Old 01-19-2013, 03:02 PM
  # 24 (permalink)  
PohsFriend
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Join Date: Nov 2011
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I think it is good to be cautious when you use the word abuse.

I would tend to label what Earthworm describes as neglect, the absence of any response. It's certainly a fact that addicts are unlikely to want to discuss what they've done wrong but that's also true of people and I hate to admit, especially men.

In Gottman's "Seven Principles for Making Marriage Work" book he spends a lot of time on the dynamics of a couple's communication. Actually, he rewrote what we think we know about it. The back story on the book is that after many years as marriage counselors, Gottman and his wife decided they were pretty much frauds - the conventional wisdom was a pile of crap.

They set up a laboratory - an apartment wired for sound and video (except bathroom of course and the electronics were shut off at 10PM). They brought in couples for the weekend and observed how they talked. They were told to make themselves at home, do what they normally did on a weekend at home - bring the dog, drink if you drink, etcetera. They wore heart rate monitors too.

Stonewalling, what Earthworm describes, is covered early on under the broader topic of major warning signs in a relationship. He calls it one of the "Four Horsemen of the Apocolypse": Criticism, Contempt, Defensiveness, Stonewalling.

Gottman's work led, over time, to where they got incredibly effective prediction of whether a couple would stay married or not. For me, it was the best book I ever read regarding relationships.

Here's a scanrio to consider...
Gottman realized quickly that women and men respond different at a physiological level to stress during an argument. Once the fight/flight response kicks in you may as well quit, that conversation isn't turning around. Stonewalling very often is a response to someone feeling overwhelmed, or flooded. 85% of the time it is the man who does this.

What leads to it? Usually, not always, because men are actually more easily overwhelmed by the emotional stress of marital conflict and seek to stop it by withdrawing or stonewalling. I've done this one and the thoughts in my head at the time ranged from "Why talk, I'm tired of getting beat up and bitched at for every f---ing thing I do and there is no reasonig with you" to "You reallllllly want to know what I think? If I open my mouth right now I am going to say things I will regret so I just need to calm down first".

So... what preceded this? Is what you wanted to talk about one of his faults? How did the conversation start? Were you critical? Contemptuous? I'm not blaming you for it but stonewalling is usually a reaction, not an action. I didn't see it until I read Gottman's book.

Nobody likes to hear how much they suck, that's the most common path to stonewalling.

We all draw the line of where abuse and control start based on our own experiences. In mine, stonewalling is rude but not abusive. It can quickly turn to abuse and control if the person starts gaslighting or blameshifting or simply verbally beating you into submission because you dared to express a complaint or a need.

There are things that can get to all of us here. I know what Lexie does for a living and it makes good sense that she would set the bar for abuse where she does and she's an expert on the topic. There's nothing dangerous about that. I got my neck hairs up a little when KatieKate said "alcoholics do..." because not all do but Katie is a friend here and I totally get that her responses and mine are different because we have different experiences that we draw from.

Take a breath guys... whether it is abuse and control or just ****** communication patterns it is frustrating and upsetting and nobody disagrees with that.

To Earthworm - If you have a chance, the first couple chapters of Gottman's book were revolutionary for me. He talks about how a conversation that is kicked off with a harsh startup and criticism/contempt lead right into defensiveness and stonewalling and in MY unique experience he nailed it.

The difference between a complaint, criticism and contempt are crucial too.
Complaint: You were late getting home sp I had to watch the kids and missed my meeting
Criticism: I missed my meeting because you are too inconsiderate to get home on time
Contermpt: I missed my meeting again because as usual, you can't bother to be responsible and do what you are supposed to do, like that's a surprise...

Or more simply:
Complaint: You did a bad thing and I am unhappy
Criticism: You did a bad thing because you are a bad person
Contempt: You did a bad thing and by the way, you effing suck... seriously you suck.

Contempt is the real killer in that list and Gottman suggests that left unchecked usually leads to divorce. Now here's the one that got me between the eyes... Sarcasm is contempt.

Yeah - ouch.
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