Originally Posted by
wpainterw 
This matter of character "defects". Is it not possible, even likely, that these character defects are a result of drinking? That people are not alcoholics because they are "bad"(the old time traditional judgemental view) but that they are "bad" because of the alcohol? How many "bad" people are not alcoholics? A lot! When people drink and when they become alcoholics, then because of their dependency they lie, become selfish, even cheat or steal. Their bodies and their brains have changed.They can do something about this. They can get themselves into recovery.
W.
I stole, lied, cheated and was selfish long before I drank. So there were definitely moral issues prior to alcohol. These are human frailties and just part of the human condition to different degrees. In alcoholics I believe they are extreme though. And I believe these issue may manifest themselves prior to drinking a drop.
I am of the school today that I was an alcoholic long before I took my first drink. I subscribe to alcoholism as a disease
that comes about when alcoholics drink and cross that line of no return = frequency, amount of consumption being part of this. For me it's like that cancer cell(s) that always been there in certain types and something sets it off.
Again, this is where I am at today and do not defend this position vigorously. I am just satisfied that's where I am at, but respect others thoughts on the subject.