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Not The Way way, Just the way
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: US
Posts: 1,413
Hi Philemon,
Sooo...I just wanted to say congratulations on making your Big Plan a few days ago.
Philemon’s Big Plan stated at the end of this blog post (<- link)
GT
Sooo...I just wanted to say congratulations on making your Big Plan a few days ago.
Philemon’s Big Plan stated at the end of this blog post (<- link)
GT
Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 25,373
hah, Philemon.
Yeah, "I don't drink," pretty much covers any and all THOUGHTS about drinking.
I know this is the AVRT section, and I'm not an adherent to every nuance of AVRT, but yeah. Why even entertain the convoluted question you posed if you don't drink anyway? It's a rabbit hole of wasted time.
Yesterday I was on a walk and there on the side of the road was a beer 12 pack box. Empty, but my mind went to, "Haven't had one of those for a while, that would be good after the...." WTH????
It happens. As soon as I realized I was going down that path in my head I stopped. It takes practice. The thoughts still come up...always will, I think.
Yeah, "I don't drink," pretty much covers any and all THOUGHTS about drinking.
I know this is the AVRT section, and I'm not an adherent to every nuance of AVRT, but yeah. Why even entertain the convoluted question you posed if you don't drink anyway? It's a rabbit hole of wasted time.
Yesterday I was on a walk and there on the side of the road was a beer 12 pack box. Empty, but my mind went to, "Haven't had one of those for a while, that would be good after the...." WTH????
It happens. As soon as I realized I was going down that path in my head I stopped. It takes practice. The thoughts still come up...always will, I think.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: England
Posts: 315
Yeah, haha thanks GT and Bimini, I just suddenly thought "WTH are you thinking, I made my BP I don't drink, doesn't matter if cupboard is locked, unlocked, drinks poured out on the counter waitin..I don't bloody drink..and I will never change my mind!!" Letting myself get let down rabbit holes by the old AV. I think practice will make perfect (eventually, it bloody better haha). I still keep having to prod myself to remind myself that any doubts I have that I am not 100% confident I can do this is the AV too!!
PS As it happened, I was so distracted trying to get DIL new kitchen gadget to work, I didn't even think to even look at the cupboard to see if key was still in or not!
PS As it happened, I was so distracted trying to get DIL new kitchen gadget to work, I didn't even think to even look at the cupboard to see if key was still in or not!
Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 25,373
yeah, I don't do that whole extra step of, "It's the AV." I know that extra step is useful to some people.
I just don't spend time romanticizing, recalling, wishing, worrying, remembering, FEARING, any of that. It's a stupid brain glitch and it's annoying, nothing more. So I just move on to something else. Change the channel. Turn the page, look the other way, it's just a biological pathway that was reinforced over and over for years. I truly don't think the thoughts will ever go completely away and they will always be annoying. That's okay, small price to pay in the scheme of things. Every time it comes up it gives me another opportunity to make the right decision and to enforce my true self.
The self that was born not needing alcohol.
I just don't spend time romanticizing, recalling, wishing, worrying, remembering, FEARING, any of that. It's a stupid brain glitch and it's annoying, nothing more. So I just move on to something else. Change the channel. Turn the page, look the other way, it's just a biological pathway that was reinforced over and over for years. I truly don't think the thoughts will ever go completely away and they will always be annoying. That's okay, small price to pay in the scheme of things. Every time it comes up it gives me another opportunity to make the right decision and to enforce my true self.
The self that was born not needing alcohol.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: England
Posts: 315
Yes Bimini, I'm sure you already know, because I've seen quite a few of your posts in Secular Connections, that's how Trimpey came up with the idea of AVRT by asking people who had quit off their own bats how they did it.
I do find the visualizations in AVRT useful
For years I would not admit even to myself what it was I drank for. I would not admit I got even the slightest pleasure out of drinking. Which is funny, because when I was young, that is how my friends and I enjoyed ourselves on a Saturday night..down the pub.. drinking.
My ex would say " you must be getting something from it or you wouldn't do it"
Once I admitted to myself that the thing I was drinking for was that deep pleasure I could only get from drink (ok in the end it became more of chasing it than feeling it for very long) then I could see that all the excuses I was using to drink were lies, even to myself, especially to myself infact. After I had that great revelation, I was really attracted to AVRT, I am finding not drinking a hell of a lot easier since using it and best of all, it has helped me dispel, those dark obsessive thoughts that used to plague me and the reason I always said I drank.."to escape" I don't have anything I want to escape from now. I'm perfectly happy in my own head and with my own company (when I have to be haha)
I do find the visualizations in AVRT useful
For years I would not admit even to myself what it was I drank for. I would not admit I got even the slightest pleasure out of drinking. Which is funny, because when I was young, that is how my friends and I enjoyed ourselves on a Saturday night..down the pub.. drinking.
My ex would say " you must be getting something from it or you wouldn't do it"
Once I admitted to myself that the thing I was drinking for was that deep pleasure I could only get from drink (ok in the end it became more of chasing it than feeling it for very long) then I could see that all the excuses I was using to drink were lies, even to myself, especially to myself infact. After I had that great revelation, I was really attracted to AVRT, I am finding not drinking a hell of a lot easier since using it and best of all, it has helped me dispel, those dark obsessive thoughts that used to plague me and the reason I always said I drank.."to escape" I don't have anything I want to escape from now. I'm perfectly happy in my own head and with my own company (when I have to be haha)
Not The Way way, Just the way
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: US
Posts: 1,413
There is an optional exercise in Addictive Voice Recognition Technique, AVRT, that is called Shifting. Philemon did a fleeting version of Shifting when she Recognized that not only are all thoughts and feelings about access into the liquor cabinet her Addictive Voice, but EVEN IF there had been “drinks poured out on the counter waitin...” she would easily have not drank.
Shifting is when you intentionally pause and imagine what used to be an “ah, YES, here we go again!” situation for the AV and shift back and forth from ITs feeling of desire and excitement to YOUR thoughts and feelings of “nope, absolutely wrong. I made the Big Plan and love it.” It’s a way to further familiarize yourself with the Recognition process.
Having made a Big Plan, complete personal capability along with an extremely specific incapability are fused together.
The complete personal capability of “I will never drink again.” means the recovery from addiction is done and over with because there is no reliance on anything outside myself.
The specific incapability means that no matter what the circumstance or series of events that could occur leading to alcohol getting near my mouth, I am simply incapable of pouring it in and swallowing it - ever again. I cannot do it.
Biminiblue mentions that AVRT seems like “A rabbit hole of wasted time.” That is an example of good news awaiting people who make the pledge of total abstinence as Biminiblue has done. And Biminiblue gives an example of post-Big-Plan-AVRT directly following his statement. Yes, AVRT eventually becomes SO FAST in your mind’s thinking and feeling when the subject of re-experiencing that old Deep Pleasure may pop up, unexpectedly or not, that when you see a new student of AVRT pausing to analyze and Recognize IT in some detail, it actually seems slow or like “wasted time”.
But here’s the full context. Imagine NOT making the Big Plan. What kind of “a rabbit hole of wasted time” is one going to spend in recovery in that case?
Having made the pledge of permanent abstinence, one has perfect free choice on whether to spend more time helping other addicted people attain that same free choice, or simply leave the sphere of recovery altogether and get on with life.
Shifting is when you intentionally pause and imagine what used to be an “ah, YES, here we go again!” situation for the AV and shift back and forth from ITs feeling of desire and excitement to YOUR thoughts and feelings of “nope, absolutely wrong. I made the Big Plan and love it.” It’s a way to further familiarize yourself with the Recognition process.
Having made a Big Plan, complete personal capability along with an extremely specific incapability are fused together.
The complete personal capability of “I will never drink again.” means the recovery from addiction is done and over with because there is no reliance on anything outside myself.
The specific incapability means that no matter what the circumstance or series of events that could occur leading to alcohol getting near my mouth, I am simply incapable of pouring it in and swallowing it - ever again. I cannot do it.
Biminiblue mentions that AVRT seems like “A rabbit hole of wasted time.” That is an example of good news awaiting people who make the pledge of total abstinence as Biminiblue has done. And Biminiblue gives an example of post-Big-Plan-AVRT directly following his statement. Yes, AVRT eventually becomes SO FAST in your mind’s thinking and feeling when the subject of re-experiencing that old Deep Pleasure may pop up, unexpectedly or not, that when you see a new student of AVRT pausing to analyze and Recognize IT in some detail, it actually seems slow or like “wasted time”.
But here’s the full context. Imagine NOT making the Big Plan. What kind of “a rabbit hole of wasted time” is one going to spend in recovery in that case?
Having made the pledge of permanent abstinence, one has perfect free choice on whether to spend more time helping other addicted people attain that same free choice, or simply leave the sphere of recovery altogether and get on with life.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: England
Posts: 315
I don't think Bimini meant AVRT was a rabbit hole of wasted time, but my trying to work out whether AV was choice A (asking him to lock booze cupboard and hide key, which meant I didn't trust myself) or B (that not asking him was leaving door open for future drinking opportunities). I worked out (slowly haha) both were. I think Bimini meant that, like you say and like I eventually worked out, it doesn't matter if both were or none were, because I don't drink. Both you and Bimini, instinctually came to the point of "it doesn't matter, because you don't drink" instantly.... and the rabbit hole she was talking about was me ruminating over it. That's how I see it anyway.
I do feel very free now. In lots of ways.
I love it, I am amazed how fast this time not drinking has passed, seems like a blink of an eye. And not difficult at all, not as difficult by a mile as drinking.
I do feel very free now. In lots of ways.
I love it, I am amazed how fast this time not drinking has passed, seems like a blink of an eye. And not difficult at all, not as difficult by a mile as drinking.
quat
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: terra (mostly)firma
Posts: 4,822
Philemon
Congratulations on your decision !
Another form of shifting (perhaps, not sure technically as per RR, though I don't see why it isn't or wouldn't be) is to consciously and purposefully add "ever" to the phrase "don't drink" , Think/say directly at/to your Beast " I will Never drink again, and I will not change my mind" , that will always give a little tingle( and that tingle is AV, yeah ?)
Just as residual desire is not a problem and 100% ignorable, so too is any doubt in your ability to remain abstinent, again congratulations on your decision ! Another badass in this corner of the webs , awesome
Congratulations on your decision !
Another form of shifting (perhaps, not sure technically as per RR, though I don't see why it isn't or wouldn't be) is to consciously and purposefully add "ever" to the phrase "don't drink" , Think/say directly at/to your Beast " I will Never drink again, and I will not change my mind" , that will always give a little tingle( and that tingle is AV, yeah ?)
Just as residual desire is not a problem and 100% ignorable, so too is any doubt in your ability to remain abstinent, again congratulations on your decision ! Another badass in this corner of the webs , awesome
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: England
Posts: 315
Thanks dwtbd
And I will add that, thanks
Tingle? My stomach did a full involuntary 360 degree turn when I did my BP the other day
. Although I have been practicing AVRT since I stopped drinking ,I (It) didn't want to rush into a BP straight away. Although I had no intention of drinking again anyway. Now with the BP no going back, ever (yes, another lurch there!)
Residual desire, I like that phrase!
I could see myself as a bit of a badass come to think of it
And I will add that, thanks
Tingle? My stomach did a full involuntary 360 degree turn when I did my BP the other day
. Although I have been practicing AVRT since I stopped drinking ,I (It) didn't want to rush into a BP straight away. Although I had no intention of drinking again anyway. Now with the BP no going back, ever (yes, another lurch there!)Residual desire, I like that phrase!
I could see myself as a bit of a badass come to think of it
Not The Way way, Just the way
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: US
Posts: 1,413
Hi Philemon,
Congratulations on completing your recovery.
Philemon’s blog entry. <— link
All the best (whether or not you decide to continue posting to help others),
GT
PS. Over my 8+ years here, it seems most of the British women who Join SR and succeed with AVRT are real dynamos with expressive personalities.
Congratulations on completing your recovery.
Philemon’s blog entry. <— link
All the best (whether or not you decide to continue posting to help others),
GT
PS. Over my 8+ years here, it seems most of the British women who Join SR and succeed with AVRT are real dynamos with expressive personalities.
Not The Way way, Just the way
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: US
Posts: 1,413
Originally Posted by GerandTwine 
Hi Philemon,
Congratulations on completing your recovery.
Philemon’s blog entry. <— link
All the best (whether or not you decide to continue posting to help others),
GT
PS. Over my 8+ years here, it seems most of the British women who Join SR and succeed with AVRT are real dynamos with expressive personalities.
Congratulations on completing your recovery.
Philemon’s blog entry. <— link
All the best (whether or not you decide to continue posting to help others),
GT
PS. Over my 8+ years here, it seems most of the British women who Join SR and succeed with AVRT are real dynamos with expressive personalities.
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