jellicology

Hi all,
I would like to start this tread for anyone who has just recently discovered AVRT and SR. I am a 25 year old male from Pakistan who was badly hooked to heroin for about 2 years before which I was using other drugs but not in an addictive fashion. I tried to quit on my own but the withdrawals kept me from doing so. I tried to make a big plan on my own but did not know what it really was. I ended up going to a rehab where I was detoxed for 2 weeks and while I was there I was introduced to the 12 step program. I had never heard of anything crappier in my addictive life (IMO, it has helped many people that I know but I can only express myself here, no offence to anyone else). So many contradictions and inferiority complex laced thoughts kept me from succeeding at the program. I was told in rehab that will power was a trap and that so much more had to be done and done everyday to stay sober. I tried to believe that and I honestly worked on the other alternate programs. When my 2 weeks were up, I came out of rehab with the sole statement ruling my mind that 'I would never use drugs again. Rain, hail, sleet, snow, it did not matter. I was done.' I still attended the follow ups and played along with the 12 step program but the only thing that kept me secure was my own decision. I saw as others in my group practicing 12 steps fell left and right while I soared ahead. My psychologist was surprised that I was so motivated and doing so well without the 12 steps and he wanted to know my secret, but I felt that telling him would only create an argument. I managed to stay sober for a year and a half before I started a job where the person next to me turned out to be a junkie. I resisted for a couple of days but then one fine day gave in without realizing what had happened. I now know that I had forgotten my own statement; especially the part of never changing my mind. I relapsed and then got fired. After that I stayed home for another month without even leaving to go to the store or anything and I could not figure out what went wrong. I began questioning my method. I started thinking that I can never achieve complete sobriety as I don't understand and follow the 12 step program and thus there is no way out for me. I started to attend NA meetings again only to realize how lonely I felt there. I heard so much talk about an addictive voice in that program which was the only part I could identify with, but I could never digest all that talk about a higher power ruling my life and being helpless and needing something to do regarding recovery everyday. So I started to look for alternatives to the 12 steps and landed on the 16 step program, the AVRT and SR. I have finally found something that has worked for me without ever realizing it and something that I will once again put into practice. Not failing again. For now, I know what has to be done and I will do it.
So here I am, creating this forum for anyone who can identify with my situation and can help me understand AVRT better. I live in a country where AVRT has not even been considered let alone developed. I lack the resources and the texts to become fully aware of what has to be done. So if anyone can help me with that issue then please do. I would greatly appreciate an links and as much knowledge about AVRT and SR as you can throw my way. I will regularly update is forum and share my thoughts and experiences. There is so much I have to say but I will ration it out.
Thanks to anyone who can and will help me out or will share their own thoughts with me.
Cheers,
Jelly.

freshstart57

Powerful, Jelly. Welcome to you, and to anyone else who feels as you do. You are in good company here. For starters, get comfy here and start looking around. There is a massive thread called AVRT discussion, with over 2000 posts, and it starts here:http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...iscussion.html.

Please keep posting. Glad you found us.

soberlicious

Hi jelly...welcome
I second Fresh...read through those couple thousand posts on the AVRT threads. There's some pretty good stuff there.
So happy for you that you took your life back from addiction. The beast only lives in darkness, so shine that light on him...

Received

Good to have you jelli. I also agree with Fresh.

jkb

Glad to have you here...... great story... Jess

jellicology

I have read a lot about AVRT and SR but some questions still arise which had put me off from the conventional methods in the first people. For example: in my rehab and according to the 12 steps it is said that people who used heroin could never again use any drugs. They had developed a 'metabolic error' for all drugs; that just seems childish. One psychologist suggested that I should not smoke pot or drink as it will lead back to my drug of choice, that being heroin. This seemed fairly more realistic. But in AVRT if we have decided to never do heroin again and to never change our minds, then where does this argument fit in. I know a person who without knowing it himself is using, the AVRT technique and he smokes pot but has decided to never use H again and to never change his mind. He has everything well undercontrol. It has been years now and he is managing just fine with pot and beer. Can anyone give me their feed back on this point.
Secondly, I have decided that my BIG DAY will be august 1st. Not that I am addicted and regularly using right now, but i have lapsed a few times and that is the last part of the beast i want to slay. So I will build up to the 1st of August 2013 and that will be the day I will reinforce that statement into my mind. 'I will never use heroin again and I will never change my mind'
Lastly, which books would you guys recommend for AVRT and SR as i am looking to combine the two and also share it (my approach) with my family. Thanks

soberlicious

Well, I decided many years ago that I no longer wanted to get f*cked up. The drug is irrelevant...the way that I live my life means no drugs period (alcohol is a drug). It's not about looking for a drug that I can use without consequence...it's so much bigger than that now. It's about my brain functioning as it is designed to do, free of all chemical intoxicants. I even quit smoking cigarettes a year ago and cut out sugar and cut down caffeine 6 months ago. I just keep getting cleaner and cleaner
I would recommend Rational Recovery: The New Cure for Substance Addiction by Jack Trimpey

jkb

Hi Jelli-
In my opinion... as to "other drugs".... Once I really quit drinking I no longer wanted the feeling of "high" in any way. My first attempt at "sobriety from alcohol" I was fighting myself everyday not to take a drink. My beast was loud, condescending and had me pretty well convinced it was in control and I was bound to relapse.... I did after 36 days. And it all started with a xanax.
I take xanax for panic attacks. For over 2 and a half years I took them and another benzo daily as prescribed (5 mgs total per day). I finally got free of most of the benzos (which I loved A LOT back then) after a 6 month "taper". Anyway, long story short after 36 days of absolute miserable "sobriety" I gave in and took a xanax to "get out of my head". After I took it my thinking was very different. I thought well now I am pretty relaxed why not have a glass of wine......
I live in a place where weed is legal. Lots of people smoke pot who don't use "other drugs" (alcohol, cocaine etc... whatever their DOC was) and they are quite happy with that. So, idk but, this time around I just like being "in my head" fully. When I have had to take xanax I no longer like the way it makes me feel. I am so glad for this.
Just my experience. I also set a "quit date". Scheduled it for the day after the Superbowl and like I said I made it 36 days. Once i chose to drink again I was done. The reward of a drink was not worth it anymore... I knew I was done not bc drinking was fun and I was "giving up something" but, I was done bc I no longer wished to do that to myself. I was not "giving up anything".
So, I feel like if you want to quit H but smoke pot or have a beer here and there... do it. See if it works for you. If it doesn't then don't do it again. GL--- Jess

jellicology

This particular post I want to write about my introduction to heroin. I feel it plays a part even today and perhaps someone with a sharp brain out there will read this and have something insightful to say. Anyway, here it is:
I was in my third year in university. I used to smoke pot and sometime i would have a beer or two. But rarely. Also, I used to love doing LSD. other drugs i did not care for. Then one day a friend of mine picked me up and said he wanted to go try something new and he had a weird grin on his face. I asked him what did he have in mind and he said he wanted to try heroin. Up till that point I had thought that heroin could only be injected and I was and still am totally against needles. So i begged him not to go for it, but he insisted. I did not know about the manner in which addiction takes place nor about the physical withdrawals of the drug. I had heard stuff about not being psychologically able to stop once you start and again i was not going to try it because i hated needles and i still begged my friend to not do this drug. I remember saying to him that we have done all drugs known to mankind, lets just leave this alone, ive heard too many bad things (though nothing in detail, nor was i interested in them then). But he did not budge so i said i would babysit him if need but would not do it myself and we proceeded to another friends place who was a junkie. We picked him up and went to the dealer and he got a gram of smack. Once back in the car he started to roll up a cigarette and that is when i found out that H is also smokable, my favorite way to do a drug in the first place, so i decided that i would have a few hits. We all shared one cigarette and i got the buzz as if i had smoked a lot of pot and that is all. so i got interested. A few days after, this time I insisted on trying it again and my friend and I went and scored some more. Mind you, smack here in my country is dirt cheap and very pure, i mean, we do border Afghanistan so go figure. And this time we rolled a few cigarettes and shared them. That was the first time I got a proper opiate buzz that I was aware of. And I Loved It! unfortunately...
Another unfortunate thing was that one time or a couple of uses dont give you withdrawals otherwise perhaps i wouldve backed the **** up. But no, for 6 months I used H every few days sometimes even more till one night I woke up in sweats and realized that I was withdrawing. I said to myself that I was done using the drug and fell back to sleep immediately. But that was not the case. Perhaps after a few days I started smoking it again. And after that everyone who is an addict knows how the story goes. But till date I still think back that only if Heroin was not smokable or that If that friend only injected or something, things wouldve been so much better and different. But of course, it was not meant to be like that.
I still have not hit rock bottom which makes it harder for me to just quit all drugs the way 12 steps recommends it nor do i see the sense in it. Im still not sure if AVRT supports the same argument. Hence I have given myself the time period of 40 days from today to quit heroin for good. No more dabbling as i end up doing nowadays every few weeks. Never ever again. And I will never ever change my mind about it. That is a cert. But as far as pot and the rest of my interests in the drug world go, I am still giving it some thought. My next post will explain the situation better. The post where I explain why I believe pot and booze are not bad but good for me. Not the most popular opinion in the world, but that is the one I hold.
I love you all who listen and give me feedback. No ********, no sugarcoating, no nothing. That is what I need. And for that, Thank you

soberlicious

I know it's tempting to think like this, but when you are addicted there is always a way. Someone very dear to me was against needles too. He simply had other people shoot him up. Unfortunately in addiction nothing will stand in the way of the high.

Your statements of "my interests in the drug world" and "why I believe pot and booze are not bad for me but good" are both coming directly from your AV. You may not agree with me right now (more aptly your Beast will be extremely p*ssed off at what I'm suggesting) but if you abstain completely from all drugs and alcohol and read the RR book, it might make more sense. I'd be interested to know your thoughts on it.

TameTheBeast

Hi everyone, I just got the book and read about 60 pages, so far so good, I took the crash course and feel different... its weird.

freshstart57

It is kind of terrifying, knowing that you are about to leave that comforting mess of anxiety, shame, depression and anger all behind, and embark on something new. Bare neggid too, and that is all you need.

dwtbd

I had a fair understanding of what AVRT was about just from visiting the site and taking the free crash course. I just completed reading the Rational Recovery book and now I have a fair understanding of how much insight to addiction is involved with AVRT, and I also understand there is a lot to learn after 'learning' AVRT.
One of the chapters that struck such a big chord, is " I know why you drink". I drank because I loved to be drunk/high, and it was that simple. Reading it and saying to myself 'yep that nails it in a nutshell'. That really is the crux of the matter pure and simple, bang right in the face and truer than true, something I think I knew all along, but I think I figured I was unique , as if no one else just loved the feeling. I now think I see that my Beast was 'born' along time ago and I was going along for the ride(or perhaps willingly decided to play chauffer), but I am back in the driver's seat , the Beast is raising a ruckus in the trunk, but in time I think it will be delegated to a maybe a small rattle in the tailpipe or a squeaky wheel.