Sponsor . . . . Shopping? Tips?
 

Well, I have done my six Al-Anon meetings.

Yunno. Six meetings and you are One Of Us (repeat) One Of Us. One Of Us. :)

So there I am and here I am for some time to come from what I understand.

Somewhere down the path, I understand that a Sponsor is part of the path?

I like to do look-ahead and roadmap as much as possible and often more than possible, so I asked something about it at the second meeting -- and the older ladies sort of chuckled and said there would plenty of time for that.

I say "older ladies" because most seem older or at least as old as I am and it is mostly women. (btw, I am a guy, 48). I was pretty much a basket case my first couple of meetings, so bless their co-dependent souls they have sort of adopted me as a special case. Not a good thing, but I know the look and behaviors. OK. Things are what they are.

I follow the sponsor thing is usually same sex -- keeps the 13th steps down -- so to speak -- from what I follow. On the other hand, Mrs. Hammer tells me she wound up in bed with her first AA sponsor (12 years ago -- female pole dancer who totally relapsed at 10 months), so even that is not really fully true. At any rate, I am just as comfortable or not -- male or female, I guess -- most of my PTSD recovery group was female -- at least the sane ones. My therapist is a woman, and most the folks in Al-Anon are women.

I am babbling. What I wanted to ask for is tips, pointers, don't-do, when, where, how, etc. on the Sponsor thing. Any tips, experiences, etc., would be helpful and appreciated.

Thanks.

Having a sponsor has been invaluable to me. We no longer have Alanon in our little town, but I am blessed to have a sponsor who is black belt AA and Alanon (I qualify for both programs).

That being said, I am female, and my sponsor is male. There have been periods of years where I was the only female in recovery in my little town, and for me, having a sponsor of the opposite sex has created no problems whatsoever. He is happily married, and has never steered me wrong in my recovery.

He has a rock solid program, and has been consistent in how he works it over the past 22 years I have known him. I have seen him struggle, grow, and benefit from recovery, and that is something I admire in him.

He definitely has what I want in recovery, and to me, that is a must in seeking out a sponsor.

Feel free to PM me if you have any questions or just want to talk one-on-one. :)

I am an alcoholic woman very early in my recovery. I have no problem with my husbands female sponsor in al-anon. I do have a problem that he has another female "friend" in the group that he is getting close to. He is pretty much the only man in the group and seems to have become quite a novelty in the group. Right or wrong I have trouble with the understanding that he shows these women that he never had for me. He was the abusive one in our marriage. I have been married to him for 16 years. The alcoholism has only been a part of our life for the last 3 years. His verbal abuse and lying has been there through our whole marriage. I resent that he is now seen as the poor long suffering spouse.
I know I need to let go of these resentments but although I am staying sober I feel like as he gets closer and closer to this woman we are getting farther and farther apart. If I keep trying to swallow these feelings of insecurity I know I will start drinking again.
I dislike the fact that if we have an argument he tells these women details. I think we need a professional for our personal marital problems but he refuses. We have a small group and I feel that there is no privacy or anonymity. If I try to talk to him about maybe going to a different town he becomes angry and tries to say that I am just trying to control him and keep him from being friends with this woman.
I am starting to think that I need to leave him so I can have a recovery without this stress and jealousy.:a108:

Welcome to Sober Recovery lostone460

Can I start a new thread for you? You can introduce yourself to the family and get more support for yourself.

lostone - you need to do what you need to do, for you. You can't change him, and if you can't deal with his behavior then perhaps it's time to make changes from your side of the street.

Your recovery is the most important thing.

My experience is that, much of the time, one gets a very, very different attitude and approach from Al Anons than from AAs on issues like finding a sponsor, working the Steps, etc..... In my experience, AAs typically have a much greater sense of urgency and of "the right way" vs. any other way with these things.......and that is a sense of urgency as in "this-is-a-life-or-death-matter" and that I personally share, even though I am Al Anon -- and not a "double winner."

My personal feeling is that my recovery and my spiritual journey are just as important and urgent as anyone else's. So, when I decided that I was going to "do the 12 Step deal," I wanted to get to it and I wanted a sponsor. It ended up that things didn't go exactly as I had planned:

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ml#post2354258

But, you know, I was extremely determined, and so I did what I had to do to make it work for me. Also, at this point (closing in on 6 years), the person on whom I rely most often for "sponsorship"-like support is an AA woman, sober 28 years,.......and, lately, I've been getting the added benefit of her sponsor's support, too -- and that woman has been sober longer than God!

I guess there's probably a couple of things I would say, in general, about getting what you need: The 12 Steps are the 12 Steps, and, if you can't find everything you need and want in one set of rooms, attend open meetings in the rooms of other programs, too. When you've been seen around long enough to be known and long enough to be perceived as serious and willing to do the deal, you will have a lot more options open to you for help, support and fellowship. Anyone who truly lives the last phrase of the 12th Step ("and to practice these principles in all our affairs") is not going to be playing exclusivity games.

One other thing that I think is important: really, truly you do not want a sponsor to whom you might find yourself sexually attracted or who might find herself attracted to you -- that's really what the "same-sex sponsorship" rule comes down to. So, if one of the ladies you've met has what you want -- spiritually and in general program-wise -- and you are relatively confident that sexual attraction would not be an issue on either side, then just go and present your case to her, focusing on your commitment to working a good program and on what you see in her program and character that you want. If her own recovery is truly strong, she should not be so overly hung-up on the "rules" (of which, BTW, there actually are none -- they are all "suggestions") that she'll refuse to help you out -- at least temporarily. And temporarily is fine for a start.

Bottom line, I guess I would just say, whatever happens, don't let anything stand between you and working your program.

Good luck -- freya

Boy THIS is an OLD thread.

From the Way-Back Files.

I have a sponsor and very trusted Alanon folks I go to for advice.

But the STEPS -- I have been floundering for a couple of months, now.

BUT . . . . AS OF TODAY! I HAVE ME A STEPS SPONSOR.

[thank you, Jesus]

Real Strong One, too. Starting with the AA Steps. Basis being -- why would we not start with the real foundation work, and then move up to Alanon?

OKAY! If that is the way the road goes, I am on it.

HAPPY! HAPPY! HAPPY! Happy Hammer Heart Time.

Happy New Year to You.

And Happy New Life to ME!

Oh, okay.....I was so confused. You are well-versed in Alanon so I was wondering why you'd be asking questions about finding a sponsor!

Yeah, that was from 2009, when I first stumbled in here.

Now just some Steps away. :)

Well I guess don,t get a pole dancer for starters :)

Take your time and get to know people before you ask them to be your sponsor,

and hopefully you,ll end up with a guy.

what was alanon sponsor for if you didnt do steps w that person?

THAT part is from 4 years ago. :)

Just got up to a Serious Step Sponsor today.

I started into this much righter back those 4 years ago.

Had a Sponsor who got me up into the 4th Step.

Real Life changing stuff even at that level. God smiled greatly on me.

Got what I wanted and totally dumped Alanon and stopped the Step Work.

Lived to regret all that. Life and Mrs. Hammer all spiraled out of control.

After I got back in Alanon, I went looking for what I wanted as the Big Happy Ending.

My current Sponsor is old. Near 80. Fading out and really just sort of doing "duty" until he dies and gets home with his wife. (She was AA and he Alanon for 34 years.) She died this last year. They were married for 56 years. But that is what I sort of wanted for Mrs. Hammer and me.

He would let me (not) do things at my own pace.

Today's Step Sponsor is much more Basic Training, Get It Right, Get It Done.

Better match for how I work (or fail to) in life.

I will still keep my current sponsor -- the Step Sponsor required it in fact. Just figured I would put this type stuff in this thread.

i get it. you started. got what you thought you wanted and stopped. then realized oops, not quite what i wanted. and started back.

you have made a lot of progress. some people go a b c d, others go a c a b a b c d. its all about the journey. my thing for a while was trying to see the positive in bad (really bad) situations i lived through. one take away is that well that was a hard experience, but now i have it under my belt. i know what it feels like. some people never experience things like that. i did. and lived to tell.

mkay.

Have my first assignment.

Made my first morning report call. Was hoping to hit Step Sponsor's voice mail, but wound up talking a little. Got off before I got Peanut Butter mouth, or my voice started cracking.

I can do this.

. . . . by God's Grace.

Thank you, SR.

You can do this!

what i meant was some people take a direct route, others take the scenic route. i have take the scenic route many times and had to learn hard lessons, but in the end i am glad i learned them.

i also understand your tagline now.

Yeah. Put less kindly (thank you) Some Alanon folks . . . well THIS one at least . . . can Relapse. I did. Hard. About a year and a half in or so into the Program. I got everything I wanted and just quit.

Strange how I left the path. We came out of the deep hood side of Dallas. Rough Area. Just Rough. Getting the kids a decent house and decent school was my 4th Step. Just 12 hours into it we already had the house. We had been looking for 3 years. But just so I could know it was a God thing, He delivered that day. Big family house, way up in Lilywhite, on an acre with trees and horses in the meadow in back.

But I loved my old Alanon group so much that I did not want to go to another group up here. Even when folks would come and ask me to show up to help new guys. Boy, THAT is some shameful and selfish sh1t.

But God Gives and God Takes Away. Mrs. Hammer had already Relapsed, as well, and was spiraling downward. We wound up homeless just from the crazy -- not money like I would have thought. She wound up in Rehab, and I am back in Alanon -- and I have learned the only Bad Alanon is No Alanon.

And God restores. Have a nice house again, the kids are happy in school. Mrs. Hammer is working in a Rehab Center helping other folks. As I am reading in the Big Book this morning . . . THAT is the Best Way for an A to keep their Sobriety -- to be helping others. I guess God knows His business.

As for me . . . Continue to March. (my favorite military drill command). I pray I NEVER again take my eyes off of Him, His Will and His Way.

Yeah, I am an Electrical Guy. Texas Master and Electrical Engineering. But I came up through the trades. And often on job sites there is a pleasant animosity between the Plumbers and Electricians. Both sides look down on each other. So I was SEVERELY humbled when at meeting a Plumber told me that he would think it extremely stupid to not be doing the Steps when in a Step based program.

So I have struggled for the past couple of months trying to do the Step stuff, but making no real progress.

Had to ask at a meeting last week for help. God delivers. As always.

Probably what is true on the A side is true on our side, too.

Best Way for an A to keep their Sobriety -- to be helping others.

I guess God knows His business.

Hey, folks, not for nuthin', but I cannot think of a single reason that a pole dancer would necessarily not be a good sponsor.

We need to be careful of slipping into that kind of judgmental, sex-negativity and into making these kinds of totally bizarre assumptions.

I mean, seriously, where is it written that a pole-dancer can't be a spiritual person? Can't have good recovery? Can't have had a spiritual awakening as the result of doing the 12 Steps and/or can't perhaps be the best person in the world to pass that on to someone else?

This kinda stuff bothers me a lot. I hear this crap from sponsees all the time...and the only thing that pisses me off more than hearing them say it is the way they just assume that I'm gonna co-sign it, no questions asked: like somehow being a recovered person necessarily means that I'm never going to have sex again -- unless I get married again -- to a man-born-male -- and suddenly develop a weird obsession with the missionary position; like because they perceive me as a spiritual person, I am some kind of sex-negative ***** 2 seconds away from joining the convent (not that I necessarily think that all nuns are sex-negative, but this seems to be the assumption on which most sex-negative people are operating).

Just last week I was going over 4th Step directions in the book with a sponsee, and when we got into the sex inventory part, she says to me, totally nonchalant and offhandedly, like it is the most to-be-expected comment in the world: "I really need for you to teach me how to be a lady when it comes to sex!"

...and my first thought is: 'WTF?????'

...except that I am totally familiar with WTF-it's about because I deal with this kinda of sex-negative BS all the time with sponsees, so my second and third thoughts are: 'Not again!' and 'Oh, sweetie, if that's really what you want, you really need to get a different sponsor!'

...and finally, because God is in charge and I do have an unfortunately sad amount of experience dealing with this kind of trite, not-at-all-thought-through, knee-jerk morality and sex-negativity from sponsees, what I actually said is:

"Well, let's do the inventory first, and, when we get to your 5th Step on this part, we'll talk about that...about what your values and ideals are around sex and sexuality and what you need to be doing to live according to those, rather than just some free-floating nonsense you might have absorbed from the culture you were raised in..."

..at this point they usually look at me like I'm speaking ancient Greek, so the rest goes something like this: "...because we just read about how only God can be the arbiter of our sex conduct. So, this all depends on how you understand God...not on how your neighbor, or your mom, or patriarchy in general, or sex-negative people in recovery, or the church you grew up in understands Him -- on God as you understand Him...and we just read that the no-nos here - just like in everything else -- are acting out of dishonesty, fear, inconsideration, and selfishness.

It doesn't say anything anywhere about being 'unladylike,'...so you probably need to think a little about -- and maybe take it into prayer and meditation, too -- : What does being 'a lady' mean to you? And then what does that have to do with your sexual identity and your sexual expression -- if it even ends up having anything at all to do with it....because that is for you and your God to decide...and you need to think about those no-no's, because those no-no's are the things that make a particular sexual situation 'wrong.' According to the book, it doesn't matter what you're doing or who your doing it with, what matters is are you being selfish, inconsiderate, dishonest or fearful?"

So, yeah, let's not be trying to arbitrate, or assuming we have the right to arbitrate, the sex conduct of pole-dancers...because it's silly to even assume we know what it is on an individual to individual basis!

freya

Um, my only thought about the pole dancer was that she shouldn't have been sleeping with her sponsee. That does seem like dubious behavior.

what is sex negative? neither male nor female?

freya,

You make a Very Good point that a Pole Dancer could be a fine sponsor.

Please consider that I wrote that back 4 years ago. When I was pretty much full-bore jackass. Now maybe I am down to half-ass jackass. I hope.

I had joked about that stuff for years. Not to put down the Pole Dancer. but rather . . . because . . . .egad . . . how to say this . . . That your girl slept with girls is . . . ummm . . . sort of bragging rights.

How is that for Jackass?

I have learned a little. Maybe just a little, since.

You might have caught a thread on here where I was laughing about getting a motel room at a Crack Ho Motel, while attending an AA conference in Shreveport with Mrs. Hammer. I was walking around joking about the Crack Ho Motel while Mrs. Hammer was horrified with me as some of her friends there from AA were former Crack Hos.

----------------

Probably about 6 months after that top post in this thread, I had settled in to the Alanon Group I was talking about there. One of my friends there was a deathly thin Black girl. This was before Mrs. Hammer's Anorexia set in, so I pretty much assumed the Black girl was a Crack Ho with AIDS, that was not uncommon in the 'hood, and I figured I was a hell-of-a-guy for sitting with her, being nice, and holding her hand during the closing prayers. And thinking that Mrs. Hammer and Crack Hos would be pretty impressed with me, now.

Turned out I was all wrong. My Alanon friend -- she was a very intelligent and educated person, with the sweetest, smoothest voice and wisdom. I can still hear her now, as I close my eyes. She was not an addict. Nor Ho. Nor any of the rest of my ignorance. She had Sickle Cell Anemia and was slowly dying week-by-week.

While I thought I was being all nice and magnanimous, in truth I was being a being an ass. It was my deadly-thin-Black-friend-girl who was being nice and kind to an ignorant, cracker, redneck . . . me.

When I figured that out I went home and cried about it on and off for a week. Still brings tears to my thinking about it.

-------------

So at any rate.

Thank you for your very good points. I welcome your corrections of me. Seems to be the only way I learn is for someone to tell or show me that I am wrong.

Thank you.

Sure. That is what is called the 13th Step.

In truth, the Pole Dancer should not have been sponsoring anyone. She was too early in the program, and should have been working on herself.

And Mrs. Hammer can get wwaaayyyy across the line.

Glad you cleared that up Hammer,i was surprised when I read it,as you always seemed so experienced when it comes to alanon,i suppose I should have checked the date.

'Sex-negative' as a term used in Sex and Gender Studies (or Queer Studies or Women's Studies) refers to an attitude toward sex (referring to 'sex acts, behaviors, practices' here, not sex as 'male, female, intersexed or asexual) and sexuality that is narrow, rigid, limited/limiting, judgmental, controlling, fearful, moralistic, etc... and pretty much all-around negative. Sex-negative people tend to think of sex and sexuality as taboo and/or dirty and/or embarrassing. They tend to become very uncomfortable when the topic comes up and often will try to shut the discussion down by relying on common social and/or religious sex-negative beliefs and stereotypes (i.e. like the idea that a pole-dancer or a stripper or someone who is comfortable with casual sexual encounters cannot possibly be a recovered and/or spiritual person) and/or by manipulating or playing off of the guilt and shame that so many people carry around this part of their lives.

freya

There are a few guys in the Al-Anon meetings I go to, but even if I were single I don't think I'd want to date them because they are too much like me, to the point where it would be a disaster.

oh yeah.

There is some saying about Sick + Sick does not equal Well or something like that. (help if anyone knows the right way that goes).

Way I figure things right now, I cannot handle the one I have, who needs another right now?

Okay. Step Sponsor Drama Update . . .

I am going through them like a Polar Bear jumping from Iceberg to Iceberg, floating South. Earlier today, I thought I was going swimming.

My . . . .

(less than a week, now)

. . . Step Sponsor calls this morning and said that her . . .

(Yes, HER. Yes, I did "conveniently" leave this out of this discussion. Yes. I know, I know),

. . . Sponsor forbid her from going past Step 3 with me, but she could do up through Step 3, but no further . . . .

[Step 4 can get rather intense due to Sexual Issues]

She recommended that I go to the Area Huge "Mecca" Meeting at noon today and plead my case to a guy I call "Yoda." 30 years in, Sponsor of all Sponsors.

(My inner jackass brayed inside my head -- Great , if she is not my sponsor does THAT mean I can date her?)

So I went to the meeting. Plead my case . . .

(while I stared so hard at the toes of my shoes, I drilled holes through them)

Yoda turned me down.

Sent me to another.

Who also turned me down.

(I was thinking This Polar Bear is Going Swimming)

BUT the second guy put me in contact with a Quiet Low-Key Group . . . .

Who are JUST starting a 20 Week Intense Men Group Step Process Study Group intended to work folks RIGHT THROUGH THE STEPS -- RIGHT!

I am signed up.

Can keep my current . . .

(6 days now)

Step Sponsor for Step 1, 2, 3 and THEY WILL ASSIGN ME a Sponsor for Step 4 and beyond.

ONE HAPPY POLAR BEAR, HERE, LET ME TELL YOU.

Thank You, God.

Who . . . Closes one door and opens opens up the Toll Free Super-Highway . . .

So....

There is sometimes a misconception that affairs start in a bedroom or that they start with intent.

Not so much. There are a lot of people who would NEVER have an affair except that well, they do.

Affairs typically start when a member of the opposite sex is meeting an unmet emotional need because that creates intimacy and then another need or two and then whoooops.

By no means would I suggest that having an opposite sex sponsor is going to or even likely to lead to an affair but if they are someone you find remotely - I mean REMOTELY attractive then think that through.

When do you really need your sponsor and why? If there comes a time when my wife relapses and I am very emotional and very upset with my wife and feeling betrayed and yada yada yada and I want to bawl my eyes out I'm thinkin I'm a WHOLE lot better off crying on Hammer's lumpy old nasty shoulder 4 inches from his hairy armpit because there ain't no way in hell Hammer or I are all that likely to get confused there - we're gonna bitch and moan and commiserate and etcetera (Hammer - let's assume I'm 2% less appealing than I described you buddy - I'm illustratin here not being ugly... well yeah, OK, think of me as ugly that helps make the point).

Now... freeze frame, remove Hammer's aforementioned lumpy and malodourous shoulder, insert silky smooth, jasmine scented shoulder which is strategically located about 4" above a .....different gland that men seem to have an odd fascination with (guilty, can't deny it, can't explain it, it's one of those things I've just learned to accept).

Now.... If I am feeling misunderstood and hurting and let's assume that our aforementioned hypothetical pole dancer has a heart of gold and just collects those singles so that she can send care packages to starving kids in the third world and she's not one to flaunt her pulchritude for nefarious purposes.... well crap, that's WORSE. Empathy and understanding and smooth jasmine scented... BAD BAD BAD BAD!!!!!!!!

joking aside, when we are in crisis mode with a spouse and turn to a sponsor or a friend or other source of understanding and compassion to vent it's good to feel understood and valued and it's good to provide that for someone who is hurting but this isn't a recovery thing it's a marriage thing and a boundary thing. I am nuts about my wife and I genuinely don't think there is a woman who could turn my head but hey, when I met Poh she was off limits for other reasons and whoooooops.

Now my man Hammer? I think I can speak for both of us when I say that even if there was a perfect storm of misery and both of our wives ran off drunk with Chippendale studs and took the pole dancer with them then we could cry on one another's shoulder all night in a state of total misery and confusion but ain't nobody getting THAT confused!

....we have enough to worry about don't we? We don't exactly share a lot of members with the "Never made an unwise romantic choice in our life" forum around here do we? Or am I the only one who figures it is not a risk worth taking????

;-)

Ok people. Kindly share your personal experience with the original question. General statements and analysis of the population at large is just opinion. Take it to some TV talk show.

If you don't have direct personal experience in the subject being discussed then sit on your hands. Go for a walk. Call a friend. Come back tomorrow and find a thread where you _do_ have experience.

Mike
Moderator, SR