Jimba

Could be a bad reaction to the Prozac too, I tried taking lexipro at onrme point in my life before the opiates and it made me sick as a dog. I'm not a doc but they also inhibit certain reuptake functions of the brain could be interfering with you body rebalancing.

Again not a Doctor just a suggestion to explore with a medical professional.

Jimba

By the way I'm cutting down to 4 tomorow, I'm not sleeping good just woke up with nightmares, I'm cranky but that's the extent so far.

I think after I began absianence I would take a sub before any vics or oxyies, I'm going way back tobday 16 and just nattering about what I may end up doing, already in denial and justifying. LOL

christin1225

I'm confused, Jimba. Why are you going down to 4? Which doctor suggested the decrease? I didn't quite get what you were saying in the last paragraph. Rephrase, please? I hope that you're not planning to self-adjust your medication and you already are seeing denial and justifying creeping in.

christin1225

I get to see my counselor today, Bagger. I usually tell her that I'm a walking relapse just waiting to happen. Argghhh!

As far as a snort of oxy goes, I think that it IS sick thinking, no question about it. (The fact that it can trigger me, proves it.) All the same, it's to be expected. But, that doesn't matter. It's sick thinking and it needs to be made better.

One of the things that most threatens my recovery is "glorifying the high." That's all that my brain recalls on its own... the good aspect of using. So, I have to help it to recall all the rest. I'm told that, eventually, my brain will recall it on its own. Your post sounds very much like my brain when it's thinking. My sponsor instructed me to make a list of the things in my life that oxys have done: the things that using made unmanageable and also to write down examples of how I was powerless. If you need some examples, PM me. I'll share my list and then you can make your own.

Every day, I wake up and think that it should be no big deal to do what's right. Then within thirty minutes, I'm tired of it already (the first episode of sweating doesn't help any, either!). So, I guess that means that I have to work on my recovery in thirty-minute or less intervals. Maybe you need to handle staying clean in ten or in five-minute intervals. I know it's hard, but even just five minutes of doing the right thing can be enough to avoid the train wreck.

scaredtostp

Its quite a battle isn't it, those little pills are soo strong, they manipulate our brain even when our system is clear of them. When we take them, they make a part of our brain, the joy center so haappy, that it rewards us with strength and courage and energy and takes all of our wd away. The only problem is that the part of the brain that knows that we should not use beats us up inside and we punish ourselves for using. That is the battle. Ive never taken suboxone as it is not avail in my area, trust me, i've looked all over and called and called with no luck and I did not have the will power to detox at home, so off to the local detox centre i went, it is free in canada.Its day nine and I get to go home today, with all of the oxy out of my system and the wd gone. it was a tough go but i made it, there were times that i wanted to walk out the door but i toughed it all out. pheeeeew.

I think suboxone works the same way, but it stays in your system for a much longer time due to its very long half life and blocks and wd symptoms from happening. Then once you stop sub, it is just like stopping oxy, but drawn out a little longer due to the long half liife, even though the oxy has been out of my system for almost 10 days, i still sweat in bed, and ocasionally during the day, get a fatigue that comes over me and have to lay down for a while. Those are what i call oxy's last kick at the can trying to get me to use as i know if i use, those sweaty, tired symptoms will be gone. I think its normal for a long acting pill like sub to cause the symptoms you describe as there is no way around going through wd, we either get them right away, detox, or later on methadone and suboxone. There is no way around it.

There is one guy in here trying to detox off of methadone, he was having no wd for three days, i thought, i should have taken the methadone before comming here, he has no wd, then on the fourth day, bam, they hit him like a truck, much more severe then mine and the dr there told me he will be in wd for up to two weeks due to the long half life. what a terrible thing, one minute he was ok then the next, sick as a dog...

baggervance

Im doing Iop four days a week and meetings other three as far as Running well if You see me running please call the cops because someone with a gun is chasing me , and Jimba Dude I;m a Dude LOL.

Jimba

No I am not having cravings or feelings of relapse. I was just saying that if I got to a point in my complete sobriety where I could not stand DTs, I would return to the suboxone treatment not the oxyies or the vics. At least you can stabilize and live without chasing like us adicts like to do.

As far as my own situation I am going to see a doctor that will help me with detox, but the doses I have been prescribed are to high all I want to do is sleep. I can drink a quad cafe mocha and conc out. I am watching my blood pressure a few times a day and like I said if I start to have cravings I will up the sub. I'm not craving DOCs or the sub, so I am reducing my dose to 4mg. My actions are in accordance with conversations I have had with my Dr.. I am basing my actions on those and I think there is actually a detox schedule on the suboxone site.

Shellslove

Oh man, I'm sorry you're going through this! I'm tapering from a semi-high dose of subutex to a more moderate dose at the moment. Like Christin's, my doc says 'no way' to w/d symptoms at doses this high - but let me tell you - he's incorrect in this case! There I said it!!...he is WRONG! I refuse to go on thinking this is all in my head any longer!!! Cold sweats, constant headaches, flushing and red face, and jumping through the roof anxiety??? That just can't all 'be in my head' !!! I really do think it's different for each person. We've all had different habits for different amounts of time - we're different people at different ages - different backgrouds, different metabolism, different experience... But guess what? that 'one snort of oxy' would do the same thing to all of us! It would more likely than not lead us back to the behavior that got us here in the first place - and we'd have to start all over again!! So PLEASE hang in there b/c I KNOW it will get better.

Subutex has improved my quality of life alot...don't get me wrong - it's been a savior when I needed it to be...and now this. 4 mgs seems high to jump off of - but he!!, you're almost a month in -this will let up soon. This doesn't happen with everyone, I think alot of people have little to no problem with the weaning or tapering...the problem is we here are a skewed sample! SR is a great place to come during the process of recovery, but I think the whole wanting to be 'completely' sober ASAP leads some people to jump off the sub too quickly...and while the good intentions are there, it can end badly. I'm sure there are also just some of us that are very sensitive and have a low tolerance to pain (hand raised.) I don't want to curse off the sub, b/c it's really helped me, I just think there are those few people who have a hard time...and misery loves company, so we find each other! I think you're being very strong here and this WILL pass!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Someone else made a good point - maybe you should talk to your dr about whether the Prozac could be adding to the problem instead of helping? Maybe you need to try something else?

baggervance

Ive been 100% honest with the Doc. She told me, stay on the prozac, although I cant tell its helping. Maybe I should try snorting it! Bad joke just kidding I think.

Jimba

No god talk about getting sick!!

baggervance

Ok 26th day and im feeling better still some minor stuff but not as long or as intense. I f you ready to jump off this please taper if you can jumping from 4 mgs sucked.

christin1225

Bagger...
According to what I've been reading, 30 days is average. I've also read that jumping from a higher dose doesn't shorten the withdrawal period nor does it lessen the risk or duration of PAWS. That all depends on the length of treatment. Under 21 days of treatment, best case scenario which just doesn't get better. (I'm at 75 days and only down to 6mg as of today ).

Please don't stop keeping us informed.

Jimba

Sounds like she's turning the corner. Good days and bad days lie ahead but Ive gotta feeling you coming around the bend.

Congratulations!!!!

baggervance

I got thirty days cold turkey off subs today. feeling much much better.

Jimba

Oh I love you!!!!

I have hope. I am down to 4mg thinking of cutting to 2mg tomorrow. I saw my Dr. today and he was on board for whatever I could handle and gave me a script for 90 2mgs with 1 refill.

Good for you!!!

Jimba

You know christin its not a race and you have to experiment with what you are comfortable with and what kind of agony you are able to endure. Some of us have very high pain thresholds and some great determination, those people are lucky. I'm not one of them maybe you have to cut at .5 mg rates instead of 1 mg rates or 2 mg rates. Just keep it up!!! Of course keep your doc informed, like I didn't.

Angelic17

The Good News is that we only have to go through withdrawals once. Even though addiction has a hold on us, and keeps leading us to our drug of choice, we don't have to take it. We can remember the horror and discomfort of withdrawal and never go through it again. That's what keeps me straight. The longer I'm clean the easier it gets. I think of using every once in a while, and it's usually when I am upset or tired. Since I have been clean, so many times drugs have been readily and easily available to me. I refuse to give in. If I fell into a sea of opiates, I wouldn't open my mouth. I would remove myself from the situation. Remember the withdrawals. It will keep you clean for the future.

christin1225

Jimba,
No race. I think that you misunderstood me. I'm not talking about tapering schedules. I was simply sharing what I have read to be the average time that people have said that it takes for them to feel back to normal after coming off Sub completely. The average is 30 days. So, what Bagger is experiencing is right in line with the average.
(Unless your comment is soley in regard to my experience, then I'm the one who has misunderstood. )

Jimba

I always forget the pain and remember the swinging from the chandeliers naked part. LOL I guess thats an indication that I need N/A in my life to remind me.

Jimba

Yeah, I was just talking to you. I don't know if you feel bad or guilty for your scheduling, I just wanted to say you are making an effort and thats good. After readng these posts and getting feedback from you which has been invaluable (I almost jumped at 8mg after only a few days at being at much higher doses), I am realizing more and more how different we all are in our positions. Just didn't want you to feel bad, your making an effort and maybe you know that, but I like you and you have given me good advise and help. You probably know better than I.