Wholesome

That's awesome! He's like a gunslinger except with words!

fini

right. thanks, algo.

Wholesome

I have tremendous admiration for Jack Trimpy, the guy is my hero. He stood up against the whole system and exposed them as charlatans because it's true that there's no money in sobriety. And then gave us RR with the message to stand up too and save ourselves. I love truth speakers. He could have sold out and used AVRT to make himself rich but he didn't. He didn't have to go toe to toe against the establishment. The guys got courage and character in spades.

AlericB

Yes, AVRT teaches how to move from being a victim of addiction to being a witness of addiction by recognising AV, which it precisely defines, as being not-you.

Fusion

How can this knowledge that we have acquired and applied, be passed on more effectively, into the general population of addicts and their relatives. What can be done?

Morning Glory

I removed a group of posts referring to 12 step programs or quoting and commenting on those posts.
A few of you already know this is off topic for this forum.

Fusion

This is so sad. We folks who've discovered a method to stop drinking, forever, are censored out. I'm glad this forum was here last year when I joined, asked questions, was gently guided and informed and the good folks on SR saved my life.

It's clear from the recent moderation of this Secular Connections forum, that the miracle I experienced is never going to happen again. When learning how to stop drinking I read back over historic posts and the hardline moderation from which we now suffer, wasn't in operation, then. I'm talking 2011-2016. I'm trying to restrain myself from saying 'blood on hands'. It's such a shame.

Algorithm

I don't know what posts MG pulled from this thread, Tatsy, but neither can you know what posts were pulled over a five-year span of time, no?

I imagine that the mods have to contend with the report button, judging from what Astro posted once in another forum that he moderates.

For my part, I'm not concerned with any 'bashing' of AVRT. What others may perceive as such is simply AVRT in action, and its lens will identify and expose any AV embedded within any attempt to 'bash' AVRT, regardless of the word play.

I would wager that anyone with actual ill intent would soon tread elsewhere.

Greenwood618

While I cannot speak with precision for anyone but me, I think the concern, rather, is that it is hereby verboten to compare AVRT with other recovery methods, thereby rendering it difficult if not impossible to place it in the context of self help and planned and permanent abstinence as opposed to the other stuff that we aren't allowed to discuss.

Algorithm

Although I understand what you are saying, Greenwood, I imagine there are concerns which we are unaware of. Regarding Tatsy's original question as to what can be done, this here is a start.

RR is obviously aware that their service marks are used on SR, and they did not have to allow this. Neither did SR have to allow it.

It would seem to me that both parties have prudently set aside any historic ill feelings in order to serve a greater good in the long term.

Morning Glory

I fought really hard to get this forum up and fought hard to find someone who could share AVRT in a positive way. We have that here now. Now it helps people. It didn't help anyone before. Many were banned and it was a debate forum. That's why we have rules. When I remove posts it's to keep things running smoothly so you can keep what you have here.

Fusion

Yes Greenwood, you spoke with precision for me.

In order for AVRT, or SMART or LifeRing (et all here in Secular) to be learnt and successfully applied to conquer addiction.....if someone has previously been exposed to the 'life-long recovery group movement' (meetings forever and 'passing it on to keep it' belief) then first and foremost, those old indoctrinated beliefs need to be exposed, re-evaluated. Only then can the process of ending addiction the AVRT, SMART and LifeRing way (et all) begin.

Wholesome

I just find it weird that I can't even talk about how recovery is portrayed in movies and tv which is what my posts were about. It's fiction. It is Hollywood who portrays that which I may not mention in that light and I was pointing it out.

I was busy over the weekend but I was going to come on here and answer Tatsy's question about how to get the word out by saying that this forum is a good platform but then I logged on to find that I'd been censored. Oh the irony!

Anyways, although I find that frustrating, I am grateful for this forum. Without learning about AVRT, here on this sub forum, I would still be drinking and would have ended up putting myself in an early grave. Instead I'm free! My only goal on here is to try to pay what I've been given back, there are a lot of people who don't jive with that which I may not mention and then don't get better because it's the status quo and they don't know about other options and they've been confused by a lot of the cultural messages about recovery.

Maybe it's time for me to take a step back from here though, I have a hard time not speaking my mind and I don't want to end up getting banned or upsetting the mods who really do do a good job on here.

dwtbd

I aided and abetted my AV for quite awhile. I had shunned 'recoveryism' for years, I was special, different , damaged yada yada ect ect. But I still harbored the idea that since I was purposely not involving myself 'in anything', I was cutting myself from a cure , which was really just the desire to continue masked.
I knew abstinence was the cure, but did not separate from my AV , I accepted the idea that even though I knew quitting would put a full stop to my addiction, 'getting to' abstinence was some ephemeral path and consciously choosing to shun a, the way made justifying and rationalizing more drinking, all that much more easy. Sick , right ?

I did reach a breaking point and in a moment of clarity/desperation decided to do something, anything, something.

I found SR and learned about AVRT, learned it existed, got the RR TNC book and was thunderstruck. Couldn't believe what I was reading about unconditional, permanent abstinence and how the only thing keeping me from it, the only thing keeping me freeing myself from the slavish cycle was Me.

It wasn't debates on a forum, or lack thereof, just the steering direction and the self honesty to realize that I could do it, the only thing stopping Me was Me.

I'm grateful SR allowed me the opportunity to see the beacon. I understand that sites/forums are 'things' in the real world, they have owners and their use can be conditional, I'd probably hate my rules if I were master of the universe , but that doesn't mean Sec Con isn't a beacon, rules and all, I'd consider myself proof

dwtbd

It is ironic what is verboten is specific sub forums , but not in others, I think it is possible to expose AV in other areas here on SR and point to this sub forum , rules and all and spread the idea of self recovery/reliane.

dwtbd

Zen
I like your voice here on SR , just look how many flickers of the beacon this thread created.
I am not my Beast

AlericB

Me too. Stay zen

Fusion

I am not my Beast, too!

Flickers of the beacon: superb. Please stay Zen and let your voice ring out clear and true. A flame in the otherwise, wilderness.

Wholesome

Aw thanks guys, I'm fond of all you too!

I think AVRT threatens some people and gets their Beasts all riled up. They don't like that it pokes holes in the things they believe in, I guess the truth hurts. They can't handle hearing it. So heck ya I want to be a beacon of truth for anyone searching for it! For others out there who like rational thought and logic and who want to be truly unshackled like we are. If others want to go through their live identifying as their Beasts then I guess that's their prerogative, but I am not.

Fusion

Zen, beacons of truth are often front runners and prone to getting shot down by whatever establishment thought of the year, decade, century. Do you recall the girl on the bus in America. Claudette Colvin, who stood up (or rather sat down at the front of the bus) but she didn't allow her voice to be drowned out. Neither should we.

I am proud to be free of addiction, through self recovery. We shouldn't be censored or shackled to the populist recovery group movement. Yes, if after one has stopped drinking, there exist other conditions, then please, seek professional help. But addiction has a simple cure and this seems to be obscured.