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Anything goes secular spirituality thread

Old 02-03-2009, 09:30 AM
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Have any of you read this book?
Lost Art of Being Happy: Spirituality for Sceptics: Amazon.co.uk: Tony Wilkinson: Books

I'm thinking of checking it out.
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Old 02-03-2009, 10:27 AM
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I should write a book.

"Simple Like Me - A [email protected] Guide to Bumbling Through Recovery"

or

"Recovery Idiot"

or

"12 Steps to Knuckleheadedness"
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Old 02-03-2009, 10:27 AM
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My signature line sums it up for me my attraction to the secular forum. You have to have more tools in your toolbox than religion. No God is going to help me if I don't frickin' help myself. I don't know if anyone ever gets this about my sig below, but that is what it is all about.
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Old 02-03-2009, 03:46 PM
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dgillz, didn't get the connection to religion but that makes sense as a way to interpret the quote.

friendly suggestion:
how about a Swiss army knife for an avatar and then see if anyone gets the connection between that and your sig line
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Old 02-03-2009, 08:01 PM
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“Zen does not confuse spirituality with thinking about God while one is peeling potatoes. Zen spirituality is just to peel the potatoes.” ~ Alan Watts
I think being spiritual for me is: being fully alive with reverence for all things including myself. I think I need to peel more potatoes to get there.

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Old 02-07-2009, 08:58 AM
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I used to
say that it didn't matter to me if anything was "out there" because I didn't believe that it was my job while here to figure that out. Im a good person so either way, no worries. However I have realized in the past week or so that I do in fact want to have a grasp on what exactly I feel is going on with this whole life thing, I need to for my own peace of mind at LEAST to explore and study the different possibilities that others have put out there. I do feel spiritual...but..... Im not sure where to direct that energy. I used to be a christian....when I stopped believing what was being taught I left the church. I know I made the right decision for me....however its like there is this hole now where that was in my life. There was a certainty about it all, I was so convinced that it was the right way to go and it was so comfortable for a time. Knowing that all those people in the room believed what I did gave me a sense of community that I had never felt before and still havent found anywhere else. It was total acceptance and you had something very profound in common with all these people. Can you imagine walking into a room of 500 people and feeling that each one of them accepted you just where you were...not only accepted you but loved you, and know that all of you share the same foundation?.. so to speak. Hmmm maybe I will never feel that way again. Maybe I will never be so sure about it all....maybe I will just have to get comfortable with not knowing...cause ultimately....I never will while Im here.....
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Old 02-07-2009, 01:33 PM
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Philosophy; questions that may never be answered...

Religion; answers that may never be questioned...
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Old 02-07-2009, 08:40 PM
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I actually don't care if you call it philosophy, religion or green beans

I really like this thread and am enjoying reading it very much...others are expressing parts of my expereince a whole lot better tthan i can.

Sparkey!!!! You are really really getting on my nerves...I'm never gonna get all these books read

:ghug3
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Old 02-08-2009, 03:34 AM
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Ah it's not my intention to get on anyone's nerves! All i meant was that whilst it can be comforting that religion provides answers, it's a false comfort...

perhaps the hole left by religion can be filled with the more rational enterprise of philosophy, although it means sometimes you don't get answers, and often people won't all agree...

but like i said before i do think that a spiritual path need not be an irrational or supernatural one...

The pursuit of happiness for happiness' sake, moving away from greed and selfishness, towards generosity and kindness, connecting with fellow living beings, exploring the nature of consciousness through meditation, using meditation to develop positive mental qualities, and so on... I see these things as spiritual, but i also see them as rational...
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Old 02-08-2009, 04:09 AM
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exactly sparkey

(i was just teasing with the nerves comment..sorry i forget you can't see me smile on the internet)
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Old 02-08-2009, 06:21 AM
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Originally Posted by spark42 View Post
The pursuit of happiness for happiness' sake, moving away from greed and selfishness, towards generosity and kindness, connecting with fellow living beings, exploring the nature of consciousness through meditation, using meditation to develop positive mental qualities, and so on... I see these things as spiritual, but i also see them as rational...
Isn't there a better word for that sh*t?
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Old 02-08-2009, 07:54 AM
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This is where I get confused, because this is closer to what I understand the definition of spirituality to be:

spir·i·tu·al·i·ty (spr-ch-l-t)
n. pl. spir·i·tu·al·i·ties
1. The state, quality, manner, or fact of being spiritual.
2. The clergy.
3. Something, such as property or revenue, that belongs to the church or to a cleric. Often used in the plural

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition copyright ©2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Updated in 2003. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

From this site: spirituality - definition of spirituality by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.



------------------------------------

And this:

1spir·i·tu·al


Pronunciation: \ˈspir-i-chə-wəl, -i-chəl, -ich-wəl\
Function: adjective
Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French & Late Latin; Anglo-French espirital, spiritual, from Late Latin spiritualis, from Latin, of breathing, of wind, from spiritus
Date: 14th century
1: of, relating to, consisting of, or affecting the spirit : incorporeal <spiritual needs>
2 a: of or relating to sacred matters <spiritual songs> b: ecclesiastical rather than lay or temporal <spiritual authority> <lords spiritual>
3: concerned with religious values
4: related or joined in spirit <our spiritual home> <his spiritual heir>
5 a: of or relating to supernatural beings or phenomena b: of, relating to, or involving spiritualism : spiritualistic
— spir·i·tu·al·ly adverb
— spir·i·tu·al·ness noun



From this site: spiritual - Definition from the Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary
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Old 02-08-2009, 07:57 AM
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The reason I post this is because I've seen that everyone has a different definition of what spirituality means. What is considered to be the correct definition?

Anyone else have any sources to cite? I wish I had an Oxford dictionary lying around...
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Old 02-08-2009, 08:01 AM
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Originally Posted by spark42 View Post
The pursuit of happiness for happiness' sake, moving away from greed and selfishness, towards generosity and kindness, connecting with fellow living beings, exploring the nature of consciousness through meditation, using meditation to develop positive mental qualities, and so on... I see these things as spiritual, but i also see them as rational...
From now on, I'm calling it "The Good Stuff"...

Well me and my lady had our first big fight
So I drove around until I saw the neon lights
Of a corner bar.
It just seemed right, so I pulled up.
Not a soul around but the old barkeep
Down at the end lookin' half asleep.
And he walked up and said, "What'll it be?"
I said, "The good stuff."

He didn't reach around for the whiskey;
He didn't pour me a beer.
His blue eyes kinda went misty,
He said, "You can't find that here."

"'Cause it's the first long kiss on a second date.
Your Momma's all worried when you get home late
And droppin' the ring in the spaghetti plate,
'Cause your hands are shakin' so much.
And it's the way she looks with the rice in her hair.
Eating burnt suppers the whole first year,
And askin' for seconds to keep her from tearin' up.
Yeah, man, that's The Good Stuff."

He grabbed a carton of milk and poured a glass
And I smiled and said, "I'll have some of that."
We sat there and talked as an hour passed, like old friends.

I saw a black and white picture and HE caught my stare.
It was a pretty girl with bouffant hair.
He said, "That's my Bonnie,
Taken 'bout a year after we were wed."

He said, "Spent five years in the bottle,
When the cancer took her from me.
But I've been sober three years now,
'Cause the one thing stronger than the whiskey..."

"Was the sight of her holdin my baby girl.
The way she adored that string of pearls,
I gave her the day that our youngest boy, Earl,
Married his high school love.
And it's a new t-shirt saying, "I'm a Grandpa!"
Being right there as our time got small,
And holding her hand when the good Lord called her up.
Yeah, man, that's the good stuff."

He said, "When you get home, she'll start to cry.
When she says 'I'm sorry' say 'So am I'
And look into those eyes so deep in love,
And drink it up.
'Cause that's the good stuff.
That's the good stuff."

-Kenny Chesney
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Old 02-08-2009, 08:03 AM
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Here's the definition of spirit from the Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary:

1spir·it
Pronunciation: \ˈspir-ət\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French or Latin; Anglo-French, espirit, spirit, from Latin spiritus, literally, breath, from spirare to blow, breathe
Date: 13th century
1: an animating or vital principle held to give life to physical organisms
2: a supernatural being or essence: as acapitalized : holy spirit b: soul 2a c: an often malevolent being that is bodiless but can become visible ; specifically : ghost 2 d: a malevolent being that enters and possesses a human being
3: temper or disposition of mind or outlook especially when vigorous or animated <in high spirits>
4: the immaterial intelligent or sentient part of a person
5 a: the activating or essential principle influencing a person <acted in a spirit of helpfulness> b: an inclination, impulse, or tendency of a specified kind : mood
6 a: a special attitude or frame of mind <the money-making spirit was for a time driven back — J. A. Froude> b: the feeling, quality, or disposition characterizing something <undertaken in a spirit of fun>
7: a lively or brisk quality in a person or a person's actions
8: a person having a character or disposition of a specified nature
9: a mental disposition characterized by firmness or assertiveness <denied the charge with spirit>
10 a: distillate 1: as (1): the liquid containing ethanol and water that is distilled from an alcoholic liquid or mash —often used in plural (2): any of various volatile liquids obtained by distillation or cracking (as of petroleum, shale, or wood) —often used in plural b: a usually volatile organic solvent (as an alcohol, ester, or hydrocarbon)
11 a: prevailing tone or tendency <spirit of the age> b: general intent or real meaning <spirit of the law>
12: an alcoholic solution of a volatile substance <spirit of camphor>
13: enthusiastic loyalty <school spirit>
14capitalized Christian Science : god 1b

spirit - Definition from the Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary
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Old 02-08-2009, 08:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Bamboozle View Post
1: an animating or vital principle held to give life to physical organisms

Look, I'm not much of a science buff, but could amino acids be considered spiritual?

I wish I could talk about this more...but I have to dissappear for a few hours shortly.
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Old 02-08-2009, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by doorknob View Post
Isn't there a better word for that sh*t?


i certainly hope so!

Rational spirituality? Practical philosophy?

"the good stuff" - i'm liking that...
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Old 02-08-2009, 10:03 AM
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Red face

Originally Posted by spark42 View Post
The pursuit of happiness for happiness' sake, moving away from greed and selfishness, towards generosity and kindness, connecting with fellow living beings, exploring the nature of consciousness through meditation, using meditation to develop positive mental qualities, and so on... I see these things as spiritual, but i also see them as rational...
Originally Posted by doorknob View Post
Isn't there a better word for that sh*t?
I like what Rogers has to say about self-actualization.

Carl Rogers (1902-1987) is truly the central figure in the humanistic orientation. Rogers' person-centered theory emphasized the concept of "self-actualization." This concept implies that there is an internal, biological force to develop one's capacities and talents to the fullest. The individual's central motivation is to learn and to grow. Growth occurs when individuals confront problems, struggle to master then, and through that struggle develop new aspects of their skills, capacities, views about life. Life, therefore, is an endless process of creatively moving forward, even if only in small ways.

Source: www.mythosandlogos.com
If I were to define a process that brings me to my best potential, Rogers description of self-actualization will do nicely. No need to refer to a creative process of moving forward in life as spiritual if I like. I too don't really care for the spooky word 'spiritual' as a description of being the best a person can be anyhoo. I haven't been able as yet to dissociate from hearing people describe themselves as 'spiritual' and and thinking there saying to me: I'm saintly. I believe its that ole 'holier than tho' feeling I get when I hear 'spiritual' being added to someones self description.

Once again my old (and current challenge of working through my) despise of religion rears its ugly head. Ahhh... progress not perfection. As long as I see where this arises...I can work to let it go.
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Old 02-08-2009, 12:25 PM
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hey bam...i think of things like molcules and atoms and all that stuff as very spiritual.....My dad was a physisist..he looked for the meaning of life in atoms, quarks and stuff like that....I guess i have a very very broad view of what is "spiriutal"
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Old 02-08-2009, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by ananda View Post
hey bam...i think of things like molcules and atoms and all that stuff as very spiritual.....My dad was a physisist..he looked for the meaning of life in atoms, quarks and stuff like that....I guess i have a very very broad view of what is "spiriutal"



It could be. That's a neat way of looking at it.


It seems to me that the word "spiritual" is very broad--I wish there were more words in the vocabulary to describe the different types--like I wish there were better words to describe complex emotions. It's far too easy for me to make assumptions when one says that he/she is spiritual. Some of the descriptions I’ve heard are like the difference between a rose and the sun. That just brings me back to the issue of defining the terms...

The more I think about it, the more ambiguous the word is.

I see myself not as a spiritual person, but as an emotional human being. There are so many different things that I feel at different times...things I can't quite describe. Sad, happy, angry, elated, joyous, depressed, etc. give a general picture, but certainly do not represent the whole. I don't know where I'm going with this...I'm just talking out of my (_!_) again.
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