wow very cool

:You_Rock_

AA isn't for everyone. It wasn't for me. I question things too much and had a hard time buying into the steps. I also got really tired of listening to people's depressing stories. Not bashing it -- whatever works -- just wasn't for me. But I think you do have to have some sort of plan for when, say, you get the urge to drink or you get a craving. Make a list -- a real written list, not just something in your head --- of things you enjoy doing that don't require alcohol. Could be anything from going to Starbucks to exercising to reading a book, seeing a movie, walking the dog -- whatever. Keep the list handy and refer to it when you're tempted. I agree that in the majority of cases, drinking is a coping device to deal with our problems, boredom or unpleasant emotions. The key is to get out of the habit of drinking. Once you do that, it becomes a non-issue and is much easier to stay sober.

That's a great idea Uncorked and another person wrote something similar. A plan to get through the cravings. Today will be day 0 as I am finishing last night leftovers. No money left. I'll keep you all updated.

Being an inquisitive alcoholic, I needed to know. So, I went to a source which never fails me: Webster’s dictionary. I looked it up and it states: “An allergy is an abnormal reaction to any food, beverage or substance of any kind.” An ABNORMAL REACTION!


I tried to see where I was abnormal when it came to alcohol. To my amazement, I didn’t know what was normal or abnormal. For me to find out, I had to go to those ‘normal people’: the nine (9) out of ten (10) people considered to be ‘normal, socially moderate, temperate drinkers’ …Those who drink alcohol and do not get in trouble with it.

I asked if they would describe to me what happens when they take a drink. They said they get a warm comfortable relaxing feeling after one or two drinks… and they don’t want any more for the rest of the night. I don’t feel that way when I drink. I don’t understand a warm, comfortable, relaxing feeling. I get a ‘get up and go somewhere and do something’ feeling. I think it is one of the reasons I love to drink. It makes me feel different than it does for a normal social drinker. They said something else that absolutely amazed me. When they have two (2) or three (3) drinks, they get a slightly tipsy, out of control and the beginnings of a nauseous feeling. They don’t like that tipsy, nauseous feeling, so they only want one or two drinks. Today I realize that is a normal reaction to alcohol.

ALCOHOL IS A TOXIC DRUG. It is a destroyer of human tissue. Normally the mind and the body, when you put something in it that is going to destroy it, will sense what’s there and react by wanting to “throw it up” and “get it out”. The normal reaction to alcohol is a nauseous feeling in the body. My physical reaction, instead of nausea, is a craving for more of the same. That is a physical craving and it is so strong that it overcomes the ability of my mind to stop me after I start. I react entirely abnormally. The difference between normal and abnormal is: the majority of people
(nine (9) out of ten (10) people) don’t get the physical craving.

We react abnormally in two ways: 1) It makes us feel different than normal people; and

2) It produces the phenomenon of craving. That physical craving ensures we will continue until we get drunk every time we take a drink.

While I appreciate your argument, I still disagree. That was written nearly 80 years ago and science hasn't proved it. Just more AA gobbledygook and they wonder why people don't stay.

It may be outdated - the writers could not of course have known stuff they didn't know! But the fact is that it would appear that once we have developed an addiction to alcohol it is more or less impossible for us to drink 'normally' . We have developed an intolerance - an allergy if you like.

The point is, as far as we are concerned it isn't safe to drink.

AA *is* old fashioned and there is stuff in there that feels it. The language in the big book often seems sexist to me for example. But it is of its time.

The programme works for an awful lot of people though. If you do have another go at AA you might want to think about how it works for those who clearly have benefited from it.

I sound like an old timer. I'm not. I've only been sober 15 days. But I made a deliberate decision to return to AA after having similar doubts to yours mainly because I could see people I liked and admired there who made it work for them..and for me at any rate it is the only game in town if I want to stay sober.

There are many people here who will tell you they owe their lives to that 'gobbledygook'.

You can do whatever you want to do sweetichick...but if you're still drinking the bottom line is you're going to have to make even more changes to make recovery work.

If not AA...then what are you going to do? whats your plan?

D

As Dee says,there are many folk who owe their lives to AA.The meetings are a safe inviroment to discuss our problems.

What works for so many people can't really be 'gobbledygook' can it?

Sweetchick - there are people who have found lifetime sobriety in AA. And you are standing on the side-lines, drinking every day on top of an ulcer, and criticising it without ever being willing to try to go through the AA steps. Why not put the cynicism aside for a few months - really embrace the AA steps, sponsor and meetings and then tell us how you are getting on when trying to make it work (instead of always finding excuses why not to try it properly, while finding excuses or 'reasons' to drink every day). And yes, perhaps if you drink 2-3 bottles of wine each night with your friends, then perhaps that advice from AA that it would be better to let go of those friends for a while and go to meetings instead would help you. Your friends may not drink at all, but they are also not stopping you drinking large and harmful quantities of alcohol daily.

You haven't been able to find something that works for you so far. Why not, for a little time, let other people guide you? Or at least come up with an alternative definite plan. Having no money left (which you say will give you day 1) isn't going to be any form of basis for sobriety. Alcoholics will always get more money at times, and without any real plan they will always spend at least some of that new money on booze.

Please - be prepared to be helped, and not just on your own terms (which clearly aren't working for you).

Hi sweetichick.

I went to AA about 10-20 times and wasn't a big fan of it either.

I used other means to stop drinking. AA isn't the holy grail.

Good luck!

Adding an edit - Find something which is right for you. See your doctor as well for other options.

Thanks Michael that really helped.

I hope you find a program that you are willing to put as much effort into that you're putting into justifying your drinking. Science has proven alcoholics process alcohol differently than non-alcoholics. That doesn't matter when it comes to a recovery program. I personally think any well thought out plan to eliminate one's self-pity, entitlement issues, guilt, and/or shame will work if the person is willing to go to any lengths. Once you are convinced you're an alcoholic then recovery is possible. Whatever program you chose to attend, put the same amount of effort you put into your drinking and you'll be successful.

Many prayers sweetichick.

Whether or not you agree with the term 'allergy' is besides the point. I know for *me*, I don't react the same to alcohol as normal drinkers do, PERIOD.

sweetichick - by no means do you have to use AA for your recovery. But if not AA, what then? I learned the hard way after over a decade of trying to quit that I needed to open my mind. I was stubborn, cynical, and far too intelligent for all this recovery-nonsense. But after a decade of trying to quit - where had all that gotten me? Right back into the bottom of a beer bottle.

The act of putting the bottle down isn't difficult. But the breaking down of the ego is the real work of recovery. I know I was awful at taking advice, and I had to learn all the hard lessons myself. But I hope that some of what people have said here will help you.

have you read the big book to conclude with this opinion?

sweetichick
LOL "AA gobbledygook"? Yes the book was written 80 years ago. It hasn't changed because it doesn't need to change. It works just as well today as it did 80 years ago.

Cause and effect is science.
Read Carl Jung's The Doctor's Opinion.

[QUOTE=shortstop81;6307759] If you don't have the "allergy", it doesn't mean you will never have it. You might not have it "yet". Alcoholism is a progressive disease.

You might just be a "hard drinker", and if that's the case, then the problem could be just the alcohol and not alcoholism--but only you can determine that.

Many of us had this experience too but maybe the key word there is "experience"....

[QUOTE] :c011:

Well said.

No discussion of any program or method matters in the long run, if you continue to choose to drink.
Personally , learning about RR/AVRT helped me to realize I was making the choice, uneven though it 'felt' like the choice was being made without my ultimate consent. My addiction was driving the choice , and in that sense always will, but when it came right down to it I was the one going to the store, I was the one using my hands and arms to lift the drink to my mouth, the addiction has no real power to do that , I was letting It control me and giving It the only means of indulging Its desire.
Deciding once and for all to never drink again and then challenging the addiction to try and even make one finger flinch without My direction was when I realized the choice was mine.
Find your choice and then find the support you need , if any, to bolster your resolve. No one or thing can find or give you that choice or ability, you already have it in you , the addiction wants you to believe you need to find it or get it somewhere or from some other thing.
If you really want it , it is yours , make the decision , you absolutely can, rootin for ya

Lots of people stop lots of different ways. No method is going to be easy though and you probably won't agree with any particular method 100%. Find a way that works for you and do it before it kills you.

i have a feeling that between what you posted above and this ealier in the day:

I'll go back to AA tomorrow with a different attitude or at least try to change it. My friend from AA filled my car with petrol so I could afford to get to meetings. I owe it to her to at least make an effort. I have nothing to lose as everyone has said.

there was alcohol consumed.

How are you doing sweetichick?

D