Go Back  SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information > Secular Recovery > Secular Connections
Reload this Page >

Addictive Voice Recognition Technique (AVRT) Discussion Part 4

Blogs


Notices

Addictive Voice Recognition Technique (AVRT) Discussion Part 4

Old 05-06-2012, 04:57 AM
  # 241 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 91
Thanks for reminding me of that TU. I realized my beast just loves to have me watch the show Intervention for that very reason. It loves to compare my drinking habits with other people's. It would say "Look at her, she's a bottle a day vodka drinker, you just drink a bottle of wine a day.... So you're not over the top, go ahead keep up with your drinking"

I also (or it also) strangely reveled when people on the show relapsed. I wasn't jealous, I was strangely happy. I think it was because the beast was sending me the message "see, nothing works on this problem anyway. Expensive treatment leads to relapse anyway, so you might as well keep drinking"

I wonder how many people who watch the show are actually helped watching these extreme cases of addiction, and how many are like me..... Use it as an excuse to continue.
Thrifty is offline  
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Thrifty For This Useful Post:
Gavinandnikki (05-06-2012), Terminally Unique (05-06-2012), topspin (05-07-2012)
Old 05-07-2012, 05:16 AM
  # 242 (permalink)  
Member
 
jberk65's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 52
Hi All, My question is "drinking dreams". I had my first one last nite, it felt so real I woke up convinced that I actually drank at a party..I felt so ashamed and angry and it actually took s while to registerthatit was only a dream. Seems its common and usually after a day of anxiety or stress when you normally would have gone straight to the "bottle". Which fits in because I had that "edgy" feeling all day yesterday... but wow it felt so real. Anyone else had these "drinking dreams"????
And TU how does RR cover this topic?
jberk65 is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 11:45 AM
  # 243 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 6
I read the crash course on Sunday, decided to quit for good, was a spur of the moment thing after months of second guessing. I've literally written pages and pages of reasons for quitting, but my mind always came up with a reason to continue, Its ironic how creative our minds can be, how we backward rationalize. I like the idea of not having to compete with this inner dialogue anymore, I don't have to have a "net benefit" on my CBA to continue being sober. My attitude now is, even if there was a benefit to drinking, I still wouldn't do it, because I've already made a commitment for life and there's no second guessing. Any thought/feeling is AV of the Beast, not me. I used to be into ZEN buddhism and this makes sense.


One thing that's bothering me now is, what if I ever slip up just once. I've slipped up many times in the past, and my belief in my ability to control myself is at an all time low.

My biggest concern, is that I remain sober for a month or two, then try use the technique in other areas of my life, like to eat healthier, I could make a rule like

"I will quit carbs for good, will never eat takeouts again"

, and eventually slip up with the diet rule, because its not very practical or whatever, and then I lose all faith in my the method, and therefore lose all faith in my ability to remain sober...

Maybe I'm over thinking things and just gotta relax,

Anyway, I'm gonna get the book asap. I feel good about this except for the concern I mentioned.

Thanks very much.
laconicsa is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 01:48 PM
  # 244 (permalink)  
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location:    USA                        Recovered with AVRT  (Rational Recovery)  ___________
Posts: 3,680
RE: Drinking or Using Dreams

Originally Posted by jberk65 View Post
My question is "drinking dreams"... TU how does RR cover this topic?
Whether you drink/use in the dream or not, an AV dream is just evidence that the Beast is on the run, banished from human consciousness, and that it must now live out its existence as an invalid. The Beast can't get you to drink when you are awake, so it has to indulge when you are asleep and paralyzed, and couldn't drink even if you wanted to. Pretty pathetic. Just recognize the AV dream as a clear sign of victory, and have a nice day.

I covered this before:
Terminally Unique is offline  
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Terminally Unique For This Useful Post:
GerandTwine (05-08-2012), jberk65 (05-07-2012), Lenina (05-07-2012)
Old 05-07-2012, 01:50 PM
  # 245 (permalink)  
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location:    USA                        Recovered with AVRT  (Rational Recovery)  ___________
Posts: 3,680
[delete post]
Terminally Unique is offline  
Old 05-09-2012, 08:02 AM
  # 246 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 5
First time posting

I'm not sure where this fits into this thread. I'm plunging in. Day #1 using AVRT. First morning without having had my usual 5 glasses wine in the evening. I grappled with my beast all day yesterday. Finally went to bed hours earlier than usual knowing that my beast would wake me at 4am (as he always does) to explain to me why I am so weak and horrible. I stayed with him and said I wasn't going to drink anymore. He stopped for a while and I finally slept again. I am hearing my beast talk again today about moderation. "You can enjoy one nice glass of merlot with dinner...just don't finish the bottle. If you can quit completely, why can't you just be moderate?" THAT is my AVRT. The postings here are helping me enormously.
Novice is offline  
Old 05-09-2012, 08:15 AM
  # 247 (permalink)  
Not The Way way, Just the way
 
GerandTwine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: US
Posts: 1,414
Blog Entries: 13
Originally Posted by Novice View Post
I'm not sure where this fits into this thread. I'm plunging in. Day #1 using AVRT. First morning without having had my usual 5 glasses wine in the evening. I grappled with my beast all day yesterday. Finally went to bed hours earlier than usual knowing that my beast would wake me at 4am (as he always does) to explain to me why I am so weak and horrible. I stayed with him and said I wasn't going to drink anymore. He stopped for a while and I finally slept again. I am hearing my beast talk again today about moderation. "You can enjoy one nice glass of merlot with dinner...just don't finish the bottle. If you can quit completely, why can't you just be moderate?" THAT is my AVRT. The postings here are helping me enormously.
Hi Novice,

Congratulations on getting here. In AVRT that means a huge portion of your struggle is already over. Just be sure to stay stopped while you learn about it.

GT
GerandTwine is offline  
Old 05-09-2012, 08:27 AM
  # 248 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 5
My next question may be answered somewhere on this site: Do you experts advocate issuing an announcement to family and friends that one has decided to stop drinking for good? I have a feeling that this will start the "coaching" and "rallying cries of support" from all concerned...and, frankly, I don't like being coached. I feel like I just want my abstinence to speak for itself and not having people scrutinize me. Or is this my AV speaking again?
Novice is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to Novice For This Useful Post:
Newatthis34 (05-09-2012)
Old 05-09-2012, 08:36 AM
  # 249 (permalink)  
Not The Way way, Just the way
 
GerandTwine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: US
Posts: 1,414
Blog Entries: 13
I just posted on Big Plan Privacy here

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ml#post3395313

The quick answer is the Big Plan is unprovable to anyone else, so it really is your ongoing abstinence that will have to do the real speaking for your change, whether or not you tell them.
GerandTwine is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to GerandTwine For This Useful Post:
jberk65 (05-09-2012)
Old 05-09-2012, 04:47 PM
  # 250 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Sober State
Posts: 1,126
Can you be successful in abstinence of alcohol (BP) but not other drugs?
Let me explain, I made a BP about alcohol. Never really even thought about other stuff b/c I do not use other drugs BUT if I had opiates in the past (prescribed, years ago) I always took them even if I didn't need them.
I liked the high feeling. I've joked to my husband in the past, that when I'm 70, I'm going to pop pain pills b/c I'll be old & deserve it, who cares?
Yet, just today I remembered all of this stuff & see the AV in all of that.
I feel like I've been duped. I committed to no alcohol forever but never even crossed my mind about abstaining from other stuff in the future.
I guess I just need to make a new BP & include anything else that may ever make me high but I just wanted to share this b/c that Beast is very clever & sneaky.
Purplecatlover is offline  
Old 05-10-2012, 08:02 AM
  # 251 (permalink)  
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location:    USA                        Recovered with AVRT  (Rational Recovery)  ___________
Posts: 3,680
Personal Business

Originally Posted by Novice View Post
Do you experts advocate issuing an announcement to family and friends that one has decided to stop drinking for good? I have a feeling that this will start the "coaching" and "rallying cries of support" from all concerned...
The issue of disclosing one's Big Plan is addressed on pages 200-202 of RR: The New Cure, under the heading "Personal Business," so if you want the official RR take on it, read that. Essentially, the book likens telling others about your BP with telling others you are an alcoholic in order to be "held accountable" and/or be protected from temptation. Of course, if you do that, your Beast is going to smell that fear and uncertainty in no time flat, and correctly surmise that you didn't really mean it when you made your BP.

Personally, I think there are times when it is warranted to disclose the Big Plan, such as when your wife/husband/etc wants an answer as to whether or not this matter is finally resolved. Granted, if you have a history of broken promises, they probably won't believe you for quite a while, and they would be in their right mind for being suspicious. That said, you had better be very sure that you aren't telling them because you expect them to hold you accountable, support you, or keep you abstinent. Trust has to start somewhere, and if you can't trust yourself, why should anyone else?
Terminally Unique is offline  
The Following 13 Users Say Thank You to Terminally Unique For This Useful Post:
californiapoppy (05-14-2012), Dominorose (03-18-2013), Gavinandnikki (05-10-2012), GerandTwine (05-11-2012), jberk65 (05-12-2012), m1k3 (05-10-2012), MeredithD1 (07-11-2012), ReadyAndAble (05-10-2012), soberlicious (05-11-2012), SomethingBetter (05-16-2012), thesun (05-11-2012), theVman31 (12-24-2017), Thrifty (05-10-2012)
Old 05-11-2012, 06:18 AM
  # 252 (permalink)  
Member
 
m1k3's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 2,884
I had an interesting afternoon yesterday. Really busy at work and I was planning to stop at the grocery store on the way home. I drank a little more coffee than normal and realized I was slightly anxious because of the caffeine but no big deal I thought. A little later my beast went nuts. It was insistent that I needed to pick up some scotch at when I stopped at the grocery store. I did my thing being mindful of what it was saying and keeping its wants and my wants separate. I have to admit the anxiety that started with the coffee went way up.

So, I stopped at the grocery store, did my shopping and didn't even look at the scotch. By the time I got home it was all over. That is the 1st time that I have had a reaction that strong and that lasted that long.

Beast must be getting desperate.
m1k3 is offline  
The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to m1k3 For This Useful Post:
californiapoppy (05-14-2012), Chimp (05-11-2012), freshstart57 (05-13-2012), Gavinandnikki (05-11-2012), Lenina (05-11-2012), soberlicious (05-11-2012), Tippingpoint (05-14-2012)
Old 05-11-2012, 10:53 AM
  # 253 (permalink)  
Not The Way way, Just the way
 
GerandTwine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: US
Posts: 1,414
Blog Entries: 13
Originally Posted by m1k3 View Post
...I stopped at the grocery store, did my shopping and didn't even look at the scotch. By the time I got home it was all over.
...
Beast must be getting desperate.
Rendered a quadriplegic by your Big Plan, IT is very desparate. IT would love for you to believe it's dangerous to "look at the scotch", especially if IT gets you to go out of your way to avoid looking at it.

Check out the last paragraph on p. 203 in RR:TNC. It's about "shifting" back and forth from the Beast's view of the booze to Your view of the booze.
GerandTwine is offline  
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to GerandTwine For This Useful Post:
californiapoppy (05-14-2012), Chimp (05-11-2012), Gavinandnikki (05-11-2012), m1k3 (05-11-2012)
Old 05-11-2012, 11:12 AM
  # 254 (permalink)  
Member
 
m1k3's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 2,884
It wasn't that I was avoiding it. In my grocery store the liquor section is set up so it's pretty hard to avoid. I didn't look at the scotch the same way I didn't look at cat litter. I didn't have any intention of buying any. It was just another item in the store.
m1k3 is offline  
The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to m1k3 For This Useful Post:
californiapoppy (05-14-2012), Chimp (05-11-2012), Gavinandnikki (05-11-2012), GerandTwine (05-11-2012), Lenina (05-15-2012)
Old 05-11-2012, 11:23 AM
  # 255 (permalink)  
Member
 
m1k3's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 2,884
As I told TU, I was probably going to spend a little time talking about how I look at this as a Buddhist. For me it was just another craving, more intense than usual but not a big deal. I have learned through my Buddhism that thoughts are just thoughts, they don't require action and that feelings aren't facts.

So, just because there was a craving for scotch it was just another feeling, it wasn't MY feeling. I didn't choose to have it, the same as the thoughts. I didn't choose to have the thought. In fact there is no way for me to choose whether or not to have a thought or a feeling. They come and go of their own. What is me is whether I choose to react to them or not. That's why I like RR so much as it fits right in with my world view.

Feelings come and go
like clouds in the sky,
RR is my anchor.
m1k3 is offline  
The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to m1k3 For This Useful Post:
californiapoppy (05-14-2012), Chimp (05-11-2012), freshstart57 (05-13-2012), Gavinandnikki (05-11-2012), jberk65 (05-13-2012), Lenina (05-11-2012), Thrifty (05-12-2012), Tippingpoint (05-14-2012)
Old 05-11-2012, 01:42 PM
  # 256 (permalink)  
Member
 
Chimp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kent, UK
Posts: 351
Looking forward to receiving my copy of the book tomorrow. Having spent day online reading, Rational Recovery, is very much for me and though a beginner, did tell the beast where to go a couple of times today.

Great stuff!
Chimp is offline  
The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to Chimp For This Useful Post:
californiapoppy (05-14-2012), GerandTwine (05-11-2012), jberk65 (05-12-2012), Lenina (05-15-2012), m1k3 (05-11-2012), soberlicious (05-11-2012), Tippingpoint (05-14-2012)
Old 05-13-2012, 03:37 AM
  # 257 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 91
So, just because there was a craving for scotch it was just another feeling, it wasn't MY feeling. I didn't choose to have it, the same as the thoughts. I didn't choose to have the thought. In fact there is no way for me to choose whether or not to have a thought or a feeling. They come and go of their own. What is me is whether I choose to react to them or not. That's why I like RR so much as it fits right in with my world view.

Feelings come and go
like clouds in the sky,



I like what you said about not choosing thoughts and they come and go. When we think we are in control and that we are our urges, the urges then are our making and therefore our fault. However, acting on them is our choice.
Thrifty is offline  
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Thrifty For This Useful Post:
Aussiebutterfly (05-13-2012), californiapoppy (05-14-2012), Gavinandnikki (05-14-2012), Lenina (05-15-2012)
Old 05-13-2012, 11:39 PM
  # 258 (permalink)  
Recovered with AVRT
 
Aussiebutterfly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Queensland Australia
Posts: 86
Very true Thrifty. I had forgotten that the other day when I was having some beast activity. We have to remember that "IT" wants the drink but "I" don't and I am in control on this body "IT" is like a quadraplegic so it can't lift a finger unless I make it happen. No need to to be frightened of the desire to drink then... I just think "I never drink" because I have made my Big Plan so there is no need to debate the issue and just let the thought go.
Aussiebutterfly is offline  
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Aussiebutterfly For This Useful Post:
californiapoppy (05-14-2012), Lenina (05-15-2012), Thrifty (05-14-2012)
Old 05-14-2012, 01:43 AM
  # 259 (permalink)  
Member
 
jberk65's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 52
I've been following this thread AND going to AA once a week, because this group is all about topics and questions..a beginners group. Anyway my RR: TNC book arrived a few days ago and it reads and fits so effortlessly that AA seems..pointless..and I don't feel like going tonight. Is the twinge I'm feeling the beast in panic mode??
jberk65 is offline  
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to jberk65 For This Useful Post:
Lenina (05-15-2012), ReadyAndAble (05-14-2012), Tippingpoint (05-14-2012)
Old 05-14-2012, 01:54 PM
  # 260 (permalink)  
Not The Way way, Just the way
 
GerandTwine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: US
Posts: 1,414
Blog Entries: 13
The Beast in the spotlight of your consciousness.

Originally Posted by jberk65 View Post
I've been following this thread AND going to AA once a week, because this group is all about topics and questions..a beginners group. Anyway my RR: TNC book arrived a few days ago and it reads and fits so effortlessly that AA seems..pointless..and I don't feel like going tonight. Is the twinge I'm feeling the beast in panic mode??
Associating "panic mode" to a "twinge" you're feeling suggests more than just not going to AA meetings. It sounds like IT is reacting to "my RR: TNC book arrived a few days ago and it reads and fits so effortlessly" much more than to "I don't feel like going tonight". If you've only been to a half dozen beginner meetings, ending that is no big deal to your Beast compared to what you're preparing to do to IT.

IT sees through your eyes and can hear what you're reading as IT watches the pages slowly turn, and IT knows you've now got IT in the spotlight of your consciousness. So IT will try to throw all kinds of feelings from twinge to panic your way to try to get you to avoid seeing IT for what IT really is.
GerandTwine is offline  
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to GerandTwine For This Useful Post:
Aussiebutterfly (05-14-2012), Gavinandnikki (05-15-2012), jberk65 (05-14-2012), Lenina (05-15-2012)

Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:43 AM.