Thank you for sharing. I see the face of my son, as I read this thread.

I hear you dandylion. I have cried for her. But I know she's not hopeless. I guess that's why I've stayed. Sometimes I think I'm in a perpetual state of heartbreak for her, not really for myself. But that's the codependent thinking I guess. Thanks for your heartfelt words. You are right. She is fighting it with all her might. When she drinks, she'll say her worst fear is that I think she's not strong. She doesn't believe in psychiatry. But one day, when she wasn't drinking, I told her she could benefit from talking to a counselor, and it wouldn't mean she's weak - just the opposite. Her response is "I don't need to talk to anyone, ever."

I'm sorry she had a terrible childhood, but even if that contributed to her drinking, once she becomes an alcoholic it becomes just another excuse--the alcoholism is what's driving her drinking now, not her past. I know people with horrific childhoods who recovered just fine. The fact that she had sad things in her past makes YOU no more obligated to tolerate her drinking than if she had none of those issues.

The help is there for her if she wants it--but she's gotta want it.

^^^yes.^^^

With my beloved A (who also has neurological and pychiatric issues, BTW - triple threat), I have felt like I'm in a slow, romantic dance with Death - , you know, that cute guy with the hood and sickle?

This has kept me "suffering in love" - an amazing phrase from my therapist that pretty much says it all.

My only hope has been to turn all the focus on me (i.e. figure out why I am susceptible to this in the first place), while loving my ABF from an ever increasing distance. At first, it was excruciating and way too quiet. And now it is almost peaceful. Everyone around me is noticing the change in me. Notice, the change is in ME.

I have nothing but compassion for you, Blake. Keep working on YOU.
SQ

Thank you SQ. I really feel for you and hope it continues to get better (I know it does). This all sounds so eerily familiar, as well as what may be in my future. A slow, romantic dance with death-- Geez I know exactly what you mean. I didn't dream of that ever - I just want a slow, romantic dance with life!

I have a new therapist, who oddly enough suggested the "suffering in love" thing in different words. The flip side is my girlfriend (when not drinking) regularly says she has never been happier in her life, her friends all tell her she looks great and happy, and she doesn't even take her antidepressants every day anymore (I urged her she must take them as directed!). But the alcohol reveals another dimension of course.

Honestly with the new therapy and posting here, the last 2 weeks have been my first step turning a focus back on me. And I realized I dropped the ball on basic things - I'm exercising every day again. Writing music. Eating three meals a day again - almost ashamed to admit but when I found SR, I was so sick and worried about her that I wasn't able to eat sometimes.

A+

Shoots and scores.

Blake, believe me on the Been There, Done This, Got The T-Shirt status . . . .

soberhawk is telling you something here that you Really Need to Understand.

If you not get this, we can go MUCH deeper. But you Really Need to Understand this.

Many Borderlines seem carry along some high drama stor(ies). And sometimes so many the stories -- that they do not match upon examination. You follow what I am saying? You really need to. Lotta Drama and Fantasy, and they sometimes seem to even forget what they have made up.

Maybe start with the Karpman Drama Triangle.

whole web full of stuff on this, but here is a start >>>

Karpman drama triangle - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Karpman Drama Triangle

Thanks Hammer - I admit yours and soberhawk's were the two I had to think about the most. Still a bit confused. Because I just don't see my gf as manipulative or "trying" to set up a drama - I suppose that's your point - that I don't see it? Her addiction produces drama, then she regrets it, tries to fix, and apparently rinse and repeat. Yes, I was not only sad for her/us after that terrible night, but I was pissed, of course. I had a big day at work the next day. She messed up my schedule, and drained me emotionally to the point I felt nauseous all day. When we had the whole candlelight makeup dinner thing, I was thinking "this is sweet, but this changes nothing." On the advice of my therapist, we talked a bit about her actions and she apologized while not drinking.

I see it more as what ZenMe has called 'intermittent conditioning'. But I welcome your insights. I'll read these links.

I guess what I don't get is it sounds like you're saying this sounds like borderline behavior? I know we can't do any diagnoses here. But I unfortunately have a lot of schooling in the ways of the borderline - my last gf was a classic abusive borderline, and I consulted 2 professionals about how to break up with her when I realized what I was dealing with. She was emotionally and verbally abusive, and it was quite easy to leave her - aside from her breaking a bottle and trying to slit her wrists, and then attempting to stab me. I stayed single for quite a bit after that lol. If anything, my gf seems to be either bipolar or have major depression...those are the diagnoses she believes. She doesn't fly off the handle, or have wild mood swings or love me one second, hate me the next. the alcohol makes her unhinged but in a way that's pretty predictable and depressing, unfortunately. thanks for your time.

Hi Blake, we may be the same age if you were born in 1989.

My fiance is the same as your girlfriend. We have two kids together. I am glad that there is nothing of that nature keeping you tied to her, as hard as it may be for you.

Hugs.

I am very skeptical regarding psychiatric diagnosis among laymen, I think they belong among professionals, it was not my intention to go that way. In reality I do not know your girlfriend from anything other that what you wrote – so take it for what it is.

You just came across as very understanding in what you wrote and I hope I am not offending you by this.

For some people, probably especially those that have not been helped to this in their childhood, it does not come natural to set boundaries for them selfs, they just go over the top – and in reality if they meet a tyrant they probably can not set boundaries there either and get abused. I did see your girlfriend a little like that, at least in what you wrote.

But you know if you are born in 89, then I am a lot older than you and probably a lot more grumpy.

If this is the case I think you should try to be clear on what you want and be honest about it, it is not about being harsh or mean – it is about being a little demanding towards what ones wants and honest.

I did regret a little that I wrote the post. I did see it as I was being a little to cocksure, based on very little information.

Many addicts have some guilt game going on, you drink in the evening, have hangover and feel guilty in the morning – it can help on the guilt to do something good next day and get forgiveness. If that is something that is repeated then it is not healthy – it does not solve anything.

I am not sure I would use the word manipulative – not based on what you wrote at least.

I agree with skarletstarlet – kids make such things a lot more complicated.

You sound like a great guy.

If you are 24 remember to enjoy life :-)

Take care.

Thanks a lot soberhawk. Well, I'm 34, she's 31. 1989 was just a much happier time than now. Suppose for codependent/improvement purposes I should have used 2014 as a happier time lol.

I appreciated both your comments because yeah, I realize I have been too understanding with her. At the same time I've slowly come to understand the depth of her pain and it causes me to 'suffer in love' with her, knowing i can't help. I've allowed her to make her 'sober amends' when sometimes I didn't really want to hear it. What I really want/wanted was a dialog about why she said certain things. Maybe I'm dreaming on that front.

I would offer that your AGF didn't mess up your schedule...you did. She was just doing what A's do. She asked for one drink out that night. You then stay with her while she orders a large sake. On to dinner, where she orders wine. You are in a bar with her at the end of the night. You have your own rationale for why you made your choices.

What are your boundaries? If you had something to do the next day, then perhaps you could have set a boundary for yourself. If she had a sake early on, perhaps you could have said "enough" and called it a night. You could have a boundary of no alcohol when you're out together. If she orders a drink, and crosses that boundary, you leave. But as long as she see's that you're okay with "one drink", and you stay with her for the drinks that follow, nothing changes.

I don't mean to be harsh, but she's not going to change as long as she's enabled in this. The only control you have is over your decisions. You can't save her, but you can contribute to the chaos by enabling her behaviors. We've all been there, and we all do it with the best of intentions when we love an A. It's hard to learn to step back, and get out of the way.

34 is a fine age also.

I did read what she said, I do not know.

If people are very confused I am not sure you can help them by trying to understand them.

You should not be suffering Blake, that is not what you want.

Blake,

I did the same thing with my X before the xagf. I went to a therapist to try to understand and how best to break it off... that's how much we care, to a fault.

It's a fact of life that some relationships don't work. At one point I thought my xagf could be marriage material! (a first for me) but as I got to know her more, as the honeymoon period effects started to wear off, I realize she really isn't marriage material, and not good for me either. It takes about 2 years for you to really know a person IMO. So I'm working on me so that next time I make better decisions so I don't waste my time.

Since my work and health suffered now I have to work extra hard to get back on track. Don't let your health suffer, only going to extend your recovery time.

Ps we are the same age.

Thanks for this - the enabling is one of the hardest things for me to watch for and identify. It was a little hard here because if I left, she'd be stranded 40 miles from home, and most certainly would just drive back. I so wanted to say 'enough', but in my mind i'm going 'you can't control it'. Maybe I took it too literally.

Well, I really need to make my boundaries known to her. She is not getting the hint that I quit partaking in any alcohol around her a long while back.

As I type this, she is texting me about plans she has to take us to a craft brewery and stay the night. Under the guise of 'they have great food'. Sounds like a drinking vacation. :/

.
Perhaps your actions of being in her presence while she drinks is clouding the hint? Alcoholics will take the tiniest of YOUR actions to justify and rationalize IN THEIR MIND their continued drinking. If you continue to spend time with her while she is actively drinking in front of you, couldn't that be viewed as "approval?"

Just something to think about.

Why in the world would you want to go on this "vacation" which is going to be a big PIA for you. Either way if she drinks or not you are in for trouble. Been there done that...

If it were me I would tell her no and go do something fun that you have neglected lately. What would stop you from saying no to this? (I think this would be beneficial for you to think about it)

my 2 cents

Mused the same and sort of figured --

Blake has not had enough pain . . . quite yet.

Soon to discover the meaning of the phrase . . . . "Let go or be dragged."

Blake pretend for a moment you don't know each other in the ways you do.

If you were matchmaking for a friend, introducing them as a potential couple, how do you think your friend would feel if you picked her as his dream date?

As someone your friend might might marry or start a family with?

I know you have feelings for her, but if you stay together, you will be rewarded with a a life full of heartache and drama.

Imagine you had a son who was in a relationship with her.
What would you tell him to do?
How would you feel? Pleased for him, sad for him, worried about him?

If it was my son, I think I would feel like he had got a raw deal.

I would want him to know that he is worthy of a happy, carefree
relationship.

Not dates where he is beside himself with fear as to what crazy antic she is going to pull. If she is going to make a show of herself to the rest of the restaurant.

If she is going to make rude and crude comments in front of a server who quite frankly does not need that when all they are doing is trying to earn a living. Thats not treating the server very nicely at all. It is completely disrespectful of her.


I really do hope I have given you some things to think about.

I really do wish you the best xxxx

I didn't mean to mislead anyone - I put the stop on going on that brewery excursion when she suggested it. It sounds ludicrous to even type it. I do realize how bad an idea that would be and wasn't going to let it happen. I was just talking/typing outloud because it was poignant, at least for me, that while at work she was looking this up. Your points are well taken, and hard to hear, but I need to hear.

Sasha, thank you so much. The mental exercise about the parents is something that got me to SR. Of course they would never approve. They would be heartbroken for me, but also angry with me for my bad judgment, and my credibility with them would be forever in question. There's never been drinking in my family, and there is no room for errors like this.

Okay Blake...we're all kind of on you right now....confronting you with the ugly truth. But please don't beat yourself up over this. This is a cunning, baffling disease. It can be very insiduous, and it can take a while before you realize this is a big problem. A lot of us on here have been in that crazy painful chaos of loving someone who can't love us back because of their addiction. If love was enough to save them, none of us would be here!! Every one would be sober! But it doesn't work that way.

I'm glad you nixed the weekend plans. I would suggest you let her know you're done being in her company with alcohol. But then be ready to be tested. She'll order a drink somewhere, you have to be ready to leave. Otherwise your words are just words.

I hoe you find an Alanon group near you. You seem willing to learn, and listen. Those meetings have been life savers for a lot of us on here. You can find them on line, and there are men only meetings in some places. You will find a good local support system for you while you work through this.

(((hugs)))