouldn't mind being a "Social Drinker" I see absolutley no point in drinking 2-3 drinks a week.
Why bother drinking at all?

That is exactly the reason I know I am an alcoholic! Kinda funny that most of us can't even understand the concept of 2 or 3 a week.

I know I can't be a social drinker...

Well, maybe I can for about 10 minutes and then I lose the ability to control it and end up drinking for weeks, so for me it's a no-no... :(

The horrible part for me just now is that there is still a voice that sometimes tells me it's ok to drink, and it can be very hard to convince myself it's not ok anymore...

All it takes is one sip for me....I know the voice of which you speak...it's lying!!! You know it and I know it! When the voice talks I know it is easier to ignore it than to give in and wake up the dragon.

The only think that seperates me from i social drinker is
I don't drink anymore.

It's wierd i know..but the only time i ever say I'm alcoholic
to anyone is in an AA meeting.lol
Becuase it's like a tradition..i guess we're penguins.lol

I don't belive you have to intruduce yourself as an alcoholic
in a meeting...but you know how that gose :rof
I just say my name sometimes...people look at me cross eyes.lol

I was told once "we don't drink for the taste we drink for the buzz, or the bars would be empty"... wisdom of my alcoholic father.
Social drinking is still escapism to me. To alter ones state is to escape from reality. I know I can't stop drinking once I start and that I am addicted to it.

I haven't read the book and I most likely won't read it.

Having said that I would be interested to know what their view on other programs of recovery are. AA is not the only program that holds abstinence as the ultimate goal of recovery. So does this couple also hold that WFS, AVRT, ect....are also a bunch of lies? Also, their theory on childhood trauma seems a bit off to me since I grew up in a very loving environment. It seems like a huge claim they make . . . I would be interested in hearing how they came to this conclusion.

whatever program works for you is the one...

Control my drinking is possible if I am perpetually drunk and can do all my socialising work and general living from a horizontal position, totally mad.

Strangely enough, I prefer the life I have.

Focus on what keeps you sober and let the rest go.

Kevin

I've tried the "social drinker" thing, it doesn't work for me. It may work for some alcholics, but I would assume they are small in numbers, and may not have had big time drinking problems to begin with.

And I wonder how long they've been on their "program" of social drinking? I know at times I was able to control myself for a period, but it always led back to a living hell, binging and blackouts. Wouldn't be surprised if one or both of them crash and burn at some point down the road.

I find that part about having dysfunctional childhood interesting. Personally I had a very dysfunctional childhood - I have few memories of being with my parents as a child as I was practally raised by my baby-sitter. Although I got good results in school (without even trying too hard. I don't remember ever doing any homework at all) I was serverly dysfunctional at school too, I was a loner, never making signifcant connections with the other kids.

However I know that personally I can't be a social drinkiner. I tried every night to "just have 3 or 5" drinks, but i'd always end up going home on my hands and knees.

I, too, would question the length of their experiment in social drinking and I would also question the definition of alcoholism. Heavy drinkers may or may not be alcoholic, may or may not be able to learn to moderate. We know who we are.

The fact that they're proposing this as a solution for alcoholics assumes (according to the above description) that all alcoholics had unhappy childhoods. Sure, I had what would be considered by most an extremely traumatic childhood, but I know that's not the reason I'm alcoholic. It may have brought my alcoholism to the forefront a little sooner, but it's not the reason. I also know lots of alcoholics who describe their childhoods as ideal. My husband is one. No one beat him, deprived him, oppressed him, pushed him to achieve. His life was normal in every way until he began to drink.

What drives people to propose solutions such as this? My best guess: financial gain and extreme ego. I know my method of recovery works for me, but I wouldn't dream of suggesting it's the only way for everyone. Just like the James Frey book of a few years ago, lies and glittering generalizations kill people. I hope that they can afford a very comfortable bed from the proceeds of their book so that they can sleep at night.

Peace & Love,
Sugah