and your post makes me think you've lived under a rock your entire life. serious?

Maybe they are just sick of you drinking Jeff. They love and care for you and probably in utter despair at you abusing and killing yourself. course guys at the gym seem great - they don't see the real you, just the highlight reel you want then to see and what they want you to see. Maybe you should be more impressed with your wife and family standing by you than some guys who say they are mercenaries-don't think people like that actually go around telling people what they do btw :)

FYI, it took me 3 months to crack that egg. These guys tell me straight out, "I don't generally like people, but I like you dude." They are killers, and I love em like family. 25 years ago these guys would have rounded me up and beat the crap out of me, but life changes. right?

You aren't a prisoner here Jeff. You are here because you want to be and you need to be. All of us do. Support is the only way to get through this mess and to leave it behind for good. But support does not mean just nodding and playing along with your common narrative. We call out unhelpful and irrelevant topics like AR-15's and caged monsters for what they are - distractions from real honesty and healing. Distractions from admitting you are in pain and need help and being open to that.

Pretty thoughtful post, almost makes me cry. But I am who I am, warts an all. Might have said this before, but not sure I'm happy I even found this website. Both positive things and negative things have come from it.

ps. I try really hard not to lash out, but I'm gonna right now. For those of you who have lived in a comfy bubble your whole life, whether it be a pension, alimony, trust fund, government job, or anything else. Good for you. Some of us (me) have dipped out toes into the real world and have enjoyed $1000 dinners and have had our houses put up for auction. Yeah, the REAL world is a bumpy road and tough as nails.

You want the nitty gritty details...PM me. I will tell you about picking up $300K of cocaine and the "seller" is so high he's looking under the bed for FBI agents. Yeah, it gets worse from there. so spare me.

Because I have been there and felt exactly the same way and I don't want anyone, not even my worst enemy, to experience that same spot in hell and if someone does wind up there, I want to do anything I can to get them out of there. It absolutely wrenches me apart, what we do to ourselves. No one deserves to be treated the way you are treating yourself and yes it hurts other people. It fills me with despair and a feeling of helplessness, like watching a canary in a goldmine. There is a better way.

Jeff, put down the keyboard man. lol

You remind me so much of myself, the mindset we get into when we're drinking. You're going to read these posts tomorrow and regret them I think. Not that anything you say is wrong or anything like that, just your mindset and the place where they are coming from.

Dry up, dust yourself off and put the pieces back together. You might get out of this one unscathed, or maybe not. Buy you know pain and trouble are coming for you at the bottom of that bottle or at the bottom of the next.

People who have been around here know your heart and know your struggle so anything you've said here won't change a damn thing about what we think. But in the end it's not what we think that matters, ya know? It's how you feel about yourself.

Hope to hear from a sober Jeff soon. In the meantime, take a little break.

Okay Everybody!!

We need to take this down a notch right now.

If the thread upsets you, use the Ignore function. Do not bicker back and forth with each other. If things continue, the thread will be closed.

Try to be supportive in your postings.

Do you think you are the only one who has lost real estate because of alcohol Jeff? The only one to have eaten expensive dinners? I won't mention exact costs as would be gauche of me. And I'm so not gauche. :)

This has become inane. I'm out.

You need to stop drinking Jeff. You need to like yourself again.

I wish you all the best Thomas11 (Jeff!)

Sometimes I really really REALLY hate the person who invented alcohol.

Jeff, I'm really bummed out to hear you are drinking. One of the people who had been here along my journey. I don't want to see you choose this path for yourself, regardless of who is or isn't in your corner out there in the real world. You have plenty of people here pulling for you. Although you know what I think and it's that no one is coming to save us. Hoping you can right your ship and get it straight sooner than later.

Jeff, I hope you return when you are sober. You know we are here for you.

Don't lock the monster away, deal with him and teach him what he needs to know. Tame the monster.

Didn't you say on here before you're different when you're with family...like more angry? Most of us let our guards down when we're around family so it makes sense to me that life will be more difficult on the home front.

The one thing about family is RESPONSIBILITY....as I am learning. Are they up your ass because of things you're not taking responsibility for? Did you not follow through on some things maybe?

Jeff, our families should be our greatest source of pride. If it isn't (as has been the case with me) we have work to do. After a year sober I'm seeing tiny improvements here and there. Two steps forward, one step back type of thing. Alcohol is not even in vocabulary any more....but chocolate certainly is!

Sending calming vibes your way, Jeff.

Be careful with "should be" statements. We can't pick our family. My mother is a raging alcoholic that has said things to me like, I wish you were dead, I should have drown you when you were born not to mention when she burned all of my baby pictures in front of me at age 14. Point is, she will never be a source of pride for me and I don't spend any energy or effort to make it so. She just exists elsewhere and I exist where I am. I think some of your other observations are spot on Sober45, but "should be" statements typically make me uncomfortable.

Hey Jeff,
your state of mind seems to be very similar to how both me and my brother get at times. It's a repeating cycle over the years. At times I have found it very empowering for a short period of time.
The end result is always the same. It's not pretty. It is the number reason I strive for sobriety as I no longer want to feel so low, never again.
S Sometimes I can see myself getting into such a state before it happens and can occasionally avoid it.
Getting better all starts with eating and sleeping. Then I can see things for what they are.
Take care of yourself mate.

Why are you bummed LG? its life man, things move on. Its not like I'm gonna die or anything.

Thank you for this post. You are much smarter than myself.

WHAT IS THE REAL ME? DRUNKARD ON A FEW WEEKENDS OR THE GUY WHO KICKS ASS 70 HOURS A WEEK? i DON'T EVEN KNOW THAT ANSWER MYSELF.

Jeff, you called in sick today because you'd been drinking. That's not kicking ass 70 hours a week. Are you drinking now? If so, I really hope that you stop and get yourself prepared to go back to work tomorrow. Take care of yourself.

Yeah man, those are hard questions to answer, especially when you are exhausted and have been on a bender. We all know you as the guy who really works hard (70+ hours per week) and tries to live a good, healthy and peaceful life. But you have one of the meanest AV's I've ever come across. Your dirty AV can quickly convince you that the hounds of hell are nipping at your heels. But, the good thing is we know the real Jeff.