Dealing with the lies - for me...
 

OK, so I’m definitely staying in my relationship with ABF (pending the unexpected) and am obviously therefore choosing to tolerate the lying. Now, I don’t really mean tolerate as such, but I know he does lie and I am still choosing to be in the relationship. So, I was wondering how best to deal with that, and whether anyone else is/has been in the same situation? I know he lies, and he knows I know that he lies (!), but he probably thinks he ‘gets away with’ more than he actually does. He lies about drinking obviously, and connected to that, he’ll lie about where he is, what he is doing and who he is with. He sees most of his lies as harmless and tells them to me to protect me, to stop me worrying and to make me proud of him (by saying he’s done certain things etc). I’ve explained that I hate lies and it doesn’t make me do any of the above – it just makes me feel worthless and destroys the trust I have left in him. He still does it, so for now, I’m choosing this situation.

I’m not happy about the lies and I know that however I handle things probably won’t change his behaviour, but for my own peace of mind and sanity, I don’t know the best way to deal with the lying. Any opinions would be welcomed. I can either:

- pretend I believe him for an easy life and carry on with the charade until he possibly tells me the truth one day
- pretend I believe him for a while (he’s usually drinking when tells the lie) but then reveal that I know he was lying once he’s sobered up (I usually do this, but it causes arguments because he gets angry at me for pretending that everything was OK, then saying it isn’t – because basically he thought he’d got away with it I think)
- tell him straight away that I know he is lying (and deal with the anger and rudeness this causes immediately). There is always the possibility that I might have got it wrong and he was telling the truth about something. This also leads to an argument because he thinks I’m always expecting the worst (well, duh)
- asking him after the event whether he was telling the truth or not (could get another lie in return so doesn’t achieve anything)
- try to get him to admit to his lie by being subtle and saying that it is OK but there really is no need to lie about things etc etc (the softly, nicely approach)

I expect you are all thinking I’m trying to control him and stop him lying by my response but I’ve already worked out that no matter what approach I take, he still lies to me (and the lies are getting bigger). This is purely for me. I need to work out the best way for me, so that it avoids too much confrontation but maintains my own sanity, so I know I’m not going mad and living in his fantasy world. Also, to add that he hasn’t cheated on me or lied about meeting women or anything, and I don’t think he would (but all this lying does make me doubt that a little – if he can lie about a family member being in hospital for no reason, then I’m sure he could lie about meeting another woman, but right now I don’t think he would. Hope I’m not being naive).

Thanks to anyone who can help. I am working on developing a boundary for accepting lying but I can’t enforce it until I know I could go through with the consequence. It is a work in progress. Any ideas are grateful on that too though!

Lying is unacceptable. How can you trust someone that lies to you? Without trust, there is no relationship. And lying is intolerable.

I would re-think this boundary as more of a dealbreaker. Why should you have to accept he is a liar? Why do you think you need to make this a boundary? Are you just accepting it because it's easier than confronting him and make this an unacceptable trait for YOU in a partner? Just sayin.....

because lying is part of alcoholism and I'm choosing to be in a relationship with an alcoholic. therefore, i have to deal with the lying somehow.
i know lying should be unacceptable and it has been for me in the past, but this relationship is different because alcoholics are different to normal partners i guess. i can't see that many people are in relationships with alcoholics that don't lie.

Do you think that maybe you're giving the alcohol too much credit here? A liar is a liar, drunk or sober... Have you read Under the Influence? It helped me learn about alcoholism, what XAH was into and how the disease progresses. Very enlightening.

If you choose to be in the relationship and be lied to, I guess I would choose option A.

No confrontation, no fighting. Just say "uh-huh" every time he speaks and decide that he is not credible and you don't believe him.

Why spend all your time fighting? You already know that whatever you do, it won't change his behavior, so why not live in blissful ignorance and denial pretending everything is fine?

Asking him if he's lying, will not produce the truth and catching him will only cause him to be agitated. He will deny, deny deny

You're going to go to a place call "the crazies' trying to catch him or prove he's lying
Your madness and insanity will stop ONLY two ways, you leave or he goes into recovery.

It's a FULL TIME job keeping tabs on a pathalogical liar.

I was at my meeting on the weekend and there was a RA who talked about how much he lied to his wives (yes he had 3) and how he could not believe he lied so much
He lied about everything.
When he stopped lying is when he started to lose his AA buddies and two sponsors dumped him. He then woke up
If you're prepared to stay until a devine intervention, then you need to deatch, ignore, and try to find a way to go numb.

There is no other way to live with the sickness of lying

What is in this for you? What are you getting out of being in a relationship with an alcoholic and a liar? What is it that keeps you tied to him?

ahhhh the lying and deceipt ...... yes, you're right, they do go hand in hand with living with an addict. I don't think it'll do any good trying to have any sort of a real conversation when you're A's been drinking ... total waste of time and energy. The night before last I was having an afternoon doze and heard the zipper go on my bag and there was my drunk A with his hand in my purse, I asked him why he was going in my bag and he totally denied it even though I quite obviously saw him! He must've gone back in my bag during the night as money had gone when I checked on the way to work the next day. When he is sober I'm going to have one of those periodic conversations about unacceptable behaviour.

For me it's a gradual break down of the trust I think is so crucial in a relationship, I deal with it by detaching further and removing my trust further so I guess that's my boundary at the moment.

Roon x

By accepting lies, you are thereby declaring them acceptable. yes, i've had tons of experience with the A liar. it undermines the relationship and insults the person being lied to.

I wonder about these things too. What is so great about this guy that you would set aside the fact that he lies all the time? How can you trust someone who will lie even when telling the truth would be easier? How can you have a relationship with someone you can't trust? You aren't even married to the guy and don't even live with him. It just boggles my mind.

Mine too!

Personally, I think you are asking the wrong questions. Instead of asking how can I accept (insert unacceptable behavior here), you might want to ask why you think being with someone who behaves unacceptably is better than being without him.

L

i know it sounds crazy, but there are so many people on SR that are in a similar situation, and even if i was married or living with him i don't think that would change things. i am fed up with the lies, i do hate the way things are when he's drinking, but i choose to stay with him (at the moment) because i am not ready to leave yet.
Thanks for your opinions - i really will mull them all over, including most that tell me i'm crazy. I keep hoping he will sort himself out. Maybe that wont ever happen. Maybe it will. I think I'll know when I've had enough and have given him all the chances he is going to get. I know i'm not there yet.

but isn't everyone who is with an A and detaching, in some way 'accepting' the behaviour and finding a way to deal with it as best they can. i guess that is what i am asking for help with - how to deal with the lying as part of detachment from an A?

I have the same hopes as you IWC (on a good day!!!). But I know if this carries on without him wanting recovery or seeking help I'll have no option but to bail out. Very scarey and I don't think I'm eady yet either (I've lived with him for 23 years - the last 18 months the drinking kicked in). I probably am a little crazy .... but working on copep me and educating myself the best I can.

But most of them are either living with or married to the guy. You aren't. You already have your freedom, you just choose not to accept it. You seem to be trying to get more enmeshed with the addict. You have everything you need to free yourself, yet you refuse. That's what's so hard to understand.

Edit to add: Those of us here who appear strong didn't necessarily start out that way. Many of us were exactly where you are now or much worse. At some point, we had to stand up and say...I'm not going to live like this anymore! Did we have all the answers? No. Was it scary? Sure it was, but we had enough self-respect to do what was necessary to save ourselves. You can do it, too, but it just seems to me that you're going in the wrong direction.

and, to add that i am dealing with this lying problem right now - and feeling very vulnerable. This second I want to burst into tears and end things with him - his lying makes me feel so upset (I know i need to work on detaching from this). He has let me down again today because we were supposed to be meeting tonight, but i just told him on the phone that i think we should cancel tonight because he has been drinking and had promised he wouldn't before seeing me. That's the first time I've actually said that to him. Usually I'd still want to see him, but right now I don't want him anywhere near me. I'm so angry and upset with him. He blatantly lied about where he was - one minute he was in his bathroom, the next (literally) he was in town. I could hear that he was in a pub. I wish I didn't love him so much so I could just wash my hands of it all right now. I'll feel differently when I've calmed down but i'm so angry.

Right, I shall start calming down by planning my own evening for me tonight. I've got lots I could be doing so it gives me an opportunity to do some of them i guess. I was so looking forward to what we'd planned tonight, even though part of me was expecting him to mess up.

to suki- but you can be deeply involved with someone without having to be living together or married. we've been together almost a year and it isn't a relationship i feel i can just walk away from so easily.

Well, IWC, it seems to me that your ABF can walk away from you at any time. He has the freedom to lie, manipulate and make you upset about his behavior. And suki is right..YOU have your freedom already. So, why not take it and see what happens? Maybe, just maybe, you would find that being by yourself is ok! Trusting in your own feelings, doing your own thing, and making your own plans that won't be cancelled will be enough to keep you away from his lies.

When you said you were looking forward to what you had planned with him tonight but knew he would mess it up anyway? Call a g/f or a buddy and go do it anyway! Do NOT let HIM spoil your plans! Stop putting him first.

As the slogan goes, JUST DO IT! :c011:

are you reading the codependent no more book with us? it kind of seems that you are attempting to adapt to a relationship with an A and a liar. If you're okay with this within the dynamics of your relationship, what is the definite deal breaker for you?

I realize that, hon. But look back to your earlier posts...much of that year has been spent with you being upset about his drinking and his lies. You're going to do whatever you want to do, but when you ask us how to willingly stay in an obviously bad relationship, it just goes against what we're trying to do here. We want you to be happy and fulfilled, but you have to play the major role.

insulated - the definite deal breaker is if he cheats on me. Also, if he hasn't been making any attempts to sort himself out (not just with alcohol).

iamsaved - thanks for your comments. I think I will try what we had planned by myself tonight! The strange thing is, I know I'd be OK by myself if I wasn't in this relationship. I don't know why that doesn't make me leave, but as I said, I'm sure i'll know when the time is right.

Oh sweetheart, I just want to give you a hug.

You can stay, you can leave. A year in is not that much, but I truly understand how even at that point it appears you can't live without them, you will never find anything better etc.

I also understand why the others appear frustrated. We have dealt with this behavior and from the outside we see the path you are going down due to our own experience . . . been there done that. But since we have "done that" we also know how hard it is to leave and how desperately in love you feel.

The fact for any of us who choose to stay in a relationship built on dishonesty - is the honesty we have to have with ourselves. There is no magic button that is going to make you feel better. There is only ONE answer - and that is if you choose to stay in a relationship with a liar - you are in a relationship with a liar. If you want it to not affect you emotionally and you want to detach - you will need to not CARE or LOVE him. You will not need to care that he is obviously showing you a lack of respect and treating you "less than". How do you do that? There is no instruction manual on how to be ok with someone you love lying to you. There are no steps. You just have to stand there and listen to them lie to you and be OK with it. That simple. Can you do that?

I personally won't tell you not to do this. You need to do what you need to do. You will be done when you are done. But I will say I have been where you are and it did NOT turn out well. But I sure did learn some VERY valuable life lessons. Mostly - how to love myself enough to never tolerate this behavior from anyone else ever again and keep my side of the street clean and be the person that I want to be with.

We are here for you whatever you choose.

SeekingBalance

suki - thanks, i know it seems that way. I have had happy times with him while we've been together - its not all bad, but I know it should be a lot better. I'm sorry if i shouldn't be asking these questions, i just don't know where else to turn sometimes.

seekingbalance - thank you, your words meant a lot to me. i don't think i can be OK with him lying to me, but i guess i'm trying because i see it as more of a temporary thing. He is making slow inroads into sorting himself out and i guess i'm expecting the lying and drinking to stop at some point. If it doesn't, i can't go on like this, accepting the lies. I can understand why people are getting annoyed with me on here, i really can. I'd be giving myself the same advice.

I tolerated the unacceptable. I found a way to stay in the relationship: I stuffed my feelings of disprespect. I avoided all confrontation. I embraced insanity (doing the same thing over and over - expecting different results). I gave away my power for the sake of the relationship. I made the relationship more important than my precious life.

I became a doormat.

I do not recommend that as a way to live life. It makes you crazy.

I hope that you will honor your inner voice and take a stand for your one precious life.

So, cheating is the dealbreaker. Have you asked him if he's ever cheated? If he answered you, would you believe the liar? If he told you he was quitting drinking, and going into a program, would you believe him?
:lala

Ahh the tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive. Lying infiltrates every aspect of your relationship. Without truth, there is no bond of trust.

My heart breaks for you, that you would accept this as behavior that is tolerable.

IWC...what if you stopped subscribing to the b.s.?

I feel like I see similarities in your situation to mine. I could only gather enough gusto to go NC once my life was in danger (crazy dog attack...actually more funny in a way, but u get the point). And there just came a point where here was nothing I could do. And I knew it. I can see you're not ready. But what if you tried it for an experiment...

Next time he contacts you or whatever... Don't jump! Take it one step at a time and see how it goes. As bad as this sounds to all of the wonderful, strong people on here..One thing that kept me going was the faith that if I stood up for myself and walked away, maybe...just maybe...he would love me enough to start to see. Of course I'm working really hard on letting it go completely, but especially at first. I really didn't want to loose him. As a friend, even.

My Xabf lied a lot too. Looking back, sometimes I start to go crazy wondering what was really the truth. They are sick, yes...but what are you telling him by being by his side? He'll NEVER have a chance to see how he's hurting you.

Maybe try sticking up for yourself in small ways (i.e. don't cancel you plans for him, type stuff..I know I did that).

Does your A ever say "I know you don't believe me anyway?" Or things of that nature?
Mine did. The first few times I actually did believe him when he said that..now...
What do you guys think, that's for sure a ploy/given that he's lying right? LOL. Such distorted thinking..its NUTS!!!

Do you lie to him? Is that fair? Maybe think about it not so much ending, but give him a chance to EARN you. Idk that might not be the healthiest way..but it kinda works for me sometimes.

but at least i do have some sort of dealbreaker. there are many people on here who have been in a relationship with an A who has cheated on them many times. that is a definite no-go for me. I'd never trust him ever again.
i don't know what else to say - i thought i was doing well, trying to work out ways of detaching etc. i feel liek i'm doing worse than ever now.