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Old 05-29-2009, 09:06 AM
  # 21 (permalink)  
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Bam, as a person suffering from lifetime chronic depression I understand some of the feelings you are writing about. I have found that the local Special Collections at my University is a wonderful place to hide. I don't need to worry about returning the items since I can't check them out. I don't have to worry about abusing drugs since they aren't available in the basement of the school. I don't have to worry about being so depressed that I can't even read because much of what is available is simply audio or visual (such as cassettes or posters).

Best of all most of my triggers are not around me. The "people, places and things" that set me off are not in this room. The few people there are serious students or other folks doing research.

Is there any activity you can think of that might help you while you suffer through the depression (as I do know it won't go away overnight...the key is to get through it).
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Old 05-29-2009, 09:08 AM
  # 22 (permalink)  
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Please don't give up on yourself. It takes time to start feeling better, but drinking will sabotage whatever progress you've made so far. Please don't give up. Please hang in there and do whatever is needed to keep yourself balanced. I've been at the point of giving up. I've been there many times. But when I was drinking I just felt awful and my meds didn't help cause I was drowning them in alcohol.

Please hang on. Hang on to anything. Just don't give up on yourself please.
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Old 05-29-2009, 10:26 AM
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Hi Bam, I feel I've been in the same state as you this week, depressed, wondering what's the point, crying, being in physical pain, not being able to sleep cause of the pain, wondering why I even bother staying sober because at least when I drank I "left" my world for at least a while. I had a 4 day weekend last weekend spent entirely alone, my dad called a couple of times and 1 of my sisters called once I have no family in this state, other than that my phone did not ring. My daughter lives 15 miles from me and I had asked her to come visit last weekend, I never heard from her; even when I walked my dog I didn't see any neighbors like I usually do, guess they all had plans for the holiday weekend. I'm very alone, no friends because in the past I just had drinking buddies and being around most people stresses me out I have panic attacks, i live alone and haven't wanted to date in over 2 yrs. BUT, I won't drink because I remember the shame and embarassment that comes with drinking and I DONOT need to add shame and embarassment to how low I already feel, I will NOT drink because my drinking hurts others and I really don't want to hurt anyone else. I will NOT drink because I already have all these physical aches and pains and do NOT want to add the cr*ppy hangover pains to this mess. I look for purpose in my life and can't find any and I do believe we should have a purpose, but I keep telling myself maybe it will come to me someday and if I'm drinking I won't realize what it is.
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Old 05-29-2009, 11:15 AM
  # 24 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Bamboozle View Post



I admire those who can define their own meaning, but I haven't been able to do that thus far. I've tried...and my mind/emotions get in the way...or maybe deep down I just don't buy it. I don't know.


Can I describe the pain? I don't know if I can, but I'll try. For me, it's the emptiness and sadness that oftentimes comes out of nowhere. Otherwise, one word/thought is enough to trigger the downward spiral. How can I feel empty and sad at the same time? I donít know. And simply saying empty and sad isnít profound enough. When it sets in I have lost control. The negative thoughts take over. And all I want to do is escape from it. Itís a dark place,Öand when itís really bad nothing that I enjoy matters. Not the birdsÖnot natureÖnothing. I feel like an observer rather than a participant. I lose all motivation for everything. I donít enjoy being like this. Thatís why Iím getting helpÖ.but the help isnít working. I feel so lostÖand all I can do is wait for my mood to go on a sharp upswing AGAIN. Every single day Iím on this ride. Itís wearing me out. I need a break. And I canít get one.

I went to sleep earlier. Iím still really tiredÖ.but my mind is, of course, going like crazy. I think Iíll go buy a pack of smokes.


Thanks to everyone who responded.
((((Bam)))), no Dr. here, but dang if that doesn't make me wonder about possible bipolar disorder. I do remember the feeling of being knocked down every few days. It seemed like I'd just get back on my feet and then BAM! (sorry ) again back down. It is just a thought and smokes are better than other things. Have you or do you have a chance to discuss this with a psychiatrist? Hugs, Katie.
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Old 05-29-2009, 02:50 PM
  # 25 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Katie09 View Post
((((Bam)))), no Dr. here, but dang if that doesn't make me wonder about possible bipolar disorder. I do remember the feeling of being knocked down every few days. It seemed like I'd just get back on my feet and then BAM! (sorry ) again back down. It is just a thought and smokes are better than other things. Have you or do you have a chance to discuss this with a psychiatrist? Hugs, Katie.
I've wondered that too...but there's no family history that I know of...and besides, from hearing what people who have bipolar go through, I don't come close. I mean, my lows are terrible...but when I'm feeling good I wouldn't describe that as manic. And besides...I might be wrong here, but I thought the mood swings associated with bipolar disorder were NOT triggered by anything...they just cycle. And during my second therapy session, I answered some questions. As soon as I read the paper I knew what she was trying to screen for.....so.....based on my answers I'm not.

Certain things set me off....well, for sure for the bad things. Sometimes it's nothing...but other times I know exactly what brings on the crap mood.

I don't know what puts me in a good mood...I don't really pay attention to that. I'm just glad when it's there.
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Old 05-29-2009, 02:51 PM
  # 26 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Alera View Post
Is there any activity you can think of that might help you while you suffer through the depression (as I do know it won't go away overnight...the key is to get through it).


Yeah...taking pictures when the weather isn't crappy helps. And I go for walks when I can.
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Old 05-29-2009, 04:26 PM
  # 27 (permalink)  
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The first time I left my husband and moved into "the cave" I spiraled into a real bad spot. The cave is a room built into his garage, with one small window covered in thick velvet curtains. When first I moved in here, I played on the computer all night and slept sporadically through the day. I drank heavily. By the time I had lived in this room 3 months, I was in a really bad place.

When I moved out of the cave, I moved into a house with a small above ground pool my dogs and I would sit in for hours. Within a very short time, everything in my head/heart began to be better, and I really believe that it was lack of sunlight that about drove me nuts.

I live in the cave again. I keep the curtains parted so buddy the cave plant can get sunlight. My job forces me to be outside and active, the 2 things that I find are critical to my mental health. It also helps by forcing me to keep a regular sleep schedule and forcing me to have contact with other humans 5 days a week.

My life is far from perfect. Today I am having to work hard to quell fears inside my head that have me all but paralyzed. But I know now to get out and do my 40 minute fast walk, no matter how cruddy I feel, and I know this will pass eventually.
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Old 05-29-2009, 06:17 PM
  # 28 (permalink)  
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To Bam and Jamdls,

I think the best way to meet non-drinking buddies it to find groups related to your hobbies: like a class in an adult education center, a local group, whatever. You'll get to practice your hobby and meet some interesting people with whom alcohol doesn't have to be the point of connection. My 2c.
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Old 05-31-2009, 06:56 AM
  # 29 (permalink)  
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Hey Bam.. are you feeling better? Are things going better for you?
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Old 05-31-2009, 02:39 PM
  # 30 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Eroica View Post
Hey Bam.. are you feeling better? Are things going better for you?


Thanks.

I've been okay this weekend. I've taken a lot of pictures...I'll probably go out soon and take a few more to kill off the battery so I can have it ready to go for tomorrow.

I'm taking things as calmly as I can...and I get away from people when I need to.
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Old 05-31-2009, 04:18 PM
  # 31 (permalink)  
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Bam,

I have found it difficult as to what to say on this thread. I think if someone really wants to drink then they will and there's nothing we can say to stop them.

The only thing i would say is to take one day at a time. I know for myself i sometimes forget that and starting worrying about what may happen tomorrow, next week, next month or next year.

For me things have got better since i stopped drinking, so i find it difficult to relate to posts where someone says that they haven't. I have had my s**t moments, but as a whole i feel life is better without the drink.

My thoughts are with you, i hope you find some peace.

Paul
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Old 05-31-2009, 10:56 PM
  # 32 (permalink)  
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Suffering

Originally Posted by doorknob View Post
Can you describe the pain?

And... I'm not convinced that life has to have a point. In fact, I don't think it does.

I can describe it because I have experienced it. It is the pain of being consciously separated from the whole (you can define the whole however you like).

It is the suffering of resisting what is.

It is the dull ache of unconsciousness. It is feeling empty even when I feel good. It is the pain of not having a purpose in life.

Irish is right. The problem is within and the solution is within. You run from the problem, you run from the solution. The pain does not originate from without and you won't find the solution out there either. In fact the more you resist and the more you try to avoid it or fix it, the more you suffer.
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Old 06-01-2009, 05:02 PM
  # 33 (permalink)  
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REBT or rational emotive behavioral therapy asserts that the source of most emotional disturbances grows from irrational beliefs. In many instances, the best way to handle it is to get in an argument with the emotions and the triggers of these emotions. Please look at these statements when you are not depressed.

Therapy isn't helping.
You go to your therapist, you describe your problems, you get a chance to vent and to express how you feel, you get help and support, and it isn’t helping?

Medicines are not helping.
So, you run down to the pharmacy, you put your money down to pick up some pills which have been evaluated by the FDA as safe an effective. Do you not notice a difference? If you really don’t, then why bother taking them? If the medicines keep you from drinking, they are doing some good, in my opinion.

Nothing works.
Tink! Did you hear that? That was the needle on my BS meter pegging itself to the maximum position.

The pain never goes away.
Then why is it a rollercoaster ride? …and all you can do is wait for your mood to go on a sharp upswing AGAIN? So, maybe a more accurate statement is that the pain comes and goes, but it seems to keep coming back. What causes the pain? What makes it go away? The next time the pain comes, write down what happened; write down what you are thinking; write down what other people said.


I cannot live like this any more.
Sure you can. Everyone does. We, as addicts and alcoholics, tend to over estimate the horrible nature of fairly common and benign things, and we tend to have a low tolerance for frustrating events. Just because you are human, you have emotions and you get depressed, doesn’t necessarily mean that you cannot continue to live. Every person alive knows what it means to be depressed. Perhaps not to the extent that you are depressed, but this leads nicely to my next point.

How can I make these feelings go away?
You have control over your emotions, probably more than you appreciate. The next time you are depressed, write down what seemed to make you feel that way. Then the following time, when the same situation occurs, control your emotion. Give it a try.

Instead of thinking: He hates me.

Think: How sad that he is struggling with hatefulness


Instead of thinking: That [email protected] needs to die.

Think: Since I cannot change his behavior, I am indifferent to his hostility.


Instead of thinking: Everything is all screwed up.

Think: It is too bad that this situation is bad. I’ll either fix it or lump it.


Instead of thinking: This is pi5sing me off.

Think: Why am I allowing myself to get upset?


Instead of thinking: I am powerless over this depression.

Think: People have control over destructive emotions, especially when they challenge irrational beliefs.

There is a biological component to this as well. The emotional centers of your brain are closer to the nerves of your eyes and ears than the intellectual or cognitive center. This is a survival mechanism. So, when a madman walks into the room with a gun you say “quick run!” or “quick, kill him!” and you don’t say “gee, that guy needs to floss” or “If I were him I wouldn’t wear that shirt with those shoes.”

So, we feel before we think. You can develop the habit of checking the validity of your feelings. You can dispute irrational beliefs and replace them with rational beliefs. I have struggled with depression myself, and I know what it means to feel that with extreme intensity and hopelessness. REBT has helped me, and I hope that it can help you, too.

Last edited by Freepath; 06-01-2009 at 05:12 PM. Reason: I'm not smoking dope, but it sure seems like it.
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Old 06-01-2009, 07:05 PM
  # 34 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Freepath View Post
You go to your therapist, you describe your problems, you get a chance to vent and to express how you feel, you get help and support, and it isnít helping?
No, it's not. I have a session on Wednesday...I'm thinking about making it my last one.



Originally Posted by Freepath View Post
So, you run down to the pharmacy, you put your money down to pick up some pills which have been evaluated by the FDA as safe an effective. Do you not notice a difference? If you really donít, then why bother taking them? If the medicines keep you from drinking, they are doing some good, in my opinion.
Why bother taking them? I'm supposed to give them time to work. I'll stop taking them if I don't see an improvment in the next couple of weeks.




Originally Posted by Freepath View Post
Tink! Did you hear that? That was the needle on my BS meter pegging itself to the maximum position.

I'm not geting what I need. I'm so lonely...and hollow inside. Some things I do helps a little...but nothing gets rid of this feeling. It's constant...no matter what my mood it's there in the background.



Originally Posted by Freepath View Post
Then why is it a rollercoaster ride? Öand all you can do is wait for your mood to go on a sharp upswing AGAIN? So, maybe a more accurate statement is that the pain comes and goes, but it seems to keep coming back. What causes the pain? What makes it go away? The next time the pain comes, write down what happened; write down what you are thinking; write down what other people said.
I do write down what happens. Shoot...I don't need to....It's the same things...and nothing changes. And before you ask, I don't know how to fix it. That's why I'm in this shitstorm.



Originally Posted by Freepath View Post
Sure you can. Everyone does. We, as addicts and alcoholics, tend to over estimate the horrible nature of fairly common and benign things, and we tend to have a low tolerance for frustrating events. Just because you are human, you have emotions and you get depressed, doesnít necessarily mean that you cannot continue to live. Every person alive knows what it means to be depressed. Perhaps not to the extent that you are depressed, but this leads nicely to my next point.
Living to survive is not living. I don't care for the pain. I don't like my life. I don't like who I am...and a lot of who I am I cannot change. People say things like if you can't change things, then change your perception. I don't know how to do that. For example, I have terrible skin. Bad acne...and I'm almost 30. I can find no way to feel good about that. And I see it all the time so I'm constanly reminded of it. I've been to a dermatologist...and...surprise...nothing works. My skin is ugly. People do not like acne...and I know why. It's repulsive. I'm living proof. How the f*ck do I sugar-coat that?



Originally Posted by Freepath View Post
You have control over your emotions, probably more than you appreciate. The next time you are depressed, write down what seemed to make you feel that way. Then the following time, when the same situation occurs, control your emotion. Give it a try.

I've tried that. Several times. Epic FAIL.



Originally Posted by Freepath View Post
Instead of thinking: He hates me.

Think: How sad that he is struggling with hatefulness


Instead of thinking: That [email protected] needs to die.

Think: Since I cannot change his behavior, I am indifferent to his hostility.


Instead of thinking: Everything is all screwed up.

Think: It is too bad that this situation is bad. Iíll either fix it or lump it.


Instead of thinking: This is pi5sing me off.

Think: Why am I allowing myself to get upset?


Instead of thinking: I am powerless over this depression.

Think: People have control over destructive emotions, especially when they challenge irrational beliefs.

Most of what I get upset about has to do with me. I don't like myself. I have never liked myself. I had this realization tonight. I don't know how to love myself. All of my faults...all of the things about me that make me socially inept...I don't know how to fix those things. I don't know how to be at peace with my awkwardness.



I feel like I have no way out. It's a terrible place to be. Most of the time I'm barely hanging on. I don't tell my family how bad it is...I don't want them to worry. I wish I could talk about this more and in detail here, but suicide is pretty much a banned topic. I've looked for places on the net to discuss this and I've come up with a whole lotta nothing.

I've noticed that whatever is wrong with me has been getting worse. Pretty soon I'll be too far gone to care.
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Old 06-01-2009, 07:10 PM
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I've noticed that whatever is wrong with me has been getting worse. Pretty soon I'll be too far gone to care.
then, with all due respect to other viewpoints, you need to find a better therapist and different meds, Bam.

I like you - I think you're a great person - but I can't tell you how to love or like yourself, or not feel awkward - but I know that giving up gives you zero chance of ever finding out how.

D
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:16 PM
  # 36 (permalink)  
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How do I "fire" my therapist? I'm not good at that sort of thing. I'm passive...and I'm sure it will be an awkward situation. Therapy started out okay...and then it just went stagnant. It could be me...I mean, look at my posts here. I'm not well and I know it...what should I be doing in therapy, anyway? I'm lost.

My mind is all over the place and I just want to stop thinking about everything.

I know, I can see everyone shaking their heads here, but I don't have insurance and first appointments with therapist are expensive. I simply don't have the funds to shuffle through several to find one that may work.

I'm getting tired of this. I need to save up my money to do things like buy a car so I can get a better job so that I can move into my own place. I have bills that are past due...like everyone else here...and I want to get caught up.

I don't know what I'm going to do.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:17 PM
  # 37 (permalink)  
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Hey Bam..I am just jumpin on the end here.

I get like that all the time. WTF is the point.
I get clean and I am still miserable. Might as well be miserable and be Messed up. At least it takes some of the edge off.

I still get like that at times.
I think I am learning with myself tho is that my happiness has to come within myself somewhere.
I have to want it and make it. It isnt goin to come in any pill or pipe or bottle.
And even tho it seems like it does for a short time. Thats all it is. A masking..a front for a vey short time.
And using only adds to it. You cant be F***ed uip all the time. Reality has to hit once in awhile. And then what happens?
Faced with some really overwhelming **** that has just been buried and added to.

I am not in a good place this past week.
If I were to use to escape. Right now would be it. But I'm not going to and and I am tyring like hell not to either.
I usually get high to relax and have fun. Thank God I dont everytime something went wrong. I would be dead.
I know the point for me is that I am so tired of feeling liek **** from using. Not doin anything with myself. Not being responsible or productive in any way.
No progress. No meaning. Nothing. Might as well just not exist if all I am goin to do is get high all the time.

I fight this **** everyday. Sometimes I give in. But I get right back up again. And sometimes that seems so impossible and I get so tired of it I just cant go on anymore.
But that doesnt last long for me.
I cant just give up. Its not in me to go out like that.
My happiness is in knowing tried. I wanted to try. And that I gave an effort.
My happiness is in not building a pile of consequences behind my addiciton anymore.
Life is real dull compared to what it use to be.
But it is alot more calm and sless stressful if I really look at it and think zabout it.
I have gotten to a point where I am just so tired of all the BS. The emotional and physical and mental BS that comes with the drugs.
I cant take it.
And I havent got it down by any means. I relapse every couple months. But I know I did wrong. I learn what I can from it. And I know I didnt do it becasue I gave up on myself.
And no matter what. I always habe to try.
I may go to my grave trying. But its better than just say F it all and letting it win.
I cant do that.
Things take time Bam. And it takes alot of work inside ourselves.
And of course its goin to be harder to get back to where we need to be.
But good things always are.
Thats what makes them worth it.
I hope you snap out of it soon and get some serious help for those suicidal thoughts.
That **** is npothing to play with.
I dont care how serious you think you are or not.
It is not right to even play with that idea.
Thinking of you. An dyou know you have alot of people here who care alot about you.
I would be asking myself why I am not happy. What is making me so unhappy. What is it that will make me truly content. And what do I have to do to get there.
It isnt that hard really.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:25 PM
  # 38 (permalink)  
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And I want to add that you can get help from social services. Especoially with emergency situations liek this.
If your just goin to give up on being happy. Why not gibe up on trying to save money and bills too?
Whats the point of that? If you dont want to live than why do any of that?
Think about that.
You have to take responsibility and control somewhere here Bam.
Sometimes you gotta say F it and do what you gotta do to get right.
If you keep goin o like this. Your not goin to get better. And you may not be around to drive a car or move into a new place.
You have to fight..I mean literally fight every way possible if you want results. Noon eis goin to do it for you. No therapist or Dr can fix you.
I hope you dont take that wrong or harsh. I care alot about you.
You make me laugh and you are an awesome chick.
I know you got it in you to do better.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:48 PM
  # 39 (permalink)  
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You know Bam, you have a lot more experience with depression than most. Maybe when you are feeling really low, you could reach out to some of the people suffering so much on these boards. Talk about what helps you, like your pictures, even if it isn't a cure all. Even if you don't see the point for yourself, I think you still have a lot of wisdom to offer others here.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:54 PM
  # 40 (permalink)  
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I don't know you, but I know what you're describing... and I am sorry you feel that way, because it is crushing.

It sounds to me like your loneliness is a big factor here. Could you join a photo club or hiking club and meet new people? It seems that's where you find some of your 'point.'

After years of ducking phone calls and turning down invitations, it surprised me (though in hindsight it shouldn't have) to find myself in the basement (literally, and mentally) all alone. There's a way out of that basement, but you gotta take those steps to get up and out. Phoning a friend just to say hi, or making idle chit-chat with a stranger at the coffee shop has gone a long way to me just feeling less alone in the world. Or just look up at the sun, close your eyes, and smile. Or, if it's your thing, go to meetings.

It can feel like pulling teeth in the beginning, but I truly believe that mental well-being has a lot to do with regular positive social interaction. I hope you're doing better today, and wish you the best of luck going forward!
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