steppingup that is one of the most useful posts i have read thanks

were you truly alcoholic ??
 

possibly you truly never crossed over that invisible line to alcoholic
or like a few others who have dabbled such as you are
the liquid devil is cunning and waiting
and will bite you yet again
and for some poor souls with much greater force

???????????????????

for you I hope not -- but only time will tell

MM

Just as many alcoholics are misdiagnosed with mental illness, the opposite is also possible. There are many non alcoholics in AA these days. Sent by the courts or referred by other means because someone thinks their behaviour is unacceptable.

Many of those I went to school with went through a phase where they exhibited what could be called alcoholic behaviour. They grew out of it . They didn't have the problems I had. They went on to have normal happy lives while I continued to the bottom of the alcoholic pit.
If you are not an alcoholic, of course you can stop or moderate any time you like. Fine with me.

But if you are a real alcoholic you might end up like Dave, not his real name. I met Dave in the intensive care unit. He had bee there three months with no visitors. He could not speak due to intubation, he could only move one arm a bit, he looked about twenty years older than me although he was two years younger. His sister sent me a photo of him before the accident. Hew was unrecognisable. Dave's spirits were low.

I visited him over the course of two or three weeks. It turns out Dave's story was similar to the OP. He had been sober 17 years. He stopped going to AA thinking he knew enough to stay sober on his own account. He did not buy the God business in fact he told me god could go f... Himself. He had a big ole resentment against God and AA.

He got drunk. More than once, then he drove his car over a bank. Broke his neck, and suffered a head injury. He was moved to my town due to the neck injury. No one visited him in his home town. While in the spinal unit he contracted a lung infection which is what placed him in the ICU. Can you imagine the misery he went through. Three months confined, wanting to drink but unable to. Alcoholic hell on earth.

Our group tried to lift his spirits and the ICU specialist rang me to say he was amazed at the positive effect our efforts had on him. But sadly it wasn't enough to beat the infection.
The day came when he was disconnected from the machines. The ICU called me to be with him for his last moments. I have sat with dying people before and I have always been amazed at the strength and serenity their faith gave them. There was no fear, just peace.

This was the first time I sat with someone who categorically rejected God. I'll never forget the fear in his eyes, the plea in his look, for me to intervene and stop the doctors from disconnecting him as he realised what was happening. Then the morphine took effect. I can't say he went peacefully, the nurse said he fought hard.

The really sad thing is that his death was not attributed to alcohol. Instead the case was put down as four factors. Broken neck, thrombosis, head injury and lung infection.

I really don't know why he drank. Was it because he thought he could moderate, or was it because he couldn't swallow the God idea?

I like to keep things simple so I go with the simple definition of an alcoholic: If you can't stop, once you start, you are an alcoholic. I've never been able to stop once I start.

I don't think AA literature is very good at reflecting the range of addiction. Not all relapses start with a bang. It's possible that you're not an alcoholic; but I've heard similar stories of relapse that started out modestly; but then, look out.

Hey guys...I posted this a few years before venturing out into "moderate" drinking for 18 months or so. Not sure how this thread got resurrected, but the, uh, experiment failed. I'm almost 2 1/2 years sober this time around.

oh yeah, lol.

Congrats!!! Well, old or not, this thread was good for me. I'm doing the steps now to help convince myself, some more, that attempting moderation is not a real good idea. I haven't heard from anyone that's done it successfully and I don't see why I should be an exception. I think I'm almost at: "It's just plain impossible dummy".

Thanks. I have yet to meet someone who has been happily moderating long term. It seems as rare as a Bigfoot sighting, and just as believable. :whoop

Lol, yeah.

2 beers never did and never will do it for me. 2 beers is alcohol abuse

Yeah again. Funny how 2 is enough for many... apparently most. Was never enough for me either; just getting started.

The big book is beginning to sink in with me. I think we all just want to escape... from ourselves. That's why it's all about fixing ourselves. Reduces or eliminates the desire to escape.

The thought of having only 2 drinks just physically made me tense up and feel anxious.

There have been times when I've only had 2...but I'd call that conscious moderation.

Drinking is such hard work...why do we have those silly internal fights? Reading this thread makes it so clear....it's not even worth considering as an option. But also, how we have to keep vigilant on our thoughts towards alcohol.

Not sure this is true. What seems more appropriate is for many whatever they drink does not seem to control or affect their lives. This is where I get hung up.

2 beers!! I've been sober almost 5 years thanks to AA and alcohol is as much an issue as not eating prunes, can't stand prunes yuck! But one thing is for sure if I ever did pick up again it wouldn't be having 2 beers! Even when I was at my worst if it was a choice of 2 beers or diet coke I would be drinking diet coke! What is the point in drinking 2 beers?! Be like opening a bag of crisps and eating 2 crisps lol! Brilliant thread made me smile:-)

I agree. It is a brilliant thread, glad it got resurrected.

I think it's brilliant because it addresses a subject that I believe is very difficult for many alcoholics, definitely this one.

I would like to be able to drink socially. I know that sometimes I was able to take my wife and kids out to a restaurant, have two drinks and safely drive us all home. I also know that sometimes I wasn't. Further, I know that if I went out with my friends, I didn't even try to drink moderately.

This was all before, later in life, I started drinking to drown my sorrows. Once I started that, I went out of my way to drink myself to oblivion. WAY out of my way.

I now fully understand the consequences of doing this; it WILL kill me and hurt and/or kill others.

It just seems irresponsible and stupid to take that risk again. The sanest approach seems to be to drill that danger further into my thick skull and develop a sincere distaste for alcohol and its effects, as many have before me.

And there it is. The mind and thought process of an addict. I never learned how to moderate from the get go. Never learned how to socially drink. Maybe faked it at times. But now I can never go back because I abused it for too long. Maturing out moderate drinking isn't possible for the alcoholic in me.

I'm 41 and don't seem to have 'matured out of it'...

I did see my own father act pretty alcoholically for many years and quit drinking for many years and now in his later years occasionally has a beer or two and hasn't allowed that to slide into anything awful for the past 10 years I've been aware of him sometimes having a beer or two. His life back then was very different to his life now, so maybe there is something to it....

on the other hand, I know personally several people around the tables who had essentially the same story as you're offering here but then - suddenly and out of the blue - things were way worse than ever before and their lives were in shambles.

Why did you decide to pick up again?

After 16 years of living without alcohol - what was the point?

And, is the addition of a few beers here and there providing you with a value that is rich enough to risk it?

Just wondering.

:ring

yep... it was a good and timely resurrection for me too... for some reason today has been one of those days plagued with little fleeting thoughts and video clips and suggestions that maybe sometime down the line it'll just magically be "OK" and the result of drinking for me will be different than the consistent result of the past 25+ years....

:)

johnston - I'm glad the uhh... 'experiment' didn't kill you and you're back here.

:ring