Zencat

I'm more an implicit atheist, but yea, thank Godlessness for that

raku

a question..are you an "atheist" or a supporter of human kind ?

C

Zencat

Both

Alraihani

Thats how i feel when it comes to attracting addicts. Just out of curiosity, do athiests meditate?

Zencat

I DO!

A mantra with mediation or guided meditation worked for me in the beginning. Now I sit or walk in "clear mind" meditation for a few minuets a few times daily.



^ Is a great starter intro/practice of meditation.

Zen its a spirituality of the mind...I love it!

Be well
Zenny

Alraihani

Zencat, so you're not an athiest?

raku

ZenCat

just watched & listened to the Mindfulness experience. It was wonderful, thank you !

I practice "Actualism", a network of meditation schools, started by Russell Paul Schofield, primarily now based in Ca. I studied in NYC, and to this day, about 40 years later, I find the experience cleansing, focusing awareness, and effortless in the now.
Perhaps you would find this as uplifting as I found yours.

raku

Boleo

Sobriety -- freedom from alcohol -- through the teaching and practice of the Twelve Steps, is the sole purpose of an AA group. Groups have repeatedly tried other activities and they have always failed. It has also been learned that there is no possible way to make non-alcoholics into AA members. We have to confine our membership to alcoholics and we have to confine our AA groups to a single purpose. If we don't stick to these principles, we shall almost surely collapse. And if we collapse, we cannot help anyone.

To illustrate, let's review some typical experiences. Years ago, we hoped to give AA membership to our families and to certain non-alcoholic friends who had been greatly helpful. They had their problems, too, and we wanted them in our fold. Regretfully, we found that this was impossible. They couldn't make straight AA talks; nor, save a few exceptions, could they identify with new AA members. Hence, they couldn't do continuous Twelfth Step work. Close to us as these good folks were, we had to deny them membership. We could only welcome them at our open meetings.

Therefore I see no way of making non-alcoholic addicts into AA members. Experience says loudly that we can admit no exceptions, even though drug users and alcoholics happen to be first cousins of a sort. If we persist in trying this, I'm afraid it will be hard on the drug user himself, as well as on AA. We must accept the fact that no non-alcoholic, whatever his affliction, can be converted into an alcoholic AA member.

Suppose, though, that we are approached by a drug addict who nevertheless has had a genuine alcoholic history. There was a time when such a person would have been rejected. Many early AAs had the almost comical notion that they were "pure alcoholics" -- guzzlers only, no other serious problems at all. When alcoholic "ex-cons" and drug users first turned up there was much pious indignation. "What will people think?" chanted the pure alcoholics. Happily, this foolishness has long since evaporated.

One of the best AAs I know is a man who had been seven years on the needle before he joined up with us. But prior to that, he had been a terrific alcoholic and his history proved it. Therefore he could qualify for AA and this he certainly did. Since then, he has helped many AAs and some non-AAs with their pill and drug troubles. Of course, that is strictly his affair and is no way the business of the AA group to which he belongs. In his group he is a member because, in actual fact, he is an alcoholic.

Such is the sum of what AA Cannot do -- for narcotics addicts or for anybody else.

Now, then, what can be done? Very effective answers to problems other than freedom from alcohol have always been found through "special purpose" groups, some of them operating within AA and some on the outside.

Our first special-purpose group was created 'way back in 1938. AA needed a world service office and some literature. It had a service problem that could not be met by an AA group, as such. Therefore, we formed a Board of Trustees (The Alcoholic Foundation) to look after these matters. Some of the Trustees were alcoholics, and some were non-alcoholics. Obviously, this was not an "AA group." Instead, it was a group of AAs and non-AAs who devoted themselves to a special task.

Another example: in 1940, the New York AAs got lonesome and installed themselves in a club. The club had directors and dues-paying AA members. For a long time, the club members and directors thought that they were an AA group. But after awhile, it was found that lots of AAs who attended meetings at "Old 24th" didn't care one hoot for the club, as such. Hence, the management of the club (for its social purpose) had to be completely separated from the management of the AA group that came there to hold its meetings. It took years of hassling to prove that you couldn't put an AA group into the club business and make it stick. Everywhere today, club managements and their dues-paying members are seen as "special purpose" groups, not as AA groups.

The same thing has happened with drying-out places and "Twelfth Step Houses" managed by AAs. We never think of these activities as "AA groups." They are clearly seen as the functions of interested individuals who are doing helpful and often very valuable jobs.

Some years ago, numbers of AAs formed themselves in "retreat groups" having a religious purpose. At first, they wanted to call themselves "AA groups" of various descriptions. But they soon realized this could not be done because their groups had a dual purpose: both AA and religion.
At another time a number of us AAs wanted to enter the field of alcohol education. I was one of them. We associated ourselves with some non-alcoholics, likewise interested. The non-alcoholics wanted AAs because they needed our experience, philosophy, and general slant. Things were fine until some of us AAs publicly disclosed our membership in the educational group. Right away, the public got the idea that this particular brand of alcoholic education and Alcoholics Anonymous were one and the same thing. It took years to change this impression. But now that this correction has been made, plenty of AA members work with this fine group and we are glad that they do.

It was thus proven that, as individuals, we can carry the AA experience and ideas into any outside field whatever, provided that we guard anonymity and refuse to use the AA name for money-raising or publicity purposes.

I'm very sure that these experiences of yesterday can be the basis of resolving today's confusions about the narcotic problem. This problem is new, but the AA experience and Tradition which can solve it is already old and time-tested. I think we might sum it up like this:

We cannot give AA membership to non-alcoholic narcotics-addicts. But like anyone else, they should be able to attend certain open AA meetings, provided, of course, that the groups themselves are willing.
AA members who are so inclined should be encouraged to band together in groups to deal with sedative and drug problems. But they ought to refrain from calling themselves AA groups.

There seems to be no reason why several AAs cannot join, if they wish, with a group of straight addicts to solve the alcohol and the drug problem together. But, obviously, such a "dual purpose" group should not insist that it be called an AA group nor should it use the AA name in its title. Neither should its "straight addict" contingent be led to believe that they have become AA members by reason of such an association.


http://www.aa.org/pdf/products/p-35_...hanAlcohol.pdf

legna

This one does as well; every day.

Alraihani

Boleo, quit being a dik. We are now talking about meditation. Not some archaic view of who can or cannot be a "member" of AA.

raku

Thank you, Alraihani, for your comment...somewhat crude, but my sentiments exactly !
Sure, AA has it's place and purpose...for me, not enough !

raku

Boleo

I was trying to stay on-topic to the O.P. If someone wants to talk about meditation, try staring a new thread. Why hi-jack this thread?

There are dozens of posts in the Spirituality forum already talking about meditation.

Alraihani

Good idea.

Boleo, your a genius.