Step 1 2 3 Dance
 

I have a friend who's been in and out of AA for 18 years, still on the steps 1 2 3 dance.

Now, after her last relapse, her sponsor has suggested 90 in 90.

Sorry, it's not the meetings that have helped me get to one year; it was working the steps 4-9 that made the difference. 10-12 daily also helps. I have the steps to work in any situation I am in; I don't have a meeting any time I am having problems in life....

When will this sponsor realize that this person needs the solution that is in the steps?

More or less just venting here. My friend now believes it's the 90 in 90 that will help her. I tend to disagree.

Opinions on the topic welcomed!

I danced in and out of AA for 3 years. It took me getting a sponser that told me either I work the steps or die drinking. My experience was I had to work all steps in order to stay sober. Like you, I work 10-12 daily.

Maybe with her doing 90 in 90, she will see someone who has what she wants.

It's like going to an emergency room while bleeding profusely and choosing to not be seen by the doctor

Sugarbear, I honestly think that people who have NOT worked the steps really think that meetings can keep them sober, while they walk around w/ tons of resentments and baggage they could have been free from had they worked through the steps.

I only think and can say this is cuz i used to believe it too! :)

Fellowship is very helpful in very early sobriety.

But fellowship isn't the solution, no human power will ever be the solution .

The solution is the steps.......nose in the book for 90 days sounds good

"Whether such a person can quit upon a nonspiritual basis depends upon the extent to which he has already lost the power to choose whether he will drink or not." (BB page 34)

Not everyone in AA has lost the power of choice. Some folks just needed to change their social situation. The fellowship of AA provides a great place for them to have that.

I did the 1-2-3 waltz until I got me a bellyful of booze and was willing to do anything to live,including taking the 12 steps.

Sugarbear,I guess you have told her how you finally got sober and what it takes?

90 in 90 is fine if you are doing the steps.

I can't imagine that the sponsor hasn't suggested moving forward with the steps as a solution to relapse.

But....some people refuse.

All of my sponsors say that the first three steps are the ones given to you. They do not get worked. In particular, you cannot decide to "believe." You either do or do not.

In my experience, sponsors start working with a sponsee when they are ready for a fourth step. I think it is great to read here that there are sponsors willing to give more support early on.

I was one of those who never moved on because I did not know how. So rather than clucking over how misguided someone is, why not offer help? Early recovery is where people need the most help, so maybe offering to help someone understand the first three steps would be a good start. I know for sure, I would have been glad for the help!

although meetings are important, going to meetings and not drinking didnt treat my alcoholism. it was working every step that got me sober and practicing the principles of every step in all of my affairs that keeps me sober.

how another sponsor takes another sponsee through the steps is none of my business.

I agree. Faith without works is dead and work involves inventory, amends and service to others. Trying to get by on just the first three steps is like paddling a boat with one oar in the water. You just end up going in circles.

Boleo--

I agree and that is why I eventually left 12-step recovery. I needed to DO something and after years of trying to "get" belief I realized that it might never come.

I thought about lying and saying that I had the first three steps so that my sponsor would work with me. But I thought that if I based my recovery on a lie that would not be good.

It seems to me that people trying to get through the first three steps need MORE one-on-one help, not LESS. I know that there are never enough sponsors blah blah blah---but I think that if 12-step programs did more for people in early sobriety they would help more people. But the pattern seems to be to complain about the newcomer and wait for them to prove themselves.

If I had had someone help me through the first three steps maybe I would have stayed in the program. It was not something I could do on my own. If it is not a sponsors place, then maybe others can help.

Of course it is easier to see that at a distance and who am I to make suggestions. But I bet with more sponsor involvement early on there would be less 1-2-3 dance going on.

You all just relieved my frustration!

Thanks to ALL of you!!

I'm kind of wondering if my friend is just avoiding the real step work. We'll get her there, in time!

Thanks again!!

:c011:

The way I understand it Dr. Bob didn't stop drinking until approaches for Step 9 were made.

Two guys I know, stuck on Step 8, drank again. Wasn't much, they came back right away. A bit more willing to get willing and start on their 9th Step.


I've met folks that didn't get into the 4th Step until after a year or more. Untreated alcoholism - it was either drink - or get with the program. They opted for the program.

Your right, the problem is not the with the newcomer. Nor is it all old-timers who tell newcomers to take their time. If there is any single source for the blame, it would be the short form of Tradition 3 - "The ONLY requirement for membership...".

Unfortunately, this quote gets over-used to the point that many members (new & old) think of it as a suggestion to do nothing except attend meetings.

Boleo--

You could be right. But without some guidance of course there will be misunderstandings.

Maybe with the growth of the internet it is different now than it was 10 years ago when I started, but I have to admit that there is a lot that I did not understand from the Big Book alone. I learned a lot on this forum about the program that I never knew when I was a part of it.

I think that the program is so concerned that we do not become dependent on other people for sobriety that we overlook all the parts of the Big Book that say that members need to be available to help each other. Throwing a Big Book at the newcomer, ordering them to throw out their green clothing and wash oldtimers' cars, then telling them to get back to their sponsor for their 4th step---it is not enough.

It does not surprise me that so many never get to the point of getting to work with their sponsors.

A lady took me through the steps last year meeting w/ her once a week for an hour for about 2 months or so. She gave me a LOT of homework.... I was VERY willing. I had been a chronic relapser for 20 yrs plus. I had so much self hatred and self loathing I hated everyone else and I was positive everyone else hated me.

She wasn't even my sponsor, but the relief that followed was incredible!! It was as if a 1000 lb weight had been removed from my shoulders. I am forever grateful for her.

Thank you M.M.S.!! You are an angel!!

Maybe somehow you could help her...Not to undermine her sponsor, but in addition to her sponsors work? ;)

Dr. Bob was sober and DID work the steps in order before working on his ninth step, but, he did all of his ninth step in one day.

The thing that got him stuck originally was that he didn't want to confess to his patients or colleagues that he was under the influence when he performed medical work/decisions.

The difference was that there were about 6 steps, based on The Oxford Group, that the original AAer's worked. Bill W. turned those 6 steps into 12. 12 is a spiritual number. See page 13 of the 4th edition of the big book (well, page 13 hasn't changed since the 1st edition). Read Not-God A History Of Alcoholics Anonymous by Ernest Kurtz.

It seems to me like there was more action sooner in those original 6 precepts.

1. "We admitted we were licked."
2. "We got honest with ourselves." 
3. "We talked it over with another person. "
4. "We made amends to those we had harmed." 
5. "We tried to carry this message to others with no thought of reward." 
6. "We prayed to whatever God we thought there was ."

One can do 90 and 90 AND work steps 4 through 12. For me, the third step is working 4 through 12. As they say, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. That's all a sponsor can do.

She claims that not one sponsor has taken her past step 3. Around here, I know this to be true. I lived through it until I found Apryl, who is going back to CA tomorrow....

I am a newcomer. From what i'm experiencing so far, it's not "either..or" but "both...and". My sponsor is working with me through the big book; we read it together and are currently on step one. She's really taken the time to explain the history of AA, how the BB evolved, what the different editions are about etc. I really am being guided through each step so I can understand and internalize the process of recovery. At the same time, I need meetings; at the moment, i need one every day in order to stay on the path. I am so wobbly, one tip and i could tip into a nice glass of red wine. I can't call my sponsor as much as I need help, so knowing I'm going to a meeting at X time is like a lifeline for the day. Anyway, that's my two cents. Step work is the recovery; meetings are the support for my recovery.


Zorah

3 Meetings a day while not working and in recovery. That is where I met Apryl.

First thing Apryl and I did was to work the steps.

Then the big book study and reading about AA history. Lots of discussions. Other books read and discussed.

Still going through the big book with my sponsor, although now that Apryl had gone back to CA, I now have another sponsor. Same process through the steps, 3 times altogether by 8 months.

Just another way, but the steps are the solution.

This is not rehab, this is real life relief and freedom that I've experienced. Again, just another way to work through my "ism."

The point is, the new solution is in the steps, no matter how one gets there. I didn't do any writing until the 4th and 8th steps.

When someone can't stay sober it's about Step 1. It's the only step we must do perfectly to stay sober. The other steps are based on us understanding that we're powerless over alcohol. I agree with this sponsor.

Having had a Spiritual Awakening as the result of these steps - I now realize that the Spiritual Awakening could have never been the result of step 1 only. In fact, I would say the only thing I realized as the result of the step 1 was the problem. I was screwed without a Higher Power.

That's How It Works for those of us who are beyond human aid. The solution was found in the remaining steps. I had to find a Power greater than myself and that power came from working steps 4 - 9. That Power remains with me so long as I work steps 10 - 12.

Step one is self knowledge and the big book states self knowledge cannot keep me sober. Action is needed to seek the power that will keep me sober. I can admit I am powerless but it is a mute point if I don't seek power, actually I can think of nothing worse than sitting in the knowledge I am woot defense against the first drink and not being given the solution. If I were diagnosed diabetic would you refuse me insulin or tell me to wait, take my time?

I strongly disagree with this idea of "doing step 1 perfectly." I admitted I was powerless over alcohol. I admitted my life was unmanageable. I had no other solution but to drink. Off and on for 25 years I had no solution BUT to drink. I had not been guided past step 3.

Bill W. once said that "the only thing that is perfect or absolute in AA is NOTHING." Nothing is absolute, nothing is perfect; we are not a higher power nor are we saints.

I knew for 25 years, that I was powerless over alcohol. Without a new solution, without a new manager, life was hopeless and unmanageable.

I don't know where this "the only step we must do perfectly is step 1" came from as it is not in the big book or anywhere in the approved AA literature. I assume it's another rehab myth.

Page 60: "No one among us has been able to maintain anything like perfect adherence to these principles. We are not saints. The point is, that we are willing to grow along spiritual lines. The principles we have set down are guides to spiritual progress. We claim spiritual progress rather than spiritual perfection."

To do step 1 "perfectly" goes against the entire precept of what AA is about.

I can't obtain a conscious contact with my higher power without working through ALL 12 steps. It's plain and simply written in our literature.

How does one work a step perfectly in a program of action which has imperfection as it's stepping stone?

Steps 1 through 3 prepare us for steps 4-12. I don't work steps 1-3 daily. I work steps 10-12 daily. My spirituality is a constant struggle. I have not reached nirvana yet. Agree to disagree.

How do you define "doing step 1 perfectly?"

I certainly mastered being powerless and having an unmanageable life. I admitted step 1 daily. Nothing changed. I still don't admit to working step 1 perfectly, I could have messed up a whole lot more in my life than I already had. No perfection there.

That [step alone] didn't help me to stay stopped from a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body. "No human power could have relieved our alcoholism. God could and would if he were sought."

My solution is in the steps of AA.

"Only Step One, where we made the 100 percent admission we were powerless over alcohol, can be practiced with absolute perfection."
(12&12 page 69)

However, no where does it say step 1, even if practiced perfectly, will keep us sober. In fact the Big Book says sobriety is not enough at least 4 times;

"We feel that elimination of our drinking is but a beginning." (p 19)
"Our liquor was but a symptom." (p 64)
"We feel a man is unthinking when he says that sobriety is enough." (p 82)
"Cessation of drinking is but the first step away from a highly strained, abnormal condition." (p 122)

Thank you, Boleo! :)

I never assume my babies are ready to go straight to step 4. There have been some very good points raised about the first three steps. Step one in particular is vital. If it is not done 100%, then drinking will always be an option. And there will always be an excuse as to why we really don't need to go to any lengths. Something left out of step 5, an amends not made, these are the things that lead back to drinking, and they often have their origin in a less than total acceptance of step one.