What the Bleep Do We Know?
 

'What the Bleep Do We Know? Down the Rabbit Hole', is the title of a VERY interesting movie I watched recently. I think it would appeal to many of you here in Secular Connections. Has anyone else seen it? What did you think?

If you are philosophically, scientifically, and/or spiritually inquisitive....You should see this film.

They do spend a little time talking about addictions. Physical and emotional. The best thing in this film IMO...is how they explain that thoughts, and just the act of observing the world, cause changes in reality, down to a molecular level.

I think I will make Quantum Physics my new religion. LOL

I just wanted to share the title with you guys because, I think some of you may get a lot out of it. I DID! (it's certainly not for everybody though)

Oh yeah... Hi again everyone! I'm still here and still alcohol free thank goodness!

-Wandergrrl

Love it...

Have the original and the new extended version..

Truths that help me are......

Change your thinking change your life...

A long time slogan in AA....

The movie proposes a chemical build up and subsequent

"addiction" to negative thinking by replaying past sufferings....

I would recommend it to anyone in addiction.

Love,

Sherry

This is a very spiritual film. My aunt, a quantum physicist who is about as open minded as one will ever be (she believes in a goddess after years of questioning and an athesit period) warned me about this film. She said the physics in this film is "full of crap". After doing some research I found out why. It is made by Ramtha's School of Enlightenment, a group who follows JZ Knight-the woman who claims to channel Ramtha, a 35,000-year-old warrior. Randi wrote a bit on her and even awarded her for twisting new age to a new level. (for those that don't know Randi is the one who offers a million dollars to anyone that can prove in scientific conditions that they are psychic.)

if i weren't so stupid i'd watch it.

i better stick to old episodes of pee wee's playhouse instead.

Have not seen yet but I will look out for it.

It's an interesting film, for sure.
I had a very big concern at the end, when, the main character threw away her anti-depressants. Not very socially responsible message to give to those who need meds to keep them from going over the edge.

And I did understand the message of changing our thinking. But, depression, bipolar condition and other mental illness is a chemical imbalance in the brain. It's not subject to the old, "pull yourself up by the boot strap" thinking. It's an illness that needs treatment, and throwing away the meds can, and has often meant, one more dead body. As I said, not socially responsible in that category, though I did like much of the movie.

Alera, thanks for the input! Interestig about your aunt! :e058:

Another good one is the Secret.

Shalom!

Thanks Alera and Historyteach. This film promotes a lot of fuzzy pseudoscience. I think it's a shame that our science education is in such a state that a lot of people accept this as the real deal through either lack of exposure or exposure to inaccurate information.

As for Changing your thinking to change the world. Well, if you change your mind and decide to take action, then I say ok. Otherwise, no. You cannot just think your way out of a paper bag.

Historyteach- especially agree with the idea of Just Throwing Out the antidepressants. My aunt is bi-polar and has decided to Just Throw Out her medication, the results are not good, no matter what she thinks.

I love Pee Wee's Playhouse! I wish they would do reruns! Remember Chairry? And Laurence Fishburne as Cowboy Phil? LOL! :biggrin:

Mekka-lekka hi mekka hiney ho!
Mekka-lekka hi mekka chahney ho!
Mola-mekka chala mekka hola hayla hey!


Click on "enter" to hear the theme song:

http://www.peewee.com/


Okay, sorry for the hijack - back to the movie!

margo too funny margo... where pee wee now?

wander... saw it a couple of years ago... a recovery underground cult classic... saw it with trish... lol, she said... what the hell are you bringing me to see!

and glad you fork'd it over $$$... meaning... i pay for the tickets... lol

hey, the last basketball scene... http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/3444/crazy1no.gif

xxoo, rz

ps, SS, thanks for the tip on the extended version... will have to check it out.

Lawrence Fishburne looked really Messed Up in that cowboy outfit . I would seek purchase of the rights to the show , footage ,and burn them and try to delete all internet feeds .

I though it was a cool film and the way it was put together.
It was only suppost to be a documentary film at first.
Just interviewing scienctist and guru
The directors simply was just experimenting and they left it
open and the film had a life of it's own. In the interviews,
they where butting heads themselves while producing the film.
Body chemistary wasn't a new idea...they simple havn't applied it
they also notice how they were re-acting and getting angery
at one other.
The directors simply just threw out a bunch of ideas
nothing more than any suggestion i would hear in a meeting
I can take it or leave it. It's about being openminded

Einstine theary of relativity clashed a lot with his other thearies,
and relativity dose not give conclusive answers on everything.
the term anomaly is simply use to toss out whatever can't be explain.

hawken's therary of the big bang stops at the bang..the man is
in a wheel chair...he hasn't travel beyound this planet.
I can't remember if he is the one that came up with the inflation
equation, also

quatum machanics is still a bit confussing for me, but just becuase
I can't grasp it , it dosn't mean it dosn't exist.
I don't have to accept it, but I can relate to a lot of aspect of
the film.

So i basically live to how i think or belive. I belive it's what i got
out of wtf...do we know.
A happy ball kept my arss sober for many years..
It's because i'm mature enough to allow myself to be openminded.
it's silly...but it's not as stupid as injecting pioson into my body.

I'm not sure if it's the green pill or the red pill you take to go into
the rabbit hole...I'll have to watch the metrix again.lol

But i did dream once in a dream of where i was going live and be doing
a certain thing....Six months later....there i was....so that's a trip.
So where the hell did my mind get those images of the future from ???

That is my problem. The money behind the movie is not about being openminded. The people behind the movie are not openminded. The ideas behind the movie are not openminded. It is about a group that believes a 35,000 year old man channels ideas to a middle aged woman. Don't belive me? I just threw the title "what the bleep do we know" into google and the first PAID ad is for "ramtha"--which has his own defination of god here:http://ramtha.com/html/pdf/introduction.pdf

Intersting, although she says Ramtha is real, she has gone to court to prevent others from channeling him, saying he is her creation.


Nor is it supposed to. Einstein's Theory of General Relativity only deals with specific ideas, specifically the equivalence principle and the Einstein Field Equations http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/c/5...992e5d4172.png

Quantum Mechanics are confusing because they are based on theoretical physics and expermental physics. However, it is very math based (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_mechanics). It can seem confusing because people throw things under the title of QM that don't belong there.

I don't think it is stupid at all.

Red LOL. Here is an interesting article about choosing the Red Pill over the Blue... It will make you think:
http://www.arrod.co.uk/essays/matrix.php
One quote from that site: "To justify taking the red pill we might ask what is the purpose of an ignorant existence? Further still, what is there in merely existing? Simply existing brings humans down to the level of objects; they might have utility or even purpose, but where is the meaning? Existence without meaning is surely not living your life, but just experiencing it. As Trinity says to Neo, "The Matrix cannot tell you who you are.""

Ah, the world of Psi. I think your mind may have gotten that image from the future but what do I know?

well...I remember that dream clearly. I didn't think too much
of it...But when I got to actually doing it and being in that
exact room and doing those exact actions.
It was a place I've never been to and never saw.

It wasn't deja vo. It felt like it at first, but then
I remember having that dream 6 months before.
wtf...is there a glich in the matrix ?
I taught it was weird

what the heck is psi ?... pound per square inch ?

I don't have esp...if I did..I'll be standing in line
at 7/11 buying loto tickets every weekend..lol

I'm just a recovery addict...

Here is an inserting article that reflects my feelings about: “ keeping an open mind”
http://www.capmag.com/article.asp?ID=369

I also like this saying: “keep an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out”. Ano. (I think)

I ask stupid questions, but I'm still hard wire.
That's why i havn't asked too much about it...becuase i can get
too obsess into seeking truth, sometimes. But maybe that's the
fear mechanism that keeps me hard wired. Pull me out of the rabbit
hole before I get too lost and bring me back to reality..
mmm..but what the heck is reality, becuase that's why I ask
the stupid question in the first place....did that make sense ?

So, do I create my reality, as wtf do we know suggested ?
if so...what's up with my dreams...it wasn't a consicious effort
on my part...or did i just simply looked and it all came together.lol
That was facts...but i'm not incline to let people drill holes in my head
or throw me into a box. To approve or disprove my facts.

There always a part of me that wants the truth.
The very simple questions I've asked as a child..what is the meaning of life ?
why are we here ? what is the purpose of all of this ?

which comes back to, dose god exist ?
I don't know...
So was that happy ball just my belief, something I made up..
it works..it kept me sober
So is god something mankind made up ? A system.
it works...it helps a lot of people.
Here i go again...asking stupid questions...lol

I am a Christian.....

O.K. but I appreciated the movie....the facts about the chemical

addictions to grief and suffering.

Very real and damaging to good people struggling to get well...

Playing the past tapes and wondering why they don't "feel"

better even after they are in recovery.

The "Ramtha" thing?

No, I'm not sucked into that...

Another thing my good friend and therapist in the past advised

me of years ago...when I left AA because those folks were

"telling my story" and scared the crap out of me.......

"Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater"..

Something AA taught me.....

"Take what you need and leave the rest"....

Hey SaTiT...Hawkins fan here...lol...

Love,

:Flower111:

Sherry

I will look it up, but I know Carl Sagan (sayer of many really useful things) at least quoted it in Demon-Haunted World.

Edit to add- I looked it up- many many people have said it. Sagan among lots and lots.


It's true, too. Yes, be open to new possibilities, but have critical thinking skills in place to weed out the plain (or extra-fancy) hooey. That's what scientists do- they have open minds, which is why they are open to ideas and willing to test them, to give up even the most beloved of hunches or even theories which prove ultimately not true. The persuit of knowledge is a valuable thing.

Just as in recovery, we find the ways which work for us and discard the ones which don't or we sink. In either case, using the right tools to get the right result is imperative.

"Take what you need and leave the rest"....

Really changed my attitude about AA meetings....

Thank God..

Love


IO

Well... Yes, it as well as The Secret actually roll together a bunch of decades old, new-age spiritualism with a liberal helping of feel-good concoction. lol

It's catchy though. Wayne W. Dyer made a killin' off these same precepts 30 years ago in the awesome book, Your Erroneous Zones.

It sells. Telling people that society has constructed a myth-cocoon and we're willing denizens is intoxicating! It feels good to hear a credentialled talking head say to you... You Can Do Any Damned Thing You Set Your Mind To Doing.

And sells even better. That's precisely what Dyer did, and a slew of others throughout the seventies into the eighties and part of nineties (The Celestine Prophecy - another one).

Dyer was right, of course, and so are the producers of Bleep and the author of Secret--there IS far more to the world than what we know! That's part of the lure. However, claiming then to have answers... to talk of reincarnation and the journey of the soul, and variously claim that science supports these types of ideals is the fatal leap they make.

To a degree these people are right about the mantras, "We create our own reality"... "Change your thoughts and you change your world"... "We are the sum total of the choices we have made," and "Thoughts are things."

See... it's tantalizing; nay, titallating! I know! I've long been the student. It's, well it's stupefying to think that... With my thoughts alone, I can create the circumstance in my life that will grow me $10,000,000 over the next ten years.

There is *some* truth to the principle. Unfortunately, once you come out of the theatre or the book, there is no magic to it, no supernatural "beam of attraction" going to make that happen. It requires all the luck, all the hard work, all the brains and savy to make happen as if one never read the books or saw the movies.

It's mostly feel good, pop psych with a new dressing, people.

And hey, if the spiritual principles feel good to live by and they improve your life, then by all means! ...So long as you don't start blaming yourself for having cancer or being alcoholic... or stop an antidepressant because The Secret does, after all, champion "the power of thought!" -with frightening exaggeration.

Oh. And if you want financial freedom? A four-year degree in a high-demand field will net you more than being versed on the 30 year-old "Secret" that everybody already knew about.

:wink3:

Ten

LOL... Re-writing the title, eh?

"A happy ball???" do what...?

Bipolar recovering alkie/addict here.....hello....

I would never stop my closely monitored meds regime and doctor visits.

I had to accept my mental disorder/chemical imbalance
just as I do with my disease of addiction...

But waking up and applying prayer and positive thinking
has helped me to recover and I believe will help me to
recover and build a happy and productive life indefinitely.

Why take a buutload of medicine every night when all you
do is whine all day...

I would bet the meds would be ineffective and the poor
mental attitude would lead to relapse....

And make everyone around me miserable...and not to mention..

how would I ever be able to reach out and inspire others?

Just MHO.....

Love,

:andy:

Sherry

Ouch. That was great, Sherry.

Something for me to sleep on. :)

Ahhhh Ten..

You know you're a lamb.

Love,

:flower5:

Sherry

This is where some of the danger lies, really- it can too easily be turned around and turned into (in most cases further) self- blame for things which go wrong- many of which you do not have a say in (I had cancer, for instance, am fine now but was not helped by the rage I felt when someone told me it was all my "inner anger" which had physically manifested). A positive attitude *is* better for you than a negative one, to be sure, but it is not going to keep you dry when it rains. For that you need an umbrella and to engage in the act of opening it.

You mentioned something about "answers". I think there is a lot of fear in not having answers. Sometimes, though, it is ok to not have an answer. In my experience it can be better to not have an answer rather than to have the wrong answer. (Example- There is a clear liquid in an unmarked bottle. Is it water? Don't know- don't drink it. Someone says "yeah, it's water" you drink it, but it's not. You're now ill.)

lol

Please allow me to share my personal experience.

I was diagnosed as Bipolar in my early teens. I have been in and out of psychiatric hospitals and treatment centers. It wasn't until I took responsibility for MY thoughts and made a concerted effort to practice love toward others and patience that I began to feel better. All the pills (the prozac, seroquel, wellbutin, ativan, klonopin, etc...) never changed the way I felt about myself. Until I realized that life was worth living and did what I needed to do whether I felt like doing it or not, that I chucked my pills too. I grew tired of being a slave to psychiatrist appointments and other people's labels. I am the only person who can define ME. I let go of resentments and practiced loving others, even those who aren't very nice people. See, I always used to think that if people would just be nice to me, I'd feel better. But when people are mean, it's really just because deep down inside they are unhappy and it has nothing to do with me. So, as a result of practicing love and tolerance and letting go of resentments, I have grown more in the last year than in all the treatment centers I've ever been in.

As a result, I am clean and sober and happier than I've ever been in my 37 years on this earth. I don't take prescription medication anymore and I feel great.

I realize not everyone can do this as they are not ready and may never be ready. I just knew that I was ready.

Thanks for the great post. Good job taking control of your life and making it better! Gotta watch out for those doctors these days....they are always trying to put pple on meds.

If it worked for you, that's wonderful.
It's also true that there are people who suffer from chemical imbalances. For them to stop taking their meds can easily mean death. It's happened FAR too often! Especially when people try to play doctor and tell them they don't *need* their meds.

All people need to do what's right for them.
Other people should not interfer with the decisions made by a person in conjunction with their own doctor.
We are not medical professionals here. We don't play doctor. It's too dangerous to screw around with another person's life.
And a *real* doctor would NEVER try to diagnose someone, or tell them they don't need meds online.

Sometimes, we gotta watch out for those who *think* they know better for someone else. Especially when they don't know the other person.

Shalom!

I work CBT as well as take Paxil. Both are very important to my recovery. I could not do it without both. Everyone is different but that is my experience.

I am very careful with medication and do a lot of my own research. I think we all should take care of ourselves when it comes to medication or medical advice. With knowledge we can protect ourselves and our families.

I've had numerous times when I have had to jump in and make my own decisions. I've seen many mistakes made by physicians with the clients I work with. I've had doctors continue medications when I told them I had serious side effects. Sometimes it's a real joke.

On the other hand there are many bi-polar patients who stop taking medication with terrible consequences. I've also seen this many times. I've seen many relapses on the forums from those who quit taking their medication. I think careful planning, informed decisions, and careful monitoring by a physician you can trust is the best way to make desired changes.

I'm very happy this has worked for you divinedesign21. It sounds like you really worked hard at it with good results. That's quite an accomplishment.

Congratulations!