Handling Irrational Beliefs by James J. Messina, Ph.D. & Constance M. Messina, Ph.D What are irrational beliefs? Irrational beliefs are:
Irrational beliefs (negative) about self:
Irrational beliefs can be present if we:
By refuting our irrational beliefs we are able to:
Step 1: Is your thinking and problem solving ability being blocked by an irrational belief? Consider a specific problem as you answer the following questions:
1-no 2-yes 3-yes 4-no 5-yes 6-yes 7-yes 8-no 9-no 10-no If you are unable to give healthy answers to one or more question in Step 2, then your blocking belief is most likely irrational. Step 4: Once you have determined that the blocking belief is irrational, you are ready to refute this irrational belief. Respond to the following questions in your journal:
My substitute rational healthy belief is: Step 5: If you still have trouble solving problems, return to Step 1 and begin again. |
Wonderful. Thanks very much for this. |
WOAH!!! COOL POST!! That has to be one of the best written ones I've seen!! |
Brilliant, brilliant. Thanks Morning. this will be my lunch break reading. Ta. |
Bump. So Good. |
Another irrational belief is the belief in a higher power that listens to our innermost thoughts and takes some kind of interest in our lives and intercedes in favor of or against actions we take. |
I feel that way too Jack, but we're certainly in the minority. |
Thanks for bumping this one up!
Originally Posted by jbm125 Another irrational belief is the belief in a higher power that listens to our innermost thoughts and takes some kind of interest in our lives and intercedes in favor of or against actions we take. Does it then become non secular? Is it a problem of semantics?. Maybe I will change my use of HP to HS.. meaning higher self. I guess I just need to name the internal source that I have learned/accessed. AA doesn't have a corner on the market of the use of "higher power" or does it? How about HIP? Meaning Higher Internal Power? Does have a nice ring to it doesn't it? :C023: |
michski How about HIP? Meaning Higher Internal Power? Does have a nice ring to it doesn't it? |
It's What's Inside That Makes The Difference After reading this thread I see myself not too long ago. As Jung described Alcoholism/Addiction: "..a spiritual quest for wholeness" I saw myself as one seeking that "wholeness" by any means possible from the outside world. The idea of a higher power (i.e. "God") was repugnant to me. Maybe I've studied too much science, Oh Well.... Anyway, as time went on thinking my answers would come from something I could put in myself, it became clear that would not work. After finally just "Letting Go" (to what ? I don't know, didn't need to at the time) I understood it was me trying to hold on to whatever thinking "I" could handle it which brought about my torment, so by giving "it" to what/whoever is out there, that life changed for the better. Remember, everything we have been searching for from the outside has been on the inside all along, we just couldn't find it. It is with that "unsuspected internal resource" that I have my relationship. From it comes a quality of living which effects all areas of my life. For that I am grateful. For some, to name it is to diminish it, so whatever you find that works..................... :Xmaselfc |
For me, the strength of will I find to do all great things in life comes from "within" (cheesy, right?). Not the "me" that is destructive, but that better person I know resides there, waiting to be drawn out. I feel very accomplished (good marriage, good career, etc) for my 25 years, and I give credit to myself for getting there. Why would I not give myself credit as I overcome addiction? For me, placing the "reins" outside of my inner self (giving it over) is contrary to how I've progressed in life. Deities have no place in my spirituality, and one of those will never take credit for my accomplishments OR my failures. This is why the whole "it's not my fault, I have a disease and have no control" thing doesn't ring true for me. I get my strength from knowing my behavior and its consequences lie squarely in my lap. However, I can get on board with the notion that many people find "god" within themselves, their family, their friends, etc. Nomenclature makes little difference as long as it WORKS for that individual. |
very bottom line: stay sober I agree, whatever works for any particular person(i.e. staying sober) is the bottom line. I know people, and myself, who require more than the bottom line. For me, spiritual growth (by that I mean having a quality relationship with the most important thing in my life) is essential, without it I may be sober but waiting for the next relapse. I must grow or die. Why be dry and miserable? So to have that real intimacy necessary for that spiritual growth, I had to let go of that old self and construct a new one. My old self would revel in each accomplishment (good or bad) as proof of my omnipotence. Loss after loss after loss, yet I would not see how I was Mr. Hyde. Finally, after admitting to my innermost self I could not manage life as I had been living it, I let go, surrendered, whatever you wish to call it and my entire life changed in ways I could not have dreamed of, all positive (sometimes I make a lot of "lemonade" though). Anyway, just want to say, in my case (I can only reflect from my experience) I had to let go to something beyond myself to find myself. Things have happened in my life which defy coincidence (hence noco..) all wonderful. That is what it takes for me, that's the type of ego which can return if I do not "place principles before personalities". To tell someone the way they stay sober is wrong would indicate I have not come very far at all in my recovery..... So, whatever it takes is whatever it takes...words can only get in the way sometimes! :Xmastc |
Bottom Line
Originally Posted by Brightening
(Post 2031368)
I get my strength from knowing my behavior and its consequences lie squarely in my lap. Then the bottom line for me is: do something and attribute the change to whatever that works for you. ;) |
Originally Posted by Brightening
(Post 2031368)
... the whole "it's not my fault, I have a disease and have no control" thing doesn't ring true for me. I get my strength from knowing my behavior and its consequences lie squarely in my lap. However, I can get on board with the notion that many people find "god" within themselves, their family, their friends, etc. Nomenclature makes little difference as long as it WORKS for that individual. I follow a journey in which knowledge of lack of control is immediately followed by seeking and applying remedies leading to better control. |
The Doctors Messina Wow. The Doctors seem to have everything covered in their list of irrationalities. They even get irrational themselves while committing to the list. For example: Scripts we have in our head about how we believe life "should'' be for us and for others. values with which we were raised. Self-defeating ways of acting [that] may look appropriate for the occasion... Habitual ways of thinking, feeling, or acting that we think are effective; however, in the long run they are ineffectual. idealistic ways of looking at necessary life experiences Patterns of thinking that make us appear to others as stubborn, Lifelong messages...They are unproductive... Standards by which we were reared and from which we learned how to act, what to believe, and how to express or experience feelings.[Period. No equivocation on that.] When followed, however, these standards do not result in a satisfactory resolution of our current problems. The Doctors are Humanists, but they seem to be determinists, whereby such broad generalizations are meant to show "compassion" to the "poor humans" who are "fully caused to be what they are", rather than moral agents capable of making informed choices. The Doctors do, however, offer a couple of good points about irrationalities: Messages about life we send to ourselves that keep us from growing emotionally. Unfounded attitudes, opinions, and values we hold to that are out of synchrony with the way the world really is. True. When we are in "synchronicity with the way the world really is", that is called having "correspondence" with the truth of reality. [1][2] Counterproductive ways of thinking, which give comfort and security in the short run, but either do not resolve or actually exacerbate the problem in the long run. Ways of thinking about ourselves that are out of context with the real facts resulting in our either under-valuing or over-valuing ourselves. I don't like lists such as the one put together by the Doctors. By definition they must be so general that they suck anyone into their argument who isn't familiar with the embedded issues in each argument. This generality waters down the list so it becomes unusable, once you bother to look twice. No one should [ought] ever accept such a list without looking twice. But most people are not trained to see the deficiencies in such arguments. Don't be fooled by any argument. Look closely at it. Question it. Ask yourself if it fits the "correspondence theory". Obviously most of what the Doctors wrote in this piece does not correspond. I know that many will argue with me. It isn't necessary to do so in writing. I am not trying to change your minds. I don't know if you agreed with that list in the first place. I'm trying to open some eyes, and if you disagree with me---Good for you, so long as you can make your disagreement correspond. :tyou for reading my critique. Sincerely, Curtis C |
The Power Within, Not Without Brightening wrote: For me, the strength of will I find to do all great things in life comes from "within" (cheesy, right?). Not the "me" that is destructive, but that better person I know resides there, waiting to be drawn out. When I talked once at a step meeting, I said that when I was drinking I often wondered why I did things I knew to be wrong, seemingly without the ability to prevent myself; and why I did not do things I knew to be right. When I was struck, one day, by the idea that this was my whole problem, my means of making excuses, I was hit by a ton of bricks, I admitted I was powerless, and then went to my first meeting! After the meeting, a man thanked me for my honesty about my atheism, and told me that I basically had said what Paul said in Romans 7:15. I was dumbfounded. But he was right. I went home and read it. However, Paul attributed his inability to do the next right thing to the sinful nature of the flesh. I attributed it to "stinkin' thinkin'" Thanks for saying outloud what many of us already think but don't say often enough outloud. Other's need to hear it. Sincerely, Curtis C |
Wow. This came along at the right time in my life!!! And it wasn't a higher power that led me to this!! |
Just wanted to chime in to say thanks for a fantastic, thoughtful list. It's definitely something I will refer to when running into difficulties. |
This is very long, but the following quote from a REBT advocate is on message here. (If MG or others prefer, remove this post and I will provide a hyperlink instead.) The 12 Irrational Beliefs (iB's) of REBT 1. The idea that it is a dire necessity for adults to be loved by significant others for almost everything they do-- Instead of their concentrating on their own self-respect, on winning approval for practical purposes, and on loving rather than on being loved. 2. The idea that certain acts are awful or wicked, and that people who perform such acts should be severely damned -- Instead of the idea that certain acts are self-defeating or antisocial, and that people who perform such acts are behaving stupidly, ignorantly, or neurotically, and would be better helped to change. People's poor behaviors do not make them rotten individuals. 3. The idea that it is horrible when things are not the way we like them to be-- Instead of the idea that it is too bad, that we would better try to change or control bad conditions so that they become more satisfactory, and, if that is not possible, we had better temporarily accept and gracefully lump their existence. 4. The idea that human misery is invariably externally caused and is forced on us by outside people and events Instead of the idea that neurosis is largely caused by the view that we take of unfortunate conditions. 5. The idea that if something is or may be dangerous or fearsome we should be terribly upset and endlessly obsess about it-- Instead of the idea that one would better frankly face it and render it non-dangerous and, when that is not possible, accept the inevitable. 6. The idea that it is easier to avoid than to face life difficulties and self-responsibilities Instead of the idea that the so-called easy way is usually much harder in the long run. 7. The idea that we absolutely need something other or stronger or greater than ourself on which to rely -- Instead of the idea that it is better to take the risks of thinking and acting less dependently. 8. The idea that we should be thoroughly competent, intelligent, and achieving in all possible respects -- Instead of the idea that we should do better rather than always need to do well, and accept ourself as a quite imperfect creature, who has general human limitations and specific fallibilities. 9. The idea that because something once strongly affected our life, it should indefinitely affect it -- Instead of the idea that we can learn from our past experiences but not be overly-attached to or prejudiced by them. 10. The idea that we must have certain and perfect control over things -- Instead of the idea that the world is full of improbability and chance and that we can still enjoy life despite this. 11. The idea that human happiness can be achieved by inertia and inaction -- Instead of the idea that we tend to be happiest when we are vitally absorbed in creative pursuits, or when we are devoting ourselves to people or projects outside ourselves. 12. The idea that we have virtually no control over our emotions and that we cannot help feeling disturbed about things -- Instead of the idea that we have real control over our destructive emotions if we choose to work at changing the “musturbatory” hypotheses which we often employ to create them. |
I am very pleased to see a secular thread dealing with addiction. I've never come across a mini-community that deals with it in a secular manner. My mother who is suffering from addiction is religious and so are my family members who fund her recovery programs, and so they are adamant about projects that repeatedly fail (and are against most forms of medication that could probably help her.) No one wants to listen to any of my (or her) advice on what's best for her. Thanks for this thread. |
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