bugsmum

I learned about the liquid taper method on another forum that I frequently visit called suboxone talk zone. It was started by and is moderated in part by Dr. Jeffery Junig. I've aslo watched many of his videos on youtube. I can't remember for sure if he actually was an addict himself but he sure has studied and worked with a lot of them. His forum is specificly for those already on ORT so there is very little arguement about clean time and whether or not it's effective. Most people there have already deemed it an appropriate choice for themselves. What's interesting about it for me is that real life, first hand experiences are offered. People describe their experiences and offer what may be helpful and useful to others. For example, the liquid taper method.... I understand that's it's not for everyone, but it seems to be a legitimate option that has worked very well for many. I'm honestly not sure if I'll try it or not, but I'm thankful for the knowledge. Now I'll decide if I want to take it or leave it.

Nallabelle

The liquid taper is something some sub doctors use. It isnt widely known, but I personally know a psychiatrist who uses it will all of his patients and he claims NONE of them complain about any withdrawal from it. I also PERSONALLY know people who have done it, who say it is a bit tedious, but produces little to no withdrawal for them.

bugsmum

hey Becky, just wanted to tell you again that like Penny, I didn't feel any real effects when I tapered until I got below 2mg. Some very mild weepiness but nothing I couldn't handle. Absolutely zero physical effects.

I say call the doctor now. Share your concerns and ask for advice. If you still feel uncomfortable, I'd consider looking for a different doctor.

Shellslove

Thank you for posting that, Bug. I completely forgot that Dr. Junig does describe this on his site, and in detail. I love love love him, his blog is a must read, IMO, for anyone taking Suboxone or anyone who wants a PROPER education on it's use. IIRC, Dr. Junig is actually a former anesthesiologist who lost his license due to addicition. Ugh, I can't even imagine having access to those types of meds in my active addiction! And he has some ridiculous stories, including a gnarly one about 'accidentally' (I think) injecting himself w/something like narcan or naltrexone to detox, oops! Anyway, I personally take everything that man says for face value and respect his opinion, he really knows his stuff. I believe he is a p-doc (or a counselor? not sure of his degree) now, and I know he does Rx suboxone. Still, for me, that method does sound very involved. It would scare me to be that closely attached to the ritual of opiates again. Just me though. Btw, have I mentioned I love Junig???!!!! He's pretty much the only resourse I trust on the internet for true and accurate info regarding suboxone (and I am not making any money for saying that! haha)

Sorry about the OT Beck Didn't mean to hijack - seriously though - go read as much as you can on his site. get educated. you won't be sorry!!!

Shellslove

BTW - you can e-mail Dr. Junig with Q's and he's pretty quick about getting back to you with answers. (I've had several discussions with him, smart guy) His e-mail is on his site (Bug mentioned it above) or you can send a question in the form of a comment to one of his blog posts. Easy way to get another drs opinion?

Junig's experience: Reckitt-Benckiser/Suboxone ‘Treatment Advocate’ for several years. My experiences as an opiate addict for 16 years, my PhD in neurochemistry, my 3+ months of residential treatment and 6 years of formal aftercare, the hundreds of AA and NA meetings I have attended, the eight years I spent working in pain clinics as an anesthesiologist, my psychiatric training, my experience treating over 450 patients using buprenorphine, and four years as medical director of a large residential treatment center have all contributed to some level of insight into addiction and addiction treatment.

Timebuster

Nice resume

My experience with liquid subs,

There is a doctor in NYC that uses this method. He is the only sub doctor that I know of that you have to go to his office on a daily basses to get your sub dose. No take home. The nurses there administer the liquid dose through a syringe. Once you received your sub you have to sit in the waiting area until the sub is absorbed. Spit it out then you can go. The whole process takes about twenty minutes.

I was on liquid sub from a heroin addiction for several months.

I was taper down on liquid subs in four weeks.

Sadly, I relapse two weeks after my last dose of subs.

My experience, Subs give me a false sense of reality, when I came off of subs nothing had changed. I had to learn the hard way, Drugs was never my problem, I – me was the problem.

For those who are on replacement therapy I applaud you for taking the first step to a new life. But if you don’t take this opportunity to correct your life now, then nothing has change.

Peace and serenity
TB

Shellslove

Just want to make it clear in case I didn't that is SO not MY resume, it's Dr. Jeffrey Junig's and I got that info from a blog post of his
(Personally, I have a measley BA in Psychology with a year of Masters work in Counseling and too many years of opiate addiction - don't listen to a word I say! ahhh! )

That's interesting Timebuster, I've never heard of a Clinic like that. Sounds like a PITA, than again I'd feel that way about reporting to a Methadone Clinic -- and that's worked for a ton of people. If I was going to taper down using that method I think I'd have to go to a daily Clinic setting like this, and honestly I may end up going to a detox for that part. I'm an addict - can't control a taper like that, never could.

Subs have bought me time, but have not made the road any less bumpy. I've been working on my recovery, which is the most important thing to me right now. I know I will have an inevitable physical w/d which will bring discomfort/pain, I'm prepared to deal with it - didn't think I was going to be the 'one' who got off easy. But, for me, Subs did not distort my reality. No illusions about it - I am an opiate addict and always will be and will always need to work on my recovery. The rest of it is between me, my doctor and the wall. That's the way I see it.

Back to the OT, Beck you know how I feel and thanks for the PM. I think you're gonna be just fine!

Dee74

After speaking with Becky I'm happy she's gotten all she wants to out of this thread, so I'm going to close it.

I reiterate my concern from earlier in the thread - we're not a medical board - any advice or suggested procedures here should be discussed with your doctor to ascertain whether the treatment is suitable for your particular circumstances.

D