And the Big Plan is made...
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: "I'm not lost for I know where I am. But however, where I am may be lost ..."
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Originally Posted by fini
actually, no, now that you're clarifying i'm extra sure i didn't misunderstand.
i understood it just right the first time.
the moment was a surrender.
but this isn't the thread for that nor do i wish to argue the point.
i understood it just right the first time.
the moment was a surrender.
but this isn't the thread for that nor do i wish to argue the point.
I wasn't arguing.
Not sure what's got your knickers in a twist, but my intention was not to offend. Many people have that moment of clarity, that moment of surrender, that flip of the switch, that epiphany, that awakening, that profound "knowing"...and that is the end for them. They know there will be no return. That is how Jack Trimpey describes the Big Plan. It's when it's all done. It's often why Trimpey says folks have a made a Big Plan without actually calling it such. That's because it's an act that's been around long before he assigned a name to it.
Anyway I was just chiming in on this "Big Plan" thread to make an observation from my POV.
Seriously, no need to get all excited.
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Originally Posted by dwtbd 
Making a Big Plan, or the idea of a Big Plan in general was a turning point for me. Before I knew the phrase, prior to learning of RR/AVRT, I made a BP hundreds of times, hundreds of regret filled never agains, most have I'm sure.
But those I now see as big plans(lowercase), because though I was truly regretful of my actions and didn't want to suffer the consequences , nor continue to, I made the plan while entertaining on different levels the notion of the disease model of addiction. I let myself believe I was most likely going to be influenced by 'something' beyond me control. That relapse was nearly inevitable, I was determined to fight it but I felt that drinking again was possible or even likely, whether I sincerely wanted to quit or not.
I now have a Big Plan, I will never drink again, and I will never change my mind. It establishes a different mindset a 'tool' to borrow a recovery term, a big one too, sledgehammer size. This tool affirms for me that it will stay in place in happiness , sadness during or 'in' any 'ness'. Forgetting or ignoring it are not options. I no longer believe something beyond my control influences that decision.
I ended my addiction, my BP is the tool I use to never let it start again.
So I think I see what Jess is saying. Never couldn't be said or affirmed while knowing or thinking that future drinking was a possibility. If I still believed the disease model , I couldn't have made mine either.
Jess awesome thread, your honesty and integrity are inspiring , Onward!
But those I now see as big plans(lowercase), because though I was truly regretful of my actions and didn't want to suffer the consequences , nor continue to, I made the plan while entertaining on different levels the notion of the disease model of addiction. I let myself believe I was most likely going to be influenced by 'something' beyond me control. That relapse was nearly inevitable, I was determined to fight it but I felt that drinking again was possible or even likely, whether I sincerely wanted to quit or not.
I now have a Big Plan, I will never drink again, and I will never change my mind. It establishes a different mindset a 'tool' to borrow a recovery term, a big one too, sledgehammer size. This tool affirms for me that it will stay in place in happiness , sadness during or 'in' any 'ness'. Forgetting or ignoring it are not options. I no longer believe something beyond my control influences that decision.
I ended my addiction, my BP is the tool I use to never let it start again.
So I think I see what Jess is saying. Never couldn't be said or affirmed while knowing or thinking that future drinking was a possibility. If I still believed the disease model , I couldn't have made mine either.
Jess awesome thread, your honesty and integrity are inspiring , Onward!
This place and you guys are the one place I get to be honest. My boyfriend knows I drank but no one else does. However, no-one else besides immediate family knows I quit so they wouldn't care if I drank.
I know that there is no need for this thread and that never drinking again is a personal decision but, there I times I really like to get feedback into "my beast". Hence the reason for it.
Lastly no offense intended to anyone but, I am not surrendering sh*t. I fully knew exactly what I was doing when I chose to consume alcohol. Nothing made me do it. Thus, the beast won a small battle.... however, I (the real me) has got the war.
Jess
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So I catch my 15 year old smoking weed. I am freaking the f**k out for the last two days. I have her on every punishment I could think of (computer=gone, phone=gone, cable TV=gone) and now I just feel like a bad mom.
I cant say what did I do wrong? It's more like what have I done right.....UUGGHH!!!!!!
Jess
I cant say what did I do wrong? It's more like what have I done right.....UUGGHH!!!!!!
Jess
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Sorry to hear this news, Jess. I'm not sure punishment is the answer here which helps best, but each parent has to make these calls as they choose. Creating more of a two-way trust on responsibilities and choices might be helpful, imo. Being a parent is not easy of course, but like it or not, as parents we do set the examples, and its what it is.
I understand your feeling all kinds of emotions too. I hope your okay with yourself over all this. Guilt and blame are useless, imo, except to be examples of what not to do.
Take it easy, Jess.
I understand your feeling all kinds of emotions too. I hope your okay with yourself over all this. Guilt and blame are useless, imo, except to be examples of what not to do.
Take it easy, Jess.
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Yeah, we had the talk many times because weed is legal here and it is just not taken all to seriously. The punishment is so that she knows I absolutely do consider it a big deal.
However, she gets her phone back tomorrow and we intend to move about happily with the holidays. It is just crazy to me that I didn't see the signs. This started AFTER I got sober and she does not know about my one night of drinking so I thought I was setting a good example.
But, at any rate.... it just sucks.
Jess
However, she gets her phone back tomorrow and we intend to move about happily with the holidays. It is just crazy to me that I didn't see the signs. This started AFTER I got sober and she does not know about my one night of drinking so I thought I was setting a good example.
But, at any rate.... it just sucks.
Jess
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Hey, I believe you have been this last year setting a great example of making the right choices for alcohol/drugs, and I hope you believe you have too! It hurts to have a child make a bad choice of course. You can still be a great example for her now too. As you know, we can always turn things around for the better, and you're a wonderful example of doing exactly that too, Jess.
None of us are perfect, including our kids, lol.
None of us are perfect, including our kids, lol.
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Join Date: May 2012
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Jess,
when my oldest daughter was 15/16/17, i "caught" her doing several things. (i put this in quotation marks because to this day i'm not certain that she didn't WANT to be caught and made it kind of easy, even though it was partly hidden....)
i found a couple of bottles of vodka and gin in her closet (i was doing her laundry occasionally and had asked if she wanted to put it away herself or would it be alright if i went into her room to put it on her bed...she chose the latter. meaning: she knew full well i went into her room)
i made her take those downstairs and i have a great photo of her with her coolest sunglasses on, standing over the sink while she's pouring it all out with a giant -almost-laughing-pout on her face...
i found 400 dollars worth of lingerie on her bed just before the phone call from her dad that his wife's (her step mom's) wallet had gone missing, with over 400 dollars in it....
the thing that freaked me out the most was the knife.
i made her dump the booze (and boy did i feel like a giant hypocrite; i was a secret drinker).
i sent her step mom a cheque and told my kid she had one day in which to come up with three different written plans how to pay me that money back and i'd get to choose the way. she cleaned the house every saturday for many months. it was wonderful
the knife...i can't remember...how weird is that????...but i got rid of it and nothing like that ever came back.
i know the fears, Jess, and the first intense desire to do anything that will hit hard, hard enough to have the biggest positive impact.
and i know the feeling of impotence that went along with it.
the panic.
and i don't know what made me able to step back and take a few breaths and gather my wits.
what i'm trying to say is: you reacted, and you reacted strongly. nothing wrong with that. no doubt she understood you take it seriously. and that's important.
what i found with my kid was that i could actually talk with her once we both settled down a bit. not lecture, but talk with. and she was always appreciative the few times i admitted to overreacting, or to not having known what to do...it was okay to be human and show i could be unsure and wrong. took me a while to do this, as i was very afraid that might mean she would see it as weak and try to take advantage, or she'd see it as weak and then not feel safe...
i don't know your relationship with your kid, but if it's basically okay, then take a breather and you can chat about this ongoing as you're both able, and willing to hear. then she'll be sure to know it comes from a place of love and concern. it's obvious to US HERE that that's where it is, but teenagers may not always see it that way
and by the way, that kid is now 36 and a smashingly wonderful person; straifghtshooting as anything, and occasionally still pouts!
when my oldest daughter was 15/16/17, i "caught" her doing several things. (i put this in quotation marks because to this day i'm not certain that she didn't WANT to be caught and made it kind of easy, even though it was partly hidden....)
i found a couple of bottles of vodka and gin in her closet (i was doing her laundry occasionally and had asked if she wanted to put it away herself or would it be alright if i went into her room to put it on her bed...she chose the latter. meaning: she knew full well i went into her room)
i made her take those downstairs and i have a great photo of her with her coolest sunglasses on, standing over the sink while she's pouring it all out with a giant -almost-laughing-pout on her face...
i found 400 dollars worth of lingerie on her bed just before the phone call from her dad that his wife's (her step mom's) wallet had gone missing, with over 400 dollars in it....
the thing that freaked me out the most was the knife.
i made her dump the booze (and boy did i feel like a giant hypocrite; i was a secret drinker).
i sent her step mom a cheque and told my kid she had one day in which to come up with three different written plans how to pay me that money back and i'd get to choose the way. she cleaned the house every saturday for many months. it was wonderful
the knife...i can't remember...how weird is that????...but i got rid of it and nothing like that ever came back.
i know the fears, Jess, and the first intense desire to do anything that will hit hard, hard enough to have the biggest positive impact.
and i know the feeling of impotence that went along with it.
the panic.
and i don't know what made me able to step back and take a few breaths and gather my wits.
what i'm trying to say is: you reacted, and you reacted strongly. nothing wrong with that. no doubt she understood you take it seriously. and that's important.
what i found with my kid was that i could actually talk with her once we both settled down a bit. not lecture, but talk with. and she was always appreciative the few times i admitted to overreacting, or to not having known what to do...it was okay to be human and show i could be unsure and wrong. took me a while to do this, as i was very afraid that might mean she would see it as weak and try to take advantage, or she'd see it as weak and then not feel safe...
i don't know your relationship with your kid, but if it's basically okay, then take a breather and you can chat about this ongoing as you're both able, and willing to hear. then she'll be sure to know it comes from a place of love and concern. it's obvious to US HERE that that's where it is, but teenagers may not always see it that way
and by the way, that kid is now 36 and a smashingly wonderful person; straifghtshooting as anything, and occasionally still pouts!
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Strange, isn't it? The roads we've walked. The abuse of ourselves we were willing to endure. But let one of our kids put one foot on that road and we have zero toleration. If only we had been as concerned for ourselves all along.
That's what our children do for us. They make us feel all kinds of things we never intended to feel.
That's what our children do for us. They make us feel all kinds of things we never intended to feel.
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And I did sit down and talk with her. I explained that I stood by the punishment but, only for the weekend and then gave her phone, computer and cable back. I thought 48 hours of thinking about her decision was probably long enough. She seemed to get where I was coming from about it. I think she was a bit surprised that I saw it as such a big deal but, it is pretty much like you said Paul..."They make us feel all kinds of things we never intended to feel."
And fini... thank you for the kind response. I keep thinking its because I work too much or I didn't say the right thin\gs. Its good to know that other people go through this sh*t also.
Why do I have this horrible feeling that at 15 this is only the beginning. My mom sid we love our kids through anything.....
Anyway, thank you all.
Jess
And fini... thank you for the kind response. I keep thinking its because I work too much or I didn't say the right thin\gs. Its good to know that other people go through this sh*t also.
Why do I have this horrible feeling that at 15 this is only the beginning. My mom sid we love our kids through anything.....
Anyway, thank you all.
Jess
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: "I'm not lost for I know where I am. But however, where I am may be lost ..."
Posts: 5,273
Hope all is well Jess. I understand how you feel. I have triplet boys who will be 16 in March. It's strange to be past the phase when my biggest problem was the boys playing too rough on the playground. Things have gotten real lol.
Honestly, I know you say you "freaked out" but a strong reaction from you is not necessarily a bad thing. As a young girl/teen, I did not receive much direction. I did as I pleased. My mother was busy managing my stepfather's addiction and enduring his daily abuse, so I was free to run and I took full advantage of that. I had already smoked pot, drank, smoked cigarettes, and had sex by my thirteenth birthday.
My friends all thought I was lucky. But I was out of control, and no one bothered to stop it. Although I certainly would have rebelled against any discipline, deep down I know I craved some boundaries, and for someone to notice that I was self destructing.
Honestly, I know you say you "freaked out" but a strong reaction from you is not necessarily a bad thing. As a young girl/teen, I did not receive much direction. I did as I pleased. My mother was busy managing my stepfather's addiction and enduring his daily abuse, so I was free to run and I took full advantage of that. I had already smoked pot, drank, smoked cigarettes, and had sex by my thirteenth birthday.
My friends all thought I was lucky. But I was out of control, and no one bothered to stop it. Although I certainly would have rebelled against any discipline, deep down I know I craved some boundaries, and for someone to notice that I was self destructing.
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Thank you for that SL-
I feel like she is growing up way to quickly... something I did as well. She said, "I can't believe how you are acting about a little weed. You are so over dramatic". It's amazing how much we change when we are raising kids.
She has not had an easy go of it up till now and I think I parent out of guilt sometimes. No, I know I parent out of guilt.
Now that things have settled down some I think she is glad that I was not "cool" about it. A lot of her friends parents are ok with it and a few even allow it to be used in their houses. I told her I would never be that parent and she said "I don't expect you to".... that to me was a compliment.
I hope you have a wonderful Christmas SL and thanks again.
Jess
I feel like she is growing up way to quickly... something I did as well. She said, "I can't believe how you are acting about a little weed. You are so over dramatic". It's amazing how much we change when we are raising kids.
She has not had an easy go of it up till now and I think I parent out of guilt sometimes. No, I know I parent out of guilt.
Now that things have settled down some I think she is glad that I was not "cool" about it. A lot of her friends parents are ok with it and a few even allow it to be used in their houses. I told her I would never be that parent and she said "I don't expect you to".... that to me was a compliment.
I hope you have a wonderful Christmas SL and thanks again.
Jess
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Originally Posted by jkb
Thanks for this. You do get what I am saying. The very crux of the BP was what I struggled with. I did not drink for almost 9 months but, I could not say never will I drink again. Without the never (as SL had attempted to show me in the past) it is all for not, as they say.
This place and you guys are the one place I get to be honest. My boyfriend knows I drank but no one else does. However, no-one else besides immediate family knows I quit so they wouldn't care if I drank.
I know that there is no need for this thread and that never drinking again is a personal decision but, there I times I really like to get feedback into "my beast". Hence the reason for it.
Lastly no offense intended to anyone but, I am not surrendering sh*t. I fully knew exactly what I was doing when I chose to consume alcohol. Nothing made me do it. Thus, the beast won a small battle.... however, I (the real me) has got the war.
Jess
This place and you guys are the one place I get to be honest. My boyfriend knows I drank but no one else does. However, no-one else besides immediate family knows I quit so they wouldn't care if I drank.
I know that there is no need for this thread and that never drinking again is a personal decision but, there I times I really like to get feedback into "my beast". Hence the reason for it.
Lastly no offense intended to anyone but, I am not surrendering sh*t. I fully knew exactly what I was doing when I chose to consume alcohol. Nothing made me do it. Thus, the beast won a small battle.... however, I (the real me) has got the war.
Jess
I love your honesty it's refreshing
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The months go by and I see my thread less and less. I suppose that is a good thing. Thanks for the reminder that it is here 13. Not drinking has not really been an issue.
Living a whole new life is weird. I am going to need to make some tough relationship decisions in the near future. It is amazing the clarity that comes with truly knowing you will never drink again. Knowing that I have made that decision gives me the strength to make so many other decisions and not be so insecure about them. Even if they are tough.
I love life post-BP. Sure I have sh*t days but, for the most part I am ok. I got my second job going so I keep REALLY busy. My daughter and I are getting along much better and now I realize that I am ready to move forward and make a life for myself.
I feel a ton of guilt for having outgrown my relationship with the guy who stood by me through the last 7 years of hell and it is not any easier since I moved in with him a few months back but, all in due time I guess.
Anyway, just a quick update. Happy New Years
everyone..........
Jess
Living a whole new life is weird. I am going to need to make some tough relationship decisions in the near future. It is amazing the clarity that comes with truly knowing you will never drink again. Knowing that I have made that decision gives me the strength to make so many other decisions and not be so insecure about them. Even if they are tough.
I love life post-BP. Sure I have sh*t days but, for the most part I am ok. I got my second job going so I keep REALLY busy. My daughter and I are getting along much better and now I realize that I am ready to move forward and make a life for myself.
I feel a ton of guilt for having outgrown my relationship with the guy who stood by me through the last 7 years of hell and it is not any easier since I moved in with him a few months back but, all in due time I guess.
Anyway, just a quick update. Happy New Years
everyone..........Jess
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It is amazing the clarity that comes with truly knowing you will never drink again. Knowing that I have made that decision gives me the strength to make so many other decisions and not be so insecure about them. Even if they are tough.
I think you need a special hat.
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