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Old 10-02-2008, 02:28 PM
  # 5 (permalink)  
Ago
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: The Swish Alps, SF CA
Posts: 2,144
truthfully, by far and away the best relationship I have ever had was with a woman with Long Term Sobriety.

We ended up breaking up because I moved away, and while I won't paint a picture of Ward and June cleaver and blow sunshine up yer A$$ about how perfect it was, it was the best relationship I have ever been a part of.

We had problems, we had difficulties, however, we had TOOLS, we went to couples counseling and therapy early on to get a handle on things when it started to get squirrelly but some of the good things were:

She was STILL, I mean she was VERY still, and she spoke her truth, no lies, no manipulations, no prevarications, and she was gentle, and vulnerable. When something was possibly "modified by her filter" as in if she was triggered or insecure about something, or something was possibly based on her issues and not "reality" she always made that clear.

She knew the rules for "fighting fair" and used them, "I feel" "I think" etc. she never laid her trips on my head. This is your action, this is how it made me feel. period. end of story. no way to argue with that.

She hit HARD, and I mean HARD, when she told the truth, it was HER truth, and there was NO getting around it, however, she was vulnerable, she would expose herself to me...like I have NEVER seen..it was amazing.

What that made me do is learn how to listen, learn how to be still (took her awhile to get warmed up) but it FORCED me to tell the truth, to respect her words, to respect her actions...and it took away all that drama.

By sitting still and walking through our issues, the interesting thing was we were always coming from the same place, however our "acting out" about it looked completely different, I reacted to abandonment by going to a meeting and staying out till 2-3 AM with my friends, whereas she acted completely different, (Mars Venus anyone?) but when we had a "sit down" about it...true healing took place.

Anyway, yes...RA's can be wonderful partners, but they can also be the worse partners in the world, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, and place a little knowledge into the hands of someone who is NOT recovered (hasn't worked the 12 steps and done TONS of work on themselves) and you have the relationship equivalent of a bank robber with a gun they are not afraid to use.

That includes me by the way, I have been a TERROR armed with a little knowledge, give a manipulator tools to manipulate someone with without the necessary maturity, self love and recovery and LOOK OUT!

My last relationship took a HUGE nosedive when she decided to get sober and started attending meetings, all of the sudden she was taking my inventory, manipulating the jargon, giving me "helpful advice" etc (note: I called a buddy and was b1tching to him and he was all, "hmmm, what's she got? 11 days? and she knows it all now and is telling you how to work your program? She's right on schedule!!!" and was convulsed with peals and gales laughter at my discomfiture.

My relationship when I first got sober 16 years ago also took a nosedive when she started attending Coda...the dynamics of the relationship just got crazy. We ended up staying together for another 6 years off and on, but between the two of us...oof, we were like children playing with guns.

So be careful, I'd not recommend anyone less then 5 years, or I should say, anyone I ever dated with less then 5 years ended poorly, but yes, recovering alcoholics that work a program can be wonderful life partners, and THAT is my experience, the truth is I don't even want to date anyone that DOESN'T have/work a program, it seems with the women I pick outside the program, the truth is optional and variable, accountability is non-existent, impact of actions on each other is a foreign language, manipulation is normal...It goes on and on, I'm not saying all normies are like that, but the ones I pick are. That's fine, but for me, I don't handle that very well, I need accountability, I can't have dishonesty, manipulation etc. I realize I hold my partner up to a higher standard then I do people not so close to me, but I get Ill when I'm in a relationship with those aspects, I never learned the tools to deal with that.

When I was in my last relationship, with the practicing Alkie, I was calling a LOT of program people but one of the people I called was my XRAGF and she was VERY helpful, I would begin by telling on myself, my behaviors, my acting out etc. I wasn't looking for someone to cosign my BullShyte and one thing she said over and over to me was " Andrew, I KNOW what you look like in a relationship, and I have a pretty good working knowledge of ALL your character defects, but when you are treated with Love, Honesty, and Integrity you respond in kind"

Anyway....I rest my case, my best friend is an XRAGF....they can be good people.
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