exhman

OK, I just read this thread and there is a lot of misleading info. I am an ex heroin user who has tried most treatments to get off it (AA/NA, rapid detox, meth, rehab several times, and bup). I was detoxing from a high meth dose when I had to switch to Bup. (suboxone) because I moved out of the US. First off, the drug buprenophine contains both agonist and antagonist, i.e. it is both an opiate and an opiate blocker in one drug. I am not talking about the naloxone (or similar) that is mixed with bup. in drugs like suboxone, I am talking about straight bup. Subutex is only bup. Suboxone is bup. mixed with naloxone. The naloxone is only to prevent people from shooting it up, which some kids died from doing in France. It (the naloxone) is rendered inert by your stomach acid as long as you take it orally as intended. If you are taking anything containing buprenorphine you are still taking opiates, just like when taking methadone! If you take bup. for anything other than detoxing (i.e. more than 3 days) you will have withdrawal when you stop! Clinical studies are split between people saying coming off bup. is easier (ie the w/d) than coming off meth, and those who say it is the same (all subjects going from meth to bup. and having detoxed off meth before). When starting bup. from meth you have to be REALLY sick before you take your first dose, or you will be REALLY sorry. If you are already sick, you should feel relatively ok by the time you leave the docs office. He had me take 2mg (subutex) about every 15 min. until I took 8mg total, and then 4mg. at a time until 16mg total. At 16mg. I felt pretty "normal." I went from 35mg. of meth to 0mg. in 2 weeks and then nothing for 2 days, before taking my first dose of bup. All of this only applies to those going from meth to bup. For any other opiate (heroin, morphine, vicodin, oxycontin, etc.) you can start taking bup. no matter what "dose" you are taking (you don't have to wean down first). This is because meth is so powerful, and more importantly, has such a long half-life. I'm sure the same would apply for LAAM (similar to a super long lasting meth), if they still use LAAM. In the US, doctors need a special, separate, license to prescribe bup. You can take it for maintenance, but usually only through private methadone clinics. The many detox clinics/hospitals that use bup. for detox purposes will not give you scripts for maintenance. Bup. maintenance is VERY expensive. Unless you have good insurance, or are rich, you can pretty much forget it (just over $1000 for a 1 month supply at 32mg, which is the maximum dose they will give you, or is effective). I am currently down to 2mg. of suboxone) a day (a quarter of an 8mg. tablet), which wasn't too difficult to get down to. I still have about 20 full pills left (about 3 moths supply), and will get off of them when my supply runs out. I can't get bup. in the country I now live in. I have been taking bup. for 9 months and began at 16mg for my starting dose. I will let you know how the detox goes, but I am not looking forward to it. I hope this helps someone. All my info comes from various doctors I have seen, and medical papers. The impressions/opinions are from my personal experience.