agnostic alternative to the third step prayer ?
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Portland OR
Posts: 6
agnostic alternative to the third step prayer ?
I'm about to go over the third step with my sponcor and she wants me to come up with a version of the third step prayer that works for me. I thought about coming up with some kind of commitment instead. Any ideas? How did you guys work the third step? Thanks!
Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Oxnard (The Nard), CA, USA.
Posts: 13,878
I just edited out the spooky stuff and came up with a mantra to say:
"I will be relieved of the bondage of self and take away my difficulties so as to have victory over them."
That will do the job just as good as any way a believer can do with the third step prayer.
"I will be relieved of the bondage of self and take away my difficulties so as to have victory over them."
That will do the job just as good as any way a believer can do with the third step prayer.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: NY
Posts: 117
I'm defining "god" as the good energy in the universe, and karma. I'm a definite atheist, but there is something greater out there, just not an entity/deity for me. For example, for my first meeting I chose a group kind of randomly, and it is a great group. The woman who is my temporary sponsor sat behind me yesterday at a meeting and struck up a conversation with me...IDK I guess instead of seeing these things as random, I'm attributing it to the "higher power" concept. I'm doing the right thing, and the more I invest in my recovery, the more tools I'll have to cope positively and to see the positive in life, no matter what bad comes my way. I hope this makes sense. I just think of my concept of higher power when the word god comes up.
Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Albany NY
Posts: 1,212
I am agnostic. I have come to believe that nothing operates in a vaccuum (be it nature, people, the universe) and everything that occurs has a ripple effect that can be felt by someone or something down the line.
With this understanding, I was able to envision Good Orderly Direction to be a higher power.
I want my footprint, or ripple, to be a positive influence for me and those who travel in my wake.
A heavenly way to live....and a far better stance to the ego-centric person I was. Living in this manner brings its own reward.
All my best....
With this understanding, I was able to envision Good Orderly Direction to be a higher power.
I want my footprint, or ripple, to be a positive influence for me and those who travel in my wake.
A heavenly way to live....and a far better stance to the ego-centric person I was. Living in this manner brings its own reward.
All my best....
Sobriety is Traditional
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Orcas Island, Washington
Posts: 9,056
From San Francisco Zen Center, 9 Essays: Buddhism & The 12 Step Model of Recovery, 2005, p.12:
In the Third Step prayer, we ask to be relieved of the bondage of self. This
can take on many meanings. One is choosing freedom from fixed ideas of who
we are, and who we can become. It means giving up the illusion of control
(moment by moment, event by event) and, more importantly, giving up our
fixed patterns of behavior and thought. It means returning to the place of not-
knowing. For most of us, what we “knew” was that disaster was imminent, life
was a long exercise in agony and defeat and that nothing we could do would
change that. Not-knowing can serve as an antidote to such thought patterns.
For more discussion see http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ake-steps.html
In the Third Step prayer, we ask to be relieved of the bondage of self. This
can take on many meanings. One is choosing freedom from fixed ideas of who
we are, and who we can become. It means giving up the illusion of control
(moment by moment, event by event) and, more importantly, giving up our
fixed patterns of behavior and thought. It means returning to the place of not-
knowing. For most of us, what we “knew” was that disaster was imminent, life
was a long exercise in agony and defeat and that nothing we could do would
change that. Not-knowing can serve as an antidote to such thought patterns.
For more discussion see http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ake-steps.html
Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 567
Frankly, I remember my desperation to get through the steps, it was a "who cares about the "God" bit, I was willing more than the drink"
I went past all these philosophicals about life, creation, man or beast, etc etc...
The one fact I knew, it was 2007 and AA "Big Book" was first written in 1935.
Taking the 3rd Step Prayer and getting into the 4th Step with my then "sponsor" was that action leap of faith after the willingness.
Either that or live miserably sober, eventually I am sure I would have gone to the local.
Point is, I was glad I just put all my prejudices aside, took the prayer and still praying sober...!
I went past all these philosophicals about life, creation, man or beast, etc etc...
The one fact I knew, it was 2007 and AA "Big Book" was first written in 1935.
Taking the 3rd Step Prayer and getting into the 4th Step with my then "sponsor" was that action leap of faith after the willingness.
Either that or live miserably sober, eventually I am sure I would have gone to the local.
Point is, I was glad I just put all my prejudices aside, took the prayer and still praying sober...!
Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Oxnard (The Nard), CA, USA.
Posts: 13,878
Originally Posted by Pete55 
Point is, I was glad I just put all my prejudices aside, took the prayer and still praying sober...!
I'm very pleased that I was able to put the whole G*d/HP deal-o aside, took to no prayer and am still faithless sober!
Different strokes for different folks.
Grateful to be free
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Arizona
Posts: 3,680
This is from a site called Addiction Alchemy
" I am committed to seek the Truth in all things in order to restore my connection with my center and to reconnect my Will with that of my highest purpose."
" I am committed to seek the Truth in all things in order to restore my connection with my center and to reconnect my Will with that of my highest purpose."
Guest
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: The Deep South
Posts: 14,636
Here is a great link to alternative versions of the 12 Steps: Secular and Alternative Steps | AA Agnostica
I particularly like the Agnostic version and the Freethinkers version.
I particularly like the Agnostic version and the Freethinkers version.
Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Oxnard (The Nard), CA, USA.
Posts: 13,878
Great link Jennie!
I'm partial to the Buddhist Non-Theist 12 steps.
I have constructed a home made Tibetan prayer wheel to asst me with the godly AA' steps. The wheel is very effective with getting prayers said. With
a good stead spinning of the prayer wheel will result in saying 200 prayers in one minuet!
[IMG]httpith a://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb193/zencat69/Picture139.jpg[/IMG]
A pencil, rope, nut/bolt, empty medical bottle .....a little of this and a bit of that and Wa-La, I can now pray as sa much of a holy man.
pretae person
I'm partial to the Buddhist Non-Theist 12 steps.
I have constructed a home made Tibetan prayer wheel to asst me with the godly AA' steps. The wheel is very effective with getting prayers said. With
a good stead spinning of the prayer wheel will result in saying 200 prayers in one minuet!
[IMG]httpith a://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb193/zencat69/Picture139.jpg[/IMG]
A pencil, rope, nut/bolt, empty medical bottle .....a little of this and a bit of that and Wa-La, I can now pray as sa much of a holy man.
pretae person
Blu**ed Lines...A ClockWork SR
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: AZ
Posts: 2,529
Become dyslexic. Seriously though I have used idealistic secular ideologies and even the "Golden Rule" that was posted on the hallway in Elementary School. I think anything that has meaning/collective/highers purpose kind of stuff that resonates/inspires works.
Gonna check out the Buddhist Non-Theist 12 steps; looks interesting.
Gonna check out the Buddhist Non-Theist 12 steps; looks interesting.
Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Oxnard (The Nard), CA, USA.
Posts: 13,878
Great link Jennie!
[qUOTE=Zencat;4002340]I'm partial to the Buddhist Non-Theist 12 steps.[/quote
I have constructed a home made Tibetan prayer wheel to asst me with the godly AA' steps. The wheel is very effective with getting prayers said. With
a good stead spinning of the prayer wheel will result in saying 200 prayers in one minuet!
A pencil, rope, nut/bolt, empty medical bottle .....a little of this and a bit of that and Wa-La, I can now pray as much of as any a holy man.
My PRAYER WHEEL
With the found junk around myself, I see 'll be building some more prayer wheels. Already a few of my friends want on. ASAP.
[qUOTE=Zencat;4002340]I'm partial to the Buddhist Non-Theist 12 steps.[/quote
I have constructed a home made Tibetan prayer wheel to asst me with the godly AA' steps. The wheel is very effective with getting prayers said. With
a good stead spinning of the prayer wheel will result in saying 200 prayers in one minuet!
A pencil, rope, nut/bolt, empty medical bottle .....a little of this and a bit of that and Wa-La, I can now pray as much of as any a holy man.
My PRAYER WHEEL
With the found junk around myself, I see 'll be building some more prayer wheels. Already a few of my friends want on. ASAP.
Guest
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,452
Originally Posted by Reedling
Just "relieve me of the bondage of self" works for me and is so short I can remember it even when I'm tired.
The intent of the prayer, is to free us from self bondage, not so that we will feel better, for us...for our relief and feelings...
but that so we may be helpful to others...to bear witness to the transformation that can occur...
So we can be as a light to others to lead them to have the same recovery...experience that happened for us...
Free me, so I can be useful...and others will be inspired that they can change too...help me to be an example...help me to recover so I can live and be helpful to others...
Member
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Chicago
Posts: 88
Hi,
I too am an agnostic. I resisted going to AA for a long time because of this step. Finally when I did make it in, I realized that the concept is not restrictive. My sponsor is actually a secular humanist. He has helped me understand that what we are looking for is a realization that there is something outside of ourselves that controls our lives, not us.
I have blogged here about the whole thing about my understanding of my HP, if you are interested. But this is my version of the 3rd step prayer. I call it a 3rd step reminder.
Looking at the 3rd step prayer; it conforms to my understanding of my HP.
paraphrasing
--having come to a realization that I do not have control over my life; my HP does,
--having come to accept that my life till now has been governed by my selfishness and fear
--having made a decision to turn over my life to the care of my HP
--I now humbly ask that I may find the strength to live my life in a way that is of service to my fellow man and bring credit to my fellow AA bretheren.
Another AA guy is also a humanist and he came up with this after some thinking:
Having felt the Power of the connection to my fellow men in the program - I offer myself wholly to that higher power - To relieve me of the bondage of my ego, that I may better serve my fellow man - Take away my difficulties, self imposed or otherwise - that victory over them may serve as an example of the power of this group, the power of love of others and a humble, honest way of life. May I be willing every day to live the principles and truths that I have learned in AA.
Whatever it is, there are 2 things to remember. The HP concept you come up with is only something that will allow you to continue on with the other steps. And your conception of the HP will change with time as you go through the rest of your sober life in the program.
I too am an agnostic. I resisted going to AA for a long time because of this step. Finally when I did make it in, I realized that the concept is not restrictive. My sponsor is actually a secular humanist. He has helped me understand that what we are looking for is a realization that there is something outside of ourselves that controls our lives, not us.
I have blogged here about the whole thing about my understanding of my HP, if you are interested. But this is my version of the 3rd step prayer. I call it a 3rd step reminder.
Looking at the 3rd step prayer; it conforms to my understanding of my HP.
paraphrasing
--having come to a realization that I do not have control over my life; my HP does,
--having come to accept that my life till now has been governed by my selfishness and fear
--having made a decision to turn over my life to the care of my HP
--I now humbly ask that I may find the strength to live my life in a way that is of service to my fellow man and bring credit to my fellow AA bretheren.
Another AA guy is also a humanist and he came up with this after some thinking:
Having felt the Power of the connection to my fellow men in the program - I offer myself wholly to that higher power - To relieve me of the bondage of my ego, that I may better serve my fellow man - Take away my difficulties, self imposed or otherwise - that victory over them may serve as an example of the power of this group, the power of love of others and a humble, honest way of life. May I be willing every day to live the principles and truths that I have learned in AA.
Whatever it is, there are 2 things to remember. The HP concept you come up with is only something that will allow you to continue on with the other steps. And your conception of the HP will change with time as you go through the rest of your sober life in the program.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 14
When I pray I am speaking to what I call my higher self. It's my potential, a better version of myself. At meetings during group prayers I simply omit the word God because I have an aversion to that word. I am athiest/ agnostic that does believe in the healing power of prayer. It's good to get your thoughts together and seek your inner strength and wisdom. There are some really good books out there for a non religious take on twelve step spirituality. These include Waiting by Marya Hornbacher, The Little Book: A Collection of Alternative 12 Steps, Beyond Belief- a agnostic daily meditation book, and Get Up and Still Standing by Bucky Sinister.
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