stay or go...why did you?
 

I'd like to hear from anyone who has been able to stay with their A that isn't in recovery. Or if you did leave at what point did you realize that you needed to leave? Anyone want to share some ESH?

That's an interesting question, TM. I stayed with my AH for 12 years even though he denied he was an alcoholic, refused treatment and was a nightmare. The reason I finally left was because in Feb. he turned violent. Not that he hadn't been violent before but he had never hit me before. Of course he started that in Feb and took until May before I left.
But, I knew that first night in Feb. that I had to leave.

You know what I still have a hard time understanding is that if he had never abused me physically I would still be there. I would have never left.

That makes me sad and angry.
I still love him and I still want to be with him but I can't--that makes me sad.
Knowing what he did to me all those years. Knowing how bad it was when it didn't have to be--that makes me angry.

I left because of mental and physical abuse.
He punched me...I left.
I also took our mutual money
from the bank on my way out of town...:)

I suggest you make a list of reasons
pro and con
so you can have clairty.

Blessings

it took me a long time to make him leave . he was always a happy drunk , life of the party . never was obviously drunk or stumbling , was never abusive either physically or mentally . Over 10 years there was probably 3 times where his drinking started keeping him out late at nght and then he would cut down (never quit because he was never an alcoholic) But that last 6 - 9 months before he went to his first rehab he changed . he got meaner and more arrogant . I learned later he was doing drugs .
It was a whole year later and his 4th rehab that my 10 yr old daughter asked me 'why was God doing this to us again , why is daddy back in the hospital' and then it hit me . I wasnt doing enough to protect my kids . I was still doing the dance. He lives with his mom now

I made the decision to end my marriage when it finally became obvious to me that my exah had become a man who I could never believe or trust again, and that I had gradually lost all sense of who I was because I was so focused on him.

I really can't explain it except to say that I hit my bottom and knew it was either get away from him or die (not necessarily die physically, but in every other way...).

This post basically describes what I felt then:

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ain-stops.html

It hasn't been easy but it has been the best thing I ever did for myself and my kids.

Thank you for posting that link, Duet.

"The Pain Stops: when your longing for them gets slowly replaced by a desire to get away,"

No amount of detaching in ABF's presence could remove this niggling awareness that I felt physically ill-at-ease around him both when he had been drinking and when that short-temperedness pre-first drink of the day was setting in. There was a booze-free "window" each day which I always wanted to hold close. Of course, I now understand from reading these forums that many of his physiological problems (upset stomach, vomiting) early in the morning were linked to the drinking of the night before.

ABF never became physically abusive but.....drunks get a look in their eye which is glazed and scarey. I didn't know what he might be thinking. In any event, I found the "look" emotionally abusive.

ARL

I had a nightmares about this "look".

I think my moment was mostly when he said, "I don't think I'm an alcoholic and I should be able to have a few whenever I want to."

He said this almost 2 years after getting his license back after his second DUI.

The thing that reinforced my decision to have no contact with him was when he left a voice message on my cell - "I understand why you could hate me...but maybe I'll hear from you." Sick...real sick.

"I had a nightmares about this "look"."

Oh I had seen that "look" other places....other people who had consumed so much alcohol that they were beyond reasoning and probably about to black-out. Jack Nicholson immortalized the "look" in The Shining. With ABF, I would be praying inwardly for him to just go to sleep so that I could stop that feeling of walking on eggshells. It was like I was babysitting him! And who needs that?

ARL

I stayed with my AH for 17 years, til he left the family. Now I cringe when I think I'd probably still be there if he hadn't left. He was never physically abusive, but he was so emotionally and verbally cruel that I blocked alot of stuff he's said and done out, and I'm now remembering things I had pushed back in my memory from years ago. Walking on eggshells with a knot in my stomach became normal. I can hardly believe I ever lived that way, and I'm so grateful my HP got me out.

Ditto....to what guineapigjude says....like her I stayed for 22 yrs until he left the family...and I remember all too well that "look"....and also I remember how his facial features just seemed to sag like gravity took hold....does anyone remember that? And he had a hair trigger temper in this state....which normally he was never like. The eggshell life is gone for us now and even tho somehow I still long for this abusive life I already feel healed...but then its been 2 years this coming 4th of July. I feel like I've been to war and back...right on the front lines.

I think I alway knew I would leave when my kids were old enough. Our world started falling about over the past year and a half or so, I began detaching myself. My baby was getting ready to graduate and I wasn't sticking around to continue raising "my son" that would never grow up. I lost myself in this relationship and needed very much to find myself again. He was emotionally unavailable to me for so many years. Everyone else thought I was okay, funny, pretty good person, everybody but him. I started believing all of them instead and decided I had had enough. Of course, when he found out I wanted out, all of a sudden he was ready to clean up. Too little too late. I had fallen out of love too long ago. My mind & heart were already gone. He has stayed clean so far for the past four months, so thank goodness he hadn't fallen off the wagon, and I can't predict the future, so I don't know what's in store for us as a couple. But so much has been said & done, he has turned into someone I don't even know. I don't think he quite knows who he is yet. It's been a very strange ride.

Xah and I were together for about 15 1/2 years. Those years were filled with denial of the seriousness and extent of the problem, alot of mental abuse with some physical abuse. The mind games were just unreal but so chaotic at the time that I didn't even realize half of them. There were fights, heartbreak and lots of tears and pain on my side - lots of anger, remorse, etc. on his but still the cycle continued.
Even after seperating - the merry go round of the game continued to spin for about 3 years.

When we initially seperated, I was sooooo angry! I was at a point where I was filled with anger and had that feeling of having come full circle (as I found myself in a situation I'd been in 15 years before) and realized that I'd gone nowhere but back to where we began.
Then after the 3 years of crap that followed our seperation, I began to really focus on my recovery. Slips and falls came but I finally realized that he wasn't going to change. And I learned to accept that. (Acceptance was a major key) And I realized that I had a choice - I knew that I couldn't save him - but I could save myself. So I chose to save myself.

The pain stopped for me when I realized I didn't particularly like him whether he was drunk or sober, and had no expectations of him being able to meet my needs - he didn't have it to give. I realized I was going to leave when I saw the depth of his deceitfulness and his compulsion to control me. I also realized I wasn't going to fulfill his fantasy of being the "perfect" woman. Shucks, I went and made the fatal mistake in his eyes of being a flawed human being.

I knew I would leave when the anger gave way to annoyance and a feeling of dread having to be in the same house with him. Bottom line: I like who I am, and I like my life more without him than with him.

Barring some miraculous recovery on his part (which I don't logically forsee as happening), I am prepared to leave him when I graduate from college and get a job. If I decide to leave prior to my December graduation, I have a plan in place to do so.

The moment I decided to leave was when I realised that I didn't have another chance left in me. However, the build up to that lightbulb moment was multi-faceted.

Bottom line - I could no longer sacrifice myself at the altar of someone elses issues. I had (and have) enough of my own to deal with and I was finding it hard to stay on track whilst being actively thwarted. Those last few months between starting counselling/attending meetings and leaving almost broke me emotionally.

Life is far from perfect nowadays, however it is immeasureably better than the alternative.

When i realized that I had given up hope of him ever becoming sober. I read through the threads here and on a similar forum on a different website and saw how other people had gone through the same thing with addicts that I did only for years longer.

At the same time I read "codependent no more" by Melody Beattie and that was a turning point for me. I realised how much I had lost myself and how to set boundries and get out of the situation.

I am much better off now.

My A was never violent. He was/is well educated, well spoken, well employed, kind. He and I had a thousand conversations over the years about his alcoholism, which he totally acknowledged. He was in therapy the whole time and was honest with his therapist about his drinking. I realize now that the therapy and acknowledgement were actually tools he used to keep drinking. "Look, I'm working on it but it's a DISEASE! Did I mention this thing that happened to me when I was an infant? If that happened to you, you'd drink too!"

After lots of heartbreaking relapses, usually during some expensive and long awaited vacation, I realized that I lived in terror. No, I was not afraid of violence, I was afraid of his drunk driving, of his potential health problems, of the things he said and did when his judgement was bad.

I was sick and tired of coming home to find him drunk having called in to work, of finding the beer cans hidden everywhere, of hearing him snore, of hearing him crapping his brains out every morning with alchohol induced diarrhea. He was also getting hugely fat from all the calories and I was no longer attracted to him.

One day he "lost" the car keys and I had to go to work. After a frantic search they were found in the iginition of the car. He was so drunk the night before that he forgot to remove them and it's a miracle that no one stole the car. By that day I had had enough of his BS to last me a lifetime.

I have been dealing with my AH's alcoholism for 17 years now. I think for me things began to change emotionally when our son was born. My focus became raising our baby and his focus remained on the drinking. He was always going out to “watch the game” while I was left to be the responsible parent. He was emotionally unavailable and very selfish. My life revolved around his “game time”. He was part of the family when it was good for him and didn’t interfere with drinking time.

Since he worked nights, we got to feel the aftermath of his drinking when we got home for the day. The mood was often negative with off handed remarks about anything and everything that I just couldn’t bear to hear this day after day. Some of the remarks hurt my son’s feelings and that stuck with me. Over the years my feelings of love became replaced with anger and resentment. In my mind I was preparing to separate for quite a while.

Then I found out about many lies and deception about a “friendship” with another woman who he met at the bar. That was the last straw for me. He moved out 2 months ago and now my home has peace. I still have moments where I feel weak but have to do what is healthy for me and my son.

stay or go..why did you?
 

I haven't left yet, but my plans are to go.

ABF went into detox for the first time in his life when he became involved with me. He refuses any programs as they are "cults" in his mind and will not become a "Bible thumping, chain smoking, coffee addict who has to preach to the world his wisdom on one knee to the world."

In the two years I have been with him, he has also abused me in every category and tells me he does so because I matter more than anyone else in the world to him.

I am suggesting that we attend counseling together as a last assurance to me that I am doing what is best for me. I also go to a counselor just for me. I don't see how he can change.. he lacks character and skills to do that, but I am making sure because it will help me fully let go when the time comes.

I have detached so much from all the good things I felt in the beginning because they have been replaced by so much bad and damage to me. I didn't know about the disease as up close and personal before him so I got a crash course.

He has regained his health but his mind is forever affected by over 30 years of alcohol and drug abuse (that part was before knowing me.) I can see no hope because any "healthy changes" he has made has (he quit smoking too because it makes me ill but it was a huge struggle for him to understand it was a neccesity not control on my part), come after fights to the death of parts of me and I have no faith that they are real or would last. His lying and sneaking behind my back when he doesn't agree with me to do as he pleases has taken my ability to trust him out of the picture.

Words roll off his tongue easily but his actions speak another language entirely.

I hope he can really make and keep beneficial changes for his life for his sake. As of right now, I can't see myself staying with him for the rest of my life. I am working on safely leaving so he can't find or contact me as he has vowed to never let me go, ever, no matter what I do.

I have worked too hard on my issues all my life to let the final word about me be his influence on my life. His life is up to him. He's on his ninth life with me and I doubt he will ever own that no matter how much time goes by.

I know that it is not the person he is with that is the problem, he would do the same to any woman. He can't appreciate and nurture hmself let alone another person. It's sad but it's reality.

I applaude all who have gotten the courage to do what is in their higher good and pray that everyone who is facing the same questions will find their strength to do the same for themselves.

my ex became mentally and physically abusive as his alcoholism progressed. i left for my and my daughter's safety. and sanity. blessings, k

I left because I was mentally and physically wiped out. I had to take care of an infant, hold a full time job, because AH already lost his job by then and was too busy drinking, and come home every night feeling on the verge of vomiting, because I didn't know what was on the other side of the door. He often woke up when I returned home from work at 6. The house would be a huge mess with wine stains everywhere, AH would invent delusional (truly) stories that he believed were true, and then he would lock himself in the spare bedroom where he would watch movies all night and get so drunk that he would start throwing himself against the walls and moan so loud that it woke me up. Then he would wake me up countless times--mind you, I already didn't have any sleep with our baby--so by the time morning arrived, I felt like walking death. That in itself was enough for me to leave.

" he has also abused me in every category and tells me he does so because I matter more than anyone else in the world to him."

Jilly....reading your post was frightening, especially the above part. You know that you are being abused by this man and I very much hope that you have a support system in place to get out of this relationship as soon as possible.

"I am suggesting that we attend counseling together "

Why put yourself through more with this man when he has shown you through his treatment of you what he really thinks of you? Personally, I think you would be giving him more ammunition to abuse you.

What stops you from leaving NOW?

Make yourself your number on priority! You know you cannot change him.

ARL

I tried staying with my exA but and using my Alanon tools but he was becoming increasingly verbally abusive towards me in front of my teenage son and lying about everything. I figured I'd better go while the going was good (before I was physically abused). Things happened after I left which helped me to see I had definitely made the right decision and as far as I know he's still out there drinking.

Earthworm

I met RAH 23 years ago, while he was actively drinking. I stayed with him for three years cause I had 3 small kids from a previous marriage, no money, no child support, no car, no nothing. He paid all the bills and took care of us, but the trade off was a drunk every day. But I made plans, I went back to business school. After three years he started turning mean. I left him for three weeks, got a very good paying job at a lawfirm, during which time he went to detox and rehab and I moved his stuff out of the apartment we shared. After he got out of rehab, we dated for a while, got back together, got married and he remained sober over 14 years. Several years ago, he picked up again, was able to control it in the beginning, but it progressively got worse and worse, drinking sun up to sun up. He was still a sweetheart, drunk and sober and was never mean ... until ... It was then that I had finally had enough and said to myself I wasn't going to go down this street again! I told him I didn't want him to stop drinking, he had a God given right to drink, but that I was leaving him and my plans were already in place. I did have every intention of leaving him, I had plans in place, my kids were grown and out of the house, and I was not going to spend the rest of my life with this man acting like this. But then, after his threat of suicide and a blood alcohol level of .4 (lethal level), and two days in the hospital, he went to rehab and is now going to AA and working on his recovery. I decided to stay cause I really do love him and I know he loves me, but I never really realized how those years affected me and my feelings toward him. I am working on me now, and taking it one day at a time, just as he is. And while it is said that relapse may be a part of recovery, I honestly think if he did relapse, I would have to leave, I don't want to be on that rollercoaster anymore!!! Hope this helps.
Teree

Dear ARL,

That is the part I am working on. I don't have the support or the means to safely leave.

I am making myself a priority by detaching and focusing on my future while keeping myself as safe as possible. I'm hoping a counselor can help me do that by working with him as well. If he can be reached, then that's good but I'm not putting myself on hold while waiting to see it.

This is a way that I am owning my issues as well as taking responsibility for my life.

Thank you for caring. It helps me stay my path.

Quick hug to you Jillybean ((((((((((((hug)))))))))))))) it's hard to leave those you care about even when they abuse. Good for you for taking the steps to take care of yourself. Healing doesn't happen overnight, but it does happen.

Thank you thinkmink for understanding. Your message means a great deal!


(((((((HUGS))))))) back atcha!

Jilly

After 23 years of on and off active drinking I am finally without him. He has lost his job,been hospitalized 2 near fatal motorcycle accidents went to prison and I filed a PFA against him. For the first time in a long time I am starting to feel PEACE. Our children do not want him to come home. My 12 year old son seems to be the only one to realize he will never change. The last time he was in rehab (4 times altogether}., I truly believed this time it would be different. All the lies and bs he told his counselers and me were proven to be a lie when he came home from rehab and drank the same night. My son said Mom HE ISN'T GOING TO STOP. His family was never there for him in the past now they have no choice but to take him in because he cannot come home. Well guess what they are angry with me now!!! I have called them to tell them he must send me child support and they think he shouldn't have to. So I went to domestic relations they are handling it now. How can these people have no reguard for their grandchildren? I could go on forever but the fact is there are 2 children who will not be forgotten about. They never call to see how the kids are or if we need anything,How can they now blame me for his mistakes,there is no justifacation for what was done to us over the years.

Today I live with an active alcoholic. He tries, but we all know they cannot do it alone. I am patiently waiting for the courts to put the ball in motion as far as his treatment goes. I understand that "forced" treatment does not always work, but I have no other choice. I have given myself and my family 1 year to work this out and have progress. If at that time things are no better I will have no choice but to move on as I cannot live this way for the rest of my life. I have needs too.

I left when I realized that I was living with a self-centered, emotionally stunted, manipulative person who saw me only as a tool for his own security and comfort. He "loved me" of course, and I "loved him" but when push came to shove those were only words taught to us by movies, TV and books. Love is when you respect and support each other on this journey called life...and with an alcoholic respect and support are almost never forthcoming, and never for more than a few minutes at a time.

I wanted more than a few minutes.

I wanted to be with a man, not an infant.

I didn't want to reach the end of my life, look back and realize that I'd wasted it all staying with someone who I could never trust, and never fully forgive for all of the abusive actions.

The alternative was to leave that relationship and open myself up to finding someone with whom trust, respect, support, and love were possible.

When I realized that I deserved that, and that I had no control over the disease and never would, and that my life would also be so-so ("settling for that" as a friend put it) then I realized that it was time to go.

I was very afraid for several weeks, then numb for several more, and then I began to get very, very happy.

Now I know I will reach the end of my life knowing that I did everything I could to use the gifts god gave me to have a long, happy, joyful, helpful, and fulfilling life, with my energies put to better use than just supporting one man with a problem he won't/can't fix.

GiveLove

I haven't left because where I live is my own personal property....I don't feel I shoulsd have to leave my home...

I put all of his stuff out of the house and into his truck...he was sleeping in it he now has moved into the travel trailer.

I don't speak to him anymore except to get his share of the bills...I wrote and had notarized a lease agreement and if he does not pay I will have him evicted.

I am going to just live my life and if I want to do something I will including date if I meet someone I am interested in....