Originally Posted by
basIam 
(Stereosteveo.... do you say the set aside prayer??? Isn't that the ultimate admission of agnosticsm? "Please enable me to set aside the things I think I know..." )
Yes I really like the set aside prayer and you make a great point now that I think more about it literally. But I don't pray to "a nothing that doesn't exist".
By the same token if you asked me exactly who he is and where he lives I don't know if I could tell you. But it's definately a "something that exists somewhere".
Originally Posted by
basIam Part of that is understanding what "agnostic" means,"
That was my sole intention here. For my own curiosity as well as having a better understanding of the newcomer who claims Agnostic. It didn't go over to well.
Originally Posted by
basIam Many newcomers can see the (find god in order to recover) lie and as a result cross AA of the list of possibilities when it comes to recovery paths."
Funny you should metion this. I had my first experience with the "opposite" reaction about 2 weeks ago. I followed this guy out of the meeting who is in a 1/2-way house here. It was about the 3rd time I'd seen him. He basically said "You guys think all of the answers are in that silly book. I know who my God is and it's Jesus Christ" I started to tell him that the book references no God in particular and he said "I got my own book and it's called the bible." He was saying this while turning his back and walking away.
So I don't know. Apparently we didn't give enough credit to "God" in that meeting..
On that note I like the saying that also goes along with my experience: "If the God talk scares you out of here, that's OK. The alcohol will scare you right back in."
At any rate bro, like I told Ago; I greatly respect you for making efforts in upholding the traditions and ensuring the new guy can believe anything he wants. It takes all kinds. And I can't say I haven't learned anything in this thought provoking thread. Another memmber sent me the "Freethinkers" version of the steps. I have somewhat mixed feelings about them, but bottom line I think if I had seen the steps put this way I would have obtained a quicker understanding of how important it is to just work them, and what this thing is really about. That on my own I would never recover.
I think McGowdog sums it up pretty well:
Originally Posted by
McGowdog I never recall having the luxury to argue "Gods" or "not Gods" or whether or not A.A. was the correct recovery program for me. I was always, as a newcomer who had recently come down from being on the sauce, been willing to just come in and say, "Here I am. What do I have to do?"
I spent my first year in AA trying to figure out God. Then I used the old saying "There is a God and I'm not it". Left it at that, worked the steps, and he revealed himself to me.